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Diet Poison
Jan 20, 2008
Hooch is crazy.

Die Laughing posted:

Messiah Complex begins the Hope story, and was my way back into monthly X-Men. The follow up is Second Coming. They're both big X-Men crossovers, and pretty fun stuff.

Seconded like Scruffy. And since you read House of M, start X-Factor, at the beginning if you can Messiah Complex happens between the 4th and 5th TPBs. You don't HAVE to read X-Factor to jump right into MC but it crosses over and if you don't you'll be wondering "who the hell are some of these guys" because they don't often pop up in the "main" books. But when I read MC I hadn't read X-Factor, so it's not like you NEED to have done to follow it. I just enjoyed it more on my 2nd readthrough cause I understood it better.
And you can't go right from Messiah Complex to Second Coming (well, you could, but why would you), you've either gotta read all of the Uncanny issues in between or (and this is what I would recommend) the 3rd volume of Cable, which happens between MC and SC.

Okay, I can ramble all day. Who is this even for.. triplexpac! Here's going on the theory that you'll pick your name out of skimming poo poo. I'd say pick up "X-Factor vol 1: The Longest Night" and "X-Men: Messiah Complex". And if you like MC, pick up "Cable: Messiah War" (NOT to be confused with "X-Force/Cable: Messiah War", which comes later. Who the hell can I blame for that oversight?) for the Fun and Happy Adventures of Cable and Hope in the Future.

edit: Ah jesus, top of a new page.

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Madrox
Jan 31, 2001

Does whatever
a multiple can.


I recently became aware of how awesome artist Fiona Staples is. I remember really taking notice of her covers for the DV8: Gods and Monsters series, but didn't track down more stuff at that time. I'm very excited for her and Brian K. Vaughn's upcoming series Saga (she's doing covers and interiors on this). Can anyone recommend other work by her?

EVGA Longoria
Dec 25, 2005

Let's go exploring!


triplexpac posted:

I was really into the X-men as a kid, but then stopped buying comics. I've been spending the past few months getting caught up on the X-Men universe, wondering if I'm missing anything great. I've read:

• A bunch of the Whedon Astonishing X-Men
• House of M
• and I'm reading New X-Men right now

currently I'm caught up on the last few months of
• The main Cyclops & Wolverine books
• X-Men Legacy
• Uncanny X-Force
• Generation Hope

So what I'm wondering is, is there any "key" X-Men stuff from the last 15 or so years that I should read?

Not necessary, but "Age of X" was a unique x-men crossover event, I kinda liked it.

Gaz-L
Jan 28, 2009


Casao posted:

Not necessary, but "Age of X" was a unique x-men crossover event, I kinda liked it.

No comment on the quality, but 'alternate universe where the heroes have it lovely' isn't exactly a first for the X-Men. Depending on the definition, I can think of at least 3 before that.

prefect
Sep 11, 2001

No one, Woodhouse.
No one.


Gaz-L posted:

No comment on the quality, but 'alternate universe where the heroes have it lovely' isn't exactly a first for the X-Men. Depending on the definition, I can think of at least 3 before that.

"Days of Future Past"
"Age of Apocalypse"

I'm having trouble with a third. Gimme a hint.

redbackground
Sep 24, 2007

BEHOLD!
OPTIC BLAST!


Madrox posted:

I recently became aware of how awesome artist Fiona Staples is. I remember really taking notice of her covers for the DV8: Gods and Monsters series, but didn't track down more stuff at that time. I'm very excited for her and Brian K. Vaughn's upcoming series Saga (she's doing covers and interiors on this). Can anyone recommend other work by her?
She absolutely rocks Secret History of the Authority: Hawksmoor, which is happily also a great read.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

Ever have one of those day?

prefect posted:

"Days of Future Past"
"Age of Apocalypse"

I'm having trouble with a third. Gimme a hint.

12

Gaz-L
Jan 28, 2009


prefect posted:

"Days of Future Past"
"Age of Apocalypse"

I'm having trouble with a third. Gimme a hint.

Three words.

triplexpac
Mar 24, 2007

One day in your memoirs, you'll describe me as inscrutable.

Thanks for the advice guys, I'll definitely check those out!

EVGA Longoria
Dec 25, 2005

Let's go exploring!


Gaz-L posted:

No comment on the quality, but 'alternate universe where the heroes have it lovely' isn't exactly a first for the X-Men. Depending on the definition, I can think of at least 3 before that.

