quote:

@masseffect: @theagiaseries We are not the gaming press. We are listening to our community's concerns and pass them on to the developers.

Internet Kraken posted:

Only if you ignore Kaiden/Ashley, Thane, Legion, Mordin, and every other character that has sacrificed themselves throughout this series. Sacrifice has always been a part of Mass Effect. If you did everything right you could save most of your friends, but not all of them. This was established in the very first game. And it definitely becomes much more prevalent in Mass Effect 3, culminating in shepard sacrificing himself.

Internet Kraken posted:

Why can't it be both of these things? Mass Effect has a lot of themes, and I'd say both sacrifice and triumph against the impossible is a part of it.

Mr.Unique-Name posted:

This gives me some hope.


I also feel kinda bad for whoever monitors that twitter, since they have to take the brunt of the rage but have no control of anything.

The Ultimate Frisco posted:

But at the same time, the sacrifice is for the great good of GALACTIC CIVILIZATION AS WE KNOW IT. Not "I wonder what colorsplosion I should use to make it impossible to have the society I just brought together to fight as allies?" I think that's my biggest peeve. Sure, Shep can die, but for the love of God not to gently caress over everyone that's left and strand them from home and resources.

Lemon King posted:

Someone posted this picture earlier in this thread or the last one, so this whole ending thing may have been planned?

But I'd take it with a gain of salt.

The Ultimate Frisco posted:

But at the same time, the sacrifice is for the great good of GALACTIC CIVILIZATION AS WE KNOW IT. Not "I wonder what colorsplosion I should use to make it impossible to have the society I just brought together to fight as allies?" I think that's my biggest peeve. Sure, Shep can die, but for the love of God not to gently caress over everyone that's left and strand them from home and resources.

Drighton posted:

I've been saying this for a while. Some of the best stories/movies are the ones that ignore the WHY/HOW aspect and just go on an adventure. Back to the Future: Flux Capacitor, that's how, now lets have some fun!

Lemon King posted:

Someone posted this picture earlier in this thread or the last one, so this whole ending thing may have been planned?

But I'd take it with a gain of salt.

doctor 7 posted:

Uh Shepard not dying basically makes him a hug dick. He recruits people over and over with the mantra that they need to be willing to die because it's life or death. If Shepard isn't willing to sacrifice himself that makes him a coward.

Also his name is Shepard for God's sake and he's setup as the saviour of humanity. If you can't see BioWare was setting up Shepard to die at the end I don't even know what to tell you.

Drighton posted:

I've been saying this for a while. Some of the best stories/movies are the ones that ignore the WHY/HOW aspect and just go on an adventure. Back to the Future: Flux Capacitor, that's how, now lets have some fun!

Crappy Jack posted:

Except Shepard is not even in the same solar system as the Normandy, and also evaporated in two of the endings.

Crappy Jack posted:

Except Shepard is not even in the same solar system as the Normandy, and also evaporated in two of the endings.

Nelson Mandingo posted:

I hope you don't mind if I copy this and use it in any future arguments ( with credit to you of course ) I have on the endings of Mass Effect.

Crustashio posted:

Illusive man being written as the "right" choice just bugged me. That entire plot point could have stayed as-is without the ending choices and still worked IMO. I even remember a line somewhere (prothean VI?) about how the reapers in past cycles always used indoctrination to convince a segment of the population control was feasible. When 90 hours of gaming present a consistent theme of kill the reapers it just came off as lazy that suddenly you can control them or merge with them.

Crustashio posted:

Illusive man being written as the "right" choice just bugged me. That entire plot point could have stayed as-is without the ending choices and still worked IMO. I even remember a line somewhere (prothean VI?) about how the reapers in past cycles always used indoctrination to convince a segment of the population control was feasible. When 90 hours of gaming present a consistent theme of kill the reapers it just came off as lazy that suddenly you can control them or merge with them.

quote:

@masseffect: @theagiaseries We are not the gaming press. We are listening to our community's concerns and pass them on to the developers.

Sky Shadowing posted:

1. They ripped out the ending to fleece us a bit for DLC. Given the sheer amount of "TAKE MY MONEY AND FIX MY ENDING" I'm seeing, it worked to perfection. They then shoved in a lovely ending that they said "maybe it could stand on its own for those who don't want to buy DLC."

Crustashio posted:

This loving ending bugged me all day. I finished it last night, went to bed annoyed and thought about it at work.

