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Telex posted:Also shooting guns but I guess I wouldn't mind if they made me shoot guns. That's the best part!
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 04:07 |
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| # ? May 24, 2013 19:16 |
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Red_Fred posted:Well seems like the beginning of my IT career is off to a shitter. by "between semesters" do you actually mean you have 3 months worth of working at Subway on your resume over summer break for two summers or something that's actually meaningful? Sometimes having a job doesn't count for much at all and something totally unrelated doesn't really count for anything when there are people who did internships while in college or worst case worked in the university lab or at least did something relevant. If you just graduated, pump your facebook friends for job leads. Someone's gotta have some sort of opening (assuming you're willing to relocate if you live in a tiny part of the country at least) that they can get you into. Most of the time, this poo poo is about knowing someone who knows someone and it's just that simple. Assuming you made friends with any Junior/Seniors your Freshman year, those people probably have jobs right now and they probably have the ability to put in a nice word with their HR in smaller companies or their bosses in bigger ones. That's the thing you have to work.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 04:14 |
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Telex posted:by "between semesters" do you actually mean you have 3 months worth of working at Subway on your resume over summer break for two summers or something that's actually meaningful? Sometimes having a job doesn't count for much at all and something totally unrelated doesn't really count for anything when there are people who did internships while in college or worst case worked in the university lab or at least did something relevant. I have a BSc in Geology and worked in Geology for 2 years before returning to uni to add an IT major to my degree (only takes a year, so I'm half way). I'm trying to get experience between semesters to put me in a better position when I finish but it seems even that is next to impossible where I am. Yeah I've been hitting up everyone and anyone that is in an even remotely IT related field. So far though I have had very little luck except un-paid work experience.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 04:38 |
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Red_Fred posted:I have a BSc in Geology and worked in Geology for 2 years before returning to uni to add an IT major to my degree (only takes a year, so I'm half way). I'm trying to get experience between semesters to put me in a better position when I finish but it seems even that is next to impossible where I am. yeah I got no idea how to practically apply even the concept of Geology to an IT career so that's a tough one to sell. Keep in mind that a lot of places (mine for instance) consider helpdesk to be Customer Service, so actually working in retail would help you out more than most places if you can suck it up and deal with it. If you can work retail in a technology based thing, even better. If you can get a job at the Apple Store and suck it up for a year, I bet you can get a decent to great helpdesk job in a mac-based environment, or be "the mac guy" in a mixed shop. That sort of thing. You don't have to do unpaid things, especially if you don't want to do unpaid things.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 04:48 |
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Telex posted:yeah I got no idea how to practically apply even the concept of Geology to an IT career so that's a tough one to sell. Well Geology is a science and has many transferable skills so there's that but no it's not directly transferable. Hmm I hadn't thought about retail at all. I can't imagine I'm much of a salesman but I could sure do some things behind the scenes. Also helpdesk is not my goal when I finish at all, I just started looking there as I figured it was the best (only?) place to start out.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 05:04 |
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Red_Fred posted:Well Geology is a science and has many transferable skills so there's that but no it's not directly transferable. Hmm I hadn't thought about retail at all. I can't imagine I'm much of a salesman but I could sure do some things behind the scenes. Welcome to where I was pretty much 3 years ago. I graduated with a Geography degree right as the economy went to crap, I had worked retail at Circuit City doing Firedog as a PC Tech (they went under right as I started applying everywhere), basically I had to upsell crap and remove viruses from porn laden computers. I interviewed for a helpdesk / pc tech job at a major hospital in my area, its a combined answer phones / resolve all pc problems / choose your own adventure type of place. Honestly, I got lucky. Their other applicants at the time had tons of silly errors, like typos on their cover letters etc. My boss took a chance on me and then 2 years later after always being the guy that volunteered whenever anything came along I got promoted to a LAN Admin. So... apply to larger companies that have helpdesks / call centers, and make sure your resume is perfect! Show enthusiasm in the interview or during the call screening and you might get your shot! Make sure you are troubleshooting as much as possible at home / for your friends so that you can answer things pretty quickly. Did you take any GIS related courses? Often those include some basic programming and database design. Mention that! Start freelance work to expose yourself to as many problems as possible, again its all valid resume fodder. Start working on entry-level certs, Microsoft Desktop Support Technician is a good one, A+, Network+ and the like are also great. Self studying before your job will just be the beginning of learning IT on your own most likely, so get used to it! I guess I am just re-hashing what others have said, there are no secrets. It requires patience and a little luck.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 05:33 |
