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SB35 posted:China is a great place, and I wouldn't keep living here if I didn't enjoy it. That said, it's not really the place for the most profit potential. Yeah living is rather cheap, and you may be paid decently. But if you have any bills at home, it's just not enough. As far as western amenities are concerned, Taiwan, Korea and Japan probably have more (unless you live in BJ or SH, then you're okay). Chengdu is a great place to live I'm sure, but you won't stumble into a tech job unless you're getting to know people and really networking, especially with other expats that aren't there to teach. I meant higher pay and western amenities(western toilets for foreigners) relative to other countries I was looking at (Thailand, Vietnam, Indonesia). Korea and Japan would be interesting but I am more interested in countries that are developing and have fewer western influences. Plus I want to learn mandarin. Taiwan is my next stop if I can't find a decent job in China. Also I have no expectations of finding a job other then TEFL, but I heard Chengdu was the "silicon valley of China" and figured it wouldn't hurt to keep my ears open for a job proofreading chinglish tech manuals or something. SB35 posted:You can come here and then find a job, that's certainly doable. Probably the easiest way to find a job and make sure it isn't gonna suck. Even if you get here in a week or two, the only jobs available right now are schools desperate for a teacher or training schools (available all year 'round), though you could easily work at a training school for the first semester and get some experience while looking for a better job. That would be fine, I realize I'm a little late out of the gate and I need to get some experience anyway. I don't mind being flexible until I establish myself and get some classroom hours. SB35 posted:To get the tourist visa you have to submit proof of a plane ticket purchase. You could submit an itinerary that you haven't actually paid for and probably still get it. Also, it really only takes about 1 week to get your visa after you buy the ticket, or as few as a couple days if it's expedited. Good to know, I live near DC though so I will have to look into just going there in person. Provided we all survive the weekend atleast. I live on Delmarva and I am secretly hoping Irene comes through and drops a tree on my car so Nationwide can fund my move across the world.
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 04:56 |
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| # ? May 23, 2013 01:01 |
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NighteyesUMD posted:I meant higher pay and western amenities(western toilets for foreigners) relative to other countries I was looking at (Thailand, Vietnam, Indonesia). Korea and Japan would be interesting but I am more interested in countries that are developing and have fewer western influences. Plus I want to learn mandarin. Taiwan is my next stop if I can't find a decent job in China. Also I have no expectations of finding a job other then TEFL, but I heard Chengdu was the "silicon valley of China" and figured it wouldn't hurt to keep my ears open for a job proofreading chinglish tech manuals or something. As others have said... yea, you're not gonna be picking up some tech job here with no Mandarin and without tons of experience in the field and contacts to get you in... You are not gonna be making any money at it, especially seeing as they have endless native Chinese speaking engineers to pick from who won't be insulted with a 4000 salary starting.... Foreigners in IT in China are rarely if ever the coders... more of upper-middle to upper management. Learning Chinese is of course the right approach, but do be aware, you will be here for years before it's up to par enough to be worth anything in the job market... Wages in Chengdu are not all that high and the property market there is kinda crazy. Nice place though all said and done however. If you want to go the absolute best method for getting your rear end in here and staying a long time to land something real... Come in on an L and swap over to a 6-month F asap (or buy an F down in Hong Kong in the first place). You eventually will be wanting to get yourself a Z/RP and F's are easy as all hell to convert over, whereas Ls have a tendency to leave you hosed really fast. Technically, yes, you can come over and buy a Z/RP, but it ain't cheap and there are lotsa scammers Pick a big city, come over and immediately start hitting the ads and streets for part-time work. Tutoring pays well, recording pays well (harder to get), there are editing jobs as well. You are going to want to research this in advance and you are gonna want to have enough savings to pay for: Plane tickets (both ways, you'll want to be able to bail out if you have to) 4 months of housing (3 months in advance plus 1 month deposit... depends on the city, but for chengdu, i'd plan on that number being around 8000 RMB or $1300. For Beijing, you'll want to double that amount) 1 month of hotel and basic living costs (figure 250RMB a day x 30 = 7500 RMB or $1200) $1000 of petty cash for visa runs (a good F with no contacts and no Chinese speaking... yea, you'll get jacked a bit, expect around 3000 RMB for a 6 month) and other stuff that comes up (cell phone, taxis, food, utilities, etc). If you are wanting to get into the IT world over here, your absolute best bet (short of getting an offer stateside and being stationed here) is probably going to be as an intern, ideally in a large company. Also plan on at some point saving up enough cash to take a year off and enroll in actual Chinese classes... yes you can still do your tutoring stuff on the side, but I'd limit it to that. Can you do all this cheaper? Yep, you bet! But you probably won't enjoy it at the time. Stay in a hotel or hostel for that first month, your goal is to replenish your expenses entirely for that first month and be prepared to move elsewhere if something better in another city comes along until you are settled down. Also those toilets you speak of? In a hotel? sure. In your apartment? you bet! out in public... i advise to practice your squatting form and as a tip, your other back pocket is for TP.... also, get really comfortable with the idea of people being able to watch you poop. Not to spoil the fun... none of this is to detract you from coming over, it's merely to let you know what you're getting into and what to expect. Who knows, you might have a common name and you land at the airport and there's a guy from a F500 holding a sign with your name on it and you walk right into another guy's job and just run with it.. just be a bit realistic all's I'm sayin.
