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Cottle's OPG should be Fake Baby because his abilities to scrounge up dead premies for switcheroos is second to none.
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Aug 3, 2011 20:04
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| # ? Apr 24, 2024 18:55 |
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"First, Do No Harm - Once per game, you may execute someone in Sickbay or move someone in Sickbay to any other location (except the Brig)."
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Aug 3, 2011 23:31
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mp5 posted:"First, Do No Harm - Once per game, you may execute someone in Sickbay or move someone in Sickbay to any other location (except the Brig)."  Other than that contradiction, the less characters that can execute people on a whim the better and the move out of Sickbay is not terribly helpful for a OPG.
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Aug 3, 2011 23:34
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Cocks Cable posted:
The contradiction is why it's awesome, duh. And it forces you to make hard choices about avoiding Sickbay if you're not sure about Cottle's Loyalty.
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Aug 3, 2011 23:36
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It definitely has its uses, but we don't need another Cally in the game. That bitch is controversial enough.
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Aug 3, 2011 23:44
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It's not another Cally because he can't just do it to anyone anywhere. As far as the beneficial side, maybe give Cottle motivation for De-Sickbaying someone: "Action: Once per game, you may execute someone in Sickbay or move someone in Sickbay to any other location (except the Brig). If you move someone with this ability, you and that person may both draw two cards from within your skill set."
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Aug 3, 2011 23:55
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I still like my version of his OPG.  I also don't like the current version of his static. Being a doctor doesn't preclude you from being hit by a missile and getting your poo poo hosed up. I think his static ability should have to do with getting other characters out of sick bay more quickly.
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Aug 3, 2011 23:57
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ChewyLSB posted:I think his static ability should have to do with getting other characters out of sick bay more quickly. I understand that, but ferrying people out of Sickbay seems so bland and weak. How is it any better than straight up XO? It's also not very helpful to a cylon Cottle. Edit: Being immune to Sickbay at least is beneficial to both human and a cylon Cottle. And he can hide from Cally! iceyman fucked around with this message at 00:16 on Aug 4, 2011 |
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Aug 4, 2011 00:12
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How about something like this... Chief Medical Officer -- At the end of every turn, if you are not in the Brig and there is a human in Sickbay, you may exchange their location with any other human (except for those in the Brig). Kinda like you can shuffle people in and out of Sickbay. A cylon Cottle would have fun with that. As a human, its blanket safety net against Sickbay.
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Aug 4, 2011 00:49
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How about this for a OPG: Once before the destiny deck is added to a skill check, you may look at all the cards in the DD and exchange them with cards in your hand. Edit to make more sense
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Aug 4, 2011 01:05
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Kendra's OPG should involve gunning down lots of civilians, obviously.
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Aug 4, 2011 01:46
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Gifted Surgeon: When you choose a player with "Executive Order," if that player is in the "Sickbay" location, they may move and take two actions.
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Aug 4, 2011 02:33
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Some Numbers posted:Gifted Surgeon: When you choose a player with "Executive Order," if that player is in the "Sickbay" location, they may move and take two actions. Even though XO chaining is basically de rigeur, this is still out-of-flavour with the other character abilities, which don't rely on any other specific cards or abilities. How about Movement: Move any human player in Sick Bay to any other Galactica location. You may then draw one skill card from within your skill set. The draw part is optional but gives him a motivation to forgo his move action. Other option is allow him to move as normal but also move someone out of sickbay for free.
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Aug 4, 2011 02:47
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Vulpes posted:Even though XO chaining is basically de rigeur, this is still out-of-flavour with the other character abilities, which don't rely on any other specific cards or abilities. That's not out of flavor, it's untapped design space. And the advantage of making it work off of an XO like that instead of letting Cottle move the character is that it increases paranoia by giving hidden cylons a great opportunity to sabotage.
