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Among the distressing thoughts that bother me on an almost daily basis, one stands out and underpins the rest. Few things motivate me anymore except food and women. The food motivation goes when I am full but the desire for a realtionship stays. The thing is, I don't particularly care about sex itself (it's nice and all but nothing that masturbation can't achieve). No, the reason I care about sex is for how other people (mainly other guys) perceive me. In fact, I'd rather be seen with an attractive woman than to actually have sex with her but without anyone actually knowing that anything happened between us. The flip side of this (and this is worse) is that how attractive a woman is to other guys is more important to me than how much I like her (theoretically I know since I am very much a stereotypical goon that wouldn't even know how to ask a woman out). What makes this worse for me is that I am aware of how horrible it is. I hate typical male boasting about sex and the pressures society puts on men to be sexually "successful". I hate it when sex is treated like some kind of game and the zero-sum thinking it seems to promote- I actually now try to not let women know if I like them (to the point even of not making any unnecessary eye contact), like there's some kind of balance of power in my head and besides Id rather be considered aloof than shy or awkward. I hate it when in my mind women are reduced to "currency" that I can use to compare myself with other men. Yet, if I remove this desire I feel like I am left empty, my only motivation being the avoidance of pain and discomfort. In fact what drives me now is essentially wanting to avoid situations like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vn3IRHhPXMo . I had even considered making up a story about a LDR but decided against when I realised I'd probably end up looking even worse than Carrell in that clip. When anybody asks me about previous relationships I just say I've had a few flings but nothing serious (...like Im such a player  ). I keep it non-descript and the conversation moves along.For the record I'm a 26 year old male. I've never been in a relationship (probably for the best) and only ever asked a couple of girls out. I have had sex though (with prostitutes- Im in a country where its legal). What the gently caress is wrong with me?
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 07:51 |
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| # ? May 22, 2013 13:35 |
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What's wrong with you is you have a really pathetic sense of self esteem. Other people think about you far less that you realize, because they're dealing with their own lives. Why do you even care what they think? Ask yourself that. And get therapy.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:07 |
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Benny Harvey posted:The thing is, I don't particularly care about sex itself (it's nice and all but nothing that masturbation can't achieve). Sex with a prostitute isn't much more than masturbation. That's simply it. Of course having an extra person there is nicer than being on your own, but sex with someone you don't care about can't be compared to sex in a loving relationship. They quite simply aren't the same thing. That said, you aren't in a good place for a relationship right now. You need therapy and a huge boost of self esteem. Learn to love yourself, then you can find someone to love. Once a relationship becomes about finding a life partner rather than a piece of eye candy on the end of your arm you'll have a chance of actually being happy. In or out of a relationship. Don't get me wrong. I'm not knocking prostitutes. I haven't ever been with one, but I imagine the better ones are loving amazing at sex and can do things that blow your mind. It's still ultimately aided masturbation though, rather than an intimate act between lovers.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:13 |
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So you want female attention just to gain male attention? Congrats you're gay! Or you need to find a way to value yourself that doesn't require other people to suck you off about how big of a playa you are. You can't truly know thyself without the help of an outside perspective, but your self worth needs to come from within. Until you can learn to respect yourself, you can't expect any even-minded individual to want to date you. Even if you did find someone desperate enough to date, you'd probably be poison for one another. There's a reason co-dependent relationships are considered unhealthy.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:21 |
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Congratulations, you're massively insecure. That can be cured with therapy.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:22 |
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I care because embarrassment is about the worst feeling I have experienced- I would rather get punched in the face every day if it meant going without embarrassment. And yes I know the embarrassment feels so bad because I care so much but it's not something I can just turn off (without at least 6 pints of beer), its a reflex like ducking or flinching.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:25 |
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So when are you going to start getting the therapy you so clearly need?
