Mass Effect 3: Blue Oyster Cult Was Wrong

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CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

ColHannibal posted:

So my only explanation to what happend to my entire interesting crew is DLC? Games great and all but it's got some serious loving holes.

To clarify, there is no guarantee that there will be DLC to make the endings do justice to the characters and races we've gotten to know over the past three games. We can only hope.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2012 06:51

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# ¿ Apr 26, 2024 03:56

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Almost every ending that has been postulated in this thread is better than what was actually available. Dear God I hope they make some DLC and do the end properly this time.

That said, I'll sink just as many hours into this game as I did the previous two, because the rest of it more than makes up for the last five minutes.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2012 17:20

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Rookersh posted:

Lets say you are correct.

Ok, eventually, no matter what, AI will rebel. NO MATTER WHAT, AI will kill the Organics. NO MATTER WHAT this system will keep occurring.

So your idea to stop this is to kill the Organics first.

loving Brilliant.

Its said several times over the series that the Reapers push society to evolve in certain ways so they can cleanse them easier, and that they have steps in development. They have tons of signs around telling people how to act, and all sorts of other nonsense. But rather then you know, force people to evolve in a certain way, or hell, even coming in and just wiping out the AI to save the Organics and then coming out with their "AI is bad yo" stuff, and helping guide the races to not create AI, they just come in and murder them so they don't get murdered by someone else.

This is not even counting the fact that this was the major plot of a sidesection of the game, and we solved it by possibly allying the two groups together, or how we get told by Jarvik that they were just about ready to clean up their AI before the Reapers came and used their AI against them.

The cycle makes NO sense in the context we are provided in ME3, or in the series as a whole, the rest of the side stuff of the series was built up as ways of solving these conflicts before we head on to fight the unknowable Reapers, then when we get to the unknowable Reapers, their entire thing is a side plot we already cleaned up a couple hours back, its amateur at best.

Also, the entire thing is loving stupid. If AI created by organics inevitably murders its creators, leaving aside the geth and EDI for the moment, then the Reapers could just warn us away from it instead of killing tens of trillions of people. It's completely unnecessary.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2012 19:40

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

For what it's worth, Gamefront is backing IGN on the "NG+ secret ending" thing.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2012 23:27

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Ideally you nova while rolling back, so you don't do damage but also don't expend your barrier, staying invulnerable for those frames.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2012 23:42

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

HappyKittens posted:

Are we sure that this is not a joke

"For the special �Perfect� ending you�ll need to replay ME3 with the New Game+ option. In the second playthrough, collectible models and fish reward you with extra War Assets that increase your War Assets, which in turn increases your EMS (Effective Military Strength) score. That means you�ll want to invest in a Fish-Feeding VI.
"

Ah, wait, they're full of poo poo.

quote:

Hidden after the credits is one final moment, but it takes dedication and commitment to uncover this last slice of finale from Mass Effect 3. Learn how to get the final ending moment below to truly complete this massive game.

The N7-gasp scene does not require any of what they claimed except the high warscore.

# ¿ Mar 9, 2012 23:46

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Viridiant posted:

I am hoping beyond hope that continuing to read how bad these endings are without actually spoiling myself is going to make me think better of them purely due to me expecting something really bad. Disappointing endings tend to really bug me.

For me, at least, the disappointment of the end in no way makes me reluctant to play the game again. That said, if they made it less stupid and ridiculous, that would be amazing.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 00:24

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

DrNutt posted:

Yeah, this is by far the most fun to play Mass Effect game yet, and crappy end or not, I'm going to replay it through at least as many times as the last two.

One thing I think BioWare's writers can be commended for is making the conversations flow much more naturally this time. I always felt (especially in 2) that it was really awkward to take the left options for more dialogue because once you were done, the right option always felt stilted and awkward. But I haven't really encountered a situation like that in the 3rd game. So kudos for that. Also, the writing in general has produced far fewer cringe-inducing moments, but I'm not sure if it's actually better or if my pre-release hype high just hasn't worn off yet.