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Aug 4, 2011 04:21
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I think the problem is sickbay just isn't a deep mechanic to design around. Thematically he's a healer. So you could represent that with giving cards to other players? Movement: Draw 2 Skill card from any set and give them to another player. or something similar but different: Movement: Choose a player to discard 3 skill cards. Then draw 3 skill cards from any set and give them to that player. Obviously the numbers can be tweaked, but this works as a human, and as a cylon. It's a variant of Ander's, but it's target-able and since it's movement it's more likely to be used. He can also use it on himself. I kind of like the 2nd option, especially because if a player has less than 3 cards it becomes a net gain for the person receiving. For OPG, what about the anti-Cally? Medical Miracle: When a character is executed, that execution is ignored and the player moves to sickbay. Crackbone fucked around with this message at 14:11 on Aug 4, 2011 |
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Aug 4, 2011 13:44
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I really like those! I'll post an update soon with changes and tweaks based on everyone's input.Pander posted:"ACTION: If Hot Dog is in a viper, destroy any combination of up to three raiders or heavy raiders in one space area, and then destroy up to one raider, heavy raider, or civilian ship in each other space area surrounding Galactica". Forgot to respond to this one. But this is basically the same OPG as Kat, but its strictly better.
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Aug 4, 2011 18:00
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Perhaps add a drawback to it then, "return all unmanned vipers to the reserves". Or "Destroy all raiders and heavy raiders in space areas, then damage all vipers, both in space and in the reserves." It'd sure give support characters something to do!
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Aug 4, 2011 18:02
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Here's the next draft. Keep those ideas comings! If we can mostly agree on 8 new characters, I'll start a new game with them to try out.quote:POTENTIAL NEW UNOFFICIAL CHARACTERS rev0.2 Seems like most people like Hoshi as is. hooray, one character more or less complete! Need feedback on Kendra, Romo, and Cottle. Still some general dissatisfaction over HotDog, Seelix, and Racetrack. Still need a good OPG for Billy. After reall thinking about it, the previous one just didn't fit (and was probably too powerful). iceyman fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Aug 4, 2011 |
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Aug 4, 2011 18:56
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Awesome OPG -- Still Needed!
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Billy OPG: After anyone plays a quorum card, you may also immediately play that quorum card. If the card involves a die roll, you may choose the number. If this would result in an invalid target or action, there is no effect. I think this would be a pretty fun power, you're basically a quorum card mirror. Eulogy? Add another morale! Authorize Brutal Force? Let's kill another dude! Arrest Orders? No Mr. President, I insist you go to the brig too!
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Aug 4, 2011 19:08
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I'm not a big fan of "preventative" OPG's like Cottle (like Gaeta's) because if you're a human it just means that they won't choose to Execute you (or brig you in Gaeta's case). I guess it allows the humans to choose an "executed" choice when they wouldn't have to normally. Cottle's static might be a little more interesting if instead you could give that player any two cards from your hand. That might be a little bit too strong though, I dunno. Seelix's OPG seems a little weak to me as a human. You don't really need to repair six vipers very often. It seems a lot stronger as a Cylon. Originally I was thinking you could repair 2 locations, 6 vipers, or 3 vipers and 1 location, but the damage option of that would be insanely strong, and it seems kinda wordy to make it Critical Skillset -- Action: Once per game, you may repair 2 locations, 1 location and 3 vipers, 6 vipers, or you may damage 6 vipers. Doesn't flow very well. Also I think every character needs to draw at least one leadership, but only because I think Boomer is such a piece of poo poo. Give Racetrack at least a variable draw of leadership! Also I like Racetrack's downside, although in my head her downside would've had to have done with Gaeta's mutiny.
