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gently caress; my first ever accidental doublepost!
second-hand smegma fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2012 around 15:19 |
| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:14 |
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| # ? May 19, 2013 01:23 |
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Lobok posted:You can divvy up Spider-Man’s villains into two types: the Punchables and Non-Punchables. Spider-Man’s got lots of bad guys who he either can’t harm physically or can’t touch without being harmed himself so he has to keep his distance, as opposed to guys he can brawl with. My favorite part is that sometimes he's slick as solid gold, and at other times he's like a droopier Human Torch.   VVVVV I'm totally with you there. Unfortunately, the odds of them bringing back such a cool (but obscure) villain are about as low as them resurrecting that lovable douchebag The Crime Master.  
second-hand smegma fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2012 around 15:38 |
| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:17 |
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second-hand smegma posted:My favorite part is that sometimes he's slick as solid gold, and at other times he's like a droopier Human Torch. Weird... when I quote your second post it still gives me the first one. As for his look, I think they’d go for a mix of the two. Having him be a solid, shimmering statue doesn’t really evoke his name or his power (which I fully chalk up to the limitations of comic book art of the period that just stuck). He’d look best as viscous, molten steel in human form and I think if he started off goopier and less defined it would go a long way to giving that horrific, “bleauuuargghhhEEELLP MEEEEE” kind of feeling.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:23 |
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I've never heard of The Molten Man before, but I don't think I can take him seriously at all because of Coupling's The Melty Man (even though there's nothing funny about The Melty Man): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bs1zz4zZhdM But that cover does look pretty cool.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:32 |
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I think it's pretty clear that we're gonna get a revisit of Green Goblin. Emma Stone has said a couple times that she really digs the way Lee/Ditko killed Gwen back in the day and hopes they can stay true to that (http://www.aceshowbiz.com/news/view/00051590.html) I've always seen the Green Goblin as the closest character Spidey's got to a Joker or Lex Luthor, and it would be such a loving ballsy thing to do in a summer blockbuster.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:34 |
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I'm not a huge Spider-Man fan but I thought I would throw my two cents into the villain discussion. I think a version of Mysterio would be the ideal Spider-Man movie villain. They could set up the first act so that Mysterio's illusions and FX trick Spider-Man (and the audience) into thinking he's up against an entirely different foe.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:37 |
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Veib posted:I've never heard of The Molten Man before, but I don't think I can take him seriously at all because of Coupling's The Melty Man (even though there's nothing funny about The Melty Man): And the reason why I can't take his golden man look seriously:  Directorman posted:I think it's pretty clear that we're gonna get a revisit of Green Goblin. Yeah, I hope they are open to doing the Goblin again already but only if it's crazy, rooftop-fighting, pumpkin bomb, ghost trap, razor bat, choking exhaust glider, non-stop barrage Goblin. Lobok fucked around with this message at Jun 21, 2012 around 15:48 |
| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:39 |
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Gooble Rampling posted:I'm not a huge Spider-Man fan but I thought I would throw my two cents into the villain discussion. Mysterio would have to be a support villain or something because he's just not threatening enough to carry a movie unless he got EXTREME-ified or something In a movie, the primary villain has to be "scary". There have to be stakes, and Mysterio doesn't offer that. Lobok posted:Yeah, I hope they are open to doing the Goblin again already but only if it's crazy, rooftop-fighting, pumpkin bomb, ghost trap, razor bat, choking exhaust glider, non-stop barrage Goblin. They even have the opportunity to ape Ledger-Joker a bit and make his green skin really hosed up looking. Get an actor who plays psychotic really well and make him a sort of really frightening and unstable intelligence, like Osbourne in the comics.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:40 |