There have been about five times as many awesome scenes as in both of the first two games combined. And a great line from Mordin on Tuchanka for Renegade Shepard that I will never see because I can't bear to be that terrible.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 00:30

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Codependent Poster posted:

Because at least then I can make up poo poo to make me happy.

Like so!

All the aliens around earth realize they have a shitload of ships and can go home by putting everyone on a few and using the fuel from the other. It'll be a few years, but eventually they'll all be back home.

The leftover geth who didn't get reaper code are all like "look we never wanted to fight anyway and this Legion dude was chill" so they keep helping the quarians and start building new relays.

Edi kept part of herself in the Normandy systems that was when she was a rogue VI and eventually gets back to being a full AI. Liara still can direct poo poo as the Shadow Broker. Tali remembers she's a loving genius and with Adams and Ken and Gabby they get the ship fixed and head toward Earth. Some of the crew decide to stay and they are assimilated into the locals which leads to the epilogue.

Shepard recovers and is like "I gotta find my space bros" and right when he's ready to go they all show up and then he lives with his/her LI and retires from saving the galaxy.

Also, Destroy doesn't detonate everything using Reaper tech, it just stops working. The Reapers themselves shut down, and can relatively easily be destroyed by the combined fleets. The relays can be repaired, the geth can gain individual sentience on their own terms, and there's enough air on the Citadel for Shepard to last until help arrives (on the Normandy). Anderson might easily have simply passed out from shock, for that matter. The people on the Citadel before it was stolen are still all dead, though.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 00:35

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Internet Kraken posted:

So can someone tell me exactly what happens with the Geth and the Quarians? I know that one race ends up getting killed but I'm not sure how all the Quarians would be wiped out. Or is it just their fleet?

If you haven't done the right stuff previously, the geth get destroyed by the quarian fleet (and Tali kills Legion), or the quarian fleet gets ripped to shreds by the geth, and Tali throws herself off the cliff. If you have made preparations for peace, then you need to pick one initially and then pass a renegade/paragon check.

There were only a few checks in 3, but oddly I didn't notice that until well after the end. Also, it's interesting how Han'Gerrel is cool in 2, and a total cock in 3, and Koris is the converse.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 03:44

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Subterfrugal posted:

I am concerned that most people miss the scene where Tali gets drunk off her rear end and drunk dials Javik. You don't get to see it unless a certain character Miranda dies.

I submit that this scene justifies the extinction of the Geth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQd5qjOxGnI

I didn't go to Javik's room, so I don't know about that, but the rest is the same even if Miranda lives.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 04:55

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Ham posted:

Retconning the endings now would be like shooting themselves in the foot. Just publish a decent epilogue, most people are pissed not because of the logic/principle of the endings themselves, but because of the fact that the game gives you no clue what happened to all those characters you liked, the alliances you built, the decisions you've made over the past three games. A good epilogue (preferably a free one) would dissipate most of the actual backlash, and all that would remain is people complaining about no happy ending. I'm fine with the ending story-wise, but the execution is terrible and the conclusion with regards to your squadmates is rushed and lacking.

Yeah, most of what I dislike is that I don't get to see the repercussions of what I did over the past 30 hours�all the actions are more or less meaningless. If they did that, and maybe allowed Shepard to live with really high war assets on the other two endings, I'd be satisfied, though I still think they'd have to rewrite a lot of it to escape all the stupidity. And the Catalyst should have taken the form of the Virmire sacrifice, not the kid.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 05:04

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Dan Didio posted:

Yeah, Bioware's going to focus on the people stupidly crowing for a 'happy' ending and ignore any legit criticism of it by characterizing the rest as that. The problem with the ending is not that you don't get to settle down and have kids or whatever stupid bullshit people think would be 'better',

I get why people are clamouring for that, and I understand the impulse to want that, but it's not an issue with the ending.