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Aug 4, 2011 19:10
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Hoshi is great, don't change anything. I like Kendra well enough, but maybe just have her drawback be tat the President choose if she's the Admiral (or the CAG, whichever). If she's both (or all) titles, then perhaps the next human player in turn order? Alternatively, you could have her always choose the second option in CPC crises, since those are usually the ones that force you to discard cards or lose resources or take risks instead of doing skill checks. I like Billy's static and drawback. If you want to go with the sacrifice theme, then you could use an OPG like "Sacrifice: Once per game, when a character is successfully targeted by a Brig or Airlock check, you may choose to instead become the target of that check. If this leads to your execution, the Fleet does not lose 1 Morale and you do not reveal or draw new Loyalty Cards." Of course, you could follow that up with "You must choose Tory as your new character." :P I don't like that Romo doesn't actually have an OPG, and that he has a free-use action that springs anyone out of the Brig for no consequences. That seems to me to be OPG-worthy, instead. "Once per game, after the Movement Step of any player's turn, you may immediately choose a player (including yourself) that is currently in the Brig. That player may immediately move out of the Brig to any Galactica location and take one Action." I don't like Racetrack very much. Thematically the Raptor Courier doesn't make much sense, and her OPG allows you to essentially scout Cain's Blind Jump even when you're using the house rules for that power. How about a static like "Raptor Courier - After the Movement Step of your turn, you may move any player (except those in the Brig) to your location." For an OPG, if you want to go with the Destination theme, you could say "Lead Scout - Once per game, when the Admiral would draw two Destinations and choose one, you may instead choose to draw three destinations and choose one." This would mean that it wouldn't apply when that Quorum Card that lets someone else choose destinations is in play. I like Hot Dog a lot. For Seelix, I don't like that she requires the use of the Final Five cards, which means that she can only be used in games where that mechanic is also used. If you want to keep that theme, you may want to change it to a "You are a Cylon" card. Overall she doesn't really strike me as a character that I'd ever choose, but she was pretty "meh" in the show, too. Cottle is pretty solid, and I see how the OPG could go both ways. Something that could be interesting is a Sickbay-Execution tradeoff, like "Life and Death Situation - Once per game, when a player would be executed, you may send them to Sickbay instead OR once per game, when a player would be sent to Sickbay, you may choose to execute them instead." I'm sure there would be a better way to word that. Athaboros fucked around with this message at 19:25 on Aug 4, 2011 |
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Aug 4, 2011 19:22
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Pander posted:Billy OPG: After anyone plays a quorum card, you may also immediately play that quorum card. If the card involves a die roll, you may choose the number. If this would result in an invalid target or action, there is no effect. It's a good idea, but it doesn't really fit Billy. Plus all those ifs make it rather clunky. ChewyLSB posted:I'm not a big fan of "preventative" OPG's like Cottle (like Gaeta's) because if you're a human it just means that they won't choose to Execute you (or brig you in Gaeta's case). I guess it allows the humans to choose an "executed" choice when they wouldn't have to normally. Executing Cottle might still be worth while in some cases because you still have to discard your entire hand and it sends him to Sickbay. 2 Cards from your hand is much too powerful. ChewyLSB posted:Seelix's OPG seems a little weak to me as a human. You don't really need to repair six vipers very often. It seems a lot stronger as a Cylon. I agree. Mixing in location options does it a bit better, but its so wordy and inelegant. Probably best to scrap the entire idea and go in a different direction. ChewyLSB posted:Also I think every character needs to draw at least one leadership, but only because I think Boomer is such a piece of poo poo. Give Racetrack at least a variable draw of leadership! It's hard to justify LEA for every character though. Of the 8 proposed characters, only Racetrack and Seelix don't have LEA. When were they ever Leadership-y? Even HotDog seems like a stretch! It does suck to not draw LEA, but unlike Boomer, I tried to give them variable draws so they can at least get 3 TAC which is pretty strong.
