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East Lake
Sep 13, 2007



It still looks relatively small in this commercial with master travel photographer guy.

Edit: New link to commercial. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjpWaG6Lnhg

East Lake fucked around with this message at Aug 25, 2011 around 23:07

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moonduck
Apr 1, 2005
a tour de force

nothing to see here

moonduck fucked around with this message at Aug 26, 2011 around 17:36

Pompous Rhombus
Mar 11, 2007


East Lake posted:

It still looks relatively small in this commercial with master travel photographer guy.

Well poo poo, there goes $1300 + international shipping.

Studebaker Hawk
May 22, 2004



something something something

Studebaker Hawk fucked around with this message at Aug 26, 2011 around 17:41

Pompous Rhombus
Mar 11, 2007


Studebaker Hawk posted:

Already picked up by mirrorlessrumors.com which I noticed because I am obsessively refreshing for NEX release dates.

Should be November, right?

Bob Socko
Feb 20, 2001

Forum Oilman


Earlier today, I took a walk through Pike Place Market. I was surprised by how many tourists were carrying NEX cameras. I didn't do an exact tally or anything, but I'd guess 20-25% of the non-point-and-shoots were NEXes. Anecdotal, I know, I just thought it was interesting to see so many of them mixed in with the consumer level DSLRs.

The Meat Dimension
Mar 28, 2010


Bob Socko posted:

Earlier today, I took a walk through Pike Place Market. I was surprised by how many tourists were carrying NEX cameras. I didn't do an exact tally or anything, but I'd guess 20-25% of the non-point-and-shoots were NEXes. Anecdotal, I know, I just thought it was interesting to see so many of them mixed in with the consumer level DSLRs.

Jesus that's scary. I was borrowing one and was planning on running down Pike Place with it tomorrow.

I wish that Sony built a leaf shutter into a bloody NEX instead of the one Ziess lens, because I was not expecting the shutter on the NEX-5 to be that loud.

Pompous Rhombus
Mar 11, 2007


Bob Socko posted:

Earlier today, I took a walk through Pike Place Market. I was surprised by how many tourists were carrying NEX cameras. I didn't do an exact tally or anything, but I'd guess 20-25% of the non-point-and-shoots were NEXes. Anecdotal, I know, I just thought it was interesting to see so many of them mixed in with the consumer level DSLRs.

That's kind of counter to my experience, I've seen 0 other NEX's in the wild until I came to Japan. One of the guys at Tokyo Orientation had one, and three of the other teachers here in my city have them as well. The ones in my city went with the 16mm pancake, which is a little surprising because they're novice photographers and don't have any other lenses.

Also, the NEX-7 (or next firmware update) better loving add PictBridge support.

Costello Jello
Oct 24, 2003

It had to start somewhere

I live in NYC so I see cameras all the time everywhere, and I've actually yet to see a NEX camera that wasn't in the hands of a Japanese man. Tons of consumer level Canon and Nikon DSLRs though. And I've seen a number of Panasonic micro4/3 cameras, including the latest G3, but nobody with a PEN camera as of yet.

A couple weeks ago at a museum I saw an older man with a Leica M9. Unfortunately it was too crowded for me to hit him over the head and drag him behind an exhibit.

Bob Socko
Feb 20, 2001

Forum Oilman


Pompous Rhombus posted:

That's kind of counter to my experience, I've seen 0 other NEX's in the wild until I came to Japan. One of the guys at Tokyo Orientation had one, and three of the other teachers here in my city have them as well. The ones in my city went with the 16mm pancake, which is a little surprising because they're novice photographers and don't have any other lenses.
It's counter to my experience as well, which is why I mentioned it. Also, I don't want you guys to think I saw dozens of NEXes today. I saw between twenty and twenty-five interchangable lens cameras today. Of those, five were NEXes, the rest were Canons and Nikons.

HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

I see some NEXes here and there, as I did in Europe as well. The vast, vast majority of folks are carrying Rebels and Dxx cameras. Kit lenses, of course.

