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pizzadog
Oct 9, 2009



nollij posted:

Currently trying to lose weight and get cut/fit.
My diet is:
Kellog's Special K extra protein (100 Cal) + skim milk (80Cal) for breakfast
Apple (100 Cal) and Beef Jerky (120 Cal) for mid morning snack
Salad (510-525 Cal) for lunch
Greek yogurt (80 Cal) for late afternoon snack
Workout right after work (5:30ish)
Greek Yogurt (80 Cal) post workout
PB&J or peanut butter toast or other calories for dinner. I haven't quite figured out a good assortmnet of dinner foods.

For my work outs, I am on a 2 day split. I broke my ankle a while ago and am working my way up to jogging starting next week. So, no heavy weights on my ankle yet still. When I feel comfortable with my ankle I will shift to a 3 day split.

I work out every day of the week alternating between the two workouts.

Currently I do:
1st day:
DB bench press 4 sets of 12
DB inclince bench press 4 sets of 12
assisted dips 4 sets of 12
Overhead DB extensions 4 sets of 12
Tricep pushdowns 4 sets of 12
Core exercise hiting all the parts for about 10 minutes
Cardio for 10-20 minutes depending on how I feel

2nd day:
Wide grip lateral pulldown 4 sets of 12
DB rows 4 sets of 12
DB shoulder press 4 sets of 12
DB front/lateral/rear/lateral 4 sets of 12
DB bicep curls 4 sets of 12
Core exercise hiting all the parts for about 10 minutes
Cardio for 10-20 minutes depending on how I feel

Am I on the right track?

E: NEvermind I just read that you can't do anything lower body I guess.

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Shine
Feb 26, 2007

No Muscles For The Majority


nollij posted:

By recovery being poor, how will that affect my results per my stated goal?

By hypertrophy do you mean the size of the muscle or the strength/endurance of it?

They'll be worse. You need to give your muscles and joints sufficient recovery to get optimal results. This is true regardless of your goal. Doing what you posted everyday will wreck your shoulder girdle, for example. This is why it's suggested that you use a prefab program when starting out.

Hypertrophy means size, and having sizable muscles is one of the keys to looking fit and cut (the other is not being fat).

nollij
Aug 30, 2006


So my results would be overall better to add a rest or straight cardio between my split instead of just piling the splits together?

Helios Grime
Jan 27, 2012

Power Sugar Curls


Yes, The magic of getting big and fit doesn't happen while you exercise. It happens when your body is recovering from the strain of being used and tries to adapt to this.

BjornOfBorg
Aug 28, 2011

I AM NOT BUTT WIZARD, DO YOU UNDERSTAND? HONESTLY!

Fontoyn posted:

Can you describe your situation with more detail?

Katana Gomai posted:

I started doing Alf4 as a 3-day split in the way he suggests it and my workouts are 1:10h Monday, 40min Wednesday, 1h Friday. Are you really that pressed for time?

Thanks for the replies. I'm actually surprised that the workouts in the 3-day split for Alfa4 only take you that short, Katana Gomai, but perhaps I'm bad at estimating how long it would take me to do rest-pause sets and exercises I haven't done before. I'm really not that pressed for time. I work out in the mornings and I have about an hour/hour and 15 minutes slot between the gym's opening time and having to be finished to get to work in time. I play basketball 3-4 times a week in the evenings, so in order to balance everything I think a 3-day split would fit better than a 4-day split.

But given the times you list, I should be able to make it quite comfortable so I think I'll give it a shot some time soon for a couple of weeks.

Katana Gomai
Jan 14, 2007

"Thus," concluded Miyamoto, "you must give up everything you have to be my disciple."


Those "15 deep breathes" during rest pause sets are surprisingly short and I rest for 45 seconds during the exercises that are more than one set, of which there aren't that many. I rest more for the heavy sets in the beginning but even with my whole squat session taking ~15 minutes at the beginning of leg day, the rest of it are either RPS, 2 sets or even single sets where you don't have rest time at all. I like it a lot, it's a very stringent workout and keeping downtime short is actually preferred.

I think there's a line in the thread saying that if your workouts take longer than 45 mins (4day) or 1h-1:15h (3day), you're resting too much. Considering that leg day is the same on both, I fall right into that.