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Revalis Enai posted:How do you simulate issues on a VM to troubleshoot? Or do you setup a network with VMs and attempt to solve any issue it may come up? some of vmwares products mimic cisco switching and routing so yes you can take the basic or go very advanced
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 05:56 |
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Red_Fred posted:Well Geology is a science and has many transferable skills so there's that but no it's not directly transferable. Hmm I hadn't thought about retail at all. I can't imagine I'm much of a salesman but I could sure do some things behind the scenes. You may actually want to look into some cisco stuff geology and telecommunications are cousins in careers
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 05:58 |
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Red_Fred posted:Well Geology is a science and has many transferable skills so there's that but no it's not directly transferable. Hmm I hadn't thought about retail at all. I can't imagine I'm much of a salesman but I could sure do some things behind the scenes. About 1/2 the people I've worked with started got Geology degrees, didn't want to end up working for $15/hour with a masters and hopped over to IT. They worked their way up from helpdesk.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 05:59 |
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bigdookie posted:Yeah I have/did apply most of what you said. MY CV and cover letter are impeccable (handy have a gf that is a lawyer). For this last internship I got to the last three but I guess someone was slightly better. Have applied to a tonne of other jobs but most of them are after full time/permanent people so that really goes against me. Corvettefisher posted:You may actually want to look into some cisco stuff geology and telecommunications are cousins in careers Yeah well I'm thinking of going the Network Admin route when I do finish so this could work out quite well I guess. Maneki Neko posted:About 1/2 the people I've worked with started got Geology degrees, didn't want to end up working for $15/hour with a masters and hopped over to IT. They worked their way up from helpdesk. See it's funny because I earned more than anyone my age (that I knew of) and almost as much as my Dad when I got my first job in Geology. It can pay really REALLY well, but there are many downsides and no real technology.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 06:33 |
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Red_Fred posted:I can't imagine I'm much of a salesman but I could sure do some things behind the scenes. okay, so i wrote some ranty thing which sounded probably scarier than what it should have been but maybe the relevant question would be to ask, what do you think your goal is? You may be on the wrong track entirely here. when I say retail, I mean the customer-facing, customer service type retail, dealing with the angry and confused. That's all helpdesk is anyway, angry or confused people you have to figure out how to deal with personally before you get to their tech problems, which are almost always not "real" tech problems.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 06:36 |
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Telex posted:okay, so i wrote some ranty thing which sounded probably scarier than what it should have been but maybe the relevant question would be to ask, what do you think your goal is? You may be on the wrong track entirely here. And if they are "real" tech problems, some sysadmin comes and snatches it away just as it gets interesting. That's why I made the jump from helpdesk to Infosec, I wanted to do interesting poo poo. 
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 06:44 |
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Telex posted:okay, so i wrote some ranty thing which sounded probably scarier than what it should have been but maybe the relevant question would be to ask, what do you think your goal is? You may be on the wrong track entirely here. Goal for the summer: get ANY IT experience as I have none at the moment. Goal when I finish (~6 months): Network Engineer/admin. But kinda checking out my options. Hope that's more clear. 
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 07:33 |
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Bhodi posted:tl;dr If you are just looking to make money, find yourself a decent sized company with a specific software product support need or do professional services / technical sales for a particular software product. Any product. It really doesn't matter which, they all suck in various ways. Some just suck less. The caveat here is that you become one dimensional with your skills. My resume has two software packages on it that no longer exist and there may be a third soon. Doing this kind of support has definitely helped my career, as it advanced me pretty quickly and gave experience and decent troubleshooting skills, but it can be hard to change positions. The other issue of course is outsourcing. More and more of these jobs, as least support wise, are going overseas. Technical sales may be a better option, but they tend to be higher on the layoff list from my experience.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 11:41 |