Zhentar
Sep 28, 2003

Brilliant Master Genius


HPL posted:

The vast, vast majority of folks are carrying Rebels and Dxx cameras. Kit lenses, of course.

And from what I saw in Europe, 3/4s of those who aren't on kit lenses appreciate the stylish look of reversed lens hoods over the functional direction.

Saint Fu
Sep 27, 2007
hit 'em with the rhythm make 'em feelin alright now

When I went to Hong Kong last year I felt like NEXs were everywhere. I'd say ~30% of the non-point and shoots.

Fiannaiocht
Aug 21, 2008


All I've been seeing in Disney world is L glass and lens hoods actually being used. The only UV filters I've seen are on the employee photographers. It's a good thing to see.

The Meat Dimension
Mar 28, 2010


Got back from PAX, nothing trendbreaking except... the horrifying thing was that bridge cameras seemed about as plentiful as point-and-shoots.

The Meat Dimension fucked around with this message at Aug 27, 2011 around 15:47

HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

Thors Banhammer posted:

Got back from PAX, nothing trendbreaking except... the horrifying thing was that bridge cameras seemed about as plentiful as point-and-shoots.

Bridge cameras seem to be popular with the folks that would really be better served with a Rebel with a kit lens, but they're intimidated by the whole DSLR thing. Either that or they got swayed by the "20x zoom!" thing.

Lon Lon Rabbit
Mar 27, 2006
Here comes a special boy!

A year ago in Kyoto/Osaka/Nagoya I saw a lot of Pens and the occasional Panasonic.

These days in the same areas I never see a single Panasonic, but I see a lot of Pens and NEXs.

I find the marketing really interesting.

(WARNING anecdotal) My girlfriend's fashion magazines always rant on about "retro cameras" being important to a lot of outfits these days, and Olympus' marketing really seems to be going for that. Most of the Pen marketing I see here is all young girls in fields enjoying their life with a camera always by their side, and there's several different monthly books and magazines of girls documenting their life with Pens (I ate this I bought this I saw this cat etc).

When I think about it, most of the Pens I see are all on young girls (or older women dressing young), and most of the NEXs are all in the hands of guys.

How are they being marketed in the west?

EDIT: Oh yeah and there's also a billion more accessories made available by/for Olympus, because they are basically selling the cameras as accessories to girls in the first place. TONNES of official strap and lens cap variations in different designs etc.

Here's the Olympus.jp Pen "adsite" http://olympuspen.com/jp/ad/

Like I said, girls in fields... Most of the print ads I see are less dramatic though, more low key/soft tone type stuff.

Lon Lon Rabbit fucked around with this message at Aug 29, 2011 around 01:11

HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

All I know is that in Canada, they are aiming Canon Rebel marketing at hockey moms. I think I've seen a Lumix ad with some guy walking around in a park talking about how easy it is to use. Basically, I think the bulk of the DSLR/mirrorless camera marketing is aimed at people who don't know how to use them because all they ever talk about is ease of use.

mattfl
Aug 27, 2004


Ok so I think I've decided on getting rid of my 50D and 17-50f2.8 and 70-200f2.8 lens and switching to either m4/3 or NEX gear.

Thinking of going with the NEX-5N. Looking for something I can carry around more easily with interchangeable lenses. The 70-200f2.8 I have is way over kill than anything I could ever use it for so I'm not too concerned with loosing that. Any other options I should be looking at?

-Anders
Feb 1, 2007

Denmark. Wait, what?

Just be wary of the small amount of lenses available for the e-mount.
Other than that, I am very happy about my NEX-3, although it's not entirely small even with the 16mm pancake lens.

mattfl
Aug 27, 2004


Oh god I don't know what to do.

Fuji X100
Sony NEX-5N
Olympus PEN E-PL3

Too many choices.

What I want to be able to do/shoot.

Carry something smallish around instead of my 50d + whatever lens.