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:30 |
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Nathilus posted:So you want female attention just to gain male attention? Congrats you're gay! Not gay. I need respect from men. Don't want to gently caress any though.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:31 |
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There's nothing necessarily wrong about valuing aesthetics in a person, don't let anyone tell you otherwise either. It's something you have to work at just like being smart or whatever, so don't feel bad about that. Also, the want for social status is a legitimate motivator too. So long as you aren't being duplicitous about your intentions with anyone then it's not specifically an amoral thing either, you're still relatively young so I wouldn't worry about that. So long as you don't mislead a partner you aren't doing anything wrong, and I can definitely understand the desire to have that social currency - more people are motivated that way than would like to admit it. But you also need to stop worrying about what is wrong with you and focus on what's right. And if you can't think of anything, begin working towards something. Lazy people are pretty disgusting IMO, especially those that vocalize their desire but do nothing to achieve them. By acknowledging that you want to change, you can go about it now. I recommend working out a lot and getting in shape and poo poo.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:33 |
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Get therapy. Learn that people don't give a poo poo whether or not you've got a hot lady on your arm, and also that you shouldn't care what people think of the person you're with. Additionally, try to connect with a woman on an intellectual level and you may be able to realize that we're people too, and not mere status symbols.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:33 |
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Portals posted:Get therapy. Learn that people don't give a poo poo whether or not you've got a hot lady on your arm, and also that you shouldn't care what people think of the person you're with. Additionally, try to connect with a woman on an intellectual level and you may be able to realize that we're people too, and not mere status symbols. Honestly, a lot of people probably do. Whether or not he should care about it is a different question, but it's undoubtedly an aspect of social "ranking".
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 08:36 |
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tbp posted:But you also need to stop worrying about what is wrong with you and focus on what's right. And if you can't think of anything, begin working towards something. Lazy people are pretty disgusting IMO, especially those that vocalize their desire but do nothing to achieve them. By acknowledging that you want to change, you can go about it now. I recommend working out a lot and getting in shape and poo poo. I have just started going to the gym but then I guess you know what motivates me. You were spot on about the social ranking thing btw. Portals posted:Get therapy. Learn that people don't give a poo poo whether or not you've got a hot lady on your arm, and also that you shouldn't care what people think of the person you're with. Additionally, try to connect with a woman on an intellectual level and you may be able to realize that we're people too, and not mere status symbols. I realise women are people too but I don't really care (or about men as people for that matter). slinkimalinki posted:So when are you going to start getting the therapy you so clearly need? I don't know, I'll look into my options and maybe make an appointment this week.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 09:52 |
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Embarrassment is a weird thing, if you laugh it off everyone else will too but if you let it get to you then sometimes people will pick at it and make it worse. Have you ever been able to brush off an embarrassing situation?
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 09:52 |
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It's normal to care a little bit about what other people think. That's what a society is, after all. On the other hand I don't think your rationalisations have much to do with anything and they're not going to help you solve your problem. It would probably only take one good relationship to take you out of this funk, but you're going to have a hard time finding one in your current position. Talk to a professional.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 09:55 |
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Corn Thongs posted:Embarrassment is a weird thing, if you laugh it off everyone else will too but if you let it get to you then sometimes people will pick at it and make it worse. Have you ever been able to brush off an embarrassing situation? I don't think so. I'm not really sure i would know how.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 09:56 |
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Benny Harvey posted:I care because embarrassment is about the worst feeling I have experienced- I would rather get punched in the face every day if it meant going without embarrassment. And yes I know the embarrassment feels so bad because I care so much but it's not something I can just turn off (without at least 6 pints of beer), its a reflex like ducking or flinching. How many tattoos and piercings have you got? You come across like a wanna-be. Therapy, or a life changing experience will be your only hope. By life changing I mean something that will change your whole outlook on life, like ending up in a wheelchair, I don't mean you losing 10 pounds.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 10:09 |
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TemetNosceXVIcubus posted:How many tattoos and piercings have you got? You come across like a wanna-be. None. Also, what?
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 10:14 |
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Literally no one cares about how much sex you are having with other than you. Its like building up in your head that the day you get a sportscar then you'll finally be loved and respected.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 11:42 |
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Benny Harvey posted:None. Also, what? Surprised, it shows that you do have some self control. Therapy then, find a group of friends that wants you as a friend and not someone they can judge or be judged by. Friends should all be equal, pecking orders do exist, but that's for playgrounds and high school, and dickheads.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 12:25 |
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Please. You maybe know that women are real people intellectually, but you clearly have no actual understanding of that on a deeper level. If you actually got that women were real, actual, thinking, feeling unique individuals, you wouldn't be so loving blase about thinking about them only as signaling mechanisms to show other dudes that you can get hot chicks. Can you actually get hot chicks? It sounds unlikely. Given that your only sexual experiences have been about as intimate and emotional as ordering a pizza for delivery, I can't imagine that you would have the least idea of if sex is actually enjoyable or rewarding. Did the last pizza you order help you better understand and respect pizza chefs as human beings with hopes and dreams an fears and desires of their own? You have such low self-esteem it's swung around right into massive egotism. No one cares about you scoring with mad hot chicks. No one is looking at you and thinking, "wow, I bet that dude has never had a meaningful relationship with another human being." No one gives a poo poo about you or what you do. No one expects you to do anything but bathe regularly, behave appropriately in public, and not to be a creepy pervert. This is not a bad thing. This is an amazing thing, because what it means is that you are free to focus on what actually makes you happy and fulfilled, not what you think others expect you to do. Get some damned therapy.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 13:55 |
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TemetNosceXVIcubus posted:Surprised, it shows that you do have some self control. Hate to derail, but no, it doesn't, and the converse implication - that tattoos and piercings are evidence of lack of self-control - is so goonishly  that it is itself evidence of a lack of self-esteem on your part.OP, you desperately need therapy. Your self-esteem is so low that you actively avoid talking to women in whom you are interested. I'm guessing you know you'll be a creeper if you let yourself interact with them, which is why you must practice. Try accepting that nothing will happen with an attractive woman and being friends with her maybe? Also seriously get therapy.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 14:00 |
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Wanting to impress other men with being a big success with the opposite sex isn't that strange up to a point, but it is when it's your main motivation in life. You need to find a purpose - through job, education, religion, philosophy, anything really. Apart from the inherent weirdness, as you're not actually very successful with women, it isn't very sensible for that to be the point of your life. You also need to stop thinking about sex in isolation, which is how you come to the conclusion that "actually, masturbation is as good." It's there to build a relationship, part of the package, and you have to start valuing the relationship, not just the act itself. Face facts, the reality of sex is never going to match up to whatever fantasy you have of it. We all have to deal with that.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 14:03 |
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Benny Harvey posted:What the gently caress is wrong with me? How many friends do you even have? Do not count co-workers, family, facebook friends, or WoW guild members.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 14:36 |
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Learn to laugh at yourself.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 15:00 |
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Men don't respect other men simply for having a hot girlfriend unless they're immature douchebags or 19 year old frat guys. And even then, it's not really "respect", it's simply child-like admiration from guys who are as insecure as you. Why do you crave respect and attention from people like that?
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 15:25 |
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razz posted:Men don't respect other men simply for having a hot girlfriend unless they're immature douchebags or 19 year old frat guys. And even then, it's not really "respect", it's simply child-like admiration from guys who are as insecure as you. Why do you crave respect and attention from people like that? I would note, I think even well-balanced people will have a flicker of "Hey, so-and-so's girlfriend (and boyfriend, yes, women do this too) is really hot!", but it's just a little thought. It's not fundamentally different from happening to see someone very attractive in a public place and thinking, "Hey, that person is really good looking". Having it be the driving force behind viewing a partner as desirable is a big problem though. For lack of a better way of putting it, was a lot of your life when you were younger "decided" for you? So much so that you don't trust your actual taste and opinions? Edited to add, can you unpick the food thing a bit? What drives you about food, is it going to a restaurant that other people have told you is the place to go? Is it about trying new things? Is it about compulsive eating? Poison Cake fucked around with this message at Jan 20, 2013 around 16:24 |
| # ? Jan 20, 2013 16:21 |
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http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=beard OP, quack quack.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 17:02 |
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This thread is very similar to the thread I posted around last October. OP, brace yourself for a shitstorm of feminism Poison Cake posted:Having it be the driving force behind viewing a partner as desirable is a big problem though. For lack of a better way of putting it, was a lot of your life when you were younger "decided" for you? So much so that you don't trust your actual taste and opinions? This right here was my problem. You're probably trying to impress someone in the past who was incredibly judgmental and hypercritical, who put you down for just about anything. They would only approve of you if you did as they did, and if you tried to express your individuality they would tear you down. This person has shaped your internal critic. Your individual self was judged as wrong or flawed, so you seek the approval of others by trying to fit their ideals. You imagine that everyone else is as judgmental and contemptuous of you as this person was. Benny Harvey posted:Not gay. I need respect from men. Don't want to gently caress any though. Exactly. It has nothing to do with having sex men. Hell, it has nothing to do with having sex with women. It's all about respect. You don't respect yourself because your inner critic/past events made you feel like you don't deserve respect, that you're flawed. You feel like the only way you can get respect from your peers and yourself is by scoring with chicks. Unicorncupcake posted:Please. You maybe know that women are real people intellectually, but you clearly have no actual understanding of that on a deeper level. If you actually got that women were real, actual, thinking, feeling unique individuals, you wouldn't be so loving blase about thinking about them only as signaling mechanisms to show other dudes that you can get hot chicks. Can you actually get hot chicks? It sounds unlikely. Given that your only sexual experiences have been about as intimate and emotional as ordering a pizza for delivery, I can't imagine that you would have the least idea of if sex is actually enjoyable or rewarding. Did the last pizza you order help you better understand and respect pizza chefs as human beings with hopes and dreams an fears and desires of their own? You don't need to be so hostile. Majors fucked around with this message at Jan 20, 2013 around 17:24 |
| # ? Jan 20, 2013 17:13 |
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Is this that 'husk' guy come back? If so prostitutes are progress of a sort I guess.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 17:35 |
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Did you have trouble gaining acceptance from your dad or male peers when growing up? That would explain a lot.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 17:47 |
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How about just getting a really fancy car instead, then you can impress the guys and not have to worry about the whole 'using people as status symbols' thing.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 17:50 |
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OP, do you think of anyone as a person? Or are men just sources of validation to you, with women being objects to harvest that validation?
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 17:59 |
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OP ya write like a douchebag too.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 18:20 |
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I find it funny that people claim there isn't a culture of envy that exists, at least as far as I know, in America. People very often get jealous of what others have, and there is a tenuous sort of 'respect' there when one is doing well. It's a type of social currency, or prestige. Hell, Scarface flat out said it. I genuinely think people don't like to admit it (the OP did, he's being candid at least) because it means introspection and realize that you aren't where you want to be - you don't have that respect from others.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 18:55 |
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Tell us about your friends, OP. They are at the heart of this matter.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 19:11 |
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Majors posted:You don't need to be so hostile. Don't worry, the hostility is free when it comes to guys who view women only as a means to leveling up in some ridiculous competition to have the hottest girlfriend or whatever the OP thinks is going on. The point I was actually trying to make is that when you realize that 99% of the time other people you meet aren't secretly and constantly judging you and what you do, it is incredibly freeing. Do what makes you happy. If you don't know, figure it out. Don't worry if other people think your girl is hot, or your hobbies are stupid. If you get pleasure out of them and you are not hurting yourself or others, go for it.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 19:26 |
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Majors posted:
Shut your mouth. Women don't poop.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 19:49 |
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Majors posted:OP, brace yourself for a shitstorm of feminism Well, when the OP says he cares more about the impression his girlfriends might make on his male friends than the women themselves, you don't have to be Andrea Dworkin to think that he might think a bit about his attitude to women generally. He's clearly concerned about it himself. hookerbot5000 posted:Getting a fancy car. Or doing any of a whole range of