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 08:10 |
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Booger Presley posted:The worst thing about nearly all of the fights involving the Chinese teams is they resort to slinging chairs at people and stomping folks while on the ground. I wasn't even talking about sports - even in barfights the general strategy is to push someone over and get your friends to kick the poo poo out of him. Not much kung-fu going on in this country, really.
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 08:47 |
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I have a squat toilet in my apartment. I'm actually starting to prefer them over western toilets for everything except ducking out of work to play peggle for 15 minutes
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 11:29 |
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Has anyone done any volunteering in China? Does that even exist?
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 12:33 |
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Volunteering certainly does exist, there are even people who pay for the privilege of teaching English  There are other kinds though, such as orphanages.Most NGOs are supported by European/Australian/North American people anyways so it's certainly a possibility. I have heard that the relationship between NGOs and the government can be tenuous at times but it's really organization specific. I don't have more specific information, but I think the non profit sector is one of those rare times when searching in English would actually be more productive than in Chinese. e: I realize you asked about volunteering, not non-profit sector, but that seems like a good place to start when looking for people that need volunteers PPL- Why would he have to pay 3000 RMB for a visa, shouldn't that be more like 800? :/ Speaking of visas, I wonder why nobody ever mentions the same day option. You have to pay $30 extra but it's very convenient-- last time I showed up an hour or two before the consulate opened at 9, had a nice chat with some people. Then at 9 I literally walked in and handed my paperwork and was done with it, went to brunch with a friend in Manhattan, and picked up my papers at 11. Seems a lot more convenient than heading out twice, you pay about the same as if you were paying for a visa service(I heard up to $50 actually), but you get it the same day. double edit: Haha I just noticed that comment about Western toilets. There are like never Western toilets in public in China. Maybe at "upscale" malls. They had squat toilets at the World Expo V Oh... wouldn't it be cheaper to get a legit student visa by means of enrolling in college? Hell if you put some effort in you can win a scholarship to go for free So many things people do about China puzzle me
hitension fucked around with this message at Aug 25, 2011 around 14:01 |
| # ? Aug 25, 2011 13:09 |
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Talkin' about buying the visa of your choice as opposed to applying for one you're legitimately entitled to. As for the world expo, most of the attendees were Chinese from other cities. Give that many people western toilets and they'd find some way to turn it into a poo poo holocaust.
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 13:37 |
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hitension posted:
Every public western toilet I've seen in China is something I'd never want to even hover around. Given the choice, I always went for squatters. What really irked me more than anything though, was in our school we had one really nice bathroom for the teachers and the parents would always barge in to use it. Use it by STANDING ON AND SQUATTING ON THE WESTERN TOILET LEAVING DIRTY rear end FOOTPRINTS ON THE SEAT.