I felt the whole feel was a bit different than those, since there was a sense of mystery to it. But I wasn't reading comics for the others, so it's possible that it comes from being spoiled going in.

Stagger_Lee
Mar 25, 2009


The standard X-verse is actually an anomaly for the X-men. In all possible futures and alternate presents it's concentration camps all the way down. They're lucky if they manage to die without being raised and forced to work as Nazi Ghosts.

Lurdiak
Feb 25, 2006

Everything's coming up Paz!

I think that's what made House of M so refreshing. It wasn't a utopic alternate universe by any means, but... the mutants won, and they ran poo poo, and it wasn't a nightmarish genocide world. Like you had a bunch of mutants who were seriously better off in every quantifiable way. Yet it still showed important themes that make the X-men stuff work, like Magneto's bitterness and, well, bigotry, that laid the groundworks for this technically pretty good universe being undesirable beyond not being "real". It was a lot more subtle than just some post-apocalypse with mutant death camps or Apocalypse running poo poo.

Lurdiak fucked around with this message at Mar 11, 2012 around 00:36

Die Laughing
Sep 18, 2009

You engage the Mad Duck

SMAAAAASH!

My favorite parts of House of M were Spider-Man and Wolverine getting what they always wanted. The end of the first issue, and the start of the second issue are really top notch. The plot kind of drags for a while, but if you're reading it collected then it shouldn't be much of a problem.

triplexpac
Mar 24, 2007

One day in your memoirs, you'll describe me as inscrutable.

Yeah I loved House of M, it got me back into reading X-Men comics in a big way

Stagger_Lee
Mar 25, 2009


I really enjoyed House of M as a series, but hated what it did for the mutant status quo.

prefect
Sep 11, 2001

No one, Woodhouse.
No one.


Just in case somebody wasn't already aware of this Avenging Spider-Man news:

quote:

As revealed in Marvel Comics' solicitations for May, 2012, issue #7 of Avenging will be come courtesy of guest star creators Kathryn and Stuart Immonen. Kathryn has written such well regarded Marvel books as Patsy Walker: Hellcat and Wolverine and Jubilee, while Stuart's ever evolving and versatile artwork has graced the pages of Nextwave, Ultimate Spider-Man and Fear Itself.
http://www.comicsalliance.com/2012/...onen-interview/

Because I love both the Immonens, even if I don't know how to pronounce their last name.

Die Laughing
Sep 18, 2009

You engage the Mad Duck

SMAAAAASH!

I believe they're also doing a story for AvX VS.

Seymour Butts
Jun 26, 2003
I break girls in like baseball gloves

What is everyone's opinion about Winter Soldier #1? I know it came out probably over a month ago, but I just got to it! Am I crazy for really loving the art style in this one? My only complaint is that flipping through the book a lot of the pages are the color blue, but given the settings of James and Natasha it doesn't concern me. Natasha is drawn beautifully, especially in her fighting scenes. On page 3 where she is doing that split-kick-cartwheel is sexy without the gratuitious rear end cheek angle that I see all the times in most X-Men books. I also thought the weather effects in the second half of the book helped set the mood. It was even snowing as a gorilla steps out into the loading dock with a .50 cal machine gun and ammo slung across his chest. EDIT: THE GORILLA WAS SCREAMING "DEATH TO AMERICA" IN RUSSIAN!! Pretty bad-rear end in my opinion. Real excited to read #2 and #3!

Seymour Butts fucked around with this message at Mar 12, 2012 around 16:58

moot the hopple
Apr 26, 2008

dyslexic Bowie clone

Guice and Breitweiser on art duty is probably the best thing about the book, unfortunately I can't say I'm captivated by much else. There's a lot of things that seem great on paper about Winter Soldier: Ed Brubaker doing a superhero noir book, with Bucky (who's been one of the more interesting characters to come out of Marvel in recent years) and Black Widow playing the role of Marvel’s Nick and Nora Charles. But the execution falls just short of making it all work. I think the biggest weakness is the lack of compelling villains; the threat of Soviet sleeper agents, even with the reintroduction of Lucia von Bardas, feels so banal to me at this point. I understand that the past ghosts of the Soviet Union haunting Bucky Barnes is sort of intrinsic to his very character nowadays, but I was hoping that Brubaker would explore some of the more esoteric parts of Marvel’s espionage world before returning to that old stolid workhorse of spy stories. I am hoping however that the book finds its feet after this arc because the premise has potential.