I mean, I want there to be an ending, even if it's really hard to get, where Shepard survives, but a real epilogue is far more important. Not saying anything about the krogan and geth isn't having an open ending, it's not bothering to write a proper one.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 16:57

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Malrauxs Place posted:

Except this isn't true at all. The only sacrifice Shepard absolutely had to make in the first two games was leaving one of his squad members behind on Virmire. Other than that, there was always the possibility to be the big hero AND save everyone. Sacrifice was never a major theme of the series, at least not as far as Shepard is concerned.

Well, after Virmire, you also have to choose between several human ships and the Destiny Ascension. And throughout 2, you sacrifice the various colonies that the Collectors hit while you prepare for the suicide run, though you don't get to make that choice in any meaningful way.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 17:05

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Lotish posted:

Dammit.

I love this series. I have played it since my daughter was born, and she's been right there with me the whole time to such an extent that she would hand me ME2 so she could watch me play it. When she plays around the house, sometimes she'll start shouting "Shepoo!"

"Wex!"

Lotish posted:

I have a week off work and wanted nothing more than to sit down and enjoy it. But even avoiding spoilers I have been unable to shake the despair of learning the endings are universally reviled. I can barely muster the will to play. I scarcely know what to do with myself.

For me, at least, the rest of the game far outweighed the crappy ending. Do it.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 18:08

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

ImpAtom posted:

Yeah, there is no problem with Shepard dying. Frankly, I think it was pretty much inevitable. The problem is that it makes no sense for the themes of the game.

I mean, I don't like it, and it's irritating that it's only possible for one of the options, but that's all it is: irritating and disliked. The complete lack of an actual prologue and the devastation of galactic society that Shepard directly causes are serious problems, and they'll need a fair amount of work to fix.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 19:39

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

oswald ownenstein posted:

Playing this game made me realize that ME is actually not very fun to play. It's really more about the story & RPG elements (which have been stripped considerably since the first game.)

Gone is the excitement of getting loot (even if you turned junk into omni gel), gone is the ability to just open an inventory screen and start equipping mods and weapons/armor/implants (wtf is this thing where you have to find some terminal to do armor/weapon customization?) , gone is the lockpicking.

ME3 is a 'good game', but I still enjoyed actually playing ME1 more than any of the others.

Yes, getting an incrementally better pistol is far more exciting than the handgun that shoots sticky grenades or the shotgun that shoots spikes, to say nothing of the shotgun revolver. I will grant that not being able to switch out mods on the fly is a bit annoying, but seriously. Also, I think you're the only one who liked seventy thousand games of Frogger. The RPG elements aren't gone just because you don't put lots of points in different skills over the course of the game and see tiny changes each time.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 19:46

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

oswald ownenstein posted:

The combat in ME blows and no 'sticky grenades' or 'revolver shotgun' can change that. The only thing ME brings to the table is the RPG elements - story, interaction, etc.

Also, I think the loot system could have been streamlined, and the hacking system done away with completely in place of just a check, but I cared an awful lot more about the balance of people I brought in my party on ME1 than I do in ME2 or M3.

In fact the squadmates are more or less just there and don't really provide much assistance at all.

I could not disagree with you more strongly, and I suspect this argument isn't going to go anywhere.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 19:56

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Bongo Bill posted:

I predict that the divisiveness will not be whether the ending is bad (it is), but whether it retroactively diminishes what leads up to it (I, personally, will respond decisively in the negative).

Others will disagree, but I say, in the final tally, different-colored explosions and inexplicable crash landings can't take away the fact that Tali got drunk and teased Javik over the intercom and the guy on the citadel finally got his refund. Or maybe different things happened in your game and they were cool too.

In my first playthrough, I agreed with him. On my second run, I just couldn't bear to disappoint him like that, so I agreed again. I don't think I'll ever have the heart to screw him over after three games.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 20:24

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Charlie Mopps posted:

Im pretty sure that part is one of the buggiest parts of the game. I failed 1 of those quests yet got it as a war asset.

