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Mr.48
May 1, 2007

TerminalBlue posted:

Just finished the first book after picking it up completely on a whim. Loved the poo poo out of it and it's probably the first fantasy novel I've read and really enjoyed in years now. Can't wait to move onto the second and eventually third. Seems like these days most series seem to start well and then just disappoint the poo poo out of me, so I'm hoping that for once this won't be the case.

A lot of people didnt like the second book, but I think its only because the author tried to do something different, whereas many readers expected it to be more like the first in terms of structure. I honestly still liked it a lot.

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Benson Cunningham
Dec 9, 2006

Chief of J.U.N.K.E.R. H.Q.

Mr.48 posted:

A lot of people didnt like the second book, but I think its only because the author tried to do something different, whereas many readers expected it to be more like the first in terms of structure. I honestly still liked it a lot.

I liked it, just not as much. Though upon a reread, there are a few pacing problems in the first book.

PateraOctopus
Oct 27, 2010

It's not enough to listen, it's not enough to see
When the hurricane is coming on, it's not enough to flee

Benson Cunningham posted:

I liked it, just not as much. Though upon a reread, there are a few pacing problems in the first book.

A few? That book easily could've had 250-300 pages cut from it without sacrificing any forward momentum. Like the scene in which, having just heard in dialogue how two characters broke into a mansion, subdued the guard and laid in wait for the master of the house, we see how those two characters broke into the mansion, subdued the guard and laid in wait for the master of the house (surprise:it happened exactly the way they said it did fifteen pages earlier). Or the constant putting the brakes on full-stop to explain about a bit of architecture, or current fashion in the city, or political realities whose effects have already been made abundantly clear without being fully explicated. And then there's the 50+ page interlude about Locke acquiring a particular suit of clothes, which introduces several new characters and a brand new, fully-realized con, all of which culminates in Locke getting the suit he needed with no complications and never seeing any of those new characters again, except for one who appears for approximately fifteen seconds to deliver a "Hey, those clothes sure look familiar!" joke and then disappear again. The only purpose that entire extended set-piece serves is to further establish that Locke thinks quickly in tight circumstances and can wrap powerful people around his finger, which has already been well-established--it could easily be replaced with any number of simpler ways for Locke to get fancy clothes and change the rest of the book in nothing but incredibly minor ways.

I do really enjoy the books, but rereading the first one five years later it's really clear that it's a first novel (albeit one by somebody who can write a really fun story).

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound
There's a third excerpt from Republic of Thieves available on Camorr.com (a fan forum) -- actually two separate versions of what looks like the first chapter set in the present. The first is like four years old and the second is from 2010. Lynch has apparently asked they not be posted/hosted outside Camorr.com but I can't imagine that linking to the Camorr.com threads would be objectionable.

http://camorr.com/content/new-republic-thieves-excerpt
http://www.camorr.com/content/exclusive-trot-excerpt

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

PateraOctopus posted:

A few? That book easily could've had 250-300 pages cut from it without sacrificing any forward momentum. Like the scene in which, having just heard in dialogue how two characters broke into a mansion, subdued the guard and laid in wait for the master of the house, we see how those two characters broke into the mansion, subdued the guard and laid in wait for the master of the house (surprise:it happened exactly the way they said it did fifteen pages earlier). Or the constant putting the brakes on full-stop to explain about a bit of architecture, or current fashion in the city, or political realities whose effects have already been made abundantly clear without being fully explicated. And then there's the 50+ page interlude about Locke acquiring a particular suit of clothes, which introduces several new characters and a brand new, fully-realized con, all of which culminates in Locke getting the suit he needed with no complications and never seeing any of those new characters again, except for one who appears for approximately fifteen seconds to deliver a "Hey, those clothes sure look familiar!" joke and then disappear again. The only purpose that entire extended set-piece serves is to further establish that Locke thinks quickly in tight circumstances and can wrap powerful people around his finger, which has already been well-established--it could easily be replaced with any number of simpler ways for Locke to get fancy clothes and change the rest of the book in nothing but incredibly minor ways.

I do really enjoy the books, but rereading the first one five years later it's really clear that it's a first novel (albeit one by somebody who can write a really fun story).

Perhaps, then, you should avoid that prequel about how they acquired that bottle of superexpensive brandy that they used in that con to make the Salvaras believe that said brandy was even more expensive than it actually was.

I forget the name, but it does exist.

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound

uh zip zoom posted:

Perhaps, then, you should avoid that prequel about how they acquired that bottle of superexpensive brandy that they used in that con to make the Salvaras believe that said brandy was even more expensive than it actually was.

I forget the name, but it does exist.