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Revalis Enai posted:How do you simulate issues on a VM to troubleshoot? Or do you setup a network with VMs and attempt to solve any issue it may come up? Plus you can do fun stuff like set up a machine with its own separate network, snapshot it, then do things like infect it with nasty rootkits and learn how to tidy them up, then roll it back when you're done. Or you can play with server configurations. Or you can just plain go nuts and trash things in relative safety. There's plenty you can do.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 13:10 |
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Red_Fred posted:Goal for the summer: get ANY IT experience as I have none at the moment. Certs. Lots of certs.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 13:35 |
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Everybody new to the field: it's great that you want to get out there and get real-world work experience, and it sucks that you're finding yourselves in a position where you're looking for unpaid experience just to set you apart from the competition. But above all, please keep in mind that IT is, more than most other fields, as much about who you know as it is what you know. As a result, some of the first things you should be doing to try and break into the field is to get out there, network, and meet people. Impress the poo poo out of them with your skills. (If you don't have those skills, develop them. A lot.) Join local user groups and give presentations and lead discussions. Take an active role in an open-source project that regular people know about and actually use. There's a lot of ways to get started in this field that don't involve getting coffee and reading backup logs for a senior admin who doesn't want to do work. A little bit of an ego helps here. Be the guy who wants to be showing off what he knows and what he can do. Stop just short of being arrogant about it. I ended up falling into my career by people I met through the Long Island Linux Users Group. One of the guys I befriended later turned out to be the hiring manager for a job I was applying for (and, on paper, almost completely unqualified for). I went from managing 4 Linux servers to 650 because I was able to demonstrate through presentations to that user group that even though the Linux environment I ran was small potatoes, I was able to think bigger and abstract all of the system management problems to a higher level. Misogynist fucked around with this message at Nov 28, 2011 around 14:54 |
| # ? Nov 28, 2011 14:47 |
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Alright guys, I need some insight. I've been around the IT field quite a bit over the years, and this is probably the most difficult career choice I've ever had to make. Me: 24, no degree, approx 7 years real experience, have security clearance. Right now, I'm overhead with a contractor, supporting internal operations as a Senior Systems Administrator. Its the cushiest job I've ever had. 5+ weeks of vacation a year, pay is good (around 100k), and the benefits are notably above average, but not the best I've ever had. The job is easy. I get flexibility. I've got a 3mile commute. This job has about a 6 year limit as its a small joint venture that exists solely for a contract with a duration of 7 years. We've got 6 years left on it. I have an offer on the table. It's with a Dept of State contractor. Pay is mid 100s, literally a 50% raise. Title is vague "Network Operations Center/ Senior Systems Administrator". I'd basically be running the entire network (literally, one guy shop) for a small Dept of State agency that does custom software development. There is room for some telecommute (1-2 days per week) and flextime during the week. The position is contract, 1yr increments, but it's been a long standing contract and the stability is much above average. I've got a friend who works there as a developer who speaks highly of it. Suit required every day. Benefits are good, about on par with current. The commute from where I live currently positively SUCKS. I dont know the area closer well enough to say if I would prefer it or not, but its priced similarly and I can terminate my current lease on 60 days notice. Can anyone give me some thought one direction or the other? I know the new job is a lot more stressful for the money. No doubt there. I've done contracting in the field before and I _hated_ it. But at the same time, I do not get the feeling that this contract position is anything like my past positions. Help? I'm in all-out "wtf do i do" mode right now, as I've never struggled with leaving a job I genuinely like. But the offer is so significantly better career wise that I keep coming back to it. Walked fucked around with this message at Nov 28, 2011 around 15:48 |
| # ? Nov 28, 2011 15:45 |
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It depends: How much of that 50k will be spent on booze? I'd take a 50% raise in a heartbeat, but my job pays around 30k, so I'm not exactly in the same position as you. I guess it comes down to the question of "Will more money make me happy?" Only you can decide that one. Also, how the hell are you making 100k at 24?