Incidentally, if you’re looking for an example of a capes and noir story that does everything right, check out Brubaker’s Incognito.

moot the hopple fucked around with this message at Mar 12, 2012 around 19:39

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006


moot the hopple posted:

Incidentally, if you’re looking for an example of a capes and noir story that does everything right, check out Brubaker’s Incognito.

And Brubaker's Sleeper (and the prequel, Point Blank), which I think are even better than Incognito.

Sucker Punch
Jan 24, 2008


I really dig books about regular guys trying to compete with guys with superpowers. For example, Batman, Nick Fury, Lex Luthor, Amanda Waller, and the Punisher (at times). Doesn't really matter if they're good or bad, I just find it lends itself to good story telling when they can't really fight back one on one. Gotham Central was suggested to me, and I thought that was great.

Can anyone suggest any other comics along those lines?

In addition, I love Nick Fury every time he makes an appearance in a book/show/movie, but haven't had much luck finding stuff centred on him and S.H.I.E.L.D. If anyone could throw some names at me for that, I'd appreciate it too.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

Ever have one of those day?

Sucker Punch posted:

I really dig books about regular guys trying to compete with guys with superpowers. For example, Batman, Nick Fury, Lex Luthor, Amanda Waller, and the Punisher (at times). Doesn't really matter if they're good or bad, I just find it lends itself to good story telling when they can't really fight back one on one. Gotham Central was suggested to me, and I thought that was great.

Can anyone suggest any other comics along those lines?

In addition, I love Nick Fury every time he makes an appearance in a book/show/movie, but haven't had much luck finding stuff centred on him and S.H.I.E.L.D. If anyone could throw some names at me for that, I'd appreciate it too.

Secret Warriors and Nick Fury Agent of Shield

Sucker Punch
Jan 24, 2008


bobkatt013 posted:

Secret Warriors and Nick Fury Agent of Shield

Judging from the wiki page from Secret Warriors, that sounds pretty good. I didn't know it was a Nick Fury book, and written by Bendis.

I'll see if I can pick up some of those tomorrow.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

Ever have one of those day?

Sucker Punch posted:

Judging from the wiki page from Secret Warriors, that sounds pretty good. I didn't know it was a Nick Fury book, and written by Bendis.

I'll see if I can pick up some of those tomorrow.

Only created by Bendis. It was written by Hickman. Grab that and his Fantastic Four run

Elijya
May 11, 2005

Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.

Powers is a book about homocide detectives in a world of superheroes. It's a lot more experimental than a book like Gotham Central (which is pure noir) but there's a lot of cool stuff through the series.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006


You desperately need to read Secret Warriors. It is pretty much everything you want.

Ed Brubaker's Catwoman run was terrific. The series is as noir as you would expect from Brubaker, but it recasts Catwoman as more of an antihero going up against mobsters and various criminals, and at least one super-powered menace. There's a new TPB out that collects the first nine issues, and I would highly recommend that.

There are points where Gail Simone's Secret Six was great fun, and other points where it dragged, or got too silly, or strayed too far from what made it so compelling to begin with. However, the Villains United TPB, reprinting the miniseries that launched the Secret Six team, is a great story about a group of villains who aren't quite as evil as all the other supervillains, and it creates a strong friendship and incredible badass moments between two non-powered guys, Catman and Deadshot. I didn't like any of the later Secret Six collections as much as Villains United.

CaptainApathyUK
Sep 6, 2010



I've never read any 616 Fantastic Four but I'm very tempted now because everyone's been banging on about Hickman's run. Should I just start with the Dark Reign TPB where he begins his run or is it worth going back to the Millar/Hitch arcs from just before it?

Would I be lost without reading those at the very least?

Lurdiak
Feb 25, 2006

Everything's coming up Paz!

Millar/Hitch lays a lot of the groundwork for stuff that Hickman uses, and I consider it a very good run on its own, even if it ends with a big self-indulgent story that crosses over with some of Millar's other work. Definitely worth starting with that run. The Dark Reign story is all right as a prelude to Hickman's run and lays some groundwork but doesn't really compare to his actual run.

Happy Hippo
Aug 8, 2004

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > Batman's Shameful Secret > BSS Derailed Thread: Spider-Island


I recently hopped on to Hickman's FF and I started at his Dark Reign mini and had no problems following along. DR serves as a nice intro to his run but doesn't seem completely necessary.

Wachter
Mar 23, 2007

You and whose knees?


Of the two trades of Millar's run, I would suggest getting the first (World's Greatest) and skipping the redundant and infantile second (Masters of Doom). I would also highly recommend Hickman's prologue (Dark Reign: Fantastic Four) which sets the tone for the run proper. Plus, it's a really good story all by itself.