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Directorman posted:Mysterio would have to be a support villain or something because he's just not threatening enough to carry a movie unless he got EXTREME-ified or something From earlier in the thread: My fantasy movie would have Man-Wolf and Morbius in the film at first but then reveal for the finale that they're actually fakes of Mysterio. They're both movie monster villains, which ties in with Mysterio's background, the fans get those two villains whereas otherwise they likely never would, and not only does it fake out everybody as a good Mysterio story should, it makes the fans turn from reluctant supporters ("They chose these bad guys?") to ardent supporters once the twist happens. quote:They even have the opportunity to ape Ledger-Joker a bit and make his green skin really hosed up looking. Get an actor who plays psychotic really well and make him a sort of really frightening and unstable intelligence, like Osbourne in the comics. It's funny you bring up Goblin as Joker, because he's actually more like Batman and Joker combined. Batman in the sense of being a secret identity industrialist with all the resources and gadgets and Joker in the sense of an unhinged, laughing-maniacally murderer with an otherwise jokey, juvenile look and array of weapons.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 15:59 |
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Rhino is a good character if you can make a movie out of someone who is essentially doing the only thing he is good at. Rhino is Spidey without the intelligence, who is good at smashing. I really like the gauntlet version of the old character. A life time criminal who just wants out but really can't do much else. Mobius would be interesting if you took the 90s Cartoon version of him. Someone who is just as smart and inquisitive as Peter who has no control over his powers. Hell, you can even do it to parody twilight and cast some good looking emo actor who becomes a grotesque monster.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 16:09 |
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Mooseontheloose posted:Rhino is a good character if you can make a movie out of someone who is essentially doing the only thing he is good at. Rhino is Spidey without the intelligence, who is good at smashing. I really like the gauntlet version of the old character. A life time criminal who just wants out but really can't do much else. That's why I like Rhino paired with Vulture a lot, because you can keep Rhino just the way we all like him but like Directorman said, still have some actual high stakes by having Vulture (as the brains) provide the big, dangerous plot. Rhino could see Vulture as a final way out or be tethered to him, trying to find a way to break free. It would help play up Vulture being a dickhead too, with him constantly berating Rhino.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 16:27 |
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Lobok posted:From earlier in the thread: My fantasy movie would have Man-Wolf and Morbius in the film at first but then reveal for the finale that they're actually fakes of Mysterio. They're both movie monster villains, which ties in with Mysterio's background, the fans get those two villains whereas otherwise they likely never would, and not only does it fake out everybody as a good Mysterio story should, it makes the fans turn from reluctant supporters ("They chose these bad guys?") to ardent supporters once the twist happens. I thought the way they "movie-tized" Mysterio in the Spider-Man 2 video game was pretty well done...and the "Boss fight" is still one of my favorite scenes in any game.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 17:05 |
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TheBigBudgetSequel posted:Marvel/Disney aren't making The Spider-Man movies. Besides, I hope they don't do Carnage, because's a poo poo character. All the problems with Venom turned to loving 11. What kind of problems do you see in the Venom character?