Splurgerwitzl
Oct 18, 2009

Hey guys :3
I picked splurgerwitzl as my name because it sounds silly and funny


nollij posted:

So my results would be overall better to add a rest or straight cardio between my split instead of just piling the splits together?
No. Do a program made by someone who isn't an idiot until you understand how weightlifting works. Your proposed workout has the intention of exhausting and isolating most of your body which will spread your resources too thin for you to make progress and you'll get hurt.

Do a routine in alfalfa's thread, you'll like the results if you do it right. If you want to do a split you're going to need more than two days. I don't even think three days is enough unless you don't mind slow progress.

e: lmao, I just realized you want to alternate between those workouts every day of the week.

Splurgerwitzl fucked around with this message at Sep 13, 2012 around 12:53

Zedsdeadbaby
Jun 14, 2008


For some-one who is completely new to weightlifting, I would seriously just point them to Starting Strength.

Shine
Feb 26, 2007

No Muscles For The Majority


Zedsdeadbaby posted:

For some-one who is completely new to weightlifting, I would seriously just point them to Starting Strength.

A guy with a broken ankle probably shouldn't do a squat program.

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

Tonight's starting lineup is
brought to you by Satan.


Sounds like the epitome of HTFU if you ask me.

bowmore
Oct 6, 2008



But just remember, If that broken ankle hurts don't try and push through the pain!

Rustybear
Nov 16, 2006
what the thunder said

nollij posted:

So my results would be overall better to add a rest or straight cardio between my split instead of just piling the splits together?

Your results would be better if you followed a proper program instead of throwing random stuff together and hoping for the best.

For example:
Why are you training shoulders multiple times everyday and biceps once every other day? Why are you doing 4 sets of 12 for everything?

Get an actual training program.

Olive Branch
May 26, 2010

There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance.


Zedsdeadbaby posted:

For some-one who is completely new to weightlifting, I would seriously just point them to Starting Strength.
It really should be renamed to "Squatting Strength".

And nollij I'm just echoing what everyone else said, but pick a program that's already been indicated (SS, Alfalfa's) and don't just focus on your arms literally every day of the week.

If you keep that up you'll hurt yourself and never get those sick swolebro arms you dream of.

Splurgerwitzl
Oct 18, 2009

Hey guys :3
I picked splurgerwitzl as my name because it sounds silly and funny


Starting Strength is an apt recommended program for a forum named You Look Like poo poo.

Zedsdeadbaby
Jun 14, 2008


Shine posted:

A guy with a broken ankle probably shouldn't do a squat program.

D'oh, I missed that somehow.

Reggie Died
Mar 24, 2004


Assuming diet and training frequency remain constant, is there any clear cut weight lifting program which is superior when it comes to losing weight/bf%?

I've been doing SS (with some minor tweaks) since April, and have been happy with the results so far, both in strength and in how I look. I'm now looking to really hunker down on the fat loss, with added cardio on off days and cleaning up the diet as best as I can.

Would I see any benefit from switching to a program that uses 8-12 reps instead of 5, or is it really just the diet that is going to be the TSN turning point?

Zedsdeadbaby
Jun 14, 2008


Dietary changes will help more than changing your program up if you really want to lose weight and body fat. Count the calories you have every day. Between 10-12*[your body weight in pounds] is the maximum you should consume daily if you want effective and safe weight loss. Alternatively, the OP says just add a zero to your weight and eat that much in calories. Essentially the same thing.

Abu Dave
Mar 31, 2012


I'm bored of my workouts, if I replace some of the days with extensive hiking would I be screwing myself up in any way other than not being as swole as fast?

Shine
Feb 26, 2007

No Muscles For The Majority


Abu Dave posted:

I'm bored of my workouts, if I replace some of the days with extensive hiking would I be screwing myself up in any way other than not being as swole as fast?

If you want to hike, go hike. It'll be fine.

Abu Dave
Mar 31, 2012


Thanks.

nollij
Aug 30, 2006


Olive Branch posted:

It really should be renamed to "Squatting Strength".

And nollij I'm just echoing what everyone else said, but pick a program that's already been indicated (SS, Alfalfa's) and don't just focus on your arms literally every day of the week.

If you keep that up you'll hurt yourself and never get those sick swolebro arms you dream of.

I will finish out this week doing cardio to let my muscles rest and start Cavefish's program on Sunday. Albeit, I will be taking it really easy on anything putting weight on my ankle.

Can I skip the Wed rest day in the program and skip the weekend rest days?