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 15:51 |
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KillHour posted:It depends: How much of that 50k will be spent on booze? That's the conundrum I'm at. When I was making less, 50% mattered a ton to me. At this point, I live really comfortably on my salary. The extra 50 would become icing on the cake / wrapping up a few debt payments I'm knocking out, but nothing major. Basically I'm not sure how significantly it would contribute to my happiness in all reality. Hard to say. the clearance / connections / living in a high cost of living area is how I'm at where I'm at salary-wise
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 15:53 |
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KillHour posted:It depends: How much of that 50k will be spent on booze? DC/Government contracting area pays ridiculously well, a friend of mine from a college IT/security position we used to work started at $145k out of college at 24. He also ended up quitting and moving back closer to home, apparently cost of living ate up some of the appeal text editor fucked around with this message at Nov 28, 2011 around 16:11 |
| # ? Nov 28, 2011 16:06 |
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KillHour posted:
After Cost Of living he probably is coming out with that of someone making 60k/yr in a decently sized city
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 16:30 |
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Corvettefisher posted:After Cost Of living he probably is coming out with that of someone making 60k/yr in a decently sized city I'd agree with that, however I'm a bit out in the suburbs, where the corporate HQ of my business is. The contract work is all in DC, however. That said, you make a very good point - in that if I take the job in DC proper, the large majority of the difference could possibly (likely) be eaten up with simple cost of living changes, only for a more stressful job. Thanks SH/SC for being my sounding board. Still havent decided, but getting there.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 16:45 |
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Corvettefisher posted:After Cost Of living he probably is coming out with that of someone making 60k/yr in a decently sized city It's not that bad, certainly nothing like NYC. There are plenty of options in the suburbs on metro.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 16:47 |
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Walked posted:I'd agree with that, however I'm a bit out in the suburbs, where the corporate HQ of my business is. The contract work is all in DC, however. Yeah, IF I for some reason decide to work in/near DC I will be living close to Fredricksburg where cost of living is pennies compared to DC, the 45min commute might change my mind however. Living in the beltway scares me after seeing some grocery store prices, I Thought Norfolk was high... Corvettefisher fucked around with this message at Nov 28, 2011 around 16:52 |
| # ? Nov 28, 2011 16:50 |
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Corvettefisher posted:Yeah, IF I for some reason decide to work in/near DC I will be living close to Fredricksburg where cost of living is pennies compared to DC, the 45min commute might change my mind however.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 16:55 |
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Corvettefisher posted:Yeah, IF I for some reason decide to work in/near DC I will be living close to Fredricksburg where cost of living is pennies compared to DC, the 45min commute might change my mind however. Living in the beltway scares me after seeing some grocery store prices, I Thought Norfolk was high... Having lived in Fredericksburg for 2 years, the commute to DC is far worse than 45min during rush hour unless youre somewhere right off the VRE line, and even then, it typically trends higher. Some of the "smarter" commutes in the area that I've done. Fredericksburg -> Quantico contracting (30min commute +/-) Leesburg -> Reston area (20-30min +/-) Alexandria -> DC Currently doing Leesburg -> Ashburn and it takes 10min.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 16:55 |
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Misogynist posted:45 minutes is quite a conservative estimate. 45 minutes is Saturday morning at 8 AM. Try doubling or possibly tripling that depending on where your office is located. e: There are some places around Huntington that are affordable if you're single. I think that's the key to the DC area - don't have a family, just be a lonely, unloved alcoholic. Otherwise you'll be doomed to living 2 hours away. psydude fucked around with this message at Nov 28, 2011 around 17:16 |
| # ? Nov 28, 2011 17:13 |
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Yeah I was thinking a farther north of fredricksberg there is a town north of Fberg and south of the beltway, I just can't recall the name..
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 17:17 |
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Corvettefisher posted:Yeah I was thinking a farther north of fredricksberg there is a town north of Fberg and south of the beltway, I just can't recall the name.. Youve got Stafford, Woodbridge, Lorton, and Springfield/Alexandria for areas north of Fredericksburg and south of the Beltway. South of Woodbridge sucks for commuting, as the HOV lanes gently caress things up beyond recognition when they merge back.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 17:21 |
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demonachizer posted:If any of you have experience with getting clearance for contract work, does a 15 year old misdemeanor marijuana possession charge always preclude you from an S clearance? In this case there would be no other issues criminally or financially prior to or after the conviction. You'll be fine. I personally know of instances way more recent than that (within 3 years prior to the investigation) and people were still approved for their clearance.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 18:27 |
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rocket lad posted:You'll be fine. I personally know of instances way more recent than that (within 3 years prior to the investigation) and people were still approved for their clearance. I think they only look back 7 years in your past for Secret if I'm remembering my paperwork correctly. 15 years should be a non-issue as long as you're honest if they ask. On the DC commute talk, I used to commute from Sterling to DC (near the Whitehouse) every day. If I took public transportation it was a 1.5 hour commute each way and only 45 mins if I carpooled with a co-worker (which was rare). That gets old really quick. The Metro costs added up too. It was about $10/day. However the job offered a lot of experience a lot of the local IT jobs didn't offer. In the end it was worth it because it helped me get a better job 12 mins from my house. I could bike if I wasn't lazy and/or afraid of NOVA drivers.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 20:49 |
