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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:Casey Davis is an idiot too does this mean atheists can't get married?
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Aug 27, 2015 07:50
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VitalSigns posted:Sorry I have an older book here that says the first marriage was between a brother-sister pair of Egyptian gods so that's what marriage is: brothers and sisters loving. And it can never be changed. Adam and Eve had the same parent. Also their kids. Edit: Actually, I just realized that Eve came from Adam. She's either his twin or his progeny o_o
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Aug 27, 2015 08:49
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paragon1 posted:does this mean atheists can't get married? Well, according to our 41st president atheists aren't even citizens, so yes. They can gently caress right off with their "marriage" and "rights".
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Aug 27, 2015 09:16
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People really have a hard time understanding the difference between civil/legal marriage and religious marriage.
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Aug 27, 2015 15:10
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FlamingLiberal posted:People really have a hard time understanding the difference between civil society and religion.
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Aug 27, 2015 15:16
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For some people Marriage is the equivalent of building a pillow for with a "no gays allowed" sign posted outside. Now that SCOTUS has smashed the sign and fort, they're reeling and searching for new issues to build forts around.
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Aug 27, 2015 15:19
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FlamingLiberal posted:People really have a hard time understanding the difference between civil/legal marriage and religious marriage. I have a feeling that if 'civil unions' were actually put on equal terms to marriage, these fuckers would just find another reason to cry about that. Like so much they try to play this 'It's about marriage specifically!' game, but I'm gonna assume it's really just boo hoo I'm losing my punching bag/boo hoo gays are happy.
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Aug 27, 2015 15:39
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but marriage existed for thousands of years before Christianity, didn't it? Like, polytheistic Romans had marriage. The Chinese had marriage. Literally every society prior to the rise and spread of monotheistic religion all had marriage. Bible literalists are dumb as hell :/
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Aug 27, 2015 15:39
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FlamingLiberal posted:People really have a hard time understanding the difference between civil/legal marriage and religious marriage. A large number of people think Gay marriage means that you can force a pastor to marry you and if he refuses you can sue him. That's why there's a specific provision in the New York law prohibiting that.
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Aug 27, 2015 15:41
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Thump! posted:Correct me if I'm wrong, but marriage existed for thousands of years before Christianity, didn't it?
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Aug 27, 2015 16:00
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The Macaroni posted:Duh, the world started with Adam and Eve around 4000 BC. Which was a total shock to the Sumerian civilization around then. Also, a lot of people believe that everything that predates Christianity (save for the Jewish stuff) is literally Satanic, so it just doesn't count.
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Aug 27, 2015 16:08
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FlamingLiberal posted:People really have a hard time understanding the difference between civil/legal marriage and religious marriage. There are a lot of people out there, and hell even some on this forum, who don't know that religous institutions don't do anything to make you legally married. Some of them don't even know that getting married by someone who isn't a priest/rabbi/whatever is a thing that's possible.
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Aug 27, 2015 16:19
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This is going to be an incredible next couple daysquote:Rowan County Clerk Kim Davis has refused to issue any marriage licenses, citing her Christian faith and constitutional right to religious freedom, since the landmark decision in June. On Thursday morning, a deputy clerk in her office refused to issue a marriage license to William Smith Jr. and James Yates. It was their third attempt to get a license. They said they will not give up. “They just don’t like gay people, they don’t want us to get married,” Yates said. “And they’d rather burn the earth and not let straight people in Rowan County get married either.” The action Thursday came just a day after a federal appeals court upheld a ruling ordering the clerk in rural Rowan County to issue marriage licenses to same-sex couples. U.S. District Judge David Bunning had already ordered Davis to issue marriage licenses two weeks ago. He later delayed that ruling until Aug. 31 or until the U.S. 6th Circuit Court of Appeals issued a ruling. The appeals court did so on Wednesday, denying Davis’ appeal. But a deputy clerk in Davis’ office told Smith and Yates on Thursday that the office believes Bunning’s delay remains in effect until Aug. 31. He refused to give his name or give them a license. http://talkingpointsmemo.com/news/kim-davis-kentucky-clerk-again-denies-license So legally, what happens to her. Will she just be fired? Or could she be charged/sued? Mr Ice Cream Glove fucked around with this message at 17:24 on Aug 27, 2015 |
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Aug 27, 2015 17:22
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She can be sued personally. May or may not lose her job depending on how lovely that particular county is, but the most dangerous thing to her is being thrown in jail for contempt of court by directly disobeying the judge's order.
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Aug 27, 2015 17:36
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Thump! posted:Correct me if I'm wrong, but marriage existed for thousands of years before Christianity, didn't it? Yeah but you're talking about people who think human race started 7,000 years ago from two fully-formed humans, and all other religions were made up after that by Satan.