My question is, why do there need to be 3 endings? The first two games were always about accomplishing a singular goal in the end, but along the way you get to choose HOW you do so. The beauty of the first two games is that the ending, plotwise, was the same for any playstyle. Sure, you could lose everyone in ME2 but the end result was collectors were stopped. It was so loving jarring to suddenly get a (meaningless) choice at the end of me3 when the buildup of the entire game seemed to point towards reaper destruction. I'd have variations of an ending based on what kind of success you had uniting the galaxy. As mentioned in the thread, if your readiness was absolutely maxed you could have a variation where the crucible doesn't get used or something. They would have at least been able to write something satisfying

Illusive man being written as the "right" choice just bugged me. That entire plot point could have stayed as-is without the ending choices and still worked IMO. I even remember a line somewhere (prothean VI?) about how the reapers in past cycles always used indoctrination to convince a segment of the population control was feasible. When 90 hours of gaming present a consistent theme of kill the reapers it just came off as lazy that suddenly you can control them or merge with them.

I don't even have the will to replay ME3, yet immediatly after I beat the first two games I started a new character and class to play it a different way.

And in the end the explination of "why" didn't bug me. Yeah you pretty much saw it coming from a mile away and there were probably some holes in it (namely can you really ensure civlilations won't evolve faster then you predict) but I mostly enjoyed it.

Megaman's Jockstrap posted:

The ending of Mass Effect 3 doesn't have to be some saccarine crap ending. That's a strawman.

Nobody complained at the end of Shadow of the Colossus.
Nobody complained at the end of Red Dead Redemption.
Nobody complained about the end of Max Payne 2.
Nobody complained about the end of Planescape: Torment.

All of these endings were downers in some way, but were thematically appropriate.

If Mass Effect was really supposed to be a theme of horrendous losses and sacrifices then they shouldn't have made Shepard able to stop Sovereign by blowing up his henchman's skeleton in the first game. Or complete a Suicide Mission with no losses, that ends with Shepard looking defiantly up at the oncoming Reaper horde as they prepare to kick their asses.

Nombres posted:

I agree with you overall, but besides the Control ending being blue, I don't think there's any indication that the Control option is the "right" choice. It could just as easily be seen as the Star Child loving with your head.

Internet Kraken posted:

Why can't it be both of these things? Mass Effect has a lot of themes, and I'd say both sacrifice and triumph against the impossible is a part of it.

Aristobulus posted:

Keyword: both.

As I have repeatedly stated, I am not arguing that the only ending should be a happy one, but I'm not accepting the people that are arguing sacrifice is the only theme of the game, either, which is exactly what you do when you tell me I should be happy with a downer, tragic ending no matter what.

You are right, both sacrifice and triumph are themes of the game, which is exactly why both should be possible in the end, with a slant towards one or the other based on how you played Shepard.

I don't even know why people are arguing against me on this.

Darko posted:

That (and the guy comparing it to sitcoms earlier, wtf) is a really false comparison.

Long term series with tons of fans with years in between involve tons of speculation and expectation, and when the endings don't match, people get pissed off. The more "mainstream" the series, the more people get pissed off. For instance, every single drama series that people actually like that lasts for more than 3 years or so has a ton of people complaining about the ending outside of The Wire, The Shield, and Six Feet Under. Lost, BSG, Sopranos, etc. still have people bitching about the endings constantly on the forum, for instance.

You can't compare this to a one and done game or a sitcom because its a different animal entirely. Those don't have the years and years of expectation and speculation that allows for a letdown once these things finally come to fruition.

I AM NOT SIDING WITH HIM ON THE DEFENSE OF THIS PARTICULAR ENDING because I haven't even seen it yet - as I've stated before, the overall story is probably the thing that interests me least about the game - but Mass Effect is more comparable to a long-running drama than a one and done movie or game, or a short form comedy. And people's own expectations do hugely effect how they accept how something turns out, especially dealing with the, uh, "Internet video game playing demographic."

Nombres posted:

I think the problem with this is that the anger against the ending is nearly unanimous. It's be more of a tossup if it was somewhat more even, but last I checked the BSN poll was something like 2% positive (or some other ridiculously small amount). There's a difference between people being upset that something ends, and most players being up in arms about that. Sure, the poll is self-selecting, but then again, I've yet to find a single one of my friends that was at all pleased with the ending.

It doesn't prove much, but I think we're dealing with a very different animal than "this is just the dynamics of a series coming to an end."

Jarmel posted:

Crustashio posted:

It was so loving jarring to suddenly get a (meaningless) choice at the end of me3 when the buildup of the entire game seemed to point towards reaper destruction.

Oxxidation posted:

I think that unanimous animosity is also partly the reason why games journalists are going berserk trying to defend it. This isn't the usual gaggle of people who hated the whole game and can be written off with the usual "well they're just entitled/immature and here's seven paragraphs of marketing boilerplate to explain why," they like the game but hate the last ten minutes with a passion. Games journalism is, above all else, really lazy. They're going into a tailspin trying to adapt to the situation.

Mr.Unique-Name posted:

This gives me some hope.


I also feel kinda bad for whoever monitors that twitter, since they have to take the brunt of the rage but have no control of anything.