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Aug 4, 2011 19:59
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ChewyLSB posted:I'm not a big fan of "preventative" OPG's like Cottle (like Gaeta's) because if you're a human it just means that they won't choose to Execute you (or brig you in Gaeta's case). I guess it allows the humans to choose an "executed" choice when they wouldn't have to normally. Cottle's OPG would be for ANY execution. It's not like Gaeta's at all.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:01
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Cocks Cable posted:It's hard to justify LEA for every character though. Of the 8 proposed characters, only Racetrack and Seelix don't have LEA. When were they ever Leadership-y? Even HotDog seems like a stretch! It does suck to not draw LEA, but unlike Boomer, I tried to give them variable draws so they can at least get 3 TAC which is pretty strong. I dunno Hot Dog seems pretty thematic to me. And the way that I see it is that all of the characters in the show are "leaders", I mean, Racetrack was a drat lieutenant in the show so I'm sure she's done some amount of leading. Maybe not amongst the other main characters of the show, but amongst the unseen masses. I guess not Seelix because I think she's a PFC in the show, but still. I'm arguing for LEA just for gameplay reasons because not drawing LEA is such a huge liability for a character. Crackbone posted:Cottle's OPG would be for ANY execution. It's not like Gaeta's at all. Except that a Cylon player would just choose to not execute players then. Like basically Cottle's OPG fucks over only Cylon Cally, whereas Brigging someone is a drat reveal power and a lot of character's abilities deal with it. Like basically the only way that a Cylon player could ever "guarantee" execute someone is with Political Prowess, and they could just brig them instead which is arguably even stronger.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:14
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AesirKnight posted:I don't like that Romo doesn't actually have an OPG, and that he has a free-use action that springs anyone out of the Brig for no consequences. That seems to me to be OPG-worthy, instead. "Once per game, after the Movement Step of any player's turn, you may immediately choose a player (including yourself) that is currently in the Brig. That player may immediately move out of the Brig to any Galactica location and take one Action." Sorry, his Legal Defense was suppose to be a OPG. I just forgot to add the verbiage. That in mind, I think your version accomplishes the same thing as mine. AesirKnight posted:I don't like Racetrack very much. Thematically the Raptor Courier doesn't make much sense, and her OPG allows you to essentially scout Cain's Blind Jump even when you're using the house rules for that power. How about a static like "Raptor Courier - After the Movement Step of your turn, you may move any player (except those in the Brig) to your location." For an OPG, if you want to go with the Destination theme, you could say "Lead Scout - Once per game, when the Admiral would draw two Destinations and choose one, you may instead choose to draw three destinations and choose one." This would mean that it wouldn't apply when that Quorum Card that lets someone else choose destinations is in play. Ah, I had something like that OPG a long time ago but forgot about it. Yeah, that's probably a better OPG her super scout thing. Your idea for her Raptor Courier is interesting. The wording is better and accomplishes what I hoped would be a "half" XO like ability. Is it intended to work in the brig? A cylon Racetrack could suck people into the brig (guess a human Racetrack could do the same to a cylon). Wary of potential abuse there. AesirKnight posted:For Seelix, I don't like that she requires the use of the Final Five cards, which means that she can only be used in games where that mechanic is also used. If you want to keep that theme, you may want to change it to a "You are a Cylon" card. Overall she doesn't really strike me as a character that I'd ever choose, but she was pretty "meh" in the show, too. We're scraping the bottom of the barrel here with characters, so Seelix is what we got left. She also perfectly fills a niche of Pilot/Support hybrid. Changing her drawback to that essentially makes it the same as Cavil. Want to avoid exact duplicate abilities. Gosh, the only characters left in the barrel are probably Fisk (military), Elosha (political), Crashdown (pilot), Jammer (support).
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Aug 4, 2011 20:14
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Billy OPG try 2: Before cards are played into a skill check, politics skill cards count double, and you may also have one type of skill cards not be counted at all.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:17
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Cocks Cable posted:Your idea for her Raptor Courier is interesting. The wording is better and accomplishes what I hoped would be a "half" XO like ability. Is it intended to work in the brig? A cylon Racetrack could suck people into the brig (guess a human Racetrack could do the same to a cylon). Wary of potential abuse there. Yeah, I guess it should say something like "(except when you or the target player are in the Brig)"; I think that being able to use it that way would be way too powerful. Cocks Cable posted:Changing her drawback to that essentially makes it the same as Cavil. Want to avoid exact duplicate abilities. You're right; I never play with Cylon Leaders so I'd totally forgotten about that  Given that, I still don't like that limitation. You could have it be something like "Jealous Nature - Whenever a player looks at another player's Loyalty Card (or a Loyalty Card is revealed), you must discard three random Skill Cards." EDIT: What I really like about the Romo OPG that I posted earlier is that he can do it on any player's turn, potentially really frakking things up 
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Aug 4, 2011 20:21
