Suspicious Dish posted:

The gameplay is also focused on building attack chains, which means that the levels themselves have to be long hallways full of enemies with no breaks or platforming segments, otherwise you'd lose your combo.

Do not even ask posted:

Memento posted:

But this is completely, demonstrably not the point of Shenmue or Bloodstained, the former being the subject of discussion. The money from kickstarter in both cases is in the minority share of their funding. I think it's going to be hilarious when Sony dump a truckload of money into Shenmue, and then the people that have already paid for the digital version end up being the only ones that want it at full price, and it ends up on Steam for $4.99 in eight months time. Bonus points for if Sony decide to use it as the launch "killer app" for whatever Uplay/Origin/Rockstar Social Club thing they decide to make to try and claw money away from Steam - not that I've heard anything of the sort, but it seems like the thing they would do.

Sigma-X posted:

If you think Shenmue is going to happen on $5m or whatever the gently caress kickstarter brings in you are just straight goddamn naive, they will have funding from a bunch of other sources as well and it will dwarf the amount that kickstarter raises.

Megazver posted:

One Dreamer is one of them pixely platformer adventure deelios. It features a DEMO and a whole bunch of stick leg action everyone here loves.

Nintendo Kid posted:

What's "hilarious" about "how every other game works, only the full price is paid in advance and the price drop comes sooner after release"? I mean people have been preordering at full price for games for years...

Memento posted:

That the majority of people who want the game have already bought it through kickstarter, yet there is more money being put into it by Sony for "assistance on the production and marketing end, and in Sony’s case with some publishing support as well" in anticipation of a non-kickstarter audience that may not actually exist.

Motto posted:

I always thought that Kickstarter was a funding system that gave the product to backers above a certain threshold as a bonus, not a preorder system. Like, even if a KS got funded, it'd be pretty bad if no non-backers bought the finished product.

Motto posted:

I always thought that Kickstarter was a funding system that gave the product to backers above a certain threshold as a bonus, not a preorder system. Like, even if a KS got funded, it'd be pretty bad if no non-backers bought the finished product.

Benly posted:

That was the original premise and is still how it works in some sections (art, theater, actual business proposals). The gaming sections tend to treat it as a preorder market.

Nintendo Kid posted:

And what's hilarious about that? Seriously like, it's just not funny at all. It's boring business poo poo.

Memento posted:

It's almost like humour is relative. I find amusement in the possibility that Sony will pour millions of dollars into a game that might be incredibly niche and have a very limited audience, all of whom already paid for it, thus costing Sony a lot of money. I realise it's taking joy in the misfortune of others, and also that large projects like this on KS actually benefit small projects, but it still amuses me. If this scenario plays out, it also means there is effectively zero chance for a Shenmue III, but honestly the game sounds like boring crap anyway. Who gives a poo poo what someone has in the drawers in their house, I can look inside drawers all I want in the real world.

Hat Thoughts posted:

Ya it's a shame honestly

Memento posted:

It's almost like humour is relative. I find amusement in the possibility that Sony will pour millions of dollars into a game that might be incredibly niche and have a very limited audience, all of whom already paid for it, thus costing Sony a lot of money. I realise it's taking joy in the misfortune of others, and also that large projects like this on KS actually benefit small projects, but it still amuses me. If this scenario plays out, it also means there is effectively zero chance for a Shenmue III, but honestly the game sounds like boring crap anyway. Who gives a poo poo what someone has in the drawers in their house, I can look inside drawers all I want in the real world.

Memento posted:

Who gives a poo poo what someone has in the drawers in their house, I can look inside drawers all I want in the real world.

Nintendo Kid posted:

So you find accounting funny. That's nice for you.

I also don't see how there will be zero chance of a Shenmue III when they have the money and Sany behind them? Did you hit your head recently?

Memento posted:

Sorry, I mean Shenmue IV. That is a definite error of judgement on my part that you would consider someone to have brain damage to have made, and not a typo. Indeed.

It's not accounting, it's megacorporations trying to leverage grassroots crowdfunding to do their loving jobs for them and getting bitten in the arse.

I don't know why I have attracted the ire of the almighty fishmech so I will withdraw from this line of questioning.

Nintendo Kid posted:

It seemed just as stupid as everything else you've typed on the subject on Shenmue III and I've already seen several chicken littles elsewhere online who believe "something something Sony's just going to keep all the money".


And what job is that? How is Sony getting "bitten on the rear end" by getting free money to cut down their own costs? You're really not making any sense at all. None of the people behind the kickstarter lose out at this stage of the game.. they might have if it flopped but it didn't because they hit their goal less than a week in.

Because you described arcane business accounting details as "hillarious", dude.

Memento posted:

Sony is paying additional money into a game that has possibly taken in all of the money it's going to get via kickstarter. The money Sony is putting in is more than the money that has come in from kickstarter. No more money will come in from that game. Sony loses money.

I never said I think Sony is going to keep all of the money. I said Sony is paying money to help make a game that has already taken all of the money it's ever going to get, which has gone to Ys. So Sony paying for production, marketing and publishing is money it will lose.

Memento posted:

The job of corporations is to produce products and market those products. I guess using kickstarter to do that for them, for free, is a creative way of getting other people to do your job for you, but it doesn't make it any less cynical.

