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pokecapn
Oct 17, 2003

yeah, galo sengen

LLJKSiLk posted:

Well, the white version of the prodigy has been listed as discontinued and the only place I can find it is via 3rd party sellers. The black version is out of stock everywhere. The other two (red/orange), red would work for me but they are making it more expensive (Like $20 extra) than what they were selling the black for.

As far as mITX motherboards, there are like two that are worth a poo poo for gaming/overclocking purposes. I'd just hate to lock into a case, and then have the form factor boards in the future only support HTPC uses and not be suitable for upgrading for gaming later on. That's just a feeling, and not based on any announcements I've seen.

Newegg likes to list things as discontinued if they don't know when their next shipment is coming in. miniITX and microATX usage for gaming rigs are both on the rise compared to even a year ago, you could always go microATX if you're concerned about space but don't like the miniITX offerings. If you still wanna go ATX, the Corsair case you picked out is worse at noise/cooling/ease of building than any of Corsair's other models. Only get it if you really dig the looks.

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Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


LLJKSiLk posted:

As far as mITX motherboards, there are like two that are worth a poo poo for gaming/overclocking purposes. I'd just hate to lock into a case, and then have the form factor boards in the future only support HTPC uses and not be suitable for upgrading for gaming later on. That's just a feeling, and not based on any announcements I've seen.

ITX isn't going anywhere. There will always be a more limited board selection, but in reality you don't need hundreds, or even dozens of motherboards to choose from - most of the time there is 1 or 2 "best" choices that everybody should probably be buying regardless of how many other options are out there. If anything ITX is having a resurgence in popularity now that it's possible to build a gaming system in that form factor (primarily due to the power/heat reduction in video cards/cpus).

Also, ITX isn't and won't be relegated to HTPC duties. There's nothing inherent about the size that makes it unsuited for gaming, and in general there's no distinction between what makes a gaming vs HTPC mobo anymore anyhow. There's nothing that makes an H77 board "bad" for gaming - the only thing it lacks is the ability to overclock, which isn't needed for gaming.

The one thing you will see with mITX is that overclocking-capable board will cost significantly more, because of the production costs associated with robust power delivery on such a small size board.

John Lightning
Mar 10, 2012


LLJKSiLk posted:

Well, the white version of the prodigy has been listed as discontinued and the only place I can find it is via 3rd party sellers. The black version is out of stock everywhere. The other two (red/orange), red would work for me but they are making it more expensive (Like $20 extra) than what they were selling the black for.

Micro Center has the black one for $74.99! http://www.microcenter.com/search/s....x=0&submit.y=0
I might buy it for myself as I'm looking into building a new computer.

Michael Scott
Jan 3, 2010


^ I would definitely recommend Micro Center, a good stand-up store (way better than Best Buy or Fry's)

Thanks for this thread update, a lot of great information and recommendations. I'm going to need it.

Turnus
Jul 16, 2011


I am helping my little brother find a graphics card for his Prebuilt:

-Pentium dual-core CPU E5700@ 3.00GHz 2.0GB RAM
-iNTEL g45/g43 eXPRESS CHIPSET
-Windows 7 64 Bit

- Budget= "Under 100"
- What he is doing: "Mild" gaming (I asked him to be more specific and he said "So I can play Portal 2 and Half life 2 with okay settings" .) as well as editing home movies.

Would a Radeon 7750 be appropriate or just overkill for a PC that's long in the tooth and will probably be replaced in a year or three?. My dated Radeon HD 4850 can run those games just fine, and with fancy texture upgrades in the case of Half Life. Then again, I have 4GB of RAM and a better processor.

Also, would installing a graphics card be too hard for a 14 year old boy? I would do it myself but I live miles away from him and our parents, who are literal technophobes.

Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


Turnus posted:

I am helping my little brother find a graphics card for his Prebuilt:

-Pentium dual-core CPU E5700@ 3.00GHz 2.0GB RAM
-iNTEL g45/g43 eXPRESS CHIPSET
-Windows 7 64 Bit

- Budget= "Under 100"
- What he is doing: "Mild" gaming (I asked him to be more specific and he said "So I can play Portal 2 and Half life 2 with okay settings" .) as well as editing home movies.

Would a Radeon 7750 be appropriate or just overkill for a PC that's long in the tooth and will probably be replaced in a year or three?. My dated Radeon HD 4850 can run those games just fine, and with fancy texture upgrades in the case of Half Life. Then again, I have 4GB of RAM and a better processor.

Also, would installing a graphics card be too hard for a 14 year old boy? I would do it myself but I live miles away from him and our parents, who are literal technophobes.

The 7750 is fine - it's slightly better than the 4850. Installing should be dead simple - insert into slot, run driver install package.

Require More Fire
Feb 18, 2010

"Think of the deeds of hellish cruelty, the hidden wickedness which may go on, year in, year out, in such places, and none the wiser."

What are the big differences between the Asrock and MTI mobo recommended in the OP? What would be a reason to pick one over the other?

Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


Require More Fire posted:

What are the big differences between the Asrock and MTI mobo recommended in the OP? What would be a reason to pick one over the other?

In terms of practical differences for the average PC builder? None. I try to keep a couple ATX/mATX boards up at any time so there's at least one in stock and you can see a price range you should be looking for.

BobTheSpy
Feb 12, 2012


Hey just wondering - the link that says "Windows 8 Student Discount" leads me to Microsoft's student page, but when I click "upgrade to Windows 8" it gives me the normal price. How much is the upgrade from Windows 7 to Windows 8 if I'm a student? If it's like, $30 or less I might consider it.

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

I can do sex. It's just alien sex.


Until the end of January, a Windows 8 upgrade license is $40 for everyone if you purchase it via digital download. You can do that at http://www.windows.com.

Digital Casing
Oct 17, 2008


I ordered the performance gamer setup on NewEgg last night. I currently have an Asus monitor but was wondering if I'm going to need to upgrade that part of my setup as well to get the most eye candy out of this new system.

Monitor in question is http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...82E16824236047R

Edit:wrong monitor

Digital Casing fucked around with this message at Jan 3, 2013 around 22:42

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

I can do sex. It's just alien sex.


Well, going to, say, a Dell U2412M would give better viewing angles and color saturation thanks to the IPS panel, and the smaller dot pitch would improve sharpness a small amount. But really, it's hard to get a significant step up in eye candy without moving to A) a 2560x monitor, like a Korean 27" IPS or a larger Dell Ultrasharp, B) moving to a triple-monitor surround setup, C) splitting the difference with a Dell U2913WM, or D) moving to a stereoscopic 3D setup. All of these would require a pretty solid step up in GPU power, too. A 25.5" 1920x1200 TN screen isn't the best of the best, but it's not crap.

siig
Apr 4, 2005

Being nice is the shit ...

Factory Factory posted:

Until the end of January, a Windows 8 upgrade license is $40 for everyone if you purchase it via digital download. You can do that at http://www.windows.com.
Can you perform a clean install with the upgrade installer? I have a new, uninstalled, valid Windows 7 product key sitting around to upgrade from, but I would like to install 8 without having to actually install 7 first.

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

I can do sex. It's just alien sex.


The most likely thing to work involves installing twice anyway: Install Windows 8 without entering the key (which would be rejected anyway), then use the Refresh Your PC tool to reinstall from the same media. Then the key will work. Very similar to the Win 7 double install method.

P-Funk
Jan 7, 2001



T0ne posted:

Would I be able to build my own machine in the $500-$600 price range which is capable of streaming a game such as League of Legends at an average quality, while not feeling the effect of the stream on the actual game play? With my current setup once I enable the the streaming software, xsplit, I have to deal with an in-game lag/delay which really hinders the experience. The main purpose of this new setup would be to stream without this happening. I would also be using it for other games, basic image editing, software developemt/qa and other productivity oriented tasks. In terms of video settings/stream quality I am at the point where I will be happy with what I can get for the budget.
I think you can do this for under $600. Get an i5+H77/Z77 motherboard, 8GB DDR3, reuse your case, maybe reuse your power supply depending on its age, quality, and ATX specification. Try keeping your current Radeon card and if it's not fast enough for you, buy a used one 1-2 generations old.

