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TheJoker138 posted:That Hulk was a clone who probably didn't actually know anything, and Banner could still be a gamma radiation expert without being infected with it himself. Let's be stop the fanwanking and be honest here: Millar and Loeb hosed up. They're both arrogant artists that don't care about what other writers have contributed to the universe.
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 20:04 |
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| # ? May 26, 2013 05:11 |
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TheJoker138 posted:That Hulk was a clone who probably didn't actually know anything, and Banner could still be a gamma radiation expert without being infected with it himself. Also comic book editors rarely bother policing continuity/consistency. Or grammar and writing quality for that matter. I'm not sure what most of them do.
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 20:04 |
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On books with big name creators, they mostly wrangle them to (try) to make sure the drat book ships on time and everything gets from person to person.
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 20:06 |
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Sigma posted:On books with big name creators, they mostly wrangle them to (try) to make sure the drat book ships on time and everything gets from person to person. Okay, but that's not really the definition of "editor", is it? Aren't editors supposed to contribute to the work, instead of just letting the artists and writers go nuts?
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 20:08 |
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DeimosRising posted:Also comic book editors rarely bother policing continuity/consistency. Or grammar and writing quality for that matter. I'm not sure what most of them do. Given the do-anything-to-survive state of the industry, their job is probably glorified censors. Reign in the creators when they come up something that'll make the religious crusaders/moral guardians/"Family values" groups angry.
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 20:43 |
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What happened to the "mutants are made in a lab" subplot?
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 21:00 |
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Mister Roboto posted:Given the do-anything-to-survive state of the industry, their job is probably glorified censors. Reign in the creators when they come up something that'll make the religious crusaders/moral guardians/"Family values" groups angry. Counterpoint: Ultimatum. Either there were just no editors at all or Loeb has some sort of comic book executive order where he can supersede the rules.
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 21:35 |
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massive spider posted:What happened to the "mutants are made in a lab" subplot? Everyone knows about it. It' being addressed in Ultimate Comics X-Men.
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 21:41 |
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TwoPair posted:Counterpoint: Ultimatum. Either there were just no editors at all or Loeb has some sort of comic book executive order where he can supersede the rules. As sad as this sounds, nothing in Ultimatum is going to get the Moral Guardians up in arms. Yes, it was violent, but that's not what REALLY gets them angry. It's sex and anything relating to sexuality that makes them freak out. Look at how movies can feature people beating each other bloody and throwing potentially fatal blows (Spiderman, Daredevil, etc.) and get around PG-13, but you know if they showed naked bodies it'd immediately get an R rating.
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| # ? Mar 1, 2012 22:41 |
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TwoPair posted:Counterpoint: Ultimatum. Either there were just no editors at all or Loeb has some sort of comic book executive order where he can supersede the rules. Violence and cannibalism are fine and dandy, but criticizing racists or implying the Tea Party isn't a force for good in America? Woah, better go into damage control mode, that's our core readership right there (??).
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 00:01 |
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Lurdiak posted:Violence and cannibalism are fine and dandy, but criticizing racists or implying the Tea Party isn't a force for good in America? Woah, better go into damage control mode, that's our core readership right there (??). That happened in Captain America
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 00:13 |
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bobkatt013 posted:That happened in Captain America That ended with Cap denying Nuke's criticisms, completely beating him bloody, and then reading him the Bible.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 00:16 |
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That was the reference I was making, yes. Marvel seems to be weirdly concerned with not offending people that don't really read their books.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 00:16 |
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SpeedofLife posted:Let's be stop the fanwanking and be honest here: Millar and Loeb hosed up. They're both arrogant artists that don't care about what other writers have contributed to the universe. I will never defend Loeb but that is exactly what I'm trying to say about Millar. He basically established what Ultimate Hulk is and how he became that. Millar has a lot of issues but I legitimately enjoyed his Ultimate books and some of the contributions he disregarded made the universe better (i.e. Card's atrocious Iron Man books).
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 00:19 |
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Mister Roboto posted:That ended with Cap denying Nuke's criticisms, completely beating him bloody, and then reading him the Bible. Yeah but Ultimate Captain America is an rear end in a top hat.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 01:36 |
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TheJoker138 posted:Yeah but Ultimate Captain America is an rear end in a top hat. Agreed, and it's definitely more interesting than the oversized boy scout of 616. However, I'm not sure if Cap's supposed to be read as an rear end in a top hat in that arc or that he has a genuine point. If it's SUPPOSED to be a superpowered take on the usual rightwing "The Bible solves all problems" Christian, then yes, it fits, but I'm not sure...