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 17:29 |
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WattsvilleBlues posted:What kind of problems do you see in the Venom character? Basically I think Venom is loving stupid too, but he has been used well on ocassion, pluse Eddie Brock is a character who has motivation. Carnage has none of that really, it's just "What if we put an absolute madman in the same situation and just let him go nuts." No thanks.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 21:07 |
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WattsvilleBlues posted:What kind of problems do you see in the Venom character? Venom is a really hard character to do correctly. Even in the original comics medium, his appearances have varied both in terms of Venom as a character and the quality of writing that handles him. I think the best Venom adaptation, of the few that actually exist outside of comics, is from the animated series The Spectacular Spider-Man. This series focuses on Peter while he still is in high school (something that the comics, and most media adaptations, either rush through or completely ignore). Eddie is a childhood friend of Peter's, a year or two older and protected Peter from bullies. Their parents were scientists and died o the same plane. Over the course of the series, they have their differences and eventually the symbiote comes to earth and bonds with Eddie. The problem with this is it basically took the better part of a season of an animated series to develop Eddie as a character to have good motvation to be that pissed with Peter, and make it seem genuine. I suspect Venom would need that kind of development to be successful in the movies, have him be a friend or long term co-worker of Peters who over the course of a movie or two, gets burned by Peter somehow and becomes bitter and then gets power to get his revenge.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 21:13 |
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TheBigBudgetSequel posted:Basically I think Venom is loving stupid too, but he has been used well on ocassion, pluse Eddie Brock is a character who has motivation. Carnage has none of that really, it's just "What if we put an absolute madman in the same situation and just let him go nuts." He's worse than that, he's literally the serial killer incarnation of the Joker with superpowers. He's a combo of "looks like Spider-man for marketability/extreme 90s/based on a proven popular villain," that's pretty terrible in conception. He still can be used for pretty good stories. I actually kind of liked Carnage USA.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 21:18 |
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notthegoatseguy posted:I think the best Venom adaptation, of the few that actually exist outside of comics, is from the animated series The Spectacular Spider-Man. This series focuses on Peter while he still is in high school (something that the comics, and most media adaptations, either rush through or completely ignore). Eddie is a childhood friend of Peter's, a year or two older and protected Peter from bullies. Their parents were scientists and died o the same plane. Over the course of the series, they have their differences and eventually the symbiote comes to earth and bonds with Eddie. I take it the Symbiote bonds with Peter first in this adaptation? I always loved the 90s Spider-Man:The Animated Series take on him. Great voice and artwork.
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 21:26 |
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WattsvilleBlues posted:I take it the Symbiote bonds with Peter first in this adaptation? Of course, I immediately think of
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 21:33 |
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Medullah posted:Of course, I immediately think of Beep beep  The animators at the time must have loved making the suit swallow up Eddie's head - every time the camera cuts away, when it cuts back it's like he's been running round without the face covered. Also, Parker in the suit in this series was great, like when he's going after Shocker...
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 22:03 |
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WattsvilleBlues posted:Also, Parker in the suit in this series was great, like when he's going after Shocker... I would seriously watch two solid hours of Spider-Man just chasing the Shocker around while yelling at him. The checks in the mail baby!
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| # ? Jun 21, 2012 23:08 |
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WattsvilleBlues posted:I take it the Symbiote bonds with Peter first in this adaptation? The 90s series was the first media adaptation of Venom, but it wasn't really anything more than "Co-worker X has minor grudge against Parker, and thus becomes the murderous rampagin Venom". But the best takes on Venom (Ultimate Comics Venom, Spec Spider-Man Venom) basically took several issues to build a history between Peter Parker and Venom to fuel Venom's rage against Peter and Spider-Man. This is something that would be hard to do in a movie.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 00:51 |
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I'd only want to see Venom in a movie if they at least make one movie where Eddie Brock is just a support character that helps/fights with Peter and builds up into a followup film, else all I can imagine is Topher Grace Venom 2.0. And dont even have it bond with Peter first, mix up the story. Beyond the movies and a few comic book collections I only know Spiderman from that 90s cartoon, and Venom was overpowering and scary in that one when I was a kid, silly moments aside. Many of Spidermans villains are just too goofy. I'm guessing Sony cant use Kingpin? Fox had the rights to Daredevil which had Kingpin but I dont know if that has reverted back to Disney/Marvel. I dont see how they could do Rhino and not have me laugh out loud in the theater. Mysterio would be alright if they didnt give him a fishbowl head.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 01:33 |
