SimCity: You can't remove zoning density! YOU WILL REGRET THIS!

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Games > SimCity: You can't remove zoning density! YOU WILL REGRET THIS!

john ashpool: Jun 29, 2010

Love the title, OP. You should have a link to what remains the best frontpage article ever in the odd chance someone hasn't seen it yet.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 12:47

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 21, 2013 06:09

Grand Fromage: Jan 30, 2006; You wildly underestimated my liver's ability to metabolize toxins.

Hollandia posted:

While this sounds great, and I'll definitely play it, I'm still more amazed that there's someone named Ocean Quigley.

Ocean Quigley. Really?

He's an old school Maxis guy. There's an interview with him in the giant awesome SC2K strategy guide (the cool one with the white cover, not the other lovely one).

# ? Mar 9, 2012 12:49

simosimo: Jul 10, 2009; HEY RADICAL LARRY HOW ABOUT A HAIRCUT

****MIC TO THE WILLY***

Echoing the 'I never filled the HUGE city-grid'. I always attempted too, sans the crashing and boredom-spaces, I just never got there.

I'm trying to currently, but SC4's crashing are getting the better of my enthusiasm, even with all of the launch-short-cut-tweaks under the sun.

Totally happy for medium spaces, and connecting regions, you never know, although one city is a medium grid, we don't know if cities might be integrated and displayed, but not 'active'. Therefore forming multiple districts, or one big city.

See The Sims 3.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 12:51

MikeJF: Dec 20, 2003

simosimo posted:

Don't forget bucket and pouring water physics

And swarms of gay men in speedos. Can't forget the himbo swarms.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 13:20

thedaian: Dec 11, 2005; Blistering idiots.

Beef Assistant posted:

SimTower was my favorite.

Good news! Isotower, the semi-remake of Sim Tower I've been working on since forever is finally getting good. Though with the new Sim City coming out, and reports that the Glassbox engine is designed for Maxis to remake lots of their older titles, all my effort could end up being for nothing. It was worth a shot though. Have a pretty screenshot:

# ? Mar 9, 2012 13:39

Metrication: Dec 11, 2010; Of course you have a choice. You can decide how you say yes.

If you don't want to perform the unpleasant action of visiting Reddit, here is a full transcript of the Maxis response thing:
http://www.simtropolis.com/omnibus/...transcript-r232

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:04

notZaar: Jan 7, 2004

James Polk posted:

Since it's full 3D I'm sure somebody will mod SimCopter in. A helicopter in this context is basically a floating camera with physics rules and some graphics over the top.

Wouldn't zooming in that close make everything look terrible?

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:09

Yaos: Feb 22, 2003; She is a cat of significant gravy.

notZaar posted:

Wouldn't zooming in that close make everything look terrible?

That's why they need to make Just Cause 3: SimCopter.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:11

MikeJF: Dec 20, 2003

notZaar posted:

Wouldn't zooming in that close make everything look terrible?

Well, there's speculation that they might put in a street-level walking feature, and if they do then the engine will be able to handle that level of detail.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:11

Retail Slave: Nov 25, 2011; "..and on the pedestal these words appear: My name is Retail Slave, Goon of Goons. Look on my white noise posts, ye Mighty, and despair."

I've loved the SimCity franchise ever since the original. I'm going to buy the gently caress out of this when it comes out.

Edit: Goddammit I have to wait til 2013? Motherfucker.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:16

Grand Fromage: Jan 30, 2006; You wildly underestimated my liver's ability to metabolize toxins.

Filling a large city tile is awesome, y'all need to get building.

And then build into the tiles next to it.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:27

Rupert Buttermilk: Apr 15, 2007; RowboatMan: Freezing time is an old P.I. trick...

Metrication posted:

If you don't want to perform the unpleasant action of visiting Reddit, here is a full transcript of the Maxis response thing:
http://www.simtropolis.com/omnibus/...transcript-r232

My favourite question out of there (aside from what I assume was the picture of Angry Man), is this one...

That link posted:

14) toddgak:
This needs to be answered. I pray for a game like SimCity 4. I love the complicated mechanics, the very difficult to manage budget, traffic problems because of poor design. I want a simulation. SimCity 4 had an impressive amount of behind the scene metrics it use to calculate land value, traffic volume etc... I know there are these young kids who think building a big city with cookie cutter tools and no consequences is some how a fun game, but there are already a ton of these awful dumbed-down games.I crave the complexity of SimCity 3/4 not because it is difficult, but because I'm in awe of the simulation. I love knowing that every citizen needs to find their way to work and back. How roads have realistic volume limits and how bottlenecks have serious consequences. How every piece of infrastructure will require maintenance, how pollution affects land values. How it is more about zoning and allowing the city to grow organically. I mean that is in essence what made SimCity incredible right?