Toxxupation posted:

I didn't believe it either but apparently the person who posted the tumblr post worked for whatpumpkin (the merch house for homestuck and thus would have better access to internal documents like that), radiation (a guy who's worked for hussie directly and is currently developing a game) retweeted it, and when asked hussie did a "refuse to comment" non comment over an outright denial or assertion that what happened was false

Also the tumblr post has already been deleted

All that combines into a fairly compelling case that what happened was at worst exaggerated and more than likely true, especially considering that what specifically happened within it isn't even specifically a revolutionary concept; gearbox did literally the same thing when developing aliens colonial marines/borderlands 2 with the money they were given from sega

Also there's the fact that hussie took a nearly year-long break with no explanation for why, and drawn out legal proceedings because the dev you contracted embezzled the money makes the timeline make more sense

I was skeptical too but it's too neat of an explanation that has a bunch of circumstantial evidence supporting it that makes it seem plausible and even logical to be an outright falsehood

Nintendo Kid posted:

It's only "possibly" that if you know nothing of how things work. It's also still got 11 days to go so it's going to probably rack up more millions, especially with last day lollygaggers. Sony won't lose money.

So you said something factually wrong. Got it. There has already been more money for that game from the time you wrote that post, you silly little man, and your doomsday scenario of them putting it on steam sale for $5 also gets it a lot more money - I sure hope you understand by now that games don't cost $60 because that's what they actually cost to make!

Memento posted:

And all of that KS money goes to Ys, which is what I said. I don't know where you're getting the idea of Sony taking the money from, because I never said that.

Motto posted:

I always thought that Kickstarter was a funding system that gave the product to backers above a certain threshold as a bonus, not a preorder system. Like, even if a KS got funded, it'd be pretty bad if no non-backers bought the finished product.

Nintendo Kid posted:

The more money YS NET gets, the less money Sony pays. This is, to Sony, effectively the same as them (Sony) getting extra money.since they were already prepared to pay X amount and now need to pay X minus whatever the Kickstarter finalizes over the goal. Since the goal was 2 million and Sony was probably only expecting a successful kickstarter to raise a little over that to be worth it to them, we can assume something like $2.1 million is where Sony starts having to pay less money then originally budgeted after kickstarter fees on that amount, so they're up like $2.3 million minus kickstarter fees by now.

Nintendo Kid posted:

Not really a shame though. Like, since games are the sort of thing you can give me for fractions of a penny of bandwidth and hosting costs, why shouldn't I get the game if I'm giving you money to make the game. Tons of the music projects will kick you the album or song, movie/video projects also usually give you a digital copy. Hell, I kickstarted some random student's on-stage production thing with like a combo of art and music and I at least got a copy of a CD of the music.

Megazver posted:

One Dreamer is one of them pixely platformer adventure deelios. It features a DEMO and a whole bunch of stick leg action everyone here loves.

A good poster posted:

Ideally, the Kickstarter would generate enough funds to pay the salaries of the developers, which is the exact same deal they'd get with a publisher. Getting more sales afterwards just means extra money for the developers, which is always nice, but not selling a single copy outside of Kickstarter shouldn't really be a problem, because the developers already got theirs, and the backers wouldn't be looking to or even able to profit monetarily like a publisher would.

Publishers giving millions of dollars of support to these larger Kickstarter projects actually seems like a horrible idea on the part of those publishers. There's no way in hell games like Yooka-Laylee and Mighty No. 9 are going to make back all this money from people who didn't pledge to the Kickstarter, and this trend of KS+publisher is going to die off immediately.

Megazver posted:

Memento posted:

Sony is paying additional money into a game that has possibly taken in all of the money it's going to get via kickstarter.

Memento posted:

Sony is paying additional money into a game that has possibly taken in all of the money it's going to get via kickstarter. The money Sony is putting in is more than the money that has come in from kickstarter. No more money will come in from that game. Sony loses money. This amuses me, because I am amused by the misfortunes of others.

Puppy Galaxy posted:

http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3710941&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=1

Memento posted:

So how does that work with promised stretch goal features in this sort of arrangement? Would Sony have budgeted to support them regardless, or would they have a cost matrix for the things they want that has trigger points where (x) funding pushes them over the limit for (y) stretch goal, even though that's more money Sony needs to put in? Or would stretch stuff be budgeted strictly from KS funds?

Nintendo Kid posted:

The more money YS NET gets, the less money Sony pays. This is, to Sony, effectively the same as them (Sony) getting extra money.since they were already prepared to pay X amount and now need to pay X minus whatever the Kickstarter finalizes over the goal. Since the goal was 2 million and Sony was probably only expecting a successful kickstarter to raise a little over that to be worth it to them, we can assume something like $2.1 million is where Sony starts having to pay less money then originally budgeted after kickstarter fees on that amount, so they're up like $2.3 million minus kickstarter fees by now.

gtrmp posted:

What? This is incredibly dumb.

gtrmp posted:

so that they can instead get money directly from Sony without having to lose ~10% of that money to Kickstarter's processing fees. And why would they keep adding stretch goals if meeting those goals wouldn't actually make them any more money to pay for those goals?

Nintendo Kid posted:

It isn't. Why do you think Sony ain't saying poo poo about how much they're willing to put in?