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Cherrywood posted:Why do some trans people want to live in "stealth"? Some really tolerant people will view you differently when they find out you were 'born a man'. Plus even the most fleeting entries to your social circle will inevitably be told 'she was a dude' as soon as you are not within earshot, which is a pretty bad thing when you just want to be seen as a person with gender rather than an oddity. It just makes life unnecessarily harder if you are not into waving the flag for trans pride.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 22:42 |
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| # ? May 21, 2013 21:20 |
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Slave posted:Even some really tolerant people will view you differently when they find out you were 'born a man'. Plus even the most fleeting entries to your social circle will inevitably be told 'she was a dude' as soon as you are not within earshot, which is a pretty bad thing when you just want to be seen as a person with gender rather than an oddity. Wouldn't being out foster the normalization and desired change necessary to make these things not be so much of an issue?
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 22:43 |
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Cherrywood posted:Wouldn't being out foster the normalization and desired change necessary to make these things not be so much of an issue?
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 22:48 |
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Cherrywood posted:Wouldn't being out foster the normalization and desired change necessary to make these things not be so much of an issue? Yeah and if someone is willing to sacrifice some comfort and happiness for it then they have my undying respect, but most people just want to get the transition out of the way, blend in and live their lives as their chosen gender
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 22:51 |
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Slave posted:Yeah and if someone is willing to sacrifice some comfort and happiness for it then they have my undying respect, but most people just want to get the transition out of the way, blend in and live their lives as their chosen gender understandable, but I think that is quite unfortunate
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 22:53 |
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Cherrywood posted:understandable, but I think that is quite unfortunate there's only like, 13 states that ban discrimination for gender identity. There's a large possibility that you could get fired for revealing to someone that you were once a guy or whatever.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 22:55 |
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Cityinthesea posted:there's only like, 13 states that ban discrimination for gender identity. There's a large possibility that you could get fired for revealing to someone that you were once a guy or whatever. And that would honestly be the least of your worries not being stealth.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:01 |
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Cherrywood posted:Why do some trans people want to live in "stealth"? Some of us have careers that require it.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:02 |
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Cherrywood posted:Why do some trans people want to live in "stealth"? Because it's not really necessary for everyone to know?
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:04 |
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Cherrywood posted:Why do some trans people want to live in "stealth"? Not being murdered can be nice.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:21 |
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Someday I want to get to the point where stealth is not necessary. 'Til then, keep your head down and work quietly.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:27 |
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Cherrywood posted:Wouldn't being out foster the normalization and desired change necessary to make these things not be so much of an issue? Yeah okay whose job is it to sacrifice everything and go first?
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:28 |
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Red Ryder posted:Yeah okay whose job is it to sacrifice everything and go first? I do pretty ok for myself! I do like to hear other people's perspectives though so thanks to everyone that has responded so far.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:30 |
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Personally, it's because I'd rather be thought of and treated as a woman rather than as a man who became a woman. The charge will be lead by one nobler than I.
