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Vlaada fans, hear my plea. I played Mage Knight for the first time last night - none of us had ever touched it before, and they assigned me to figure out the rules and teach everybody. We did the tutorial scenario. It was a grueling, joyless, cruelly random experience. We only made it through one day-night cycle (about three or four hours of play?) before I dropped out. The biggest issue seemed to be waiting for other people to take their drat turns - it seems like a game that could be fun with rapid-fire Dominion-style turns, but in practice there was a lot of hemming and hawing and 'oh, crap, I don't have enough movement points go get there'. Was it just the group I was playing with? Is there some rules update or vital expansion we're missing? Or is it just...no fun?
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Jul 3, 2012 17:02
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Der Shovel posted:I cannot recommend Dungeon Petz enough. It's a great worker placement game, really easy to pick up and get into thanks to the funny pets and the dumb stuff that's going on. Ha! I ordered Dungeon Petz an hour ago on a whim when my friend asked if I needed something from a webshop I frequent. He was setting up his order on Gears of War, and naturally I couldn't resist spending some more money on cardboard and plastic bits. I'm still having buyer's remorse because of Earth Reborn so I hope a box of Vlaada goodness sets things right. Wasn't the most common gripe about Petz the fact that you have to make some blind guesses when trying to sell your pets or take them to exhibitions? And speaking of good ol' Vlaada, we're having a match of Dungeon Lords tomorrow. 
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Jul 3, 2012 17:13
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General Battuta posted:Vlaada fans, hear my plea. I played Mage Knight for the first time last night - none of us had ever touched it before, and they assigned me to figure out the rules and teach everybody. We did the tutorial scenario. It was a grueling, joyless, cruelly random experience. We only made it through one day-night cycle (about three or four hours of play?) before I dropped out. The biggest issue seemed to be waiting for other people to take their drat turns - it seems like a game that could be fun with rapid-fire Dominion-style turns, but in practice there was a lot of hemming and hawing and 'oh, crap, I don't have enough movement points go get there'. It usually takes about 2-3 hours for my group to get through a 6 round game (3 day-night cycles) so you definitely took way too long. All the rules to the game are very front-loaded, so you probably should have tried to learn the rules before you introduced it to anyone. That said, I don't think I would want to play Mage Knight with all 4 players, it just takes too long. Stick with 2 and you'll have a better time. If you really want to play with all 4, choose one of the shorter length or competitive scenarios.
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Jul 3, 2012 17:16
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Day-night cycles? Wow, I was really into Mage Knight ten years ago and I don't remember anything about that. Is the new game that different?
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Jul 3, 2012 17:23
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Pope Guilty posted:Day-night cycles? Wow, I was really into Mage Knight ten years ago and I don't remember anything about that. Is the new game that different? The new Mage Knight has nothing to do with the old miniatures game outside of the name, but the groaning of old fans as they sit down to Vlaada's heaviest game yet makes it all worthwhile. The MK board game is pretty much a slightly lighter but more competitive Magic Realm with a deck building engine.
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Jul 3, 2012 17:28
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Pope Guilty posted:Day-night cycles? Wow, I was really into Mage Knight ten years ago and I don't remember anything about that. Is the new game that different? The Vlaada board game, not the collectible clicky miniatures thing. I've never played that and have no idea what it's about. This new one kind of felt like Arkham Horror.
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Jul 3, 2012 17:33
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General Battuta posted:This new one kind of felt like Arkham Horror.  VVV: Stop digging. Space Alert is overhyped. but still a good game Pierzak fucked around with this message at 17:50 on Jul 3, 2012 |
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Jul 3, 2012 17:47
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Hey I love Space Alert don't lynch me 
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Jul 3, 2012 17:48
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General Battuta posted:Vlaada fans, hear my plea. I played Mage Knight for the first time last night - none of us had ever touched it before, and they assigned me to figure out the rules and teach everybody. We did the tutorial scenario. It was a grueling, joyless, cruelly random experience. We only made it through one day-night cycle (about three or four hours of play?) before I dropped out. The biggest issue seemed to be waiting for other people to take their drat turns - it seems like a game that could be fun with rapid-fire Dominion-style turns, but in practice there was a lot of hemming and hawing and 'oh, crap, I don't have enough movement points go get there'. I just got a copy last week and can't imagine trying to learn it with other people at the table. I was pretty stoked to receive this, so I read and re-read both rulebooks after watching some playthroughs online and then finally tried the walkthrough. I made some mistakes, but on my first solo conquest I got nearly everything right. I'll be playing my first multi-player tomorrow and only now feel like I know it well enough to show others. It seems like one player needs to understand the game enough to be a sort of "DM" to help along. I would assume that training players this way allow you to slowly explain the rules during the walkthrough scenario and not overburden everyone with particulars until they need to know them. I'll post back after the holiday my findings if people are interested, but I'm also curious on others experiences with teaching more players. Also, are many goons playing the solo scenario? What settings do you have your cities at? I beat the scenario the first time and may up the difficulty next time. (Also, holy crap what a great solo variant this game has).