Nah, prequels aren't happening.

quote:


My immediate project is to refinish a novella (another long overdue project) called The Mad Baron’s Mechanical Attic, which will be published by Subterranean Press.

Although TMBMA and its companion, The Choir of Knives, were conceived as prequels to The Lies of Locke Lamora, I have decided after lengthy reflection that I’m not willing to contribute another inessential prequel to our society’s towering heap of the drat things. Although I think TMBMA is a fun story with a great cast and setting, it ultimately revealed nothing surprising about Locke and Jean’s history and it stretched the boundaries of what I consider acceptable retconning. I have come to believe that prequels should cast some accepted facts of their universes in a new light, and I just didn’t have anything up my sleeve in that department.

What I am deeply interested in, however, is the further adventures of Locke Lamora and Jean Tannen now that I’ve recovered something of my ability to push them forward. Thus, I am retooling these novellas as a bridge story between the events of The Republic of Thieves and The Thorn of Emberlain, one that is entirely optional but hopefully enriching.

After that, I will resume work on The Thorn of Emberlain, already in progress.

http://scottlynch.us/blog/2013/03/18/the-republic-of-thieves/

Dienes
Nov 4, 2009

dee
doot doot dee
doot doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot


College Slice

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

Nah, prequels aren't happening.


I'm assuming the Choir of Knives prequel is a different name for The Bastards and the Knives?

What a shame, I was really looking forward to the old gang doing their thing again.

Then again, I never thought we'd see Republic of Thieves, so I'll take what I can get.

TerminalBlue
Aug 13, 2005

I LIVE
I DIE
I LIVE AGAIN


WITNESS ME!!

PateraOctopus posted:

:words: about :words:

I do really enjoy the books, but rereading the first one five years later it's really clear that it's a first novel (albeit one by somebody who can write a really fun story).

Despite loving the hell out of it, now that some of the 'just finished it' glow has worn off I find myself agreeing with everything you just said here.

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

I'm pirating the new book because my poor sick mother needs an operation, and I can't afford the price of both.

Dienes
Nov 4, 2009

dee
doot doot dee
doot doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot


College Slice

uh zip zoom posted:

I'm pirating the new book because my poor sick mother needs an operation, and I can't afford the price of both.

LIAR!

The Supreme Court
Feb 25, 2010

Pirate World: Nearly done!
I'm forced to steal zip zoom's only copy because he deserves it

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

The Supreme Court posted:

I'm forced to steal zip zoom's only copy because he deserves it

LIAR!

Phummus
Aug 4, 2006

If I get ten spare bucks, it's going for a 30-pack of Schlitz.
I'm pirating the book because the daft of my coffer is jerry-cocked all to the futtocks you picaroons.

coyo7e
Aug 23, 2007

by zen death robot
Bastard.

Ingram
Oct 18, 2006

"Do you know how rare it is to find a girl who genuinely honest-to-god absolutely loves it up the arse?"
Heads up for kindle owners. The first book is currently .99 cents.

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound

Ingram posted:

Heads up for kindle owners. The first book is currently .99 cents.

At that price, it's a steal!

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

Say what you want about Red Seas, The scene with the jeremite redeemers is positively amazing.

"The gods have sent your doom, motherfuckers!"

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound

uh zip zoom posted:

Say what you want about Red Seas, The scene with the jeremite redeemers is positively amazing.

"The gods have sent your doom, motherfuckers!"

Lynch has the amazingly rare ability to write good profanity. Profanity in fantasy almost always comes across as the author trying too hard. In Lynch it works, which is really impressive.

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

Lynch has the amazingly rare ability to write good profanity. Profanity in fantasy almost always comes across as the author trying too hard. In Lynch it works, which is really impressive.

It's like a fantasy version of deadwood

Edit: anyone else take into naming their penis The Sinspire, yet? For me, it's either that or The Dowager Countess.

uh zip zoom fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Sep 21, 2013

Vincie
Oct 31, 2012
I finished Republic of Thieves a few days ago. It wasn't very good. Worse than Red Seas Under Red Skies by quite a bit.

MartingaleJack
Aug 26, 2004

I'll split you open and I don't even like coconuts.
This is...disappointing. I hope it's not general consensus. I had high hopes for Lynch's career, but two lackluster books in a row can kill a fanbase.

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!




Morbid Hound
Most of the advance reviews seem to be congregating around "four stars" -- not as amazing as Lies but still quite solid.

Carth Dookie
Jan 28, 2013

Well the preview chapters I read way back when certainly give me hope that it will be ok, despite Lynch's personal problems. I'll keep my fingers crossed.