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| # ? Dec 10, 2011 23:53 |
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Cherrywood posted:understandable, but I think that is quite unfortunate Well, in what sense do you mean? If you mean it's unfortunate because people want to do that because of how trans people are treated by many people, I totally agree. That said, I don't think there's anything wrong with just wanting to be treated as their target gender, rather than a third category. That's certainly my hope in my transition.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 01:07 |
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Yeah, it would nice to be out and proud, but it's going to have the be a braver person than me. I just want to be seen and treated as a man. Especially in a state where I'm not protected by discrimination or hate crime laws.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 01:25 |
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Salaminizer posted:That said, I don't think there's anything wrong with just wanting to be treated as their target gender, rather than a third category. That's certainly my hope in my transition. Quoted for emphasis. I had my phase of wanting to be an educator. It led to my car and lockers at work being vandalized with hate speech and being told that "Our sexual harassment rules only protect people of one sex or the other, not people in between" (actual quote) when I asked for them to check their video records (they had both the parking lots and the lockers monitored under CCTV surveillance) to find out who it was. In short, people are dicks, and I just want to live my life without being a beacon to people that would want to gently caress me over. Magneto was right.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 01:32 |
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What does 'Magneto was right' mean? Google turns up nothing of value.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 01:36 |
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teh winnar! posted:Quoted for emphasis. I had my phase of wanting to be an educator. It led to my car and lockers at work being vandalized with hate speech and being told that "Our sexual harassment rules only protect people of one sex or the other, not people in between" (actual quote) when I asked for them to check their video records (they had both the parking lots and the lockers monitored under CCTV surveillance) to find out who it was. Holy gently caress. Where did this happen? I ask because I work in education at the moment and want to know how worried I should be.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 01:42 |
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Plom Bar posted:Personally, it's because I'd rather be thought of and treated as a woman rather than as a man who became a woman. Exactly. As soon as someone knows your trans status, there's immediately an asterisk by your name whenever they think of you, and it goes without saying that their perception of you will be colored by it. It might not be in a bad way, per se, but it's still there. No one wants to live their life carrying around a footnote when there's not even a reason to have it. RumbleFish fucked around with this message at Dec 11, 2011 around 01:56 |
| # ? Dec 11, 2011 01:53 |
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Plom Bar posted:What does 'Magneto was right' mean? Google turns up nothing of value. *does a quick lookup* Wiki used to have a sub-heading in the article about him that gave a much better explanation than I could. Basically, in the comic storyline, Magneto was occasionally given an antihero bent instead of one as a classic villain. Both as a villain and as an anti-hero, however, Magneto believed that because of their innate fear of the "other," humans would always do their damnedest to discriminate, subjugate, or even destroy mutants, and that only by taking an active and at times combatative stance, could he establish a foothold for mutant survival. The fact that he was a Holocaust survivor no doubt helped to shape this world-view. As with any celebrity, this worldview would certainly catch the eye of some mutants, especially the disenfranchised. It got to the point where in-universe, he was even viewed by some as a sort of Che Guevara of mutants, leading to a few characters wearing red t-shirts with his visage and the text of "Magneto was right" on them. Salaminizer posted:Holy gently caress. Where did this happen? I ask because I work in education at the moment and want to know how worried I should be. This was in an little town in Iowa. Don't get me wrong, the state is a great place to raise a family or retire, and education (as far as facts and test scores) is amazing, but there isn't much of a future there for people that aren't cis hetero WASPs.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 01:58 |
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teh winnar! posted:Quoted for emphasis. I had my phase of wanting to be an educator. It led to my car and lockers at work being vandalized with hate speech and being told that "Our sexual harassment rules only protect people of one sex or the other, not people in between" (actual quote) when I asked for them to check their video records (they had both the parking lots and the lockers monitored under CCTV surveillance) to find out who it was. Ok cool lets kill all the cis tyranny in name of the transgender master race.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 02:44 |
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teh winnar! posted:This was in an little town in Iowa. Don't get me wrong, the state is a great place to raise a family or retire, and education (as far as facts and test scores) is amazing, but there isn't much of a future there for people that aren't cis hetero WASPs. Ah. It's my understanding things are a bit better for that in Canada (which is good as I'm already kind of back and forth on my career choice for other reasons), but that's still outright disgusting. Also, I'm pretty sure teh winnar wasn't seriously advocating for cisgendered genocide.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 03:10 |
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Frogmarched posted:Ok cool lets kill all the cis tyranny in name of the transgender master race. "Have you ever tried, y'know, not being a mutant?" MWR has been my catchphrase for the past few years. Which Ian McKellan role I espouse is a good reminder of how I'm feeling about life in general. Magneto was right: people suck. Gandalf was right: there are some good people out there. GWR moments make me feel warm and fuzzy inside, as though I just ate a puppy. Besides, I've got a reputation as a baby-eating monster to uphold. Gotta kick up the edginess somehow. teh winnar! fucked around with this message at Dec 11, 2011 around 03:18 |
| # ? Dec 11, 2011 03:14 |
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teh winnar! posted:"Have you ever tried, y'know, not being a mutant?" I honestly take no offence, I'm just letting you know that "Magneto was right" is a parallel to the phrase "Hitler was right". It's less "people suck", and more "Exterminate the inferior races that plague our society".