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 14:14 |
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Magna Kaser posted:Every public western toilet I've seen in China is something I'd never want to even hover around. Given the choice, I always went for squatters. Oh most definitely... Generally the issue with the sitters is that the cleaning staff DOES NOT WANT to clean them. For squatters they just run the piss-smelling mop over the edges and done, move on. Sitters are more of a pain, so they go out of their way to break them or otherwise make them inoperable. My favorite was where the guy disconnected the chain in the tank, claiming it was broken. Really loving hated me for fixing it. Or it's wired shut entirely, or they break the seat off of it, or they tear the door off the stall. It's never an accident. For public toilets in the winter, it's mentally healthier if you just assume all that slippery mess on the floor is mud. edit: chinese toilet humor! Chinese toilets have that tiny little basket next to them to shove the used toilet paper in because the plumbing is poo poo and will back up. This is also the case in many homes. Toilet paper goes into the waste basket. However, when it comes to cooking, any and all liquid and scraps of food? Flush that! Toilet can't handle a wad of paper designed to be flushed, but I'm sure it can handle half a duck carcass. Pro-PRC Laowai fucked around with this message at Aug 25, 2011 around 15:47 |
| # ? Aug 25, 2011 15:41 |
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huhu posted:Has anyone done any volunteering in China? Does that even exist? I'm kind of selfish and never donate my time to altruistic endeavors, and I do admire the drive, but I would be a little careful about the details of volunteering. It's not something Chinese people normally do, at least not in the same way that people do in the US. I have had friends over here who volunteered to teach English classes for free in rural Sichuan and found flyers advertising their services and prices all over the village printed up by the "volunteer" organization. I've known other people who were involved in volunteering for an orphanage that, it turned out, mostly just took children away from poor farmers and sold them to rich white foreigners. Now there's nothing wrong necessarily with someone charging money for you to teach English, or spending your free time tutoring orphans who were stolen from loving families by corrupt officials because their families didn't have enough money to pay the local government to look the other way, children who will be essentially sold for thousands of dollars to good Christian families that sincerely think they are adopting an unwanted child. In both cases you're really just spending time helping people, but at the same time there's a level of deceit going on that turns altruism on its head. Of course I'm sure that there are plenty of legitimate volunteer organizations. I'm just saying - like choosing a school to work at - try to be aware of exactly what you're getting into.
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 15:46 |
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huhu posted:Has anyone done any volunteering in China? Does that even exist? Habitat for Humanity is huge. They have an office in Shanghai and travel all over rural China. Your best bet is to ask an international school. IB Programme has a community service component, so they tend to know where the less sketch volunteering groups are. There are old folks homes and migrant schools you can volunteer at, but going through a school will cut through a lot of the red tape.
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 16:26 |
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As far as Shanghai jobs go, Berlitz is hiring. The pay is crap though. 110 rmb per 45 minute block, part time has no guaranteed hours. 4 days UNPAID training plus a demo and then maybe youre offered a contract. Full time isnt much better so I'd avoid that. If anyone is interested, go for it! I had an interview today and they weren't exactly selling the position. The way I see it, its a good way to get your feet wet until you find something better!
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| # ? Aug 25, 2011 19:42 |
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For anyone travelling through Shanghai, and you need to be close to the South Rail station, I just stayed in the L'otel Hotel ( http://www.lotelchina.com ). It is the cleanest hotel I have visited here, far more than any Shanghai 5 star. (being smoke free keeps most of the hackers and spitters out, obviously.)