Shine
Feb 26, 2007

No Muscles For The Majority


NO

E: DUMBASS

Helios Grime
Jan 27, 2012

Power Sugar Curls


nollij posted:

I will finish out this week doing cardio to let my muscles rest and start Cavefish's program on Sunday. Albeit, I will be taking it really easy on anything putting weight on my ankle.

Can I skip the Wed rest day in the program and skip the weekend rest days?

Why do you want to skip the rest days? They are there for a reason.

Zedsdeadbaby
Jun 14, 2008


nollij posted:

Can I skip the Wed rest day in the program and skip the weekend rest days?

Your muscles don't actually build when you use them, they build when they rest. If you work out every day, your muscles won't get the chance to rest and you'll just fatigue and burn yourself out. This has been mentioned virtually every couple of posts for the last couple of pages now and is pretty basic knowledge. There's a reason the mod of this forum just called you a dumbass in all caps.

Vomik
Jul 29, 2003

Melting.


nollij posted:

I will finish out this week doing cardio to let my muscles rest and start Cavefish's program on Sunday. Albeit, I will be taking it really easy on anything putting weight on my ankle.

Can I skip the Wed rest day in the program and skip the weekend rest days?

What's your workout background? If it's "very new" I'm predicting within a month you'll be done working out.

Abu Dave posted:

I'm bored of my workouts, if I replace some of the days with extensive hiking would I be screwing myself up in any way other than not being as swole as fast?

You can get some humongous calves hiking with a heavy pack. Way better than anything the gym can give you.

Olive Branch
May 26, 2010

There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance.


Zedsdeadbaby posted:

Your muscles don't actually build when you use them, they build when they rest. If you work out every day, your muscles won't get the chance to rest and you'll just fatigue and burn yourself out.
Well by that logic then I should be just sitting at home playing my videogames and getting swole from resting all the time. Why go to the gym otherwise?

Also don't skip the rest days, nollij, goddamn. If you are so dedicated to going to the gym every single day of the week, do only cardio those rest days and RELAX the rest of the day. You know about sleep? We need to rest our heads every night for a reason. Your muscles work the same way. Listen to everyone and don't sweat the rest days. They're essential.

If you're after quick results and think pumping iron every day will get you there faster, you've got a nasty surprise waiting for you. Getting big and strong is a marathon, not a sprint.

Zedsdeadbaby
Jun 14, 2008


Olive Branch posted:

Well by that logic then I should be just sitting at home playing my videogames and getting swole from resting all the time. Why go to the gym otherwise?

I probably worded it wrong. You know what I mean.

But yeah. Rest days are as important as the workout days themselves. You need two-three days off a week minimum.

poisonpill
Nov 8, 2009

The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength.


Let me explain this more simply. Do you remember Aladdin? He was always running, climbing, and escaping from the guards. Notice his thin build. His rest was poor: He would catch a few hours of sleep on a cot in a broken shack. He also followed a diet plan that consisted of giving his food away to orphans. This significantly hurt his recovery.

On the other hand, Beaty and the Beast villain Gaston followed the 4-dozen-eggs-per-day plan, supplemented by shooting barrels of ale and drinking the contents. He would lift benches covered with people on alternating days and spend his recovery periods scheming with his friends. He enjoyed his life and also experienced much better recovery and gains.

There is no quick-fix. You can't skip recovery and get fit twice as fast. This is a marathon, not a sprint. The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength (but there are downsides to this approach, as well). If you just take this as a lifestyle instead of a magic button, you'll find that you are able to workout three or four times per week, for the years that getting fit will take. You will enjoy it that much more, and you will develop lasting improvements to your body. Your mental health will improve, and you will know that you've worked hard for a long-term increase to your quality of life.

Olive Branch
May 26, 2010

There is no wealth like knowledge, no poverty like ignorance.


poisonpill posted:

Let me explain this more simply. Do you remember Aladdin? He was always running, climbing, and escaping from the guards. Notice his thin build. His rest was poor: He would catch a few hours of sleep on a cot in a broken shack. He also followed a diet plan that consisted of giving his food away to orphans. This significantly hurt his recovery.

On the other hand, Beaty and the Beast villain Gaston followed the 4-dozen-eggs-per-day plan, supplemented by shooting barrels of ale and drinking the contents. He would lift benches covered with people on alternating days and spend his recovery periods scheming with his friends. He enjoyed his life and also experienced much better recovery and gains.