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It's not like the movies didn't already set a precedent for the kind of character building Venom needs. Replace Harry with Eddie and there's your template.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 01:50 |
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During the Raimi films, I figured they should have introduced Venom as more a horror character: Oscorp is seen early in the film gathering remnants of webbing throughtout the city, find a blood sample of Peter's, extracting DNA from it, splicing it together with Oscorps stuff, etc. It's not as amorphous as the comics version, it's almost like hollowed out skin that hardens into a sort of exoskeleton. When it's all said and done, they have something that has an instinctual intelligence that manages to escape their labs and is able to track Peter down through remnants of webbing left in the city in an attempt to complete itself. Play with this for a while, it eventually bonds with Peter and at first he thinks it's an extension of his powers, something that developed naturally because the first time it appears he's in bad shape after a fight. As time goes on, Peter comes to learn what it really is, freaks out, tries to get rid of it. He learns it 'feeds' on his webbing, so he loses one of his advantages over it. It doesn't directly trigger his spider-sense (and vice versa), so he's lost another advantage. Peter ends up escaping and going into hiding for the next several days, barracading himself in an abandoned school lab and begins designing a new type of artificial web. Meanwhile, the suit is hijacking bodies to stay alive, being a sort of predator against crime in NYC, adding to anti-Spider-Man hysteria. edit: The main point of this idea was really to remove the 'alien' origins of the costume and attempt to ground it more in the setting of the movie series. I heard way too many people say, "They need to do a Secret Wars movie to introduce the costume!!" JediTalentAgent fucked around with this message at Jun 22, 2012 around 01:58 |
| # ? Jun 22, 2012 01:53 |
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JediTalentAgent posted:During the Raimi films, I figured they should have introduced Venom as more a horror character: Oscorp is seen early in the film gathering remnants of webbing throughtout the city, find a blood sample of Peter's, extracting DNA from it, splicing it together with Oscorps stuff, etc. It's not as amorphous as the comics version, it's almost like hollowed out skin that hardens into a sort of exoskeleton. Ultimate Spider-Man had a decent non-alien origin for Venom where IIRC the symbiote was originally created by Eddie Brock and Peter's fathers as some kind of gene-therapy cancer cure where it would enhance the wearer's strength and immune system to kill the virus. Then the military took ahold of it to gently caress around and weaponize it and the poo poo hit the fan.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 02:08 |
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notthegoatseguy posted:The 90s series was the first media adaptation of Venom, but it wasn't really anything more than "Co-worker X has minor grudge against Parker, and thus becomes the murderous rampagin Venom". But the best takes on Venom (Ultimate Comics Venom, Spec Spider-Man Venom) basically took several issues to build a history between Peter Parker and Venom to fuel Venom's rage against Peter and Spider-Man.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 04:25 |
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ghostwritingduck posted:Harry should have become Venom in the Raimi films. This would have been even more terrible than what we got.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 04:32 |
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ghostwritingduck posted:Harry should have become Venom in the Raimi films. That is retarded and messes up a lot of what could make Harry unique and interesting as an "inheritance" character. You could still do the Venom suit/powers and get the same pathos, but I think it works a lot better when he directly tries to ape his father but without his genius. It really hits home the point that he's stuck in his old man's shadow when he's in the Goblin Suit, trying to do the same things as his old man, but utterly failing. Dacap posted:Ultimate Spider-Man had a decent non-alien origin for Venom where IIRC the symbiote was originally created by Eddie Brock and Peter's fathers as some kind of gene-therapy cancer cure where it would enhance the wearer's strength and immune system to kill the virus. Then the military took ahold of it to gently caress around and weaponize it and the poo poo hit the fan. Yup, that was where Spectacular got its Venom storyline. Lobok has the right of it though that it'll take multiple movies to truly develop an Eddie Brock with motivation that actually justifies the Venom character. You could do it in one movie, but it'd take a very deft hand and frankly it's a little too easy to "rush" to the good stuff with Venom. Rhino could be done well, but he's a mook. He's not and never going to be a villain in his own right. While it is almost certainly a pipe dream, I'd love to see a movie where Doc Ock (a unsympathetic dick Doc Ock who embraces his gift)creates a bunch of animal-themed exoskeletons--The Rhino, Vulture, Beetle, Scorpion, and someone that works with the theme like Grizzly--and slaps them on people (mooks or the people who helped design them). The entire movie is then basically a Spider-Man version of "Crank" as he's forced all across the city being pushed to and beyond his limits by the "Sinister Six" loving up a whole bunch of strategic locations in NYC. No studio would ever bite on it, but tell me there isn't a part of you that thinks it'd be awesome and that the world is big enough to have just one Spider-man movie like that.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 04:39 |
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Reserved seating. Smack dab in the centre of the theatre. Tickets bought!