Watching how citizens reacted to your choices and having to work through those obstacles. And please please don't split up housing zones into lower class and upper class bullshit. This is a perfect example of something that was handled by the simulation and replaced with nonsense. You don't need to tell rich people where to live. In the real world they are perfectly able to find the most valuable land and live there. In SimCity 1-4 they could do that too!

Maxis:
[Ocean] Yeah, I agree. You�re describing SimCity. It�s a live simulation that reacts to what you do. It�s a game of indirect control, and the Sims vote with their feet.

If (for some reason) you don�t want rich Sims in a neighborhood, plop down a sewage treatment plant or an incinerator, or just don�t pick up the trash. Trust me, they�ll leave. If you want rich Sims to move in, make sure that there is employment for them and that there are amenities to attract them.

The important thing to add though, is that a deep simulation is only valuable if it�s sufficiently transparent � if you can see what�s going on. (reminds me of the observation that there are 3 kinds of fun in games � things that are fun for players, things that are fun for developers, and things that are fun for the computer). If the player can�t see what�s going on in the simulation, if they can�t understand it and change it, then it�s merely fun for the computer. Rich simulation only matters if you can do something with it.

EDIT: Oh my god, a couple questions down, he mentions SimAnt...

EDIT 2: Holy mother of christ, THIS has gotten me terribly excited.

Simtropolis' reposted AMA posted:

28) ReyDelLaCiudad:
Would I be able to build a real transit friendly walkable city, because the sims in simcity 4 would never walk up the block for anything and hardly use mass transit to go anywhere.

Plus will there be mixed use development in the game like big apartment buildings with stores at the bottom or something like the time warner building in NYC?

Maxis:
[Dan] Yes, you can build a walkable city! To geek out about our simulation for a moment � when buildings with jobs need workers, they actually send out invisible �Help Wanted� requests for that travel along your road network looking for residential buildings. First they send out a request for walkers that only travel a few blocks, and if that goes unanswered they send out another request for drivers that travels much further. This means that by mixing up areas of residential with commercial and industrial in close proximity, you�ll tend to get much more foot traffic. If you want, you could build a city where everyone is forced to drive, by putting a lot of distance between homes and businesses.

Rupert Buttermilk fucked around with this message at Mar 9, 2012 around 14:42

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:29

The Deadly Hume: May 26, 2004; I want some of that pepper steak!

Grand Fromage posted:

Filling a large city tile is awesome, y'all need to get building.

And then build into the tiles next to it.

drat that's nice looking.

Yeah I keep meaning to do stuff with large tiles now I have a much gruntier computer than I had in 2003, but

. (It'd also ameliorate the endless commute phenomena a bit as well.

In fact I really haven't done much with SC4 since I abandoned my LP.

Though I guess as the hype for the new game revs up I will. Maybe rebuilding a new region from the hometown terrain map I knocked together.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:36

Grand Fromage: Jan 30, 2006; You wildly underestimated my liver's ability to metabolize toxins.

Whole region:

Regions are the best thing SC4 added, I think. As long as I can still do this I'll be happy.

Edit:

quote:

31) BenStrike:
I know a lot of Urban Planners and Geographers love your game, so my main question is will there be some sort of multiple use zone? In previous SimCity games it is practically impossible to have commercial and residential mixed, but modern planning uses a lot of multi-use structures and districts for more efficient use of space and minimization of driving times. Will there be any of these in SimCity 5 or does it still work on the older planning model?

Maxis:
[Andrew] The underlying simulator definitely supports this. It's more of a gameplay/UI question to be honest, namely, how we handle designating mixed use zones, and how much that would impact the gameplay in the core game. Would the resulting game be as fun for all players? It's something we'll try and see how it works out.

Even if it doesn't make sense as part of the core game, you make a good point. Because the sim is completely data-driven, maybe in future we could think about releasing an "urban planning" version of the game that emphasises urban planning tools over the more traditional SimCity gameplay.

Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at Mar 9, 2012 around 15:02

# ? Mar 9, 2012 14:53

Rastor: Jun 2, 2001

Very nice OP, though you should replace the link to the teaser trailer with the one where the developers add more info:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T70evBJE93s

# ? Mar 9, 2012 17:00

Thrawn200: Dec 13, 2008; "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." - Calvin & Hobbes

Nice, OP, it made me a lot more excited for the game than I was previously since it covered some of the issues I was worried about. (too casual, moddable, if it was only available through Origin)

# ? Mar 9, 2012 17:02

abagofcheetos: Oct 29, 2003; jim kelly's newer, not-so-dead kid

I'm really curious how modding and multi player is going to work out. Will everyone in your region need the same mods? Or will just your city be affected by what you are running?

And then there is the issue of the whole "global" resources thing... what happens when I download an endless oil mod?

# ? Mar 9, 2012 18:00

Metrication: Dec 11, 2010; Of course you have a choice. You can decide how you say yes.

abagofcheetos posted:

I'm really curious how modding and multi player is going to work out. Will everyone in your region need the same mods? Or will just your city be affected by what you are running?

I imagine they won't allow mods in online play. They could do what OpenTTD does where the server has mods loaded, and before joining it prompts you to download them from a central database.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 18:12

Elentor: Dec 14, 2004; I believe... this are truly something awful.

notZaar posted:

Wouldn't zooming in that close make everything look terrible?

It would still look better than the original SimCopter

# ? Mar 9, 2012 19:23

Grifter: Jul 24, 2003; I do this technique called a suplex. You probably haven't heard of it, it's pretty obscure.

I can't believe they thought there was no market for SimCity. Who doesn't love SimCity?

# ? Mar 9, 2012 19:36

Giggily: Aug 4, 2010

Thrawn200 posted:

Nice, OP, it made me a lot more excited for the game than I was previously since it covered some of the issues I was worried about. (too casual, moddable, if it was only available through Origin)

You're still going to need to be running Origin while you launch the game, which is the most annoying part I think. Hopefully someone can write a script pretty quick that just auto closes Origin once Sim City is running.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 19:36

thedaian: Dec 11, 2005; Blistering idiots.

Grifter posted:

I can't believe they thought there was no market for SimCity. Who doesn't love SimCity?

Sim City Societies was a flop, and so was Cities XL, so obviously there's no market there for a Sim City game. Right?

Except for all the people playing Sim City 4 ten years later, but those people are lame, right?

# ? Mar 9, 2012 19:38

mutata: Mar 1, 2003; Make way for the Urinal Parade.

thedaian posted:

Sim City Societies was a flop, and so was Cities XL, so obviously there's no market there for a Sim City game. Right?

Except for all the people playing Sim City 4 ten years later, but those people are lame, right?

Except they're making a real, in-depth sequel so no one is saying this?

# ? Mar 9, 2012 19:54

Physical: Sep 26, 2007; by T. Finninho

mutata posted:

Except they're making a real, in-depth sequel so no one is saying this?

The guy you quoted was being sarcastic and showing the point of view that kept SC5 away from us for 10 years.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 20:06

Baronjutter: Dec 31, 2007; ...the engine tracks thousands of details for each unit meaning it will be a far deeper game than your grandpa's chess.
Pre-order CHESS now and receive the DLC "queen" unit.

I hate that I know about this so early. I hate going through the stages that almost always occur with any new game I'm mega looking forward to. You spend tons of time combing the internet for every official comment, then finally there's a website and you pour over every vague developer comment and insane marketing promise. There's a beta that you don't get into. Then finally the game comes out, after waiting a year or more and maybe doing something stupid like pre-ordering...

And then you get bored of it in a week or so because it's ok just barely ok. Or maybe it's a total loving disaster like moo3 or spore.

After societies and two iterations cities XL and countless failed/abandoned little indie city builders I just can't get fully excited anymore. And anno 2070 showed me that any "always online" game is going to come with a huge amount of bullshit and crippled modding.

My city builders....

# ? Mar 9, 2012 20:25

Nathilus: Apr 4, 2002

Please, please PLEASE don't be super loving dumbed down. Please.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 20:31

Kasonic: Mar 6, 2007; Tenth Street Reds, representing

Nathilus posted:

Please, please PLEASE don't be super loving dumbed down. Please.

I'm pretty sure everyone can stop saying this. We get it. So do they.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 20:32

Nathilus: Apr 4, 2002

Kasonic posted:

I'm pretty sure everyone can stop saying this. We get it. So do they.