Through a deal or two and buying a used GPU I built myself an i5 2500K + GTX 480 system with a nice PSU and good aftermarket cooling for $350 so it's possible with much more budget.

Verviticus
Mar 13, 2006


... at least we've got Aaron Rome!

T0ne posted:

Would I be able to build my own machine in the $500-$600 price range which is capable of streaming a game such as League of Legends at an average quality, while not feeling the effect of the stream on the actual game play? With my current setup once I enable the the streaming software, xsplit, I have to deal with an in-game lag/delay which really hinders the experience. The main purpose of this new setup would be to stream without this happening. I would also be using it for other games, basic image editing, software developemt/qa and other productivity oriented tasks. In terms of video settings/stream quality I am at the point where I will be happy with what I can get for the budget.

Make sure your upload is decent (over ~1mb) or you'll probably end up with some serious lag trying to get the stream to look even half decent.

Also, try OBS it's way loving better than xsplit.

And yeah to echo the guy above me, I have a few friends that are streaming on 2nd gen i5s (2500k) with no lag or stutter. I'd probably try to use your current graphics card first - with the computer I just built (i5 3570) my graphics card didn't arrive until yesterday and I was streaming League with a Radeon 4870 with no problems.

spider wisdom
Nov 4, 2011

og data bandit


Needing some help on a HDD installation on Win7.

Recently bought a Seagate Barracuda and I'm wanting to use it as storage alongside my primary Windows HDD. Before physically installing, I checked the BIOS to make sure I'm in AHCI -- I am, so I shut down and installed the SATA cables for data and power. Booted but didn't see the drive in My Computer, but it shows up in Device Manager with the driver provider is listed as Microsoft from 2006.

The Seagate site says to use DiscWizard to add the drive in case Windows doesn't see it, so I dl the program, set the drive up as an MBR partition, everything looks dandy. After a reboot, Windows still doesn't list the drive, but Device Manager sees it fine -- the Volumes tab says it's online, Basic type, MBR, etc and that's where I am now.

What am I missing?

e: Got it! Didn't actually partition the drive the first time around. Had to double-click the drive and access a few options. Now it's seen and I'm moving all the Steams to a new home.

e2: and now BSOD. Great.

spider wisdom fucked around with this message at Jan 4, 2013 around 04:29

Yivgev
May 18, 2004

i brought my +1 ak-47



I'm almost ready to pull the trigger on a ~$1400 gaming build. Since I haven't built a system in almost a decade I figure it would be a good idea to get a second opinion from someone more knowledgeable than me. The build I've worked up is mainly chosen from recommended parts from the last System Building thread:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($169.99 @ Microcenter)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($29.98 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: Asus P8Z77-V LX ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($119.95 @ SuperBiiz)
Memory: G.Skill Value Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1333 Memory ($38.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung Spinpoint F4 2TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($129.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Intel 330 Series 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($94.99 @ NCIX US)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 660 Ti 2GB Video Card ($277.55 @ Newegg)
Case: Fractal Design Core 3000 ATX Mid Tower Case ($66.30 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: PC Power & Cooling Silencer MK III 600W 80 PLUS Bronze Certified ATX12V Power Supply ($89.33 @ NCIX US)
Optical Drive: Lite-On iHAS124-04 DVD/CD Writer ($16.99 @ Newegg)
Monitor: Asus VH232H 23.0" Monitor ($143.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 (OEM) (64-bit) ($89.98 @ Outlet PC)
Other: Alfa AWUS036H 1000mW 1W 802.11b/g USB Wireless WiFi network Adapter ($30.99)
Total: $1299.02
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2013-01-03 22:17 EST-0500)

Goal: Gaming. Just gaming. I work on my laptop and I'd like to have an actual PC to game on. I play FPS games primarily - these days its almost all Planetside 2. I'm not up to speed on what higher-end gaming resolutions are these days, but I think 1080p? I'm not sure.
Budget: Around $1400 - I can go maybe $100 higher. Lower is also good but I don't want to compromise performance.