There is no quick-fix. You can't skip recovery and get fit twice as fast. This is a marathon, not a sprint. The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength (but there are downsides to this approach, as well). If you just take this as a lifestyle instead of a magic button, you'll find that you are able to workout three or four times per week, for the years that getting fit will take. You will enjoy it that much more, and you will develop lasting improvements to your body. Your mental health will improve, and you will know that you've worked hard for a long-term increase to your quality of life.
Shine please put this in the goon wisdom post, thanks in advance.

Obligatory video related.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PK3x2DOoJIc

Gaston needs to squat, though.

E: Ahaha Poisonpill already got a new avatar, that is amazing.

Olive Branch fucked around with this message at Sep 13, 2012 around 19:47

silvergoose
Mar 18, 2006

IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS


poisonpill posted:

Let me explain this more simply. Do you remember Aladdin? He was always running, climbing, and escaping from the guards. Notice his thin build. His rest was poor: He would catch a few hours of sleep on a cot in a broken shack. He also followed a diet plan that consisted of giving his food away to orphans. This significantly hurt his recovery.

On the other hand, Beaty and the Beast villain Gaston followed the 4-dozen-eggs-per-day plan, supplemented by shooting barrels of ale and drinking the contents. He would lift benches covered with people on alternating days and spend his recovery periods scheming with his friends. He enjoyed his life and also experienced much better recovery and gains.

There is no quick-fix. You can't skip recovery and get fit twice as fast. This is a marathon, not a sprint. The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength (but there are downsides to this approach, as well). If you just take this as a lifestyle instead of a magic button, you'll find that you are able to workout three or four times per week, for the years that getting fit will take. You will enjoy it that much more, and you will develop lasting improvements to your body. Your mental health will improve, and you will know that you've worked hard for a long-term increase to your quality of life.

This is amazing.

nollij
Aug 30, 2006


Haha, Noted. I will just do cardio during the rest days.

This is not my first time working out. I just havent worked out regularly since college. The routine I was on was the one I was doing in high school. I know how to do all the exercises and to keep proper form. I havent hurt anything working out since high school where I would keep picking up weights that were way too big.

I have actually been on this work out schedule for about 2 months now. It is hard for me to sit still and not actively produce/improve and right now I am in a money crunch. My normal hobbies are pretty expensive so I am trying to fill as much of my time as possible with exercise.

ForkPat
Aug 5, 2003

All the food is poison


75% of this thread is like a fitness version of this show: http://www.suzeorman.com/igsbase/ig...ordit&GnavID=42

"I'm $130,000 in debt and really want to buy a boat and diamond ring! Can I afford it?"

They really should teach sound health, fitness and finance skills in US high schools before releasing us into the wild.

HagridOfTheLibrary
Nov 17, 2005

Keeper of the Beard

I'm going to ask about an injury here, but I'll carry it over to the Goon Doctor if needed. I bought new socks, the thin kind, and tore open the ball of my foot on each foot ( http://i.imgur.com/zkCTd.jpg for those who don't like cuts). The skin came completely off the foot except for a small section on the side before I pushed it back down, so the top is kinda like a skin hat.

I've currently bandaged them up and cleaned them with alcohol, but I was wondering if there was anything I could do to prevent this in the future. This is the first time I've ever wore this thin of socks and I imagine that's the main reason this happened.

Also, has anyone else ever had an injury like this and how long did it take for you to recover?

Zedsdeadbaby
Jun 14, 2008


nollij posted:

Haha, Noted. I will just do cardio during the rest days.

Better than having no rest days at all, but you're still loving it up.

Helios Grime
Jan 27, 2012

Power Sugar Curls


What were you doing when that happened? Running?
Also yeah, the goon doctor would probably be better help for the injury itself.

Roargasm
Oct 21, 2010

Hate to sound sleazy
But tease me
I don't want it if it's that easy


I'm a novice and I'm about 7 workouts into sean10mm's modified starting strength:
A:
3x5 Squat
3x5 Bench press
1x5 Deadlift
2x 5-8 Dips
5x5 Weighted decline situp
Supermans

B:
3x5 Squat
3x5 Seated dumbbell shoulder press
3x5 One-arm dumbbell row
2x 5-8 pullups
5x5 weighted decline situp
Supermans

While I was squatting today, I had an extreme tightness in my outer thigh that felt like I had strained something. I have progressed from squatting 135lb 3x5 at the start to 180lb x5,x4,x4 two days ago, but today the tightness really kicked in while I was doing a 155lb warmup set and I really didn't feel comfortable adding more weight so that I wouldn't risk injury before I did some research.

