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What if dragons are just large reptiles that synthesize some flammable material and the others are the source of all the magic???
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Jun 29, 2015 18:36
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Ginette Reno posted:I wonder if the series will end... No
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Jun 29, 2015 18:37
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Yeah there is some connection between the dragons and the others, this is vaguely implied in various prophesies but nothing is terribly concrete. There's cause to think that the end of the long night coincided with the rise of the valyrian empire and the binding of the dragons.
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Jun 29, 2015 18:38
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I'm reading through acok and it really made me wonder how the hell season 5 stannis got so hosed over for the adaptation. In the books, I don't really get the sense that stannis is that big a believer in the red god, and he just uses mel and her magic because its a tool he needs. But in the show stannis is a nearly crazy fire cultist, and it feels like they just did a note for note repeat of robb stark's downfall, complete with the unnecessary sacrifice/execution causing half the army to desert.
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Jun 29, 2015 18:42
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I think it's just the fire magic that's been enhanced by the dragons. The ice and earth magic have probably stayed at the same strength.
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Jun 29, 2015 18:43
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I feel like the Valyrian empire and the long night were totally different time periods, for modern analogs, Valyria was the roman empire and the long night was like, the last ice age. The maesters can read history books about Valyria but have to read fantasy legends about people who lived for hundreds of years to find anything about the others.
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Jun 29, 2015 18:45
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Arcsquad12 posted:I'm reading through acok and it really made me wonder how the hell season 5 stannis got so hosed over for the adaptation. In the books, I don't really get the sense that stannis is that big a believer in the red god, and he just uses mel and her magic because its a tool he needs. But in the show stannis is a nearly crazy fire cultist, and it feels like they just did a note for note repeat of robb stark's downfall, complete with the unnecessary sacrifice/execution causing half the army to desert. He's not, he's far from a true believer both in the show and in the novels. Melisandre has been required to prove her own powers and prove R'hllors power multiple times. With that said, I think that given what was shown in the show Stannis' character was rather consistent during his entire run. EDIT: Oh and the novels actually make this more interesting (surprise!) given that while Stan himself isn't much of a believer a considerable portion of his army are r'hllor zealots through and through who constantly campaign for him to make more and more human sacrifices to their demon god. Ague Proof posted:I think it's just the fire magic that's been enhanced by the dragons. The ice and earth magic have probably stayed at the same strength. Maybe but there really isn't enough proof either way, are the 'black candles' fire magic? cause we know for certain that those simply didn't work at all before the return of the dragons. there's also water magic of which we know nothing about. Jeffrey of YOSPOS posted:I feel like the Valyrian empire and the long night were totally different time periods, for modern analogs, Valyria was the roman empire and the long night was like, the last ice age. The maesters can read history books about Valyria but have to read fantasy legends about people who lived for hundreds of years to find anything about the others. As I said, the textual link is not 'strong', but according to sam there's cause to think that the long night was only 5,000 years before the time of the ASOIAF novels and if that is true it could quite well mean that the rise of valyria actually coincides exactly with the end of the long night. There were some more quotes that got me to think that these events might be related but I can't pull them off of the top of my head, will not to look them up, I also had some spergy theory that the long night might be related to some massive lunar eclipse which would also tie things up with the Qartheen belief about the moon kissing the sun causing thousands of dragons to be born etc etc. I'll try to find the relevant quotes later. maybe. emanresu tnuocca fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Jun 29, 2015 |
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Jun 29, 2015 18:50
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How about dragonglass and dragonsteel both gently caress up the others. How's that for a link.
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Jun 29, 2015 18:56
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Yeah there is some connection between the dragons and the others, this is vaguely implied in various prophesies but nothing is terribly concrete. you mean other than the title of the series?