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 03:46 |
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Frogmarched posted:I honestly take no offense, I'm just letting you know that "Magneto was right" is a parallel to the phrase "Hitler was right". It's less "people suck", and more "Exterminate the inferior races that plague our society". Haha Really no. Magneto was right is more "people will always oppress us given the chance so we must subjugate them!" and seeing as this is an offensive internet humor site I think its pretty acceptable. All the obvious things aside there is also the whole repeated and ongoing mutants as queers allegory that the x-men writers self consciously worked into the stories with parents asking their kids "well when did you know you were a mutant?" and bigots saying poo poo like "I don't hate all mutants, just the ones that rub it in our faces". Try watching the movies and replacing mutant with enjoyable human being and lots of it still works (remember queer people have a enjoyable human being x-factor that gives them super powers, we just hide it outside of pride week).
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 04:04 |
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LtSmash posted:Haha Really no. Magneto was right is more "people will always oppress us given the chance so we must subjugate them!" and seeing as this is an offensive internet humor site I think its pretty acceptable. You could replace it with friend of the family and Jew or whatever and it works just as well, also Hitler literally believed in the same poo poo you stated I.E the Jewish cabel were selling Germany out/keeping the German people weak. The whole Magneto was right is a clear reference and example. It is supposed to show how those feeling downtrodden and ignored can easily be manipulated into supporting tyrannical views and beliefs.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 04:47 |
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Salaminizer posted:Well, in what sense do you mean? I think it's unfortunate that those threatening situations exist for people. I also think that it's unfortunate that when those situations aren't as prevalent, people often still choose to go stealth because it's the path of least resistance.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 04:53 |
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Frogmarched posted:You could replace it with friend of the family and Jew or whatever and it works just as well, also Hitler literally believed in the same poo poo you stated I.E the Jewish cabel were selling Germany out/keeping the German people weak. Actually, that symbolism is intentional. Historically, the group that would become the Nazi party focused first on bringing together the downtrodden Germans into a unified group. It wasn't until after the regime came to power that they expanded into actively persuing the plan to take out their scapegoats. Magneto, being a Holocaust survivor whose mutant powers awakened in the concentration camps, is made to accent the "those who don't learn from past mistakes are doomed to repeat it" aesop, so much so as to call it out in the "First Class" movie. I started using the phrase when I saw a t-shirt for sale in the above-mentioned Che imagery. then I saw a photoshopped image of Sir Ian McKellan in a pride march with a shirt reading "I am Gandalf and Magneto. Get over it" and the rest is awesome history. But that's a bit o' derail. Oh, and speaking of queer/mutant symbolism, What The gently caress. teh winnar! fucked around with this message at Dec 11, 2011 around 05:50 |
| # ? Dec 11, 2011 05:41 |
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Cherrywood posted:I think it's unfortunate that those threatening situations exist for people. I also think that it's unfortunate that when those situations aren't as prevalent, people often still choose to go stealth because it's the path of least resistance. But there isn't some magical place where you're guaranteed that if you come out you'll be safe and secure in your job, life, and everyone will still see you as your real gender, nobody will decide that your experiences/feelings apply to all trans people, etc. For instance, I'm basically stealth, and I daresay the majority of people would be fine with it, but I don't know. And this is a small enough town that it would likely get around to people I'm not even acquainted with but will inevitably run into and for all I know they'd be the type to beat me up outside a bar sometime. And maybe I'm being unfair and assuming the worst and blah blah blah, but I don't feel like I should have to bloody worry about that sort of thing.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 07:25 |
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Cherrywood posted:I think it's unfortunate that those threatening situations exist for people. I also think that it's unfortunate that when those situations aren't as prevalent, people often still choose to go stealth because it's the path of least resistance. Sorry if this is coming across overly hostile, but from the get go your posts have been heavily implying that people wanting to live stealth are wrong or lesser people for their choice, and that poo poo don't fly. Plom Bar fucked around with this message at Dec 11, 2011 around 07:28 |
| # ? Dec 11, 2011 07:26 |
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onecooldan posted:I did 2 photo projects about Transgenderism (featuring myself) in my Photography class, and the entire class was receptive. One person told me that my project almost made her cry and that it was gallery-ready (so happy). This sounds neat and I'd love to see them if you are comfortable sharing.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 08:41 |
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Re: stealth. My situation makes ever going stealth p. much impossible. So I guess I'll be doing some flag waving. Then again, here it's also extremely unlikely to get killed for being trans, and in my field it's not very likely I'll face any serious discrimination. Of course, many people will never see me as a real guy, but the ones that matter the most already do, even with the boobs and all.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 10:21 |
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Transman of Gor posted:Then again, here it's also extremely unlikely to get killed for being trans, Where do you live, Magical Rainbows And Puppies Utopia World?