Shoot general walk around stuff, friends at parties, landscape type stuff.

Interchangeable lenses would be nice, but larger lenses start adding bulk.

Everything is telling me the X100 is the perfect camera for what I want to do. Something small, light, fast as poo poo lens, excellent image quality.

HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

mattfl posted:

Everything is telling me the X100 is the perfect camera for what I want to do. Something small, light, fast as poo poo lens, excellent image quality.

Don't overlook a Rebel. A Rebel with a kit lens should be at least as good as your garden variety NEX or PEN and isn't that much larger. The problem with today's mirrorless interchangeable lens cameras is that they can shrink the body down until it's tiny, but the lenses are still the same size. The only way you'd get a really compact interchangeable system is if you got a PEN Mini, the new 12-24 pancake and a Panasonic 20mm f/1.7 pancake.

A Rebel would also have the advantage of using your existing EF lenses plus it can be a backup body for your 50D.

Other than that, the X100 is the major option if you want to cash in, size-wise.

mattfl
Aug 27, 2004


HPL posted:

Don't overlook a Rebel. A Rebel with a kit lens should be at least as good as your garden variety NEX or PEN and isn't that much larger. The problem with today's mirrorless interchangeable lens cameras is that they can shrink the body down until it's tiny, but the lenses are still the same size. The only way you'd get a really compact interchangeable system is if you got a PEN Mini, the new 12-24 pancake and a Panasonic 20mm f/1.7 pancake.

A Rebel would also have the advantage of using your existing EF lenses plus it can be a backup body for your 50D.

Other than that, the X100 is the major option if you want to cash in, size-wise.

I've been seeing the 20mm pancake lens being mentioned as the lens to have for m4/3, but I'm not seeing anything on the 12-24. Can you point me in the direction of that one?

HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

mattfl posted:

I've been seeing the 20mm pancake lens being mentioned as the lens to have for m4/3, but I'm not seeing anything on the 12-24. Can you point me in the direction of that one?

http://www.dpreview.com/news/1108/1...-42Xpreview.asp

mattfl
Aug 27, 2004



14-42...that's why I couldn't find it

edit:

ok so this is pretty dam cool. So this + the 20mm pancake would be pretty awesome on a m4/3 camera.

hmmm.

mattfl fucked around with this message at Sep 1, 2011 around 16:18

Costello Jello
Oct 24, 2003

It had to start somewhere


Holy crap, I want.

ChiTownEddie
Mar 26, 2010

Awesome beer, no pants.
Join the Legion.


This Zuiko 12mm and the Panasonic 20mm are what I would get on an EP (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...Digital_ED.html)

That lens looks hawt.

That said I loved my NEX, the much mentioned downside is that it has a tiny fraction of the available lenses as m4/3rds.

Man_of_Teflon
Aug 15, 2003
My dick is the bomb.

I just got the 20mm 1.7 recently, having only had the kit 14-42 before aside from a bunch of FD lenses for film stuff. It's sweet having a bright prime but drat does this thing autofocus slow kinda wish I'd gone for the 14mm 2.5 instead as apparently it's much faster and $100 cheaper.

poopinmymouth
Mar 2, 2005

PROUD 2 B AMERICAN (these colors don't run)

HPL posted:

Don't overlook a Rebel.

Other than that, the X100 is the major option if you want to cash in, size-wise.

Not only is the X100 significantly smaller than a rebel, like ludicrously so, but the viewfinder on the X100 is 5x nicer than the Rebels. It's literally as large and bright as the 5D viewfinder, instead of the dim tunnel you get on the rebel. (I know you were saying rebel as compared to the mirrorless interchangeable cameras though)

Yeah you can't change lenses, but you are essentially getting a 5D with 35mmL in performance and image quality and viewfinder size and build quality, but in a diminutive package.

mattfl
Aug 27, 2004


poopinmymouth posted:

Not only is the X100 significantly smaller than a rebel, like ludicrously so, but the viewfinder on the X100 is 5x nicer than the Rebels. It's literally as large and bright as the 5D viewfinder, instead of the dim tunnel you get on the rebel. (I know you were saying rebel as compared to the mirrorless interchangeable cameras though)

Yeah you can't change lenses, but you are essentially getting a 5D with 35mmL in performance and image quality and viewfinder size and build quality, but in a diminutive package.