One of my main concerns is wireless. I sublet a room and the router is upstairs and across the house. I definitely need a wireless connection - is the adapter I've chosen good or are there better mobo-integrated options?

Thanks very much goons!

AlphaDog
Sep 27, 2004

Destroyer of Hardware

Great job on this thread, everyone who's a regular. It's what I read to keep myself informed for when friends ask me what they should get (since I'm somehow still "the IT guy" despite not working in IT any more). I actually pointed a guy to the old thread when he was talking about his 8 core bulldozer pro gaming system that he wanted and he didn't end up buying it, so that was a success.

Also, thanks for putting PC Case Gear into the OP for Aussie goons. They're a pretty great company and their shipping prices are reasonable, which is quite rare here. They're also a convenient 5 minute drive from my house, which is nice as hell. If you really must pay someone to assemble a system for you, their rates aren't too bad either.

vyst
Aug 25, 2009

Ask me about getting into Goonwaffe early or not taking too long to answer your emails!

Yivgev posted:



One of my main concerns is wireless. I sublet a room and the router is upstairs and across the house. I definitely need a wireless connection - is the adapter I've chosen good or are there better mobo-integrated options?

Thanks very much goons!

If you're going to stick to wireless, I'd highly suggest investing in a Wireless N router, and then a Wireless N adapter for your PC. You might not see better ping times in games (and then again you might) but on the whole you should see better performance with internet-type stuff because of speed and the N protocol will be a stronger signal. If other people are using G, you can get a dual band router.

Ularg
Mar 2, 2010

Just tell me I'm beautiful.

What's the opinion on Crucial Ballistix 4gb (2 x 2gb)? The plan was two buy three sets of those to fill out my slots at around $57 for gaming and animation rendering. This was recommended to me by a friend. I guess my biggest problem is I have no idea what I am talking about and just worry too much of messing up a purchase. I'd be replacing 6GB of OCZ ram(3 x 2GB) with this.

Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


Ularg posted:

What's the opinion on Crucial Ballistix 4gb (2 x 2gb)? The plan was two buy three sets of those to fill out my slots at around $57 for gaming and animation rendering. This was recommended to me by a friend. I guess my biggest problem is I have no idea what I am talking about and just worry too much of messing up a purchase. I'd be replacing 6GB of OCZ ram(3 x 2GB) with this.

Read the OP.









Ularg
Mar 2, 2010

Just tell me I'm beautiful.

Crackbone posted:

Read the OP.




Ok, I get that. But I asked earlier with some links to RAM that didn't have any dumbshit on it and I was asking about how important is brand when it comes to RAM.

Edit: vv Thank you, it helps me feel less concious about my purchase then.

Ularg fucked around with this message at Jan 4, 2013 around 14:15

Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


The Quick Pick list has a link to a ton of ram without giant heatsinks.

Basically, RAM is RAM - brand is pretty much irrelevant. If two sets of sticks have the same speed and voltage, they're essentially identical for performance purposes. Keep in mind "speed" refers only to 1333, 1600, etc. Timings, CL, all that other stuff doesn't make a difference.

(The brand question is not in the OP, I'll add it to the RAM question).

LmaoTheKid
Oct 7, 2002

BA-DAH-DAH-DAH-DAHHH I'M LOVIN' IT


Heatsink or not, anecdotally speaking, crucial have always been good to me.

LLJKSiLk
Jul 7, 2005

We don't need a crystal ball to see the future. Roll Tide.

Does speed > 1333 matter?