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 03:55 |
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massive spider posted:What happened to the "mutants are made in a lab" subplot? This reminded me that Ultimate X-Men did manage to have some good ideas that should've made it different. Still felt like every X-Men thing I've ever seen or read. How the hell did they manage that?
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 04:17 |
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Mister Roboto posted:Agreed, and it's definitely more interesting than the oversized boy scout of 616. B-but...that's not an accurate characterization of 616 Cap at all!
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 06:10 |
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DeimosRising posted:B-but...that's not an accurate characterization of 616 Cap at all! You're very right, it isn't accurate at all. That's more an accurate description of what people who've never read him think he is. And the way the poorer writers over the years have written him. I'm no fan of Ultimate Cap, but the way he was handled in the mini was absolutely consistent with the way he'd been portrayed in other books. I know what they did with the character. I completely understand it and where it came from. I just don't care for it. Him being right, beating the poo poo out of Nuke, and then reading to him from the Bible is exactly what Ultimate Cap would do.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 07:52 |
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When is the last time we saw Ultimate Namor? I checked his wikipedia article but I swear he popped up some time after the last appearance they have listed, I'd love to see him fleshed out and utilized some more and he might actually fit in alright with the themes going on in Ultimates right now (future evolutionary steps, etc).
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 07:52 |
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Deadpool posted:You're very right, it isn't accurate at all. That's more an accurate description of what people who've never read him think he is. And the way the poorer writers over the years have written him. Could be the case, I'll admit Cap stopped being interesting to me a few years ago (like high school) when  characters lost their appeal, but if he's written better now, maybe I'll give it a second go. Flater posted:When is the last time we saw Ultimate Namor? I checked his wikipedia article but I swear he popped up some time after the last appearance they have listed, I'd love to see him fleshed out and utilized some more and he might actually fit in alright with the themes going on in Ultimates right now (future evolutionary steps, etc). I recall two appearances: Ultimatum, where he's inexplicably held captive by Doom (as Thing calmly smushes his head  ) and then Loeb stuck in a cameo of 616-hobo Namor in Ultimate X, which I assume has been overlooked and forgotten.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 07:56 |
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Flater posted:When is the last time we saw Ultimate Namor? I checked his wikipedia article but I swear he popped up some time after the last appearance they have listed, I'd love to see him fleshed out and utilized some more and he might actually fit in alright with the themes going on in Ultimates right now (future evolutionary steps, etc). I'm pretty sure the last we really saw of him was when Reed confronted him during Ultimatum. I really liked what they did with the character (in FF, not Ultimatum). Even though it really suffered from Greg Land being the artist. I'd love to see him fleshed out some. Mister Roboto posted:Could be the case, I'll admit Cap stopped being interesting to me a few years ago (like high school) when I don't know when a few years ago was, but Ed Brubaker has been writing Cap since 2005 and it's been loving great ever since. Probably the best the character has ever been. Deadpool fucked around with this message at Mar 2, 2012 around 08:04 |
| # ? Mar 2, 2012 08:02 |
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Cap's had a lot of good stories and been written with depth and subtlety since the 60s. Not to say he's not had his lovely runs, but he's very rarely been as one-dimensionally boy scout go-USA as his name and costume implies, at least not since he's been a Marvel character. People just project that poo poo onto him.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 08:09 |
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Lurdiak posted:Cap's had a lot of good stories and been written with depth and subtlety since the 60s. Not to say he's not had his lovely runs, but he's never ever been as one-dimensionally boy scout go-USA as his name and costume implies, at least not since he's been a Marvel character. People just project that poo poo onto him. Not so much in his solo title, outside a few rough patches. But in other appearances written by writers not used to him he's been portrayed poorly a number of times. Cap is my second favorite 616 character after Spidey, and I've been reading his title for years and years. I've loved him since I was a little kid and started reading comics. He and Spidey are pretty much the only Marvel characters that I stick with no matter how bad a patch they're going through. And I've been reading both for about 20 years straight now. So I've definitely seen people write him bad. I've also had this 'Boy Scout, Super Patriot, Yes Man' conversation with so many people over the years. It's too bad that so many people see him that way. Deadpool fucked around with this message at Mar 2, 2012 around 08:15 |
| # ? Mar 2, 2012 08:11 |
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Deadpool posted:Not so much in his solo title, outside a few rough patches. But in other appearance written by writers not used to him he's been portrayed poorly a number of times. Yeah, that's true. But I think you can say that about a lot of characters.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 08:14 |
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On the topic of Namor, I just looked and there's strangely NO discussion about his current status on the net. I did some digging and found his last appearance that I was referring to earlier:  Mister Roboto fucked around with this message at Mar 2, 2012 around 08:17 |
| # ? Mar 2, 2012 08:14 |
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Lurdiak posted:Yeah, that's true. But I think you can say that about a lot of characters. Obviously. But while Cap is obviously one of Marvel's main characters, he's not been terribly popular over the years. So his appearances elsewhere have a bigger affect on how people perceive him than some of the other major characters.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 08:20 |
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So I have a weird question: Who the hell was the character on the cover of this weeks Ultimate X-Men supposed to be?