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| # ? Aug 26, 2011 00:10 |
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huhu posted:Has anyone done any volunteering in China? Does that even exist? We've got a couple decent local ones here in Xi'an. Yellow River Soup Kitchen - a foreigner-run soup kitchen, 100% of donations go to people who need it. Just talked to this guy last night and he's got some great stories; been "arrested" or asked to come down to the police station 12x just in 2011 and every time it's the same thing. "What are you doing?", "Why are you doing it?", "Where do you get the food/money?". They just can't understand that there ISN'T an ulterior motive, he simply wants to help people who need it, and anyone who wants to be paid off to allow him to continue or provide him "help" he's told to gently caress-off. After a few years and seeing the work he's done, he's got a lot people behind him and enough guanxi but there's always someone else to yank you around. Starfish Foster Home - Don't really know anything about this, but they apparently help disabled kids. Especially those that need medical attention (like born with deformities) The Library Project - started in Dalian by Tom Stader, a current Xi'an resident, and has spread far and wide. NighteyesUMD posted:Talk about moving to Chengdu If I was in your position, this is what I'd do:
SB35 fucked around with this message at Aug 27, 2011 around 02:29 |
| # ? Aug 26, 2011 12:39 |
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So I'm in Beijing now. The company that brought me over doesn't actually have a job for me yet even though they guaranteed one. I turned down some nice teaching jobs in Japan and Korea because I love this city. They tried to ship me out to some city in Heibei province, but I was having none of it since they promised I'd be in Beijing. They've also moved me from a very nice apartment near Sihui station to an apartment near Sihui East that reeks of poo poo and has bugs crawling everywhere. I've been going around doing teaching demos the last few days with no results. Its kind of frustrating because some people were hired without even doing a demo. The agency told me that everyone wants Americans. Apparently Canadian just doesn't cut it. I'm now trying to find a job anywhere in the teaching/writing/editing/I know English real well sector. I want to stay in Beijing and my Mandarin is growing steadily since I need to survive on it. Also if I have to go back to Canada I'll be broke with no place to live. Just wanted to vent. I have to go do a physical on the other side of town in a few hours. Gonna get drunk tonight. My number is 13261144867 if anyone wants to hang out or whatever.
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| # ? Aug 26, 2011 22:29 |
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Pro-PRC Laowai posted:As others have said... yea, you're not gonna be picking up some tech job here with no Mandarin and without tons of experience in the field and contacts to get you in... You are not gonna be making any money at it, especially seeing as they have endless native Chinese speaking engineers to pick from who won't be insulted with a 4000 salary starting.... Foreigners in IT in China are rarely if ever the coders... more of upper-middle to upper management. I was able to get an IT job in Beijing when I got here, but that was about 8 years ago when there were fewer local IT guys around. It was local wages, but it was fun and quite the experience. Are you a sysadmin-type or a programmer? You have to think that the only advantage you have is that you aren't Chinese so you can try to sell yourself to companies that are worried about Intellectual Property. That leads more to the sysadmin jobs. Beijing is a little easier. I see positions for Embassies every once in a while, and some hire third-country local hires for IT jobs, if you are from one of the 'five friendlies' look into those (US, UK, Canada, Australia, or New Zealand). I know the Australian Embassy had an opening for an IT guy (from one of the preferred countries), and the pay was over 200,000 rmb a year.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 02:21 |
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Private Snowball posted:Apparently Canadian just doesn't cut it.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 04:55 |
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It's probably more difficult to find decent work in Beijing right now than it was in the past.. School is starting now so they already have teachers hired, ongoing joblessness in America, lots of recent graduates coming over, etc. Your chances of finding something good are also significantly reduced by insisting on staying in Beijing rather than somewhere like Tianjin. On a side note, I got my university schedule today - all freshmen, and they have military training so class doesn't start until October 10th. This comes after a two-month vacation (last semester ended June 15) so I've had something like 4 months of paid vacation this summer? I'm so bored...
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 05:20 |
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Be Depressive posted:It's probably more difficult to find decent work in Beijing right now than it was in the past.. School is starting now so they already have teachers hired, ongoing joblessness in America, lots of recent graduates coming over, etc. Your chances of finding something good are also significantly reduced by insisting on staying in Beijing rather than somewhere like Tianjin. Embrace it! I am teaching 5 different sets of curriculum and have so much planning I think my head is going to explode. So much for Beijing sightseeing!