I tried to do some solo research, but the internet is all over the place on this one regarding what I should do about it. The region where I'm feeling tightness seems to be my IT band, and it's a consistent tightness/dull pain all the way down my outer thigh that settles most heavily right above the knees.

Is it safe to keep squatting with this problem? Should I do stretches? Use a foam roller? R.I.C.E.? I don't mind squatting through pain but I don't want to suffer a setback right as I'm starting to get a good consistency going at the gym.

HagridOfTheLibrary
Nov 17, 2005

Keeper of the Beard

Helios Grime posted:

What were you doing when that happened? Running?
Also yeah, the goon doctor would probably be better help for the injury itself.

Playing basketball. Pivoting on the ball of my foot mainly. I posted here because I imagine runners have gotten similar blisters/sores before and was wondering if there was and recommendations of treatment that I haven't thought of beyond the typical first aid for this sort of thing. I'll probably post again in the goon doctor tonight.

Helios Grime
Jan 27, 2012

Power Sugar Curls


My only guess would be that you need better fitting shoes so your foot doesn't move around and allow friction to happen. But I'm nether a runner nor has this happened to me, so maybe someone more knowledgeable should answer this.

Henrik Zetterberg
Dec 7, 2007



poisonpill posted:

Let me explain this more simply. Do you remember Aladdin? He was always running, climbing, and escaping from the guards. Notice his thin build. His rest was poor: He would catch a few hours of sleep on a cot in a broken shack. He also followed a diet plan that consisted of giving his food away to orphans. This significantly hurt his recovery.

On the other hand, Beaty and the Beast villain Gaston followed the 4-dozen-eggs-per-day plan, supplemented by shooting barrels of ale and drinking the contents. He would lift benches covered with people on alternating days and spend his recovery periods scheming with his friends. He enjoyed his life and also experienced much better recovery and gains.

There is no quick-fix. You can't skip recovery and get fit twice as fast. This is a marathon, not a sprint. The only way to get huge fast is to insult a passing witch and hope she curses you with Beast-strength (but there are downsides to this approach, as well). If you just take this as a lifestyle instead of a magic button, you'll find that you are able to workout three or four times per week, for the years that getting fit will take. You will enjoy it that much more, and you will develop lasting improvements to your body. Your mental health will improve, and you will know that you've worked hard for a long-term increase to your quality of life.

Holy poo poo, this is beautiful.

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Martello
Apr 29, 2012



poisonpill posted:

Awesome Disney poo poo

I posted this in SA Quotes. Thank you.

So, in my own anecdotal personal experience, working out 6 days a week with the 1 rest day has worked well for me in the past, and I'm wondering why and/or if I will get even better gains from doing Alfalfa's workout, which I'm starting next month when I get back from my stupid army training.

Bear with me here, I'm not trying to say I was doing the right thing, since I'm sure I wasn't. But this is what happened. When I was deployed from '10-'11, I lifted for 1-3 hours every day except Sunday for about six months. In the first month I raised my bench max from 205 to 265, my preacher curl from 85 to 120, incline dumbbell press from 2x 50 to 2x 95, and so on. After I got to those numbers, I pretty much plateaued for the most part, adding 5 or 10 pounds here and there but not making any more huge lifting gains. My bodyweight went from 175 to 205 and I did very little cardio (like an idiot), pretty much just lifting. My buddy who's a natural monster type who just gets huge lifting whatever weights he feels like was my partner/trainer, basically we just did different major muscle groups every day, but pretty much only upper body. We didn't really have a plan but would change up our lifts depending on what we wanted to do. Then we redeployed and things happened and blah blah and I worked out sporadically so now I'm way back down in strength and trying to get back up again.

Short version - if working out every day with no plan like an idiot gave me significant gains, will doing Alfalfa's workout or something similar work even better? I mean, the answer is obviously going to be yes from you guys, but I guess it's just weird to me only lifting 3 days a week.

edit: Oh and I was also eating a ton of food and drinking protein shakes before and after every workout, and taking a lot of jack3d.

Martello fucked around with this message at Sep 13, 2012 around 20:34

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