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Aug 27, 2015 17:38
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VitalSigns posted:Yeah but you're talking about people who think human race started 7,000 years ago from two fully-formed humans, and all other religions were made up after that by Satan. Yeah, one of my English teachers in High School had a girl walk out of Shakespeare's Julius Caesar because it was lies, nothing came before Jesus, etc. Wish I had been in that same period to see it personally.
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Aug 27, 2015 17:44
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"Nothing came before Jesus?" The gently caress?
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Aug 27, 2015 18:05
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MariusLecter posted:Yeah, one of my English teachers in High School had a girl walk out of Shakespeare's Julius Caesar because it was lies, nothing came before Jesus, etc. Wish I had been in that same period to see it personally. "I'm sorry my lord render unto who?"
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Aug 27, 2015 18:17
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Keeshhound posted:"Nothing came before Jesus?" JESUS IS LORD. Therefore Jesus is THE LORD. "THEOLOGY IS BAD BECAUSE IT TEACHES YOU THAT THE BIBLE ISN'T TRUE." - The same loving people.
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Aug 27, 2015 18:23
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MariusLecter posted:Yeah, one of my English teachers in High School had a girl walk out of Shakespeare's Julius Caesar because it was lies, nothing came before Jesus, etc. Wish I had been in that same period to see it personally. Reminds me of the guy who runs conservapedia claiming that humor didn't exist before Jesus. Edit: http://www.conservapedia.com/Talk:Essay:Greatest_Mysteries_of_World_History#Humor HappyHippo fucked around with this message at 19:24 on Aug 27, 2015 |
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Aug 27, 2015 19:21
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Thump! posted:Correct me if I'm wrong, but marriage existed for thousands of years before Christianity, didn't it? America is a Christian Nation!!1!
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Aug 27, 2015 19:24
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Nintendo Kid posted:There are a lot of people out there, and hell even some on this forum, who don't know that religous institutions don't do anything to make you legally married. Some of them don't even know that getting married by someone who isn't a priest/rabbi/whatever is a thing that's possible. Actually priests in most states do have the right to make people legally married, which is why the Universal Life Church exists.
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Aug 27, 2015 19:33
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point of return posted:Actually priests in most states do have the right to make people legally married, which is why the Universal Life Church exists. Nope. The priests, in most cases, are just applying for the marriage license and give it to you on your wedding day. They are acting in your stead. Legally, in almost every state, you can just go apply for and receive a marriage license. That's it. You are married. ULC was started in response to pushes to make it ONLY possible to get married through priests, which was an attempted end run around gay marriage.
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Aug 27, 2015 19:37
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point of return posted:Actually priests in most states do have the right to make people legally married, which is why the Universal Life Church exists. No, the marriage license stuff is what lets you be legally married, they can't do anything without that.
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Aug 27, 2015 19:40
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:America is a Christian Nation!!1! Only for a few more generations. Just under 25% of US adults don't identify with a religion. 35% of adults under 34 years old don't identify with a religion. Non-theists outnumber Catholics. Non-believers are the fastest growing group by a wide margin. Belief in Christianity is down 8% since 2007, non-Christian beliefs are up 1%, and unaffiliated is up almost 7%. Between Christian and unaffiliated, people raised unaffiliated are second only to Jews in likeliness to remain in their "faith". "Religious nones" gain four members for everyone member lost to a religion, while all but one Christian denomination are losing members (and that one is at a 1.2:1 gain ratio). People are switching away from faith, and kids raised unfaithful stay unfaithful. ColdPie fucked around with this message at 22:19 on Aug 27, 2015 |
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Aug 27, 2015 22:14
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ColdPie posted:Only for a few more generations. Just under 25% of US adults don't identify with a religion. 35% of adults under 34 years old don't identify with a religion. Non-theists outnumber Catholics. Non-believers are the fastest growing group by a wide margin. Belief in Christianity is down 8% since 2007, non-Christian beliefs are up 1%, and unaffiliated is up almost 7%. The United States has suffered 4 Great Awakenings, and there can certainly be another grassroots revival if the economy gets bad enough. It doesn't take very much - just look at Uganda. Enlightenments are hard, revivals are easy and profitable.
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Aug 27, 2015 22:24
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Do It Once Right posted:The United States has suffered 4 Great Awakenings, and there can certainly be another grassroots revival if the economy gets bad enough. It doesn't take very much - just look at Uganda. All the US has to do is be like Uganda.
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Aug 27, 2015 22:24
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Do It Once Right posted:The United States has suffered 4 Great Awakenings, and there can certainly be another grassroots revival if the economy gets bad enough. It doesn't take very much - just look at Uganda. There's not going to be though, absent nuclear war.