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I left the defense space a number of years ago but I'm only considering it now due to proximity to DC and the fact there's rather few IT jobs other than defense in the area that will pay you decently. Also, ideologically I'd feel like a scumbag taking in so much money while contributing to the worsening of our nation's debt. That is, it might be more beneficial to the country to not serve it. On the other hand, $160k seems like chump change around here when you're married  I'm honestly very, very pissed how a security clearance can mean that an incompetent, unskilled candidate can be selected over someone that has even had a TS clearance and blows him out of the water in terms of skills. This is completely not beneficial to any defense mission whatsoever IMO because the candidate should be able to pass within a year and the other guy is just not going to get up to that level within a year, so you should just pay for the external candidate's clearance and get him in ASAP. It's not like the guy you have on-staff doesn't require some more money for renewing his TS either, so it's amortized costs anyway. Misogynist posted:45 minutes is quite a conservative estimate.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 21:11 |
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Yeah, you should really consider the traffic angle. I did a commute from Reston->Beltsville and I was in the car for at least 3 hours every day. I did that for almost a year but I got out as soon as I was able. Now that I don't have a commute, I have a much greater appreciation of how much time it eats into your life. 100k when you're 24 isn't much when you've got no time to enjoy it. You need to do the math on how much money that commute would cost you, both in dollars per mile, in free time, and especially in sanity. I know a lot of people wish they had extra hours in a day, well, to me the extra hours in a day was worth a quarter of my salary. But when you factor in the amount of money I was spending on gas+tolls+car upkeep, I got a large portion of that back.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 21:32 |
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Bhodi posted:Yeah, you should really consider the traffic angle. I have thought about that a hundred times over. I'd probably just pick and move, and keep the commute in the 30minute range. I've got a line on a place a few metro stops from the office for about $50/mo less than I'm paying rent for right now. They pay the SMART Benefit that cuts into the commute cost too. My current lease is in a good spot to end as well. Basically, if I switch, I wont end up commuting much more. I started my current job doing Fredericksburg to Ashburn daily, so I can assure you I'm very well versed in how horrid a long commute is. Thats two months of my life wasted there. Still up in the air though. Too many variables to make a perfectly informed decision.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 21:39 |
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I have a question for the WGU students. Do you have time to work/go to an actual brick and mortar school full time and do the WGU curriculum? I'm asking because the 12 unit requirement over 6 months really doesn't look like much on paper, and I would like to know what the workload is actually like.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 21:56 |
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Yes the unit requirement is ridiculously easy. I've already finished 18 on mine and I have like 3 months left.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 22:03 |
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If you are 24 and like to do stuff like get laid, just bite the bullet and move into the city. You will thank yourself. Alot. The question to ask yourself is "How much is 4 hours of my day, 5 days a week worth? Do I want to leave at 7am, get home at 8pm and live in a lovely suburb where TGI Fridays is a best-in-class eating option?" gently caress the suburbs.
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| # ? Nov 28, 2011 22:21 |
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It's not an either/or thing to me. With the money you save up as a 20-something 1%er, you can go stay in the city for a week on a whim at a hotel, get laid all the gently caress you want or whatever (assuming that whoever you're 'taking home' is ok with the concept of you living out of a hotel half the month), and you don't have to deal with all the problems of city life the other time. You could be known as that ballin' dude that's sometimes around that stays at some posh hotel instead of that ballin' dude with the random apartment downtown. And unlike burning money on rent, hotel points do have something to show for your thousands of dollars of urban debauchery. And hey, I'd be fine with $500 / mo in rent and $2100 / mo in hotel costs - to me it beats what you get for $2600 in most cities IMO. But let's face it, most of us IT guys are not exactly known for being the most social creatures (nor female magnets).
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| # ? Nov 29, 2011 06:23 |
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| # ? May 24, 2013 19:16 |
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necrobobsledder posted:It's not an either/or thing to me. With the money you save up as a 20-something 1%er, you can go stay in the city for a week on a whim at a hotel, get laid all the gently caress you want or whatever (assuming that whoever you're 'taking home' is ok with the concept of you living out of a hotel half the month), and you don't have to deal with all the problems of city life the other time. You could be known as that ballin' dude that's sometimes around that stays at some posh hotel instead of that ballin' dude with the random apartment downtown. And unlike burning money on rent, hotel points do have something to show for your thousands of dollars of urban debauchery. And hey, I'd be fine with $500 / mo in rent and $2100 / mo in hotel costs - to me it beats what you get for $2600 in most cities IMO. To be fair, 1% puts you $386k yearly income (source: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...-of-income.html) though I've also seen that number as low $250k. Though that is an interesting idea, though I'm not sure how well it would work. I don't think $2100 would you get you all that much in NYC (the only city I can really think of that lifestyle working) nor would $500 get anywhere where the commute wouldn't kill you.
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| # ? Nov 29, 2011 07:11 |
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