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Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.


Zilkin posted:

You guys make this game sound so good, was thinking of waiting for GotY edition but now I don't know. Whats holding me back is that the game + all the DLCs cost like 70 euros on Steam. Is this game really worth that?

It IS worth it, but if you don't mind waiting I can guarantee it will be on sale again at some point, probably as a GOTY edition. You will get PLENTY of value out of the game. I picked it up on sale because I didn't really feel much urge to get more of the same Fallout 3, which is what I was expecting, but I got so much more.

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Wolfsheim
Dec 23, 2003

Home of the
"FIGHTING CHOMSKYS"


Doug Lombardi posted:

NMA was 100% correct about Fallout 3 and they liked Fallout: New Vegas so I don't get the criticism.

Before Fallout 3 came out a guy made a thread about being excited for it and they closed the thread and banned him.

Omnicarus posted:

I think the criticism was directed at the sheer anger that they displayed. FO3 got the Civ V treatment, imo. It is a good game that somehow earned the ire of some dedicated fans and has since been panned as a shitheap despite being a pretty awesome reinvention of a series.

I tried to play F3 after New Vegas but only got to Megaton before I just couldn't continue. I still really like F3 for a few things it did, and without it there wouldn't even be a New Vegas, so there's that. It just gets completely attacked because on the internet there's no in-between for any piece of media, it's either redefining the genre or making GBS threads in your mouth.

Mothership Zeta absolutely deserved all the hate it got, though. I hope Bethesda took note when looking at NV's DLC.

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


I didn't enjoy FO3 nearly as much as New Vegas, but I still gave it two playthroughs and had fun with it for what it was. It did have a few really cool elements and the Washington ruins were pretty well realised.

It all bodes well for TES: New Rohan.

e: I'm really sorry I made a joke about NMA now.

J Bjelke-Postersen fucked around with this message at Sep 26, 2011 around 06:24

Node
May 20, 2001



Wolfsheim posted:

Before Fallout 3 came out a guy made a thread about being excited for it and they closed the thread and banned him.

That doesn't have anything to do with the fact that they were 100% right about FO3.

Mikael Kreoss
Feb 13, 2011

by Fistgrrl


Doug Lombardi posted:

Both of those games are total garbage though. Fallout 3 was embarrassing Fallout fanfiction and Civ V is permanently crippled by the unworkable One Unit Per Tile battle system that ruined the basic economics of earlier games and to top it off the AI still can't play the game.



Seriously, we get it you have ~opinions~ but this isn't an f3 thread, I mean could you at least wait until page 2 before you poo poo up the thread.

I don't even like f3 either, but still.

EDIT: Rad, as I posted this we already hit page 2 and people are arguing about the merits of f3 again. Doug Lombardi strikes again!

Avocados
Jul 31, 2010

Imagine growing a flower


Zilkin posted:

You guys make this game sound so good, was thinking of waiting for GotY edition but now I don't know. Whats holding me back is that the game + all the DLCs cost like 70 euros on Steam. Is this game really worth that?
I don't know if it helps, but I thought Fallout 3 was pretty boring in every aspect, and Fallout New Vegas was a game I absolutely adored. (Never played 1 or 2 though). I guess what I liked about New Vegas was:

-Cooler environment, even if still a wasteland, it was a lot more enjoyable and varied. Less green too.
-Interesting story. Suffice to say, I felt like each quest was getting me closer to the conclusion and side-quests usually provided a tangible benefit to the main story-line.
-Likeable characters. Lily
-Cowboys n cowgirls!
-Vegas
-Hearing about my beautiful home-state of

I figure if you liked Fallout 3 then Vegas should be awesome.

Zilkin
Jan 9, 2009


Jerusalem posted:

It IS worth it, but if you don't mind waiting I can guarantee it will be on sale again at some point, probably as a GOTY edition. You will get PLENTY of value out of the game. I picked it up on sale because I didn't really feel much urge to get more of the same Fallout 3, which is what I was expecting, but I got so much more.

Well I bought it, was even wrong about the price, the game + DLCs was only 60 euros, not 70 Anyway if this game really is a lot better than Fallout 3, which I also liked, that money should be well spent.