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 13:29 |
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mind the walrus posted:That is retarded and messes up a lot of what could make Harry unique and interesting as an "inheritance" character. You could still do the Venom suit/powers and get the same pathos, but I think it works a lot better when he directly tries to ape his father but without his genius. It really hits home the point that he's stuck in his old man's shadow when he's in the Goblin Suit, trying to do the same things as his old man, but utterly failing. With Sin Eater in the movie you can help set up Eddie hating Spider-man and it would die in with cops hating him. Also I too have gotten my tickets and can not wait. I hope all four of the comic book movies that I want to see this year are awesome.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 13:33 |
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mind the walrus posted:That is retarded and messes up a lot of what could make Harry unique and interesting as an "inheritance" character. You could still do the Venom suit/powers and get the same pathos, but I think it works a lot better when he directly tries to ape his father but without his genius. It really hits home the point that he's stuck in his old man's shadow when he's in the Goblin Suit, trying to do the same things as his old man, but utterly failing. You could still have that arc in the movie as it is. You just then have the suit find Harry after Peter tears the thing off, feeling badly for what he's done. It would have allowed the removal of Topher Grace and Gwen Stacey from the script allowing a more focused movie. The reason why I hated Spiderman 3 so much is the fact that the Harry story line had been built up for two other movies and the payoff was relegated to a subplot.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 13:43 |
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If they bring in Venom, they should follow his first appearance in the comics as a guideline. He was scary as poo poo in those. At that time, there was like only one other person on the planet who knew Pete was Spiderman, which was Mary Jane, and having Eddie Brock just appearing everywhere (helping Aunt May with laundry as the symbiote would wrap around himself to gently caress with Peter while his back was turned was some chilling stuff) was great. Although since Venom is apparently getting his own movie, I guess he won't be a straight up villain.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 19:34 |
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Vakal posted:I would seriously watch two solid hours of Spider-Man just chasing the Shocker around while yelling at him. I always wondered: the bell tower scene in Spider-Man 3 was obviously inspired by the similar scene in the 90s Animated Series. Were those scenes in turn inspired by the comic book or were they original ideas?
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 21:26 |
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WattsvilleBlues posted:I always wondered: the bell tower scene in Spider-Man 3 was obviously inspired by the similar scene in the 90s Animated Series. Were those scenes in turn inspired by the comic book or were they original ideas? The comic 
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 22:26 |
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I kind of miss the classic MacFarlene design of Venom sometimes.
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| # ? Jun 22, 2012 23:33 |
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Eventually McFarlane drew him with the sharp crazy teeth we've come to know. Also what's with the dialogue being copied word for word in the last two panels? That always bothered me.
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| # ? Jun 23, 2012 19:23 |
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headrest posted:Eventually McFarlane drew him with the sharp crazy teeth we've come to know. He did? I know he enlarged the mouth a bit but wasn't Larsen the one who went bonkers with the teeth?
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| # ? Jun 23, 2012 19:34 |
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McFarlane also did the sharp teeth for Venom.  Larson went nuts  But I think Bagely did him best. 
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| # ? Jun 23, 2012 20:22 |
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One of the things Carnage-haters keep forgetting is at one point Spider-man and Venom team up to effectively fight Carnage. That is awesome. Also reviews are up. http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_amazing_spider_man/
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| # ? Jun 23, 2012 20:47 |
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| # ? May 19, 2013 01:23 |
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I'm pretty sure Carnage-haters know about Venom teaming up with Spider-Man and would use that as another knock against him (Carnage), not a point in his favour that they forget or sweep under the rug. That Carnage exists and is so much more powerful than Venom renders Venom obsolete and/or non-threatening.
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| # ? Jun 23, 2012 20:58 |
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