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Jun 29, 2015 19:15
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quite the fucker posted:you mean other than the title of the series? Yeah well that's a rather big clue but I meant more along the lines that the rise of the others is entwined to the return of dragons and the such so yeah just like the title of the series. Krinkle posted:How about dragonglass and dragonsteel both gently caress up the others. How's that for a link. Dragonglass doesn't actually seem to have anything to do with dragons though, I mean there's cause to think that Dragons are somehow related to volcanoes but otherwise dragonglass is just a volcanic rock. Though valyrian steel might contain dragonglass at some quantities as suggested by the presence of grey and black ripples in the steel.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:21
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quite the fucker posted:you mean other than the title of the series? Game of Thrones? It's just a musical chairs ref as far as I can tell.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:21
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Yeah well that's a rather big clue but I meant more along the lines that the rise of the others is entwined to the return of dragons and the such so yeah just like the title of the series. They get dragonglass from dragonstone and asshai, two places known for dragons. Yes you and I know it's volcanic glass but this is a fantasy world so leave the geology degree at the door.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:23
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dragons and dragonglass share a common ancestor, namely the volcano, ie, the actual mother of dragons
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Jun 29, 2015 19:25
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Fire and Blood - the dragon folks Fire and Blood magic: comes back with dragons. Ice and Green Magic: been chilling in the north for centuries only getting stronger. Pretty straightforward yin yang poo poo. Ice was stamped out and the dragons declined. Ice started rebounding and now that it's hella powerful the dragons are back. You'd have to be dumb as dog poo poo to miss this.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:29
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The stark words should have been "Ice and Green" as the non-sequitur analog to "Fire and Blood". Ned can have a country-bumpkin superstitious belief about what it all means involving seasons and winter and stuff that's completely wrong. Also I googled Valyria and it is like 5000 years old so the time period does fit.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:31
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Ah if you meant to imply that the fact that Night's watch histories seem to mention Dragonsteel and specifically note that it is effective against walkers and if the valyrians were indeed the first who have figured out the secret of Valyrian steel than indeed this would suggest that valyria or some precursor to Valyria had some part to play in the long night, which is definitely an interesting thought. There are some possible alternative explanations though so I do not consider this to be a definitive proof. I like the theory that Lightbringer was actually the first Valyrian steel sword and that the forging of valyrian steel requires blood sacrifice, which actually doesn't neccesarily contradict the 'precursor to valyria' angle.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:31
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A GLISTENING HODOR posted:Fire and Blood - the dragon folks yeah but there's an 8,000 year gap between the victory over the others in the long night and the death of the last dragons, 7,500 years between the long night and the fall of valyria, even if you go by the 'shortened timeline' Sam talks about you get 5000 or so years between the long night and the death of the dragons. the dragons were just fine for a long time after the ice elves were defeated so, not sure that what you said really applies.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:35
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emanresu tnuocca posted:yeah but there's an 8,000 year gap between the victory over the others in the long night and the death of the last dragons, 7,500 years between the long night and the fall of valyria, even if you go by the 'shortened timeline' Sam talks about you get 5000 or so years between the long night and the death of the dragons. GRRM has admitted he has issues with scale Time is probably one of those Grandiosity and "epic" world building and then screwing poo poo up so let not these fictional numbers torment your goodly soul kind friend and think of them only as a giant playground A playground you wouldn't want to let any kids in I guess They would end up really bad at math to say the least But Epic loving worldbuilding like really big and huge just a whole lot of big stuff and long things and tall castles
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Jun 29, 2015 19:43
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the battle of the bells occurring in month 6 is good news for believers of R+L = J
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Jun 29, 2015 19:49
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I mean it's after the last dragon died that the ice dudes started to come back. They were pretty much nonexistent (snarks and grumpkins) (the watch has only fought wildlings for X number of years). Now they're all up in everyone's biz and the dragons are back. poo poo gotta balance out again. Also there's a big horse that's gonna Mr. Hands the planet.
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Jun 29, 2015 19:57
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The only real connection to Ice magic and the Greenseer stuff is assuming that there has to only be two sources of magic and Melisandre being a dumbass.
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Jun 29, 2015 20:43
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it's more to do with the titular ice/fire dichotomy i think, the starks are very frequently associated with ice and their connection to the old gods and warging (which are seemingly sorta the same thing) is made very explicit, also all that jazz about the night's king being a stark and what have you. i mean i think that the children, bloodraven and the starks represent a faction that is in opposition to the others but i'm pretty sure there's a lot they have in common on some pre-historical legendary level.
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Jun 29, 2015 21:47
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Qartheen belief about the moon kissing the sun causing thousands of dragons to be born etc etc. I'll try to find the relevant quotes later. maybe. Dany calls Drogo her "sun and stars". He calls her the "moon of his life".
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Jun 30, 2015 01:11
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Ague Proof posted:Dany calls Drogo her "sun and stars". He calls her the "moon of his life". The moon is often associated with women for some reason.
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Jun 30, 2015 01:13
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syscall girl posted:GRRM has admitted he has issues with scale yes, his scale runs out of numbers
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Jun 30, 2015 01:26
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syscall girl posted:The moon is often associated with women for some reason. because the ovulate in synch with the phases of the moon or some bullshit
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Jun 30, 2015 01:51
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jsoh posted:because the ovulate in synch with the phases of the moon or some bullshit Hmm yes, thank you for the insight Almost like things that happen every 28 days something something but my goonish brain can not resolve this puzzle e: sorry for being pissy i got my syscall girl moonblood up or something
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Jun 30, 2015 02:10
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Hogge Wild posted:yes, his scale runs out of numbers It makes me wonder what things are going to be like when HBO finishes the show and we have a "complete" story, and someone decides to remake it but with a lot of the dumb sanded off (and replaced with new dumb, cause always).