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 07:03 |
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B-Rad posted:Embrace it! I am teaching 5 different sets of curriculum and have so much planning I think my head is going to explode. So much for Beijing sightseeing! What kind of a school are you teaching for B-Rad? Private Snowball posted:Just wanted to vent. I have to go do a physical on the other side of town in a few hours. Gonna get drunk tonight. drat, sorry to hear things are going so lovely for you. I still get some hits from headhunters and agencies contacting me about work from time to time, I can try and pass them onto you if you want.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 08:13 |
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Aero737 posted:
Yeah that would be great thanks. The only problem for me is trying to find a place to stay on my own. I'm going to give this place a week and if it doesn't pan out I'll try other options. Also Be Depressive everyone from my group has been hired except me and there are still positions out there.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 08:51 |
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Private Snowball posted:I'm now trying to find a job anywhere in the teaching/writing/editing/I know English real well sector. I want to stay in Beijing and my Mandarin is growing steadily since I need to survive on it. Also if I have to go back to Canada I'll be broke with no place to live. My work may be getting super-busy soon, I'm not sure if they need new people or not, but if they do, I can pass your resume on. It'd be editing press releases, basically. Not super interesting, and not terribly well paid, but it'd be better than nothing. If they do need people, do you have an email address I could give to them? I could also ask around about English teaching jobs for you, I have a couple of friends who are working at a few different companies.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 10:51 |
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Thanks for all the volunteer responses. hitension posted:Speaking of visas, I wonder why nobody ever mentions the same day option. You have to pay $30 extra but it's very convenient-- last time I showed up an hour or two before the consulate opened at 9, had a nice chat with some people. Then at 9 I literally walked in and handed my paperwork and was done with it, went to brunch with a friend in Manhattan, and picked up my papers at 11. Seems a lot more convenient than heading out twice, you pay about the same as if you were paying for a visa service(I heard up to $50 actually), but you get it the same day. Just wanted to note on this. I did the same thing and while it's still quick I spent a total of about five hours waiting in line that day and just had enough time to meet my sister for lunch and then head back to wait in line again.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 11:29 |
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Aero737 posted:What kind of a school are you teaching for B-Rad? I teach for a pretty reputable international school, so they expect a lot from their teachers. The class sizes are small, around 15, but the amount of preparation require is ridiculous because the kids are so bright. They blow through any work I give them in half the expected time.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 12:20 |
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huhu posted:Thanks for all the volunteer responses. Yep, the secret with Chinese visas is to be there about 30-60 minutes before they open in the morning and just sit/stand in line. Have all paperwork filled out and good to go and you'll be out of there in like 10 minutes. Come back in an hour or two and it's good to go... last time I got a visa outside of China, I just skipped the line and walked right up to the window with my claim ticket, stupidly fast. Show up after the line forms though, and you'll be there many hours.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 13:43 |
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So, how do I find Chinese people to practice Chinese with on QQ? Just upload a picture of my white face and sift through all the offers of sex until I find some cool people?
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 13:48 |
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Arakan posted:So, how do I find Chinese people to practice Chinese with on QQ? Just upload a picture of my white face and sift through all the offers of sex until I find some cool people? My qq message near my name says 你好，我是美国人，我找中国朋友, and I get plenty of sane people talking with me (mostly college-aged and female), and no sex solicitation (yet).
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 14:02 |
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Private Snowball posted:Yeah that would be great thanks. The only problem for me is trying to find a place to stay on my own. I'm going to give this place a week and if it doesn't pan out I'll try other options. PS, didn't you say earlier that you had dark colored skin? For some reason that sticks out in my mind, it actually jumps off the screen when I read your post, though I don't know why. Either way, if that is the case, people in China could be treating you differently for that. Because people in China are a tad racist. If you do not have dark skin, then just ignore this entire post.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 14:19 |
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Private Snowball posted:Also Be Depressive everyone from my group has been hired except me and there are still positions out there. Well I didn't say you can't find a job now, just that it's probably more difficult than, say, 2 years ago. Schools in Beijing probably aren't desperate for teachers at the moment. There are plenty of other places where they're still desperate, though. Speaking of which, my friend in Yinchuan works at a kindergarten that's desperate for teachers. He keeps asking me to post about it again here. They keep hiring shady people who run off, so he's hoping to find a coworker of decent quality. PM me if anyone is interested, and I can send his details. The salary isn't bad.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 15:23 |