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


Zilkin posted:

Well I bought it, was even wrong about the price, the game + DLCs was only 60 euros, not 70 Anyway if this game really is a lot better than Fallout 3, which I also liked, that money should be well spent.

I don't want to pump it up, but it's a lot better and you will have a loads of fun so long as you are true to Caesar.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

You wildly underestimated my liver's ability to metabolize toxins.

If you're a long time fan, all you need to know is New Vegas is the real sequel to Fallout 1 and 2. If you were sad about losing Van Buren, many parts of it survive in New Vegas. It's also just awesome as poo poo and better than Fallout 3 in every way. And I liked 3, I'm not a hater.

New Vegas is the real Fallout 3 and Bethesda's 3 is a spinoff that's not bad but doesn't seem to understand what it's trying to do most of the time.

Avocados
Jul 31, 2010

Imagine growing a flower


Zilkin posted:

Well I bought it, was even wrong about the price, the game + DLCs was only 60 euros, not 70 Anyway if this game really is a lot better than Fallout 3, which I also liked, that money should be well spent.


Please report some thoughts after you've been acquainted with it enough

ALL-PRO SEXMAN
Nov 8, 2006

Veni, vidi, Lombardi.


Fallout 3 has Liam Neeson as your dad, therefore it cannot by any metric be bad. That said, New Vegas is still better.

Why do goons and gamers seem to have so much trouble with the concept "not as good as ≠ bad".

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


Vincent Van Goatse posted:

Fallout 3 has Liam Neeson as your dad. There it cannot by any metric be bad.

That said, New Vegas is still better.

True. Though I remember being on blackout for FO3 (I wanted it to be great and needed to avoid the hate) and when I started it up I was like "woah that's Liam Neeson." It was unfortunate though because the rest of the game couldn't really live up to Liam Neeson being my surprise dad.

A Fancy 400 lbs
Jul 23, 2008



Yup.


Vincent Van Goatse posted:

Fallout 3 has Liam Neeson as your dad, therefore it cannot by any metric be bad. That said, New Vegas is still better.

Why do goons and gamers seem to have so much trouble with the concept "not as good as ≠ bad".

Why can't people think FO3 is bad? NMA over reacted and they judged before playing it, but that doesn't mean anyone else who thinks it was bad is just an NMA troll.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

You wildly underestimated my liver's ability to metabolize toxins.

Vincent Van Goatse posted:

Why do goons and gamers seem to have so much trouble with the concept "not as good as ≠ bad".

I've often wondered this myself. I've never been able to figure out an answer. Fallout 3 is a solid six or seven, it's not bad by any stretch. It just happens to be surrounded by nines and tens.

It's an internet-wide problem. Movies, TV, books, they all get the same treatment. Something is great or poo poo, there is no middle ground.

ALL-PRO SEXMAN
Nov 8, 2006

Veni, vidi, Lombardi.


A Fancy 400 lbs posted:

Why can't people think FO3 is bad? NMA over reacted and they judged before playing it, but that doesn't mean anyone else who thinks it was bad is just an NMA troll.

Because it's not an objectively bad game. Not doing what you (not you specifically) wanted the game to do does not make it bad.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.


J Bjelke-Postersen posted:

I don't want to pump it up, but it's a lot better and you will have a loads of fun so long as you are true to Caesar.

I did not come to this thread to praise Caesar!

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


Vincent Van Goatse posted:

Because it's not an objectively bad game. Not doing what you (not you specifically) wanted the game to do does not make it bad.

I agree. If it was branded something other than Fallout it would have been a 7-9 depending on the source of the review and people would have just moved on. I get that people love the Fallout brand though, so even a pretty good game with pretty good stuff was going to get attacked.

Anyways how about that Fallout: New Vegas game? That was a great game. I'm still playing it!

Jerusalem posted:

I did not come to this thread to praise Caesar!

On the cross with you buddy.

ALL-PRO SEXMAN
Nov 8, 2006

Veni, vidi, Lombardi.


J Bjelke-Postersen posted:

I don't want to pump it up, but it's a lot better and you will have a loads of fun so long as you are true to Caesar.

Look at this barbarian, pissing on the Bear Flag like that. Shame on you.