I spent all day yesterday researching cameras. Ugh so much info. My final decision, at least for this minute, is to get the x100. Seems they hold their value really well and if it's not for me I can easily unload it.

Now to unload my canon gear!

Shmoogy
Mar 21, 2007


mattfl posted:

Seems they hold their value really well and if it's not for me I can easily unload it.

I wouldn't count on this for much longer. They're doing really well now because they aren't in stock anywhere, but once they are, I expect used ones to sell for 1000~ shortly after. Once the x200 comes in, the first generation will probably fall to 800ish.

Not bad, but bodies depreciate rather quickly compared to just lenses.

poopinmymouth
Mar 2, 2005

PROUD 2 B AMERICAN (these colors don't run)

mattfl posted:

I spent all day yesterday researching cameras. Ugh so much info. My final decision, at least for this minute, is to get the x100. Seems they hold their value really well and if it's not for me I can easily unload it.

Now to unload my canon gear!

Why does holding their value matter? I'm using a 5D original, I'm the 3rd owner, and it's what, 8 years old now? I plan to use it till it falls apart in my hands, and I feel the same with the x100. Get a good camera (the x100 is good) and use it. Whenever you get upgrade-itis, buy a bunch of prints, or go on a photo trip instead.

One of the upsides of non-interchangeable lenses, is there is nothing else to buy. You get the X100, and then go focus on being a photographer, rather than what new lens or doohicky you should buy. Use it for 5-10 years, then upgrade. The quality of the prints the X100 makes isn't ever going to go down, and the prints look amazing.

mattfl
Aug 27, 2004


Shmoogy posted:

I wouldn't count on this for much longer. They're doing really well now because they aren't in stock anywhere, but once they are, I expect used ones to sell for 1000~ shortly after. Once the x200 comes in, the first generation will probably fall to 800ish.

Not bad, but bodies depreciate rather quickly compared to just lenses.

I don't expect it to take me that long to figure out if it's for me or not. Like, a week or 2 so, not too worried about the x200 which isn't even rumored yet to come out and drop the price. The X10 was just announced and I don't expect it to affect the X100's price at all.

poopinmymouth
Mar 2, 2005

PROUD 2 B AMERICAN (these colors don't run)

mattfl posted:

I don't expect it to take me that long to figure out if it's for me or not. Like, a week or 2 so, not too worried about the x200 which isn't even rumored yet to come out and drop the price. The X10 was just announced and I don't expect it to affect the X100's price at all.

Why not buy it from Amazon or a place with a return policy then? But also, keep in mind that it is a very different camera than a DSLR. If you just pick it up without reading the manual or understanding how the focus system works, you might get frustrated with it. But learn how the parallax works, and when to switch to the EVF mode, plus decouple the AF to the back button rather than the shutter half press, and then give it some time shooting a lot for several days in a row and it's a really great experience.

ThisQuietReverie
Jul 22, 2004

I am not as I was.


Fuji has made their announcement for the X10 so I'm guessing the X100 will be their flagship for a while.

PIMM's right about the fixed length. I find it more freeing than restrictive. If I were strictly an opportunistic photo taker, the X100 would fit the bill for a long time. I try real hard not to be so I still need a 7D and lens system for a backup.

poopinmymouth
Mar 2, 2005

PROUD 2 B AMERICAN (these colors don't run)

ThisQuietReverie posted:

Fuji has made their announcement for the X10 so I'm guessing the X100 will be their flagship for a while.