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Be Depressive posted:Well I didn't say you can't find a job now, just that it's probably more difficult than, say, 2 years ago. Schools in Beijing probably aren't desperate for teachers at the moment. There are plenty of other places where they're still desperate This is quite true. I know of a few positions here in Shaanxi that are out in smaller cities/towns. They pay well (~8,000-10,000) per month and living costs there would be stupid cheap. Only problem is there isn't much in the way of an expat community (maybe one or two bar buddies) and you don't have many amenities (only KFC and maybe a Vanguard). But they are rather desperate and would be willing to hire just about any warm body that looks foreign and speaks English. As another topic, just had a, for the most part, good Taobao experience. Bought a 220v power supply for my Wii (American Wiis only come with a 110v brick) and after about 3 weeks it keeps crapping out after an hour or so of use. The guy is gonna pay for return shipping and give me a refund. He also recommended a different power supply (albeit slightly more expensive) that he claims no one has had any complaints or problems with. Guess we'll see how it works out, I just wanna be able to play my games. To my Chinese friends the Wii is as amazing and novel as it was to me 5 years ago. Girlfriend loves it and buddies girlfriend is begging him to buy one.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 15:42 |
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SB35 posted:This is quite true. I know of a few positions here in Shaanxi that are out in smaller cities/towns. They pay well (~8,000-10,000) per month and living costs there would be stupid cheap. Only problem is there isn't much in the way of an expat community (maybe one or two bar buddies) and you don't have many amenities (only KFC and maybe a Vanguard). But they are rather desperate and would be willing to hire just about any warm body that looks foreign and speaks English. This is the same thing with living in Tianjin, though obviously Tianjin is significantly bigger than some rural town in Shaanxi.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 17:22 |
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Does anyone know of short term housing sites in Beijing? I am moving there to study for 8 months and would like to have something set up for the first month so I'm not running around. Also, any Beijing Mandarin schools that stand out? I arrive in late October so I can't sign up for the Universities.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 19:24 |
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Arakan posted:So, how do I find Chinese people to practice Chinese with on QQ? Just upload a picture of my white face and sift through all the offers of sex until I find some cool people? Hit up your IRL Chinese buddies for their QQ, everyone in this country is issued a QQ number at birth.
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| # ? Aug 27, 2011 19:43 |
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goldboilermark posted:PS, didn't you say earlier that you had dark colored skin? For some reason that sticks out in my mind, it actually jumps off the screen when I read your post, though I don't know why. Either way, if that is the case, people in China could be treating you differently for that. Because people in China are a tad racist. Yeah not that dark, people sometimes guess I'm Peruvian. I didn't really want to come in this thread yelling I wasn't getting a job because of my skin colour. The agency I work for has been hinting at it though. I just don't get why they accepted me if they knew this would happen. I sent them a picture of myself and it wasn't like I used some Myspace angle that made me white.
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| # ? Aug 28, 2011 01:06 |
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menino posted:Does anyone know of short term housing sites in Beijing? I am moving there to study for 8 months and would like to have something set up for the first month so I'm not running around. Hostels of course. Some will be willing to give you a discount if you tell them straight up you wanna stay for a month. There's always couch surfing, staying with a goon in his basement sounds pleasant. Private Snowball you're here at a good time. Schools are about to start and desperate now. Are you willing to leave Beijing? I can probably find you something here in Xi'an pretty easily. SB35 fucked around with this message at Aug 28, 2011 around 01:12 |
| # ? Aug 28, 2011 01:08 |
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Private Snowball posted:I didn't really want to come in this thread yelling I wasn't getting a job because of my skin colour. The agency I work for has been hinting at it though. I just don't get why they accepted me if they knew this would happen.
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| # ? Aug 28, 2011 06:20 |
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I'm going to be living in Zhengzhou starting on Monday. You can add me to the OP now I guess.
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| # ? Aug 28, 2011 10:25 |
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Does anyone have any experience working at EF English First in Shanghai? I'm probably going to start working for them in October, teaching elementary through high school kids. They look professional and all that.
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| # ? Aug 28, 2011 22:55 |
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Do you know which branch? I had a bunch of friends at EF and it seemed they had radically different experiences at each branch. Overall though they did seem to be more sticklers for stuff like "wear a shirt and tie every day in 35+ degree weather to run around with 7-year-olds for 6 hours".
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| # ? Aug 28, 2011 23:56 |
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| # ? May 23, 2013 01:01 |
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Does anyone here know any decent natural hot springs? My contract just ran out, and I want to take a little break before starting a new job. I'm looking at Hainan, but it's so drat expensive to get there.
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| # ? Aug 29, 2011 00:47 |
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