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


I just wanted the XP, I'll always gently caress over everyone in the end

ALL-PRO SEXMAN
Nov 8, 2006

Veni, vidi, Lombardi.


I'm a California native. I just adore the idea of my state running the world (it would be a disaster IRL). I was doomed to be an NCR patriot even before I'd heard of Fallout.

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


I often end up working with the Brotherhood of Steel because:
a) they have a cool name
b) they have cool gear and
c) I'm a selfish shithead.

Dan Didio
Apr 6, 2009


J Bjelke-Postersen posted:

I agree. If it was branded something other than Fallout it would have been a 7-9 depending on the source of the review and people would have just moved on.

The actual, big issues with Fallout 3 aren't actually related to it being called 'Fallout'. It's just that the NMA mouthbreathing hordes managed to get pretty much any criticism of Fallout 3 or debate about it framed in that manner by the way they acted before it's release.

Seashell Salesman
Aug 4, 2005


Guys I think we can all agree that Civ V was a terrible insult to the fans and move on to discussing important issues like how many one hundredth scale Deathclaws it would take to kill a one hundred times scale Legate Lanius.

Horsebanger
Jun 25, 2009


it seems by level 50 the combination of perks and skillpoints makes you a wasteland god, I'm kind of annoyed at this as nothing seemed challenging anymore.

Dan Didio
Apr 6, 2009


Horsebanger posted:

it seems by level 50 the combination of perks and skillpoints makes you a wasteland god, I'm kind of annoyed at this as nothing seemed challenging anymore.

Take that Logan's Run inspired trait, dog.

Anou
May 29, 2006
Hello there!

So, in Fallout 2, you could beeline to San Francisco and Navarro straight from the Arroyo and grab the Power Armor and the high powered weapons. I was thinking of the New Vegas equivalent to that kind of blatant powergaming.

What I got was:

9 Intelligence and 9 luck at the beginning and tag lockpick to crack the safe in the school to pick up the stealthboy. Stealthboy your way across the I-15 with your finger on the quickload button in case those deathclaws spot you. This is the worst part though because those Deathclaws have really high perception and can spot you even when you're Stealth Boyed but you have enough time to get past Quarry Junction. Go to New Vegas and Freeside, go gamble away with your 9 luck at the Atomic Wrangler till you have 2000 chips to get into The Strip. Go into The Strip, break the bank at the casinos, get the intelligence implants. I think you can get away with not leveling up to level 2 if you pick up skilled as a trait, so you can choose to level up once you implant yourself to 10 Intelligence so that you have maximum skill point gain along with all the implants naturally boosting your skills because of SPECIAL boosting. Then you spend the rest of the casino money on guns and armor and I think that's the easiest way to get yourself a massive early game lead.

It might be possible to powergame it up even more by going to Old World Blues really quickly but sending a character that early into Old World Blues sounds like it would be a massive pain. I guess the Spineless with it's +2 strength would mean that you only need to bring your strength SPECIAL to 4 and not waste points in Intense Training if you want to use Strength 10 requirement guns. (Assuming you would be wearing strength boosting power armor.) You won't need to waste a perk slot on Tag! and Educated if you want max skills by the time you hit level cap (probably alot earlier though).

Am I missing anything here? Other then the extra SPECIAL point from beating Lonesome Road I think there are no other SPECIAL boosts in the game that aren't implants / the OWB perk other then from items.

Chinaman7000
Nov 28, 2003



I will always Fallout 3 because of Behemoths, Liberty Prime, and Trainquility motherfucking Lane.

But then there is the town of children and eeuuugh

Baron von der Loon
Feb 12, 2009

Awesome!


Because I won't be able to get any new games till December or so, I started Fallout 3 GotY on the 360 which I once bought on a whim, after having spent numerous hours in New Vegas. I'll admit that I have lurked at the Codex and NMA before F3 was released, so my views are likely a bit skewed to being negative about it.

Nonetheless, I will admit that I am having a good time exploring the Capital Wasteland. There are tons of locations to explore, the game is very open in allowing you to simply walk into one direction and see all the new things you can discover, and I admit that I'm starting to take a shine to that. The DLC that shipped with the GotY edition sound interesting with each adding something different to the setting. Only gone through Anchorage so far, which wasn't as bad as I heard. A quick glimpse in pre-war Fallout was neat, and I actually enjoyed just having a good ol' simple shooter for a few hours. The little mechanic with putting a team together was a nice touch as well.