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Jun 30, 2015 02:25
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Bran is the champion of the Great Other whose true name, which is forbidden and long forgotten, is Hodor. Walder the stable boy somehow knows this and is being used by dark forces to assist Bran. The final battle for Dawn will be fought between Jon and Bran. It is known.
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Jun 30, 2015 04:14
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syscall girl posted:The moon is often associated with women for some reason. this is definitely a thing, and now I gotta know why anybody read the golden bough in like the last decade edit: been answered. and nobody actually reads the golden bough. they buy it for a college class and THINK about reading it, then leave it visible on a shelf for the rest of their life. A Tasteful Nude fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Jun 30, 2015 |
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Jun 30, 2015 04:22
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Arcsquad12 posted:I'm reading through acok and it really made me wonder how the hell season 5 stannis got so hosed over for the adaptation. Watch the first two minutes of this video. Since at least the beginning of season four, D&D can't even reconcile their own takes on the character with each other let alone be bothered to look into the source material. I've always gotten the sense that both of them disliked Stannis and that only seems more likely now considering the fuckoff over the top "hey gently caress this guy, amirite" sequence of events leading up to his death. I see show Stannis as way more of a fanfic character than show Ramsay. Outside of his introduction and his quip before the Blackwater battle I don't think they cared about adapting the character from the books at all.
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Jun 30, 2015 05:43
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A Tasteful Nude posted:this is definitely a thing, and now I gotta know why I'm the same way with Intercourse Well I started reading it but got turned on and had to take a nap God drat, Dworkin that guy in NOFX was wrong wrong wrong about you poo poo is hot
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Jun 30, 2015 05:53
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Thoros had 0 powers before the return of dragons, he would just spend his days drinking and whoring with King Robert cause they were cool bros, Thoros would fight in melees with a sword coated with wildfire which was indeed just for show and would destroy the blade rather rapidly, once the dragons return and Thoros is out with the brotherhood Beric is killed and Thoros gives him the 'kiss of fire' which is simply a burial ceremony used by Red Priests all over the world, nothing magical about it, but all of a sudden Beric gets up from the ground all alive and poo poo, which surprises everyone. After that point thoros and beric both apparently gain some weird magical powers, when Beric fights against Sandor in the trial by combat he simply uses his sword to cut up his hand and coat the sword with blood and the sword catches on fire, real magic fire none of this wildfire trickery. That's what I thought, thanks!
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Jun 30, 2015 17:31
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A GLISTENING HODOR posted:Just fyi the 4 legged dragons with wings on the back look dumb as poo poo and Wales isn't a real country. You shut your mouth, Y Ddraig Goch is more awesome than that weak-rear end wyvern Drogon any day of the week Edit: and Benedict Smaugerbitch, too Kulkasha fucked around with this message at 18:36 on Jun 30, 2015 |
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Jun 30, 2015 18:34
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jsoh posted:because the ovulate in synch with the phases of the moon or some bullshit if women don't exercise (and most don't) their period is always in the same moon phase
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Jul 1, 2015 00:31
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real european dragons aren't wyverns. period
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Jul 1, 2015 00:33
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A wyvern who Smaug in he own mouth e: Quite the Biotruths.
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Jul 1, 2015 00:40
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I'll never get the house of the undying. Did they want to just straight up eat her soul? Make her an undying too? Take her blood for magicks? How do you read someone's future and then try to kill them. And why was Pyat Pree so mad she killed his ghost friends. Like gently caress you lady i'm gonna hire a sorrowful man right now. You don't do that. You don't go into a man's house and kill his ghosts! Fricken gwailos! Did they just want a sip? Just a taste? Quid pro quo, here's your future, let us chew on your soul a little bit and you can go. If your end goal is she is dead then why read her future in the first place. You could just say "everything's going to be fine and you're gonna be top dog." Isn't seeing a future where she isn't dead a HUGE RED FLAG? Maybe don't go ahead with the soul eating if you see she lives to be betrayed a couple more times and has a bunch of unrealized destiny.
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Jul 1, 2015 01:04
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Probably some "Weeping Angels from Doctor Who" bullshit about eating the magical energy inherent in an unrealized future, and the visions are a way to structure it enough to be "edible."
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Jul 1, 2015 01:13
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Krinkle posted:I'll never get the house of the undying. Did they want to just straight up eat her soul? Make her an undying too? Take her blood for magicks? How do you read someone's future and then try to kill them. And why was Pyat Pree so mad she killed his ghost friends. Like gently caress you lady i'm gonna hire a sorrowful man right now. You don't do that. You don't go into a man's house and kill his ghosts! Fricken gwailos! The point (at least in the books) is that they knew their magic was getting stronger because of dragons so they wanted to lure her and the dragons in there and keep them. The "Ghost friends" were presumably the Warlock elders or w/e.
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Jul 1, 2015 01:13
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