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Doctor Teeth posted:Oh thats good. Can I assume that Ammanas is Kellanved as well? Just seems logical. Yes. The Old Guard (Kellavend and his pirate friends, who founded the Empire) is pretty important for the whole series.
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Mar 5, 2011 08:01
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Daico posted:Well yeah, but even in the last page or two we've had people comment that they're just starting the series. Well, TCG did indeed quite a bit of a mindfuck with the series title, at least for me. Never even thought about the exact meaning of it. And then, after 10 years of reading it -  Syle187 posted:Are there any book summaries floating around? Wikipedia has some useable summaries of them. Decius fucked around with this message at 08:53 on Mar 6, 2011 |
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Mar 6, 2011 08:50
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Daico posted:Uh...at first I thought they were trying to create a place for themselves in the ranks of Godhood and then they wanted to make a decent afterlife for everybody except then they got distracted by figuring out how to free the Crippled God? gently caress, I don't know. Anybody? As I understood it they started to travel all the warrens after they entered the Deadhouse and soon realised the trouble that was brewing from many directions at once (from the danger to the Empty Throne over the whole thing with the Crippled God to the Old Gods stirring again, the Shorttails massing again and the dragons making a comeback). So they decided to do something. First they sought aid from their old friends (like Traveller, Urko, Crust, Tayschrenn?...), later they involved Rake, Hood, Queen of Dreams, Brood and so on in it. And if something like rule over larger part of Kurald Emurlahn falls to them during it... well, you take what you can get. I think some character (Hood?) even said they built layer upon layer of planning, putting contingencies in at every possible point.
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Mar 8, 2011 07:29
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A Nice Boy posted:TCG: It's a bit syrupy, sure, but then except maybe Toc and Trull nobody got as lovely a deal in the whole series, so I'm more than willing to let that one slide. Besides, it's not like she's the first - or even one of the first dozen - resurrections in the series.
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Mar 8, 2011 20:48
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Junk Science posted:Ends! They are loose! While I hated Blistig with a fiery passion for the stuff he did to Pores, I also think he was one of the most interesting characters in the book, also probably the most realistic one. He sees Tavore dragging the army through suffering into its doom, without explanation (even to her Fists), without encouragement, no cause to believe in, seemingly completely out of touch with the rest of the army. Looking out for a way to survive it is something most people would do. Blistig is only the most prominent and powerful person of a sentiment that run through the army and was mostly held in check by the marines and heavies. Of course then he stabbed Pores. Also, being an rear end in a top hat and coming out of all well is also all too near to reality for comfort. Also, don't forget, Ruthan Gudd was about to walk away too, far earlier, far before all the suffering until Tavore said the right thing to him. She didn't to Blistig until the very end.
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Mar 9, 2011 07:46
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Infinite Karma posted:I finally got to this scene with Quick Ben Quick Ben has most likely a Tiste Andii soul in him, but that shouldn't be much of a suprise, he used Kurlad Galain in GotM.
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Mar 15, 2011 07:00
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LtSmash posted:Finished TCG recently. Very good ending to an amazing series. Although I do feel like it was a little bit too much of a happy ending, especially with Hetan coming back to life without explanation. It was a bit too sweet, but it wasn't without explanation or setup (since DoD actually). Also, next to Toc Tool was the one most poo poo upon in the series, he deserves a bit of happiness.
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Mar 19, 2011 08:40
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Boogle posted:
TMBotF is probably the last series where I would expect a "happily ever after"-ending for everything to be honest. There are hundreds of characters, dozens of plots - putting a neat cap on all of them is nearly impossible, and wouldn't really fit the style. And I'm sure Erikson plans to write a few more books in the coming decades besides the two trilogies he already announced.
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Mar 20, 2011 07:52
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As I understood it: Hood used his daughter as sacrifice for the chaining. Dassem wasn't happy with that. At all. So he left Hood's "house" and vowed to kill him. Dessembrae is the part of Dassem that was turned into a god through worship of him. The odd thing, and the thing we haven't seen anywhere else in this form, is that Dassem and Dessembrae exist at the same time as separate entities.