Maybe you're right, but I'm not going to tempt fate until the game is in my hands. Until then I will continue asking really nicely.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 20:35

Greymatter: Feb 20, 2007

Someone uploaded those GDC vids onto youtube if you want to amend them into the op.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsjY...i-exrwQ2aOecF4=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9QY...ECOeGtRLls5uAI=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfQs...diJjojEWfltOmk=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhKB...VyR_q74-79D5nQ=

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:38

Nookovian-Red: Sep 13, 2002; I WILL NOT CLOSE THREAD IN Serious Hardware / Software Crap

Agents seem very cool. How well agents do their jobs, I guess is how good this game will be. Everything seems pretty well thought out to this point and they seem to be emphasizing more on the "Sim" then "build huge flashy cities!" The way how agents are used to spread fire in this new version really speaks to that. Can't wait to see what else they're doing with it.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:41

Omnicarus: Jan 16, 2006

So was it true that this game is going to cost 70.00 US Dollars or was that an announcement day rumor?

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:43

penis bandana: Aug 6, 2008

Omnicarus posted:

So was it true that this game is going to cost 70.00 US Dollars or was that an announcement day rumor?

Origins will force you to convert dollars into Simoleons to purchase the game, and it remains unclear what the conversion rate is.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:47

Omnicarus: Jan 16, 2006

go ddamnit I'm going to need to cash in these Kugerrands then

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:47

Dr. Video Games 0031: Jul 16, 2004

Omnicarus posted:

So was it true that this game is going to cost 70.00 US Dollars or was that an announcement day rumor?

It's $60 in the US.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:51

RON PAUL ALL YEARS: Jul 1, 2009; FREEDOM
INCARNATE

So is there any word on a Mac version yet or am I gonna be stuck trying to get it to work with wine or crossover?

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:53

Google Butt: Oct 4, 2005

Ugh I hope they do an open beta, 2013 is way too far away

# ? Mar 9, 2012 21:53

Baronjutter: Dec 31, 2007; ...the engine tracks thousands of details for each unit meaning it will be a far deeper game than your grandpa's chess.
Pre-order CHESS now and receive the DLC "queen" unit.

Spore looked and sounded amazing too.

My biggest worry is the whole origin/online only thing. I'm so pumped at playing a multiplayer region, but I'm so worried at what that will mean for mods and single player.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 22:00

Metrication: Dec 11, 2010; Of course you have a choice. You can decide how you say yes.

RON PAUL ALL YEARS posted:

So is there any word on a Mac version yet or am I gonna be stuck trying to get it to work with wine or crossover?

Well if it's like The Sims 3 they'll do it with Cider I assume.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 22:01

SlightlyMadman: Jan 14, 2005

Baronjutter posted:

Spore looked and sounded amazing too.

My biggest worry is the whole origin/online only thing. I'm so pumped at playing a multiplayer region, but I'm so worried at what that will mean for mods and single player.

The big problem with spore is that they focused so much on the technology, but forgot to put a fun game in there. SimCity at least has an established fun game design to build that cool new tech on. Even if it's closer to the original SimCity's basic formula, and not the awesome number-crunching fun of SC4 (which I say sincerely, but feel free to interpret as sarcasm if you're not into that sort of thing), it'll still be a really fun game.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 22:04

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 21, 2013 06:09

Dr. Video Games 0031: Jul 16, 2004

SlightlyMadman posted:

The big problem with spore is that they focused so much on the technology, but forgot to put a fun game in there. SimCity at least has an established fun game design to build that cool new tech on. Even if it's closer to the original SimCity's basic formula, and not the awesome number-crunching fun of SC4 (which I say sincerely, but feel free to interpret as sarcasm if you're not into that sort of thing), it'll still be a really fun game.

I think it's kind of the other way around. Spore looked amazing because Will Wright was just showing off a crazy wishlist of ideas in the initial GDC event. All sorts of crazy poo poo he wanted to be in the game but wasn't yet implemented, instead it was just hacked together and faked to provide a facsimile of said features. Everyone's hype immediately skyrocketed to extreme levels and the game didn't end up delivering on the large majority of those promises.

Now, all they're showing is the engine. Most of what we know and have seen is just internal engine stuff. They're starting with what's implemented and working, and they'll show us gameplay later. I expect this will make hype levels more manageable and they aren't really showing us anything that is truly mind blowing that wont be in the final product.

# ? Mar 9, 2012 22:13

«‹›281 »

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Games > SimCity: You can't remove zoning density! YOU WILL REGRET THIS!