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 12:43 |
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For the stealth question. I am a man, I want to be seen as and treated as such. I pass entirely. It would be more effort to go out of my way and tell people I am trans when they have absolutely no idea from looking at or interacting with me. It's already the case when any nurse or doctor needs to see my chest for any reason that they ask how I got my scars and are surprised if I say they are from a mastectomy due to being trans. Unless it's relevant to my treatment I just say gynecomastia or generic 'surgery' and leave it at that. It would be very tiresome to tell new people I am trans every time, I would get sick of explaining it and repeating myself with no purpose to be served. I don't want to spend my life talking about trans stuff all the time forever. It's a medical condition I'm being treated for, and it gets boring fast when people talk endlessly about their medical conditions. It would come across as attention seeking. Why would I want to colour people's perception of me and draw attention to myself like that. The only time where I tell new people I meet would be if they wanted to sleep with me, or possibly if a friend of a friend say was struggling with their own identity issues and might want to talk to someone about it.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 13:10 |
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LemonLimeTime posted:Where do you live, Magical Rainbows And Puppies Utopia World? Not quite, but close. Magical Reindeer And Socialism Utopia Finland. Overall we have quite low homicide rates here, and a whooping majority of those are drunk cis straight men fighting other drunk cis straight men and accidentally killing them. Hate-related homicides are extremely rare, at least for now. Hate crimes have become more frequent in the last few years, but that's more related to ethnicity and racism than trans- and homofobia. Sure, you can get beaten up for being trans (or a commie, or a prettier-than-average boy, or whatnot), that happens all the time, but it almost never escalates to getting killed. I don't have any statistics on this, but since I haven't heard of even one trans-related homicide in Finland, I'd say it's pretty unlikely to happen to me. Edit: Actually, now that I think about it, the only trans-related crime I've EVER seen in our media was when a transwoman robbed a bank with a crossbow. Transman of Gor fucked around with this message at Dec 11, 2011 around 15:12 |
| # ? Dec 11, 2011 15:05 |
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LemonLimeTime posted:Where do you live, Magical Rainbows And Puppies Utopia World? there's almost no chance that i'll ever get killed for being trans from where i live  (we do get fetishized a bit though)
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 15:14 |
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Transman of Gor posted:...the only trans-related crime I've EVER seen in our media was when a transwoman robbed a bank with a crossbow. Holy crap, that's something you couldn't make up. Has anyone tried this? It has great reviews but Its a bit pricey.
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 15:31 |
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Is that glitter? Too much, I reckon it would look ridiculous. In the 'blue eyeshadow' realm of ridiculous. 
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 15:49 |
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| # ? May 21, 2013 21:20 |
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I only do colors on my toes; My fingers are just a clear coat. I was asking because I've bought pricey colors in the past, but they chip and wear off quickly. The sparkles are magnetic though! I love gimmicks like that...
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| # ? Dec 11, 2011 16:41 |
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