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Aug 27, 2015 22:26
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FlamingLiberal posted:People really have a hard time understanding the difference between civil/legal marriage and religious marriage. They understand it. It's just that his distinction is inconvenient so they're now pretending that the only marriages that actually count are the (right kind of) Christian ones. My favorite extension of this is the way some Christian news sites have started throwing sarcasm quotes around the word "marriage". It's just so pathetically petty.  Also, calling it now. In five years Christian groups will buy into their own BS and extend this logic to all non-Christian people. Suddenly Hindus will not really be married anymore and by extension living in sin.
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Aug 27, 2015 22:30
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readingatwork posted:They understand it. It's just that his distinction is inconvenient so they're now pretending that the only marriages that actually count are the (right kind of) Christian ones. My favorite extension of this is the way some Christian news sites have started throwing sarcasm quotes around the word "marriage". It's just so pathetically petty. They're already living in sin by not being Christian.
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Aug 27, 2015 22:33
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Mr Ice Cream Glove posted:This is going to be an incredible next couple days I see no reason not to remove her from the position and let people sue her bigoted rear end in to the ground. If she wants to be a martyr and likely try to beg for some sweet Bigot Bucks(tm) then her victims should at least get compensated for their suffering.
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Aug 27, 2015 23:24
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Is there any way that this DOESN'T end in her being removed from office via either her caving to the court order, or her being arrested for contempt of court? I can't see how the court would possibly let this stand.
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Aug 28, 2015 02:45
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NecroBob posted:Is there any way that this DOESN'T end in her being removed from office via either her caving to the court order, or her being arrested for contempt of court? I can't see how the court would possibly let this stand. Not sure the chain of command, but I do know that the Ky governor made a statement when this all began the clerks needed to either do their jobs or lose their jobs. (Swear it is so weird moving from ga, where the governor was literally the platonic ideal of corruption, to Ky where the governor seems like a pretty decent dude.)
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Aug 28, 2015 03:18
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ColdPie posted:Only for a few more generations. Just under 25% of US adults don't identify with a religion. 35% of adults under 34 years old don't identify with a religion. Non-theists outnumber Catholics. Non-believers are the fastest growing group by a wide margin. Belief in Christianity is down 8% since 2007, non-Christian beliefs are up 1%, and unaffiliated is up almost 7%. Repeat after me: Christian! Nation!
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Aug 28, 2015 07:41
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Keeshhound posted:"Nothing came before Jesus?" you think that is bad? I had a coworker a few years ago that believed the earth was only 2,000 years old and everything that history claims happened before is a coordinated conspiracy by all the governments of the world.
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Aug 28, 2015 08:47
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Evil Fluffy posted:I see no reason not to remove her from the position and let people sue her bigoted rear end in to the ground. If she wants to be a martyr and likely try to beg for some sweet Bigot Bucks(tm) then her victims should at least get compensated for their suffering.
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Aug 28, 2015 09:41
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The problem is that these are generally in very red states. Can you imagine that any deep-red governor wants to have "fired a clerk for DEFENDING HER BELIEFS" in his opponent's arsenal?
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Aug 28, 2015 14:45
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TheBalor posted:The problem is that these are generally in very red states. Can you imagine that any deep-red governor wants to have "fired a clerk for DEFENDING HER BELIEFS" in his opponent's arsenal? She's an elected official and can't be fired anyways. If she keeps refusing, she's looking at the inside of a jail cell, potentially until her term is up, as the judge can jail her until she agrees to follow the order. Wether she follows the order or not, she's also civilly liable as an individual for violating the petitioners civil rights. The state and the county are likely not liable I a civil action as all the executive officials have ordered her to follow the SCOTUS ruling, slang monetary judgement is going to be 100% on her.
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Aug 28, 2015 15:54
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Nintendo Kid posted:No, the marriage license stuff is what lets you be legally married, they can't do anything without that. CommieGIR posted:Nope. The priests, in most cases, are just applying for the marriage license and give it to you on your wedding day. They are acting in your stead. Both of these are basically wrong. In most states you need two things: the licence, and someone authorized to perform the ceremony. That doesn't have to be a priest, but generally it's a priest, or some state official or someone with a state licence (justice of the peace, etc). They cannot, on their own, without a licence, following the laws, etc marry you. But they are one of the relatively small group of people who can be one of the two necessary components for the state to recognize your marriage. Also generally even if you use a priest you have to go apply for the licence yourself. You just then hand it over to the priest, who fills out his part after the wedding.
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Aug 28, 2015 15:55
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Yes that is correct. In my office as a clerk we both issue licenses and marry people. It's up to the couple to decide who they want to marry them, of course. We just provide that service.
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Aug 28, 2015 16:05
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