Vincie posted:

I finished Republic of Thieves a few days ago. It wasn't very good. Worse than Red Seas Under Red Skies by quite a bit.

I have no idea how you did this, as I've not been able to find any source for it (I have found many thousands of trojans, spam sites, offers to enlarge my penis and crimes against sanity though). I'll be buying it anyway, but I'd rather read it sooner rather than later.

Care to reveal your source?

Carth Dookie fucked around with this message at 12:33 on Sep 26, 2013

Carth Dookie
Jan 28, 2013

I am a dumbass who doubleposted.

Sorry.

ed balls balls man
Apr 17, 2006

darth cookie posted:

I am a dumbass who doubleposted.

Sorry.

Probably a review copy.

Carth Dookie
Jan 28, 2013

You are probably right, but I hope not.

I've waited 6 years, what's another couple of weeks? :sigh:

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

Vincie posted:

I finished Republic of Thieves a few days ago. It wasn't very good. Worse than Red Seas Under Red Skies by quite a bit.

That's pretty interesting. Can you tell us more? I've heard that it's more of a romance than anything else, and I'm okay with that if that is the case.

Vincie
Oct 31, 2012

uh zip zoom posted:

That's pretty interesting. Can you tell us more? I've heard that it's more of a romance than anything else, and I'm okay with that if that is the case.

Sure. I'll save specifics (unless asked to otherwise) until after the book comes out. I'm curious as to how other people will receive it, since I'm perhaps more critical than many when I read.

(I took a conservative stance and put spoiler tags on bits that are not specific but which might reveal too much regardless.)

I just looked up the blurb and it only describes half of the book. The narrative is split between two stories: the bondsmagi electioneering plot in Karthain (as described in the blurb), and then flashbacks that center on Sabetha's interactions with Locke as children that then segue into another plot that features all five of the Father Chains gang as teenagers. Chapters alternate between these two storylines.

I didn't care much for the flashback story. I suppose a lot of people will like it just to see the gang together again, but I grew increasingly bored and impatient with it, particularly in the latter half of the book. I can't get too much into my disappointment without resorting to spoilers, but when you have a dual narrative like this, especially with the alternating chapters, both stories need to be equally strong and play off each other in such a way that they continually increase tension and momentum. Unfortunately the flashback story is a total drag and I started skimming those parts toward the end.

Also, Karthain doesn't have much going for it as a setting. It's not memorable in the way that Camorr or parts of Tal Verrar were. Huge let down for me because that's one of the best things about both preceding novels.

Jean doesn't have much to do in this book.

The bondsmagi as a group aren't really an active part of the story. We only really get to see and experience them through the perspective and actions of one character.

And then there's Sabetha. The book focuses a lot on Locke's relationship with her, but it's all kind of a mess and at the end we're left with more questions and uncertainties, not just about them as a couple, but about Locke himself. I'm most curious as to how people will handle the revelations about Locke.

I have so much more to talk about! I hope a lot of people are willing to discuss the book once they're finished.

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

Okay, see you when you say bad I've got a whole different picture in my mind. I've read some pretty foul poo poo in this genre Mercedes Lackey

Edit: hell, right now I'm reading Emperor of Thorns by Mark Lawrence and that's probably the third or fourth most :emo: thing I've put my eyeballs to this decade. Hopefully that will make Republic of Thieves better by comparison.

uh zip zoom fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Sep 27, 2013

spootime
Oct 31, 2010

uh zip zoom posted:

Okay, see you when you say bad I've got a whole different picture in my mind. I've read some pretty foul poo poo in this genre Mercedes Lackey

Edit: hell, right now I'm reading Emperor of Thorns by Mark Lawrence and that's probably the third or fourth most :emo: thing I've put my eyeballs to this decade. Hopefully that will make Republic of Thieves better by comparison.

Oh Jesus, have you read the end yet?? I don't mean to derail the thread but holy gently caress that book was the worst poo poo I've read since the Warded Man series.

King of Foolians
Mar 16, 2006
Long live the King!
Thanks to the recommendation of this forum, I've finally got around to reading Lies and I've just finished Red Seas, and I loved them both. I agree with pretty much everyone that Lies was a stronger, tighter book. I still really liked Red Seas, but it did feel like Scott Lynch had 2 really cool ideas and mushed them together, instead of focusing 1 book on a casino heist and 1 book on pirate adventures on the high seas.

I really love the setting he's created, Lynch has definite talent in world-building.

One thing that has struck me is how predictable his books have seemed to me, only for him to pull a twist that blows my assumptions out of the water.