The biggest problem that I generally have is when people start talking, which for a RPG is a big downer. The whole "You can make a difference, you can save the wasteland" theme that seems to be running through the game feels very off from the other games. Also, after playing through New Vegas which had a setting that makes sense, it feels pretty weird to go through a setting filled with cool, random and wacky places for people to live.


One bit I've been wondering about with F3: After completing Anchorage, I got the Chinese Stealth Armour and the Gauss Rifle. I love the new look of the stealth armour, as well as the cloaking option, and the Gauss Rifle goes together pretty well with my energy-weapons PC, but I gotta ask: Did I just win the game? Every encounter basically boils down to me sniping everyone I see in VATS. I know that I could just as easily equip different gear to turn the game into a challenge, but are there any downsides to these weapons?

Chinaman7000
Nov 28, 2003



Yeah those break the game and are easy to get. You will never find better stuff.

Haul around the invincible unbreaking Power Armor you get for serious moments and you basically turned on god mode.

Lets Fuck Bro
Apr 14, 2009

by Ozmaugh


I just finished Dead Money and thought it was super cool. I loved basically everything about it. The characters were all really great and well-written and the oppressive atmosphere ended up being a lot more fun than I thought it would. And the other DLCs are really supposed to be even better? Man I love this game.

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


Anou posted:

So, in Fallout 2, you could beeline to San Francisco and Navarro straight from the Arroyo and grab the Power Armor and the high powered weapons. I was thinking of the New Vegas equivalent to that kind of blatant powergaming.

What I got was:

9 Intelligence and 9 luck at the beginning and tag lockpick to crack the safe in the school to pick up the stealthboy.

Stealthboy? Just hug the rocks on the right and it's pie. I did it with 13 sneak and just ran screaming most of the way to Vegas. I saw a giant ant in a barn, scared the poo poo out of me!

Police Automaton
Mar 17, 2009


rvdleun posted:

One bit I've been wondering about with F3: After completing Anchorage, I got the Chinese Stealth Armour and the Gauss Rifle. I love the new look of the stealth armour, as well as the cloaking option, and the Gauss Rifle goes together pretty well with my energy-weapons PC, but I gotta ask: Did I just win the game? Every encounter basically boils down to me sniping everyone I see in VATS. I know that I could just as easily equip different gear to turn the game into a challenge, but are there any downsides to these weapons?

Pretty much, but don't fret about it too much and enjoy the ride, basically all games of this kind since Morrowind have this "point of no return" where you're either highleveled or well equipped enough that you basically break the game. The way of reaching that point can usually be prolonged by extensive modding, that being said, the stuff you get realtively easy from anchorage really basically finishes the game for you. Also try to stop using VATS, it makes the game too easy.

Anou
May 29, 2006
Hello there!

J Bjelke-Postersen posted:

Stealthboy? Just hug the rocks on the right and it's pie. I did it with 13 sneak and just ran screaming most of the way to Vegas. I saw a giant ant in a barn, scared the poo poo out of me!

Huh, I never knew that. I guess the 9 intelligence / 9 luck is unnecessary too if you don't really care that much about skill points. All you need is somewhat high luck (I'd say 7+) to make the Blackjack games not an exercise in frustration.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.


Police Automaton posted:

Also try to stop using VATS, it makes the game too easy.

I did find that making a conscious decision to stop using VATS so much in FO3 made the game much more enjoyable to me. In New Vegas it's about a 50/50 split, I find.

Scorchy
Jul 15, 2006

Smug Statement: Elementary, my dear meatbag.


Jerusalem posted:

I did find that making a conscious decision to stop using VATS so much in FO3 made the game much more enjoyable to me. In New Vegas it's about a 50/50 split, I find.

New Vegas made lots of improvements to non-VATs combat balance and it feels much better there. FO3 is just, you got into VATS and win every time, it was so stupid.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.


Oh God I found and fixed Rhonda and the first thing "she" asked me was where Tabitha was

J Bjelke-Postersen
Sep 16, 2007

I have a 6 point plan to stop the boats.....or turn them around or something....No wait what were those points again....Are there really 6?