You don't need to get them all for it to count as an asset, it just won't be as strong without all three companies.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 20:58

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

deathsuxdontdie posted:

She wouldn't have been so bad if she didn't have gigantic tits that you can only cover up with Miranda's skin tight black catsuit from ME2. Her actual plot line is pretty well done, with her becoming more and more like a human/sentient living thing rather than a generic AI thing. It makes sense to put her in a more humanoid body for people to identify with her more. If she were just a glowing ball the entire time it'd be less convincing.

One alternate costume makes the breasts much less prominent, though unfortunately she doesn't wear it on the ship. Overall, I didn't mind too much, but it would have been nice if the default appearance had been closer to what the original bearer actually looked like.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 23:28

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

TenaciousTomato posted:

Someone mentioned clunky combat, pro tip: only use 2 main guns like (like Assault + sniper or assault + shotgun, + one small wep (pistol OR SMG). It lowers cool down on your abilities so battles that took kind of long will be quick work

I think you mean use only one gun for maximum cooldown reduction. :colbert:

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 23:37

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

thefncrow posted:

Maybe this is just a bug, but does anyone know where Miranda is supposed to be once you get her second message about meeting you on the Citadel? I just got the message and went to the Citadel, and my maps show she's at the Embassies, but I've looked and I just don't see her. I wondered if it was maybe just bugged and I could fix it by leaving and doing a side mission then coming back, but that didn't seem to do anything.

Go to the Spectre office and use the leftmost terminal.

# ¿ Mar 10, 2012 23:52

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Internet Kraken posted:

The more I hear about this game to more lazy and rushed it sounds. Even if it wasn't on Origin I probably wouldn't buy it until the price came down a lot.

No, it really is amazing. There is some glitchiness with sidequests, and the less said about the ending the better, but I almost immediately started a second playthrough when I beat it.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 00:07

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

DarkHamsterlord posted:

Does the game actually explain it this way? I beat it kind of late and wasn't really all there mentally, I actually completely misunderstood the options presented to me and thought the only one that would destroy the Mass Relays was the synthesis option (Imagine my surprise when they exploded anyway!), so I'm willing to believe I completely misinterpreted it.

The game doesn't explain anything remotely well in that part. You'd be better off just making up your own ending, odds are overwhelming that it'll be significantly superior to the crap we got.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 03:03

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

thepopstalinist posted:

Has it been explained how and why the Normandy fled Earth, made it to the Mass Relay, and entered interstellar transit while the siege of the Citadel was underway? Did they have someplace better to be while the final fight for the fate of the galaxy was being fought? Also, what happened to all the sapient species in the Citadel on the way from where its nebula to the Sol system?

There are some real KOTOR2-caliber "wait what?" gems in this finale

No, nothing at all is explained after Shepard chooses an ending.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 03:45

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Casimir Radon posted:

Oh, and Cerberus:
Having TIM's motivations due in large part to being indoctrinated was kind of cheap. Keeping Cerberus as a selfish, immoral, human-supremacist organization works much better. It's not to say they shouldn't have been loving around with Reaper-tech, it's just that having them be a foil to Shepard trying to unite everyone works so much better.

That's honestly been one of the things that's bothered me least, because I don't see indoctrination as really changing TIM. He's an arrogant son of a bitch who will sacrifice anything to give humanity an advantage over the rest of the galaxy. The Reapers didn't make him that way, they just accentuated it.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 03:59

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Mr Fahrenheit posted:

It looked pretty much intact during the Destroy ending, didn't it?

The increasingly frequent explosions all over didn't bode well, I think.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 04:18

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Avocados posted:

"Kelly" 2 told me Garrus wanted to meet me at C-SEC to talk. I thought it was going to be a sappy talk with me asking general questions but shooting purple cans with sniper rifles on a tower overlooking the Citadel was awesome. I found most of the ME1 characters rather boring, even in ME2. I've really grown attached to them in 3 though. I think they did a good job of making them likeable..er. I found the whole Krogan thing rather boring in 2 as well. But that's been one of my favorite parts of 3.