For example I was certain that the Gray King was Locke's father. In the book, Locke has his first meeting with the Gray King and notices something familiar about his face, and then in the very next flashback he admits to Jean that he doesn't know where/who his father is and may not be an orphan. I rolled my eyes because it seemed obvious and was surprised by the real twist.

I also thought that since the sequel was about adventures on the high seas the Gray King would escape by the end of Lies and that Red Seas would be about Locke and Jean chasing him down for revenge.

One thing that was spoiled for me was the deaths of Calo, Galdo and Bug. An advertisement in the back of my copy of Lies said "Read the continuing adventures of Locke and Jean in 'Red Seas'", so pretty early on I realized that all the Gentlemen Bastards wouldn't make it to the end of the book. You would think the publishers (or whoever puts those adverts at the end) would be smarter than to spoil the plot, when they so easily could have said 'the further adventures of the Gentlemen Bastards'.
I didn't see Ezri's death coming though. I was hoping that book 3 would be Locke, Jean, and adding a kickass pirate chick to round out the group. I liked Jean having his moment of romance and didn't want it to end, especially since there seems to be so much Gods-drat drama surrounding Locke's lovelife.


But overall I am very happy to find another good on-going fantasy series to force on my friends and family. I'm looking forward to getting my hands on Republic of Thieves!

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs

spootime posted:

Oh Jesus, have you read the end yet?? I don't mean to derail the thread but holy gently caress that book was the worst poo poo I've read since the Warded Man series.

Are you just saying that because I made that I'll advised Warded Man thread. (If so, I deserve it.)

But to get this thread somewhat back on track, has anyone noticed that many major fantasy series tend to have very weak middles? Crossroads of twilight, A feast for crows, I'm sure there are others and it's really unsurprising. The middle of any series is where the author has to juggle the most amount of plot arcs, while still advancing them at a decent pace and still keeping the readers interested. I would imagine the middle of a fantasy series is probably one of the hardest things to write. Unless, of course, your last name is Sanderson.

Edit: sweet jumping gently caress emperor of Thorns is terrible…

uh zip zoom fucked around with this message at 19:34 on Sep 29, 2013

MartingaleJack
Aug 26, 2004

I'll split you open and I don't even like coconuts.
Latest review is up on Fantasy-faction.com, and it isn't exactly stellar. Which is worrying, given that FF have historically leaned towards giving uber positive reviews even to books I dislike.

LASER BEAM DREAM
Nov 3, 2005

Oh, what? So now I suppose you're just going to sit there and pout?

BananaNutkins posted:

Latest review is up on Fantasy-faction.com, and it isn't exactly stellar. Which is worrying, given that FF have historically leaned towards giving uber positive reviews even to books I dislike.

Did you and I read the same review? 8/10 and the guy seemed to love it.

http://fantasy-faction.com/2013/the-republic-of-thieves-by-scott-lynch

MartingaleJack
Aug 26, 2004

I'll split you open and I don't even like coconuts.

LASER BEAM DREAM posted:

Did you and I read the same review? 8/10 and the guy seemed to love it.

http://fantasy-faction.com/2013/the-republic-of-thieves-by-scott-lynch

Same review.

Fantasy-Faction is not going to publish critical articles on any popular authors because they want to be sent ARCs and do interviews. Go and read some of their past articles. If they do have criticisms to make, they are always very muted and roundabout.

I'm guessing it's going to be a decent book, but not a great one. I thought the same thing after reading their review of Red Country, which I feel was also a bit of a disappointment.

Benson Cunningham
Dec 9, 2006

Chief of J.U.N.K.E.R. H.Q.

BananaNutkins posted:

Same review.

Fantasy-Faction is not going to publish critical articles on any popular authors because they want to be sent ARCs and do interviews. Go and read some of their past articles. If they do have criticisms to make, they are always very muted and roundabout.

I'm guessing it's going to be a decent book, but not a great one. I thought the same thing after reading their review of Red Country, which I feel was also a bit of a disappointment.

See, now I am less worried, because that book was awesome.

Vincie
Oct 31, 2012
You can read the first fifty pages here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/171465290/THE-REPUBLIC-OF-THIEVES-by-Scott-Lynch-50-Page-Fridays

Ghetto Prince
Sep 11, 2010

got to be mellow, y'all
Wow, thanks for that.

MartingaleJack
Aug 26, 2004

I'll split you open and I don't even like coconuts.
Republic of Thieves just got brutalized by Pat's Fantasy Hotlist. The tears...they are flowing.

Fingers crossed that he just has bad taste on this one. he hated it. First hundred pages are good and then it just falls apart

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Mr.48
May 1, 2007
Of course the preview ended on a cliffhanger, and the book wont even be shipped for another 4 days. ffffffffff :argh:

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