Ularg
Mar 2, 2010

Just tell me I'm beautiful.

And while we're on the subject: Why exactly is dumb poo poo frowned upon so much? Increase in price for no gain? Chances of leading into stupid stuff happening?

Ragehaver
Jul 27, 2001

"Though I often smell of excrement, I deserve your respect because I provide a valuable service."

Ularg posted:

And while we're on the subject: Why exactly is dumb poo poo frowned upon so much? Increase in price for no gain? Chances of leading into stupid stuff happening?

Increase in price for no gain, and the extra fins can prevent you from installing coolers and other wiring depending on the motherboard layout.

vyst
Aug 25, 2009

Ask me about getting into Goonwaffe early or not taking too long to answer your emails!

Ularg posted:

And while we're on the subject: Why exactly is dumb poo poo frowned upon so much? Increase in price for no gain? Chances of leading into stupid stuff happening?

There's a few reasons why you don't want ridiculous heatsinks

-It really does nothing for the RAM. RAM doesn't really overheat per se that I am aware of
-It's a pain if you have a tight case/motherboard
-Performance wise all that really matters is the voltage and speed

Now with all of that said, if you get a good deal on some RAM with gaudy heatsinks that are better than the plain looking alternative with same speed/voltage then buy that stuff if it will fit in the case. The idea is to not think that fatter, more futuristic looking RAM = better performing.

Ularg
Mar 2, 2010

Just tell me I'm beautiful.

vyst posted:

There's a few reasons why you don't want ridiculous heatsinks

-It really does nothing for the RAM. RAM doesn't really overheat per se that I am aware of
-It's a pain if you have a tight case/motherboard
-Performance wise all that really matters is the voltage and speed

Now with all of that said, if you get a good deal on some RAM with gaudy heatsinks that are better than the plain looking alternative with same speed/voltage then buy that stuff if it will fit in the case. The idea is to not think that fatter, more futuristic looking RAM = better performing.

Then reading this I would think it really have all the much of a difference in my position. Combining that with knowledge about brands will help me pick out RAM without overpaying. I have no problems with overheating or with room, I'm just looking for a better deal that isn't shooting myself in the foot for performance.

Edit: And with that out of the way, my next question is basically what he posted:

LLJKSiLk posted:

Does speed > 1333 matter?

Along with:

Does it matter if I am getting in 1 Stick, 2 Stick, 3 sticks or 4 besides price? I'm only worried about buying a certain number of sticks and have them not work with my motherboard for whatever reason.

Ularg fucked around with this message at Jan 4, 2013 around 15:09

BobLoblaw
Jul 24, 2007


Someone a few pages ago asked me to report back how this wireless adapter worked out. My PC is about 10 feet away from the router (through one wall) and my signal reports as full strength. It's a G network, not N for what it's worth. For $10 I'd say give it a try if you need a wireless solution.

Talaii
Sep 5, 2003

You crack me up, lil buddy!

Ularg posted:

Does it matter if I am getting in 1 Stick, 2 Stick, 3 sticks or 4 besides price? I'm only worried about buying a certain number of sticks and have them not work with my motherboard for whatever reason.

They should always work. You want a multiple of a certain number of stick installed (3 for socket 1366, 4 for socket 2011, 2 for everything else) - usually means filling either exactly half or every single available slot, rather than just filling some at random. That'll give better performance, since the CPU can read off 2 (or 3 or 4) sticks at the same time. This is called dual (triple, quad) channel memory.

That's about how much memory you INSTALL. As for what you buy: Just get whatever's cheapest at the right voltage/speed. The motherboard will just run all the sticks at the highest voltage/lowest speed of all the installed sticks, the days of having different memory sticks just not work together are over. Just buy as many sticks as you need of whatever speed/voltage you desire, and don't fret over whether it's sold singly, or in kits of two, or in kits of three, or is a mix of different brands.