PIMM's right about the fixed length. I find it more freeing than restrictive. If I were strictly an opportunistic photo taker, the X100 would fit the bill for a long time. I try real hard not to be so I still need a 7D and lens system for a backup.

That's where it fits beautifully though (assuming you have the spare cash) as your second camera. I still have a 5d + 35/50/85mm lenses, and I use them for paying gigs, or when I go on a trip where I know it's "photographer mode time". But for every day when I bicycle to work, go to the gym, walk down to the grocery store, having the 5D over my shoulder, even with the 50mm 1.8 would be such a drag. The X100 you can just wear and forget, and still get the image quality of your 7d/5d/d3/dslr. You're not sacrificing anything at all (besides lens changing) from your main camera like you are with an s90, or m4/3. You have literally the same quality (or if you don't have an L lens and full frame camera even better than) in a smaller package.

DRP Solved!
Dec 2, 2009


poopinmymouth posted:

That's where it fits beautifully though (assuming you have the spare cash) as your second camera. I still have a 5d + 35/50/85mm lenses, and I use them for paying gigs, or when I go on a trip where I know it's "photographer mode time". But for every day when I bicycle to work, go to the gym, walk down to the grocery store, having the 5D over my shoulder, even with the 50mm 1.8 would be such a drag. The X100 you can just wear and forget, and still get the image quality of your 7d/5d/d3/dslr. You're not sacrificing anything at all (besides lens changing) from your main camera like you are with an s90, or m4/3. You have literally the same quality (or if you don't have an L lens and full frame camera even better than) in a smaller package.

Stop splooging about the X100 in here... you're making it difficult for me to resist the urge to buy one!

Zurich
Jan 4, 2008


Is it worth upgrading from a GF1 + 20mm to an X100? I haven't played with an X100 in person (mainly because I have no impulse control); is it a huge step up in quality?

I'm really not happy with the direction Panasonic are taking the GF series - thought the GF2 was just a temporary blip but the GF3 is awful - everything the GF1 is not

poopinmymouth
Mar 2, 2005

PROUD 2 B AMERICAN (these colors don't run)

Zurich posted:

Is it worth upgrading from a GF1 + 20mm to an X100? I haven't played with an X100 in person (mainly because I have no impulse control); is it a huge step up in quality?

I'm really not happy with the direction Panasonic are taking the GF series - thought the GF2 was just a temporary blip but the GF3 is awful - everything the GF1 is not

I don't think it's going to be huge. You'll get 2-3 stops of ISO improvement, lots more dynamic range, but if I remember correctly, the GF1 + 20mm actually records a few more lines per inch (meaning it's sharper) than the X100, though I doubt the 20mm is as free of vignetting and CA as the X100, since it basically has none whatsoever.

The larger upgrade is the viewfinder. Whatever importance that plays in your mind should make the main part of your decision. If you don't care so much about arms length composing, it's just a reasonable sensor upgrade in dynamic range and noise, but if you care a lot about clear optical viewfinders, then it's a pretty huge leap forward.

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Chim
Jun 23, 2004
Shop Smart, Shop S-Mart!

Zurich posted:

Is it worth upgrading from a GF1 + 20mm to an X100? I haven't played with an X100 in person (mainly because I have no impulse control); is it a huge step up in quality?

I'm really not happy with the direction Panasonic are taking the GF series - thought the GF2 was just a temporary blip but the GF3 is awful - everything the GF1 is not


I had a GF1 and a 20mm and sold that way back in teh day because I still lugged around my d700 instead of the GF1 for nearly any occasion I wanted a camera.

I now have a x100 and sold the D700 because of the exact same reason that my GF1 was sold...

It may not look like much on paper, but the IQ and ergonomics and form factor absolutely kills on the x100. Its a pure photographic joyride, I can't recommend it enough.

To put things in perspective, I shot the d700 with a 24 1.4. Nearly 4500 bucks worth of gear. I found the x100 IQ to be similar enough to the point where I sold the d700 (in anticipation of the d800, but still. Haven't missed the d700 at all)

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