Anou posted:

Huh, I never knew that. I guess the 9 intelligence / 9 luck is unnecessary too if you don't really care that much about skill points. All you need is somewhat high luck (I'd say 7+) to make the Blackjack games not an exercise in frustration.

I went with luck 10 so I could double down on a twenty and pull an ace

Kalko
Oct 9, 2004



Anou posted:

So, in Fallout 2, you could beeline to San Francisco and Navarro straight from the Arroyo and grab the Power Armor and the high powered weapons. I was thinking of the New Vegas equivalent to that kind of blatant powergaming.

Since you can enter and exit the Lonesome Road whenever you feel like it you can simply go there straight from Goodsprings and pick up the Arc Welder, Nailgun, and Bowie Knife, which makes any early-to-mid-game combat challenge back in the Mojave a breeze.

You can even kill all of the Marked Men with strategic use of the plasma mine/grenade stash just outside the Hopeville bunker, or simply by letting them engage EDE (this actually felt pretty cheesy). With proper planning and the Red Glare I wouldn't be surprised if you could go all the way and complete LR. There's certainly no shortage of ammo and consumables in The Divide, which is something I found mildly affronting on my first trip since I packed for it like there was no tomorrow (because in New Vegas, hey, you never know...)

edit : spoiler added!

Kalko fucked around with this message at Sep 26, 2011 around 08:31

Police Automaton
Mar 17, 2009


I kinda see what VATS was thought for but I don't think it quite worked. I played both FO3 and NV extensively and the ToHit chances in both still feel completly random and I have still no clear idea how the game gets to them. That being said, in both games around mid-game if you focused on weapons of any kind (and who doesn't) you'll end up with your weapon of choice basically having a constant 95% ToHit chance if you're not like, miles away from the target or at an odd angle.

At that point, you end up getting into an encounter, pressing the VATS key, clicking on all the heads and calling it a day. I often ended up having encounters against multiple NPCs which ended with the NPCs being dead before they could even pull their gun. actually fighting them FPS style is a lot more fun. VATS should be harder and more of a chance thing imho.

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Knuc U Kinte
Aug 17, 2004




Anou posted:

So, in Fallout 2, you could beeline to San Francisco and Navarro straight from the Arroyo and grab the Power Armor and the high powered weapons. I was thinking of the New Vegas equivalent to that kind of blatant powergaming.

What I got was:

9 Intelligence and 9 luck at the beginning and tag lockpick to crack the safe in the school to pick up the stealthboy. Stealthboy your way across the I-15 with your finger on the quickload button in case those deathclaws spot you. This is the worst part though because those Deathclaws have really high perception and can spot you even when you're Stealth Boyed but you have enough time to get past Quarry Junction. Go to New Vegas and Freeside, go gamble away with your 9 luck at the Atomic Wrangler till you have 2000 chips to get into The Strip. Go into The Strip, break the bank at the casinos, get the intelligence implants. I think you can get away with not leveling up to level 2 if you pick up skilled as a trait, so you can choose to level up once you implant yourself to 10 Intelligence so that you have maximum skill point gain along with all the implants naturally boosting your skills because of SPECIAL boosting. Then you spend the rest of the casino money on guns and armor and I think that's the easiest way to get yourself a massive early game lead.

It might be possible to powergame it up even more by going to Old World Blues really quickly but sending a character that early into Old World Blues sounds like it would be a massive pain. I guess the Spineless with it's +2 strength would mean that you only need to bring your strength SPECIAL to 4 and not waste points in Intense Training if you want to use Strength 10 requirement guns. (Assuming you would be wearing strength boosting power armor.) You won't need to waste a perk slot on Tag! and Educated if you want max skills by the time you hit level cap (probably alot earlier though).

Am I missing anything here? Other then the extra SPECIAL point from beating Lonesome Road I think there are no other SPECIAL boosts in the game that aren't implants / the OWB perk other then from items.

No. Go to the cemetery, get snowglobe, go to Primm get NCR armour, go to Mc Carran via hugging the cliffs east of Sloan, and take the monorail. Get snowglobe from lucky 38, get int implant. No need to waste time gambling.

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