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AesirKnight posted:Given that, I still don't like that limitation. You could have it be something like "Jealous Nature - Whenever a player looks at another player's Loyalty Card (or a Loyalty Card is revealed), you must discard three random Skill Cards." I don't really understand what the problem is. Like we're not FFG if you're not using Final Five then just don't use seelix  Pander posted:Billy OPG try 2: Before cards are played into a skill check, politics skill cards count double, and you may also have one type of skill cards not be counted at all. Isn't this just Chief's OPG but strictly better.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:26
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ChewyLSB posted:I don't really understand what the problem is. Like we're not FFG if you're not using Final Five then just don't use seelix Just doesn't make sense to me to have a character that you can only use if you use a certain component of a certain expansion. I know that the Pegasus characters rely on Execution, and that's fine because you basically don't ever play with Pegasus expansion components and NOT play with Pegasus itself, but you can still play with Exodus components without using the PG/FF stuff. None of the other Exodus characters have that limitation.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:29
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Tried to adapt my idea to Billy. Self Sacrifice OPG: At any time you may look at the Destiny Deck and exchange any number of cards from the DD with the cards your hand. Move to Sickbay.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:34
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AesirKnight posted:Just doesn't make sense to me to have a character that you can only use if you use a certain component of a certain expansion. I know that the Pegasus characters rely on Execution, and that's fine because you basically don't ever play with Pegasus expansion components and NOT play with Pegasus itself, but you can still play with Exodus components without using the PG/FF stuff. None of the other Exodus characters have that limitation. Yeah but you have stuff like CAG Chooses crisis cards that you don't use without the CFB. Like I don't understand why its not a big deal to have other random stuff that you don't use with the expansions but with Characters suddenly its a big deal.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:37
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ChewyLSB posted:Yeah but you have stuff like CAG Chooses crisis cards that you don't use without the CFB. Like I don't understand why its not a big deal to have other random stuff that you don't use with the expansions but with Characters suddenly its a big deal. Because characters are FRAKKING SERIOUS MAN. Nah, I guess part of it is that with PG/FF get a lot less usage than with other components (CAG/CFB, for example). Plus it just feels kinda lame to create a character that you can't choose unless you also want to use that component. At least with CAG crises and such they're just game components and don't limit the player's choices.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:43
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You can't use Ellen with out TRE.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:45
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Cocks Cable posted:You can't use Ellen with out TRE. Yeah, but like I was saying before, TRE and Pegasus itself (and therefore executions) aren't really "optional" if you're using Pegasus. To be fair, it's a cool idea for a drawback, but I think it means that she'll get even less use than she already would.
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Aug 4, 2011 20:53
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ChewyLSB posted:Except that a Cylon player would just choose to not execute players then. Like basically Cottle's OPG fucks over only Cylon Cally, whereas Brigging someone is a drat reveal power and a lot of character's abilities deal with it. Outside of Cally and Political Prowess, there are a few crisis cards and super crisis cards that can execute a player. Cottle's OPG can be used to deflect those effect. Maybe I'm not following exactly what issue you find with it?
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Aug 4, 2011 21:09
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Cocks Cable posted:Outside of Cally and Political Prowess, there are a few crisis cards and super crisis cards that can execute a player. Cottle's OPG can be used to deflect those effect. This is kinda why I like the two-way effect of the one I proposed; it keeps the anti-execution effect, but also allows Cottle to screw over players when Cally isn't in the game or you don't draw an execution crisis. Airlocks, at least in the games I play, are relatively rare.
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Aug 4, 2011 21:16
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How about this then for Cottle's OPG. Medical Miracle -- Once per game, at the start of the turn, you may allow one player to ignore the effects of their Drawback for the duration of that turn.
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Aug 5, 2011 01:36
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Cocks Cable posted:How about this then for Cottle's OPG. Tell me, exactly, when this will actually really matter. Because I'm not seeing how "once per game, you may activate a location without discarding two cards" is an OPG level ability.
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Aug 5, 2011 01:52
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In the dire circumstances where Roslin has no cards and you need to jump the ship! Or when Gaeta is the only human sitting on 10 cards. But yeah, you are probably right. Edit: You could increase the duration to something like "until the fleet jumps", but something like that is unprecedented. iceyman fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Aug 5, 2011 |
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Aug 5, 2011 02:00
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| # ? Apr 24, 2024 18:55 |
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Here's what I had for a Billy OPG: Transparency: Once per game, you may look at all loyalty cards belonging to the President. You may then pass the president title to the next player (other than yourself) in the presidential line of succession.
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Aug 5, 2011 02:32
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