I'm not forgiving them for killing Mordin though.

It was hell of meaningful, though.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 05:04

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Cthulu Carl posted:

As for the ending I thought it was mentioned (In the Codex, maybe also Arrival in ME2) that destroying a Mass Relay basically irradiated the system, killing all life and rendering any planet a wasteland. Doesn't that mean Shepard basically genocided trillions, including Earth?

Destroying the relay by slamming a giant asteroid into it caused that supernova, yes. I think it's entirely reasonable that the Crucible's light show avoided that problem.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 17:35

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

halwain posted:

about the ending.. so after i choose the merge ending i see the normandy flying away and then crashing on an island planet, ashley then leaves the normandy with EDI and joker but how the hell did they get back onto the normandy when they were fighting as part of the hammer??? .

Just one of many things that has no explanation.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 17:47

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Marx posted:

I want to know where the Normandy was going, much in the way I wanted to know why the Normandy dropped off the anti-Grunt dudes during his loyalty mission in ME2 .

What are you talking about? You, like Uvenk, got there with the krogan vehicles, the tuktaks or whatever they were called.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 18:31

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Marx posted:

But when Warf shows up it's after an in-atmosphere flyby of the Normandy which wasn't even supposed to be able to happen because the Normandy couldn't go in atmosphere because of its increased size and stuff which is why you have the ugly dropship.

WE HAVE COMPANY!

Hmm. I'll be damned. The plot inconsistency can be waved off (badly) by them persuading Joker and EDI to give them a hand somehow, but that wouldn't change the Normandy's airworthiness.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 18:39

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

GreenBuckanneer posted:

If you're on the PC you can literally change some lines in your Coalesced.bin file and get the DLC for free, hahahaha

Thanks EA for releasing it already on the disk and then charging for it, Sleazy motherfuckers

Except that the mission on Eden Prime and all of his dialog are missing if you do that, so not exactly.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 18:54

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Dr. Abysmal posted:

Squadmates are not allowed to only carry one weapon, they have to have both. Since there is no display about recharge time bonuses for weight I don't think they're effected by it.

I dunno, Liara seems to have much shorter cooldowns than James, Ashley, or Garrus, all of whom have an assault/sniper rifle.

# ¿ Mar 11, 2012 19:04

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

How the hell do you return to the stone age by destroying all Reapers and robots?

# ¿ Mar 12, 2012 00:42

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Lofidelity Media posted:

Just finished it.

Between those those endings as Dragon Age 2, Bioware has utterly and completely lost it. That was loving terrible. Way to make 5 years of game choices boil down to "pick your favorite color".

And way to drop that whole plot thread of stars dying because of dark energy whatevers.

But, hey, I'm sure that got dropped once you saw the income potential of the multiplayer and stopped giving a poo poo, right, Bioware?

loving. Hell.

Multiplayer has dick to do with the quality of the ending.

# ¿ Mar 12, 2012 03:17

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

The ending is a lot closer to five months old than five years old.

# ¿ Mar 12, 2012 20:49

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

richardfun posted:

Could you tell me (in spoiler tags if necessary) what the ending was in the leaked script?

Dark energy. Basically, the use of mass effect fields produces it, and it's slowly degrading the galaxy or something like that; Reapers harvest civilizations that have used the mass relays in the hopes of finding some perspective that will be able to figure out how to solve the problem. It's been done, but nowhere near as much as Frankenstein, which is what we got.

# ¿ Mar 12, 2012 21:21

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# ¿ Apr 26, 2024 03:56

CaptainCarrot: Jun 9, 2010

Ambiguatron posted:

Jack has the best line in the game.

Bite me, Garrus. Better yet, bite her. I bet that's how she likes it.

I did not expect that.

Tali. Emergency. Induction. Port. :colbert:

# ¿ Mar 12, 2012 22:53

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