Boco_T
Mar 12, 2003

Keep your energy high with my Beast Power Rap

Summary of why Dark Reign: Fantastic Four is the best:

Only registered members can see post attachments!

Die Laughing
Sep 18, 2009

You engage the Mad Duck

SMAAAAASH!

Thank you! I couldn't remember where I got that line from, and it was driving me nuts.

gogisha
Sep 16, 2006

Takin' it slow at the speed of light.


Is Invincible worth getting into? I know almost nothing about it and based on superficial impressions it looks like general superhero fare. The only thing I've read of Kirkman's is The Walking Dead which I like a lot if that's anything to go on. Comixology is having a sale at the moment so it wouldn't be that much of a risk to try it out I guess.

Lurdiak
Feb 25, 2006

Everything's coming up Paz!

I really enjoyed Invincible as a fun, fresh superhero that isn't based in the Marvel and DC universe for once, at least until the first time he fought someone and guts and blood started flying all over the place. At first I thought it was like a parody of the juxtaposition of light hearted fun and violence in superhero comics (like the power puff girls) but nope, that's literally what Kirkman thinks people want from superhero fight scenes. So I don't know, it felt real stupid and gratuitous and jarring compared to every other thing in the comic, and from what I understand the violence only ramped up from there and the comic keeps having "shock" pages like TWD.

If none of that sounds like it would bother you, it's apparently a pretty fun and funny comic with some cool twists and interesting worldbuilding, but it isn't exactly reinventing the superhero wheel.

bairfanx
Jan 20, 2006

I look like this IRL,
but, you know,
more Greg Land-y.


Lurdiak posted:

Millar/Hitch lays a lot of the groundwork for stuff that Hickman uses, and I consider it a very good run on its own, even if it ends with a big self-indulgent story that crosses over with some of Millar's other work. Definitely worth starting with that run. The Dark Reign story is all right as a prelude to Hickman's run and lays some groundwork but doesn't really compare to his actual run.

They do lay a lot of the ground work, and I'm pretty sure that you don't actually need to read any of it for Hickman. Yeah, he uses pieces, and I'm pretty sure he tells you what you need to know. Millar's stuff is something you can go back to if you want, I wouldn't really say it's worth reading first, though.

IShallRiseAgain
Sep 12, 2008

Well ain't that precious?

Lurdiak posted:

I really enjoyed Invincible as a fun, fresh superhero that isn't based in the Marvel and DC universe for once, at least until the first time he fought someone and guts and blood started flying all over the place. At first I thought it was like a parody of the juxtaposition of light hearted fun and violence in superhero comics (like the power puff girls) but nope, that's literally what Kirkman thinks people want from superhero fight scenes. So I don't know, it felt real stupid and gratuitous and jarring compared to every other thing in the comic, and from what I understand the violence only ramped up from there and the comic keeps having "shock" pages like TWD.

I think it fits in perfectly with the comic. The heroes don't put up with the poo poo villains do and just take care of them if they are a big enough threat, but the heroes also don't go out of their way to kill the villians. The villains actually have consequences for their actions.

Elijya
May 11, 2005

Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.

IShallRiseAgain posted:

I think it fits in perfectly with the comic. The heroes don't put up with the poo poo villains do and just take care of them if they are a big enough threat, but the heroes also don't go out of their way to kill the villians. The villains actually have consequences for their actions.
Early in the series, a villain named Titan brags about how the villain angle of the business is almost consequence free, since heroes won't kill them and busting out of jail is so common place.

Lurdiak
Feb 25, 2006

Everything's coming up Paz!

IShallRiseAgain posted:

I think it fits in perfectly with the comic. The heroes don't put up with the poo poo villains do and just take care of them if they are a big enough threat, but the heroes also don't go out of their way to kill the villians. The villains actually have consequences for their actions.

Not sure what that has to do with all the gore.

bairfanx
Jan 20, 2006

I look like this IRL,
but, you know,
more Greg Land-y.


Lurdiak posted:

Not sure what that has to do with all the gore.

Agreed. The gore is actually why I stopped reading Invincible. It's not that I can't stomach it or anything like that, I just didn't see a need for it, especially when it ended up being a regular part of the series.

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cisneros
Apr 18, 2006

Aight, Adam, I want you to point at the nigga that gave you a dirty sanchez.


Invincible is literally Dragon Ball Z.

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