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Mar 23, 2011 07:24
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direspoon posted:Regarding Korlat, did we decide who her father was? I can't remember if I read discussion on it here or not, but it seems like another loose end that's up for debate. I assume it'll be a major part of the Tiste Andii trilogy, but I feel like there's almost enough information to figure out who it is now. Theories include Osserc and the undead Soletanken guy Silchas Ruin hung out with, the one Anomander Rake killed very messily. Although in both cases the "low born" seems a bit odd. Habibi posted:Yeah, there're a lot of unhappy readers in the Rothfuss thread (me being one of them). Forget hardship, his take on relationships - mainly romantic but also friendships - are very difficult to relate to. I liked them. They are of course completely different von Erikson, and not the same quality in my opinion, but still some quite good books and I was entertained well enough. Decius fucked around with this message at 11:17 on Mar 26, 2011 |
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Mar 26, 2011 11:14
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Doctor Teeth posted:Ok I'm about a third of the way through Deadhouse Gates and I just want to make sure I've got everything straight about the various races (at least what has been revealed thus far) Jaghut: far, far more slender than orcs, very pronounced tusks T'lan Imass: Think Neanderthals (or maybe even Australopiticus?) that didn't die out but became undead Tiste Andii: The nearest thing to elves i'd say. Their skin isn't dark, it is completly black, like charcoal. Very few can turn into dragons, but not because they are Tiste Andii, more despite of it. Anomander Rake is their leader, but "serving" is a bit much I think. Yeah, being 300k years old and having lost everything makes you a bit depressive. Forkrul Assail: Another elder race (humanoid, white skin, crazy bone joints). More to come about them. Same with the K'Chain Che'Malle (lizards).
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Mar 28, 2011 14:17
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I don't think there is anything in it that wasn't said in the first two books. It's just often not spelled out very clearly.
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Mar 28, 2011 17:16
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I rather enjoyed Esslemont's books. You can do far worse than him if picking up Fantasy (although there are of course many better authors available, nobody would deny that). I really don't understand the hate for his books. His stuff isn't any worse than Rothfuss, Ruckley, Buckell or Charan Newton in my opinion. Not the best, not the worst, perfectly fine entertainment with some flaws - which Steven Erikson has too, albeit on a far higher level. Edit: Market Forces is Decius fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Mar 31, 2011 |
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Mar 31, 2011 17:25
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Boogle posted:TCG spoilersIf anything Calm should've been one of the characters involved in the Karsa trilogy instead of being decapitated by Ubala Pung. Another big fat hint about the nature of Karsa's destiny when she was freed by Karsa back in House of Chains, it was another plot-thread that could've been picked up. Instead it was wasted. I agree it would have been pretty interesting, however I disagree saying that any instance of Ubala kicking rear end is a waste. By the way, I still wonder how well Ubala can keep Icarium's anger in check since he doesn't even really know about it and what it can do.
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Apr 8, 2011 09:45
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:Erikson sounds a little up his own rear end, to tell you the truth. I don't think he (Donaldson - it wasn't Erikson who said it) is that far off. Look how much of the literature "canon" has fantastical elements in it, some bordering outright into Epic High Fantasy. And things like the Gilgamesh epos, Homer etc. is pretty much the foundation of much of our literature. Decius fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Apr 9, 2011 |
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Apr 9, 2011 11:09
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:Has anyone got any impressions for orb scepter throne? Looks like it's available outside the United States now. Finished it now and I liked it quite a bit (disclaimer: I also liked the other ICE books). Writing again has improved and the plot was mostly very interesting. The characters were mostly very much as they are in Erikson's hands Lady Envy was the exception for me. I had only one issue with the book: When the Malazan Army makes their stand against the Seguleh. Firstly - crossbows should work very nicely, no reason to fight this as pitched melee battle. I know ICE removed the mages and munition for just that reason, but the soldiers should still have ranged weaponry. Enough bolts and the Seguleh can't evade/deflect them any longer. But only when Fist Steppen defended the fort they used them. Secondly, the reaction by the Malazans when the Seguleh get blown to pieces. It seemed completely out of place. Crying and mourning for the guys who just murdered half your comrades? Because they got blown up "unfairly" by an air bomb raid? Why? The Malazan sappers do that stuff with enemy infantry all the time, just not from the air, but with minefields, throwing weapons, rigged infrastructure. The Malazans have fought for years next to the Moranth, they surely have seen such tactics before. High Mages kill thousands in seconds, without the victims even seeing them. And now this reaction for 400 faceless Seguleh? Doesn't fit at all, them reacting like they just saw the T'lan Imass razing Y'Ghatan or Leoman burning Y'Ghatan Illuyankas posted:e: Also Esslemont you may have changed that one pretty loving major character's gender as (possibly) a reference to how you and Erikson view your collective creation differently, and even included a method for how it could have happened, but it was still a stupid, pointless and unneeded change. Pretty sure we will see a reason for K'rul's gender bender sooner or later, as the change was mentioned as odd in the book. Decius fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Jan 30, 2012 |
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Jan 30, 2012 16:20
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angerbeet posted:The series has a lot of dumb names in general, apostrophes or not. Sure there are some, but the same is true for actual names given to actual people in this country and others. Parâkramabâhu, Vimaladharmasuriya, Köprülü Mehmed Pasha, Nevşehirli Damat İbrahim Pasha, Gāoguìxiāng Gōng, Tai Situ Changchub Gyaltse, Ultrogotha, Faileube, Kaʻahumanu, Puleʻanga Fakatuʻi ʻo Tonga, Tāufaʻāhau, Q'umarkaj, Hope, Chastity, Glory, Joy, Faith, ... Same for descriptive names and nicknames. Half the Jewish names have a meaning in Hebrew, nearly all Arabic ones. My own name is a descriptive name in Latin. Is Caligula ('little boot') really better than 'Hedge', only because the source is more removed from us? Erikson's names are tame and simple compared to stuff you encounter in reading a history book.