As far as speed goes: any gains over 1333MHz are tiny (unless you are using the integrated graphics on a Llano/Trinity or Ivy Bridge and really care about graphics performance). You'll see a couple of percent difference - not big enough to notice. It might be worth grabbing 1600MHz RAM if it costs the same (it's usually only a dollar or two higher), but don't throw money away on faster RAM.

Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


# of sticks does not matter for mobo compatibility.

And I'm really not trying to be rude, but half of what's being asked about RAM been in the OP for probably more than a year.

11. How much RAM do I need? What speed, timings, brand?
8 Gigs is the current sweet spot. Brand doesn't matter, RAM is a commodity part nowadays. DDR3-1333 is the fastest you need - faster speeds and/or lower timings won't increase performance. Faster RAM is fine if it's the same price as 1333. Avoid ram with giant heatsinks/fins - they don't help and can get in the way of other parts.

Crackbone fucked around with this message at Jan 4, 2013 around 15:37

Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


Talaii posted:

They should always work. You want a multiple of a certain number of stick installed (3 for socket 1366, 4 for socket 2011, 2 for everything else) - usually means filling either exactly half or every single available slot, rather than just filling some at random. That'll give better performance, since the CPU can read off 2 (or 3 or 4) sticks at the same time. This is called dual (triple, quad) channel memory.

This is not true. Dual/Triple channel memory configs don't add performance to average computer use (desktop/gaming/etc). Single channel bandwidth is still enough for pretty much anything the typical user needs.

Vlaphor
Dec 18, 2005



Got a quick question here. I'm heading to Kansas City in a bit, and Microcenter just announced a new deal with this

http://www.microcenter.com/product/..._1155_Processor

and a free mobo. I don't know which free mobo, and if it's too crap then I wont bite, but I'm running an I7 930 right now and I just need some other people's opinions on if that would be a worthy upgrade. Thanks

Crackbone
May 23, 2003

Vlaada is my co-pilot.


Vlaphor posted:

Got a quick question here. I'm heading to Kansas City in a bit, and Microcenter just announced a new deal with this

http://www.microcenter.com/product/..._1155_Processor

and a free mobo. I don't know which free mobo, and if it's too crap then I wont bite, but I'm running an I7 930 right now and I just need some other people's opinions on if that would be a worthy upgrade. Thanks

Eh. If you do something that's heavily multi-threaded, it's probably a sidegrade at best and more likely a downgrade. For everything else it would probably be a slight increase, but I don't think it would be enough to justify the cost. If anything I'd recommend overclocking your 930 if you can. A solid heatsink is ~$35 and will bump you up close enough to an Ivy Bridge chip for most purposes.

Vlaphor
Dec 18, 2005



I have no idea how to overclock, and every guide I've read just seems to confuse me more. Still, sounds like it wouldn't be worth it overall for this upgrade and I should probably just wait for the next gen of consoles to come out and jumpstart pc development again. Thanks for the advice

also, the mobo appears to be a bit too crap.

Vlaphor fucked around with this message at Jan 4, 2013 around 15:52

LoboLoboLobo
May 26, 2008

yoink!

MicroCenter has an open box on a Gigabyte Radeon 7950 for $271.96. It says that the whole thing is complete and comes with the balance of the manufacturer's warranty. Is this a steal and a half and should I jump on it to upgrade my GTX 260? Only concern is whether or not Gigabyte is good for quality and reliability since I've never dealt with them.

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

I can do sex. It's just alien sex.


Gigabyte: Nope.
Open box items: Nope.

Conclusion: Double nope.

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Ragehaver
Jul 27, 2001

"Though I often smell of excrement, I deserve your respect because I provide a valuable service."

chazburgr posted:

MicroCenter has an open box on a Gigabyte Radeon 7950 for $271.96. It says that the whole thing is complete and comes with the balance of the manufacturer's warranty. Is this a steal and a half and should I jump on it to upgrade my GTX 260? Only concern is whether or not Gigabyte is good for quality and reliability since I've never dealt with them.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16814202006

New. Same price. Not Gigabyte.

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