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 13:03 |
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Scarlett Witch I think?
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 13:30 |
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Deadpool posted:Not so much in his solo title, outside a few rough patches. But in other appearances written by writers not used to him he's been portrayed poorly a number of times. Do you show them all the storylines were Cap tells the US goverment that he disagrees with them and he stops being Captain America? Also I guess Namor is just were he was in FF #4, waiting for Johnny to give him a shave.
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| # ? Mar 2, 2012 14:46 |
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How long is Ultimates supposed to be running? 12-13 issues like the first two volumes, or is it an on-going? I don't want it to stop.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 08:45 |
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Ultimate X-Men 1-53 are on sale for a buck an issue on Comixology. Are they worth the time it would take to read them or should I just not bother?
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 12:42 |
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A dollar a comic is exactly what some people will tell you Millar's ideas are worth. It will include the best two comics Chuck Austen ever wrote ( A Gambit two-parter) so that's actually a dollar's worth, too. If that goes straight through Vaughn I'd say go for it. I liked Ultimate X-men a lot for a long time, just don't go in expecting high art, and also, pretend people use "meatball" as a burn a lot.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 12:53 |
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Bitchin Kitchen posted:A dollar a comic is exactly what some people will tell you Millar's ideas are worth. It will include the best two comics Chuck Austen ever wrote ( A Gambit two-parter) so that's actually a dollar's worth, too. If that goes straight through Vaughn I'd say go for it. I liked Ultimate X-men a lot for a long time, just don't go in expecting high art, and also, pretend people use "meatball" as a burn a lot. That Austen two parter is probably the best two issues of Ultimate X-Men ever written. And I usually hate Chuck Austen. But gently caress me if he didn't knock it out of the park there. Of course, they then pretty much erased the entire characterization he gave to Gambit, made him a pseudo-villain, and then killed him in an annual after only one additional appearance. So, yay Marvel, I guess.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 13:27 |
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Bitchin Kitchen posted:pretend people use "meatball" as a burn a lot Also "little". Almost every insult involves the adjective "little". I don't hate Millar's Ultimate X-Men by any means, but this is my most prominent memory of it.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 13:39 |
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Kind of a silly question, but while we're on the topic of Ultimate X-Men, I had a question about how the scarlet witch was drawn in the latest issues. Has she always had comically large breasts or are those just the current artists touch to the series? I haven't read any Ultimate Comics before the current relaunch and I'm not trying to start any debate or anything, just curious since I almost laughed out loud when I was reading it on the train.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 13:40 |
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TheJoker138 posted:So I have a weird question: Who the hell was the character on the cover of this weeks Ultimate X-Men supposed to be? I assumed Jean Grey, but I also didn't look too closely.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 13:56 |
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gogisha posted:Kind of a silly question, but while we're on the topic of Ultimate X-Men, I had a question about how the scarlet witch was drawn in the latest issues. Has she always had comically large breasts or are those just the current artists touch to the series? I haven't read any Ultimate Comics before the current relaunch and I'm not trying to start any debate or anything, just curious since I almost laughed out loud when I was reading it on the train. No, back when Hitch drew her she looked like nearly anorexic eurotrash.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 14:54 |
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Strange habit they've gotten into lately of devoting several pages towards recapping what's happened in the previous few issues. Used to be the paragraph at the cover page, now it's 1/3 the issue. Must be an editorial mandate, because it's happening across the Ultimate line.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 19:21 |
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| # ? May 26, 2013 05:11 |
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TheJoker138 posted:That Austen two parter is probably the best two issues of Ultimate X-Men ever written. And I usually hate Chuck Austen. But gently caress me if he didn't knock it out of the park there. Of course, they then pretty much erased the entire characterization he gave to Gambit, made him a pseudo-villain, and then killed him in an annual after only one additional appearance. So, yay Marvel, I guess. Yeah, I've never followed the X-Men too closely but I knew that people bitched about Austen a lot. I hadn't really read anything of note that he had written when I got to those issues so based on feedback from others I was expecting it to be lovely. It was not that at all. It may have been one of my favorite Ultimate X-Men stories. And I have always hated Gambit. So I guess if you have people that hate Gambit and Austen praising the story that something really good must have happened there, even if by accident.
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| # ? Mar 5, 2012 20:57 |
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