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Jan 31, 2012 07:42
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It's not that his language is to flowery or he is too wordy in his descriptions like GRRM is at times - the problem is rather that some plot lines are too drawn out, some feel completely unnecessary and at other times he delves too deeply into philosophical discussions (the abundance of wise, world-weary soldiers who are willing to discuss the futility of war and life off-cuff in the world is at times astonishing  ). Every book features a lot of people wandering around to get to some place for the big finale. Of these wanderings some feel simply too drawn out or flat-out uninteresting. These are the parts that could need some tightening, not his style of writing itself.
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Feb 3, 2012 08:05
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Abalieno posted:Then the discussion is less about writing style and more about structure. Malazan has a very deliberate structure. An editor, good or not, has no right to make arbitrary cuts to a text. What he CAN do is persuade a writer that certain scenes could be cut. He may succeed or not. Ultimately it's the writer's choice, so the writer is to blame, not the editor. I disagree with that. The editor is there to make the stuff the author writes readable (or sellable nowadays...). This includes cutting stuff, which is completely normal and happens to every author. Of course it is the author who has the last word, but the editor is the one who has to convince them that this chapter is too long or that storyline doesn't work. And often authors do cut the stuff, as much as it pains them - until they get big and famous. Then, suddenly the publishers are too afraid to have the editor cut stuff mercilessly because it might mean that they lose the author to a publisher who is less demanding. Also, people are more likely to pay 25 USD for a 900 pages book from <Famous Fantasy Author> than 15 USD for a 400 one, so longer works are actually better for the publisher in many cases. The end result are fantasy series, which start out great, well-paced and readable. And end up with gigantic tomes filled with drawn out and outright boring parts. Erikson is one of the better in this regard, there are maybe 5-10 % of the later books I myself consider too long/much (and which others might like on expanse of stuff I like, although I wonder if anyone liked the length of for example Nimander's traveling depression therapy group or the Mhybe's lamentations). There are far more severe cases like GRRM, Hamilton, Jordan, Rowling or Rothfuss, who would have benefited from condensing certain storylines in half or a third of the pages used. Decius fucked around with this message at 07:45 on Feb 6, 2012 |
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Feb 6, 2012 07:42
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Comrade Flynn posted:I gave this series a chance a couple of years ago and just couldn't get into it despite reading pretty much every other epic fantasy series out there. I just recently heard someone recommend starting at book 2 - will this work? Do you read 2 then go back to 1 then to 3? The Malazan series has several parallel plotlines. Book 2 starts a new plotline, mostly independant of the one in Book 1. While you meet some characters and story elements introduced in Book 1 and of course spoil large parts of Book 1 (since it happens shortly after Book 1, and Book 1 has some severe consequences on the beginning of Book 2) it works as a starting point. It is better written - there are 8 years or so between the writing of Book 1 and Book 2 - and a more straightforward story as it is more grounded (the main storyline is between the Malazan Empire and an uprising on one of the occupied continents instead of millenia old godlike beings spinning their schemes). It is also a great introduction to the tone and themes of the series. It is still difficult to get into the world, as it is filled with concepts and words you don't know anything about, but compared to Book 1 it is easier. Book 3 continues the plotline/characters of Book 1, so you should read Book 1 before Book 3 eventually. Decius fucked around with this message at 07:06 on Feb 8, 2012 |
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Feb 8, 2012 06:55
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The Bridgeburner had a "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger"-experience in Raraku, (re)making them basically into devil may care badasses, who went through Hell and survived to tell the tale. You get more about the whole thing in House of Chains.
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Feb 15, 2012 16:24
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