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Jul 3, 2012 17:57
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I played the tutorial and a solo game by myself before teaching anyone. I taught my fiancé and brother and they got it really fast. My brother was going fast but fiancé was taking forever. If you are playing with people you know are slow, either play two player with them and accept that it will take them forever or find other people to play with. I think my fiancé taking so long put my brother off boardgames forever. He seemed pretty into it at first but after waiting so long for her turns he was pretty burned out. It's a "gamer's game" and no matter how much that may appeal to you, don't try to force casual players into it. My fiancé says she likes the game, but until she learns to play faster I would never subject anyone to a 3 player game with her.
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Jul 3, 2012 18:53
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General Battuta posted:Vlaada fans, hear my plea. I played Mage Knight for the first time last night - none of us had ever touched it before, and they assigned me to figure out the rules and teach everybody. We did the tutorial scenario. It was a grueling, joyless, cruelly random experience. We only made it through one day-night cycle (about three or four hours of play?) before I dropped out. The biggest issue seemed to be waiting for other people to take their drat turns - it seems like a game that could be fun with rapid-fire Dominion-style turns, but in practice there was a lot of hemming and hawing and 'oh, crap, I don't have enough movement points go get there'. Mage Knight is awesome, albeit complex. But don't give up on it. I can't imagine trying to learn this game with 4-players and no prep time. Sounds like you setup a nightmare scenario to try this game out. Play a couple of 2-player tutorial games to get the basics down. You can each help each other maximize your turns just to figure things out.
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Jul 3, 2012 18:59
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Apparently Risk is a completely reviled game, but I picked up the 2008 revised edition for nostalgia. The added objectives make the entire game a lot more strategic and small skirmishes happen a lot more, rather than one person just sitting in a continent forever. I guess its biggest downfall is that it still uses the exact same Risk dice combat system. Still, it's a light "wargame" I can pull out that is probably one of the gateways to more serious games.
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Jul 3, 2012 22:55
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Played my first game of Dominion today! I can't get over how elegantly the game is designed, it's incredible.
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Jul 3, 2012 23:22
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Friend are en route to play awesome board games as we speak. I am thinking I will introduce them to Space Alert because I haven't played in like 6 months. One more question - I was told late last thread that Switzerland is the best 2 player board for Ticket to Ride. What boards are also "good"? I only own the US board and playing it over and over again gets old. Obviously, I was told to get the 1910 expansion and plan on doing that.... anything else? How's the Marklin board or the China board set? I probably need good 2, 3, and 4 player boards. The U.S. board seems fine for 3 players and even 4, but starts to feel a bit cramped.
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Jul 3, 2012 23:32
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Myrmidongs posted:Apparently Risk is a completely reviled game, but I picked up the 2008 revised edition for nostalgia. The added objectives make the entire game a lot more strategic and small skirmishes happen a lot more, rather than one person just sitting in a continent forever. I guess its biggest downfall is that it still uses the exact same Risk dice combat system. Still, it's a light "wargame" I can pull out that is probably one of the gateways to more serious games. If you're pulling it out with the same group of people, you might be interested in Risk Legacy. It completely challenges your assumptions about what a board game is but avoids going to far out by, at the end of the day, still being Risk.
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Jul 3, 2012 23:34
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General Battuta posted:Vlaada fans, hear my plea. I played Mage Knight for the first time last night - none of us had ever touched it before, and they assigned me to figure out the rules and teach everybody. We did the tutorial scenario. It was a grueling, joyless, cruelly random experience. We only made it through one day-night cycle (about three or four hours of play?) before I dropped out. The biggest issue seemed to be waiting for other people to take their drat turns - it seems like a game that could be fun with rapid-fire Dominion-style turns, but in practice there was a lot of hemming and hawing and 'oh, crap, I don't have enough movement points go get there'. Mage Knight is heavy as gently caress. It is long and deep, and the rules aren't complex but they are numerous. Try learning the game offhand through a solo game, or only with other really heavy players around. It is a beautiful game, but it is definitely not for everybody.
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Jul 3, 2012 23:51
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quote:Risk... reviled... dice combat system. I'm just one person - but I'll clarify why I hate Risk: Risk is a fairly naked political game. There's bits and dice and cards and what not, but most games come down to who gets attacked least - and this comes down to politics. The important tactics have nothing to do with the game board, and everything to do with "flying under the radar", "choosing when to honor an alliance" and "how much of an alliance can I have without pissing off the other players". The political game works. You can be good at it. But you can also get bored of it - and not just Risk but all very political games. The important tactics in Risk are the same as the important tactics in Smallworld, Scrumbrawl, Settlers, or 100 others. I've met my lifetime quota for all of them. I'm tired of purposefully staying in second place so as not to aggro other players. I'm tired of some guy going overboard on revenge to try to discourage attackers in the next game. I'm tired of nobody trading with Bob because he's in the lead (meaning everyone else rubber-band catches up). I'm tired of all the ploys and tactics that "good" political players pride themselves in. Again - I'm not saying all these things aren't valid things to be interested in, or that you can't be good at them. And I'm definitely not against games that rely on human interaction (I love, say, The Resistance). I'm only saying I'm tired of political games. The problems I, and many people, have with Risk have nothing to do with the combat system or randomness or cards or realism or player elimination or length (well, OK, some of those are bad too.. but they're not the core complaint) and everything to do with the core interactions between players. In a multi-agent game, when one person can choose another single person to dramatically harm or benefit, you pretty much end up with the same game every time. And usually I want to play something else.
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Jul 4, 2012 00:37
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Just finished another game of TI3(+ both expansions) and man, this was probably the best one so far. Clockwise table order was Alborac(me)-Winnu-Ha'can-Yssaril-Letnev. We had lots of empty space between some while the others had a lot of useless planets and/or natural hinders. I was backstabbed early on by the Winnu but stayed alive before managing to turn the tide and in the end forcing the battle to his turf. On the other side of the map Ha'can and Yssaril were pushed into war(by, well, Ha'can's impatience) but the Yssaril had a number of strategic cards that made him overwhelmingly win the first real battle.(also, we got the law early on that banned people from retreating from battle, we also had the law that made everyone share the trade goods during Trade which somewhat neutered the otherwise rather OP Ha'can) Game was finished when my Letnev ally temporarily exposed his flagship by backstabbing the Yssaril player. I managed to scramble a fleet and brought it down through sheer firepower(lost two dreadnaughts in the process, gently caress that goddamn flagship so badly) and he thought I overcelebrated the victory since he could just produce another one without any real backlash until I played the strategy card that gave me 1 VP whenever I destroyed a warsun or flagship. I also out-teched everyone despite never once picking the technology card. All in all, quite a great game. I also spent the entire game doing small things like Local Unrest and Sabotage just to gently caress with Ha'can because he blocked my trade proposal with the Yssaril tribes back in turn 1.
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Jul 4, 2012 00:39
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jmzero posted:In a multi-agent game, when one person can choose another single person to dramatically harm or benefit, you pretty much end up with the same game every time. Kinda like how all euro efficiency engine games blur together.
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Jul 4, 2012 00:40
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Sherrard posted:Kinda like how all euro efficiency engine games blur together. Let's not say things we can't take back, now.
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Jul 4, 2012 00:50
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jmzero posted:I'm just one person - but I'll clarify why I hate Risk: Risk is a fairly naked political game. I've been trying to explain to people why I don't like Settlers of Catan despite its success and popularity -- this is why. You put it better than I have before, so I'ma just adapt what you said.
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Jul 4, 2012 01:26
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I got a trade offer on BGG for my copy (sealed) of Necromancer Island for Small World. He wants to offer me Betrayal at House on the Hill. (which he claims is a non-molded/warped copy, as had initially been shipped) Assuming everything is as described, any thoughts on this? I haven't and probably won't play Necromancer Island, because Small World sort of lost its luster, but I can't say that Betrayal is wholly met with praise around here. Thanks for any advice.
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Jul 4, 2012 02:18
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After playing it a few more times, it is a very fun game unless you play with rule Sperglords. Winning in it is more luck than anything, but the theme and situations players get themselves into IS the game.
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Jul 4, 2012 03:19
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jmzero posted:In a multi-agent game, when one person can choose another single person to dramatically harm or benefit, you pretty much end up with the same game every time. And usually I want to play something else. To be fair, this is more of an issue with mechanics than you're implying. The problem with games like Risk is that they don't offer anything interesting for the political game. Stalemating or seriously resisting an opponent that's on equal or slightly stronger footing is impossible so you're completely at the mercy of players that want to screw you for whatever reason. Way too much can happen on one turn too (especially with good rolls), which makes it a game about not being attacked ever.
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Jul 4, 2012 03:23
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General Battuta posted:Vlaada fans, hear my plea. I played Mage Knight for the first time last night - none of us had ever touched it before, and they assigned me to figure out the rules and teach everybody. We did the tutorial scenario. It was a grueling, joyless, cruelly random experience. We only made it through one day-night cycle (about three or four hours of play?) before I dropped out. The biggest issue seemed to be waiting for other people to take their drat turns - it seems like a game that could be fun with rapid-fire Dominion-style turns, but in practice there was a lot of hemming and hawing and 'oh, crap, I don't have enough movement points go get there'. You had a brief glimpse of hell.
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Jul 4, 2012 03:41
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Trane posted:It seems like one player needs to understand the game enough to be a sort of "DM" to help along. I would assume that training players this way allow you to slowly explain the rules during the walkthrough scenario and not overburden everyone with particulars until they need to know them. There are a few more barriers to learning Mage Knight than the rules. How to teach the rules is easy, the introductory scenario runs through each location, one at a time, so that players can digest the information. Teach with small groups, short games, blah blah blah. That's all in the manual, but it's not enough. It will still be a frustrating experience. A few things I have done that have helped long term are to better expose players to the cards, the combo building, and how to best use a hand. For the first few things, shuffle out three advanced actions to each player at the beginning of each round. Have each player pick one of those cards and shove it in their deck. At the beginning of each night cycle, give them a spell too. This exposes new players to more cards, which will ultimately show them what options to expect when building a character. It focuses players on building combos and watching the balance of their deck. When these extra cards are gone, players will not only have a good idea of what a late game deck should look like, they'll be extra thoughtful of how to pick each ability. To better teach how to use a hand, use all of the mana dice to fill the source instead of number of players +2. Reroll any black nice during day or suns at night. The first few games will move much faster if the players are less constrained, and players will have more fun. Once newbies are used to how to manage their hands in a good situation, then cull the dice down and let them scrape by. This will lead to a grossly unbalanced game, but it's fun as hell to watch characters skyrocket to power so quickly. If you're having fun, the newbies will too.
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Jul 4, 2012 03:45
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The Lord of Hats posted:Played my first game of Dominion today! I can't get over how elegantly the game is designed, it's incredible. I feel like I should give this a try again. The only time I played it was the year it came out at a local game convention, and spent the entire game with some not so nice people making fun of my moves. I haven't played it since.
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Jul 4, 2012 04:58
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Paradoxish posted:To be fair, this is more of an issue with mechanics than you're implying. The problem with games like Risk is that they don't offer anything interesting for the political game. Stalemating or seriously resisting an opponent that's on equal or slightly stronger footing is impossible so you're completely at the mercy of players that want to screw you for whatever reason. Way too much can happen on one turn too (especially with good rolls), which makes it a game about not being attacked ever. 
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Jul 4, 2012 05:41
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My friends birthday is coming up and he's a huge fan of power grid. Which of the expansions is the best?
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Jul 4, 2012 06:13
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Cactrot posted:My friends birthday is coming up and he's a huge fan of power grid. Which of the expansions is the best? The Robots is the best expansion if you ever play with less than 5 players. It even makes 2 player Power Grid fun. This expansion changes the game more than any of the maps, and it only costs about $7. As far as the maps go, the China/Korea set changes the game the most. Italy and France is good if you want a more normal map with a much tougher building phase. Power Grid isn't really like Age of Steam in that the maps will completely change how the game works, but it's good to have some variety.
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Jul 4, 2012 07:32
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Nice new thread. I just picked up Race for the Galaxy and am having a blast with it - I've only played it two player with my girlfriend, but it's still fun. I haven't tried the fancy 2-player advanced game yet, though. How's the solitaire mode introduced in the expansion? Is there any way to increase the player interaction (although I'm a bit wary of this since the base game seems to be designed without much interaction in mind)? The other thing I've been playing a lot of recently is Nightfall.....on my phone. It's my first deck-building game, and I think all of the direct conflict has probably spoiled me for Dominion. I've only played probably ten games so I'm not super familiar with all the cards or anything but it seems like there's some minor balance issues that make me glad I didn't shell out $50 for a hardcopy. I still have Space Alert and I still have nobody to play Space Alert with. It just sits on my shelf....taunting me...
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Jul 4, 2012 15:16
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For some reason I don't really understand I found myself quite hyped for the newly-released MMP's Kingdom of Heaven. Did perhaps any of you upstanding wargaming übermenschen had his hand on this game? I'd be very interested in some early opinions.
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Jul 4, 2012 16:04
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Ryoshi posted:Nice new thread. I just picked up Race for the Galaxy and am having a blast with it - I've only played it two player with my girlfriend, but it's still fun. I haven't tried the fancy 2-player advanced game yet, though. How's the solitaire mode introduced in the expansion? Is there any way to increase the player interaction (although I'm a bit wary of this since the base game seems to be designed without much interaction in mind)? The "advanced" 2 player version (really all that changes is you get to pick two actions) is a lot of fun, we don't play 2 player without it any more. The second expansion brings in more player interaction, and some would say the first expansion also does this in the form of objectives that earn VP, creating more direct competition.
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Jul 4, 2012 16:14
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Ryoshi posted:Nice new thread. I just picked up Race for the Galaxy and am having a blast with it - I've only played it two player with my girlfriend, but it's still fun. I haven't tried the fancy 2-player advanced game yet, though. How's the solitaire mode introduced in the expansion? Is there any way to increase the player interaction (although I'm a bit wary of this since the base game seems to be designed without much interaction in mind)? The 2 player advanced game isn't too advanced. Definitely use it for two player. The solitaire stuff is impressive in its elegance (and complexity), but there's a Windows version available that is just fine. As far as player interaction, the 2nd expansion (very good) adds a degree of that. Get the expansions in order. (The first expansion is probably the most essential, though. It adds little goals, and it's fantastic)
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Jul 4, 2012 16:31
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Re: the goal cards in Race for the Galaxy's expansions. I don't like 'em. They give me a sense of making the game even more luck-dependent. Rather than getting a hand of cards and determining the best strategy for how to win, you have to determine the best strategy to get those goals and then win, which for a given hand might happen to be straightforward and easy, and for another might gently caress you completely. I like the additional cards and mechanics in the expansion, but whenever I play, I always suggest leaving the goals in the box.
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Jul 4, 2012 16:45
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Gilgamesh posted:I feel like I should give this a try again. The only time I played it was the year it came out at a local game convention, and spent the entire game with some not so nice people making fun of my moves. I haven't played it since. I dunno, everyone I'll be playing with for a fairly long time is also going to be new to the game, so that probably affects things.
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Jul 4, 2012 17:00
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Ryoshi posted:Nice new thread. I just picked up Race for the Galaxy and am having a blast with it - I've only played it two player with my girlfriend, but it's still fun. I haven't tried the fancy 2-player advanced game yet, though. How's the solitaire mode introduced in the expansion? The solitaire mode in the first expansion is really great. I love playing it, and it has many styles of play that you randomly select before each game. It's really tough. I don't care much for the Windows version, mostly because I play board games because they are physically there and I'm not stuck in front a computer like any other video game.
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Jul 4, 2012 17:57
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Back in February, Treefrog Games announced that A Few Acres of Snow: 2nd Edition would be out in May/June. Has there been any information since then? I'm getting impatient here!
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Jul 4, 2012 18:01
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Lord_Pigeonbane posted:Back in February, Treefrog Games announced that A Few Acres of Snow: 2nd Edition would be out in May/June. Has there been any information since then? I'm getting impatient here! Cool Stuff Inc got it in on Monday (I don't know if it was the 2nd edition exactly, but it was definitely a restock). It is currently sold out.
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Jul 4, 2012 18:10
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Stepped out today, picked up Innovation because it was cheap, and Dominant Species because it's on it's third printing and I am doubting a 4th will be anytime soon. Just due to GMTs business model (Everybody who wants one probably already has one. Why print more?) I almost picked up Virgin Queen, but gently caress it. I kinda like CDGs but I dislike the thick rulebooks full of exceptions to the already heavy rules.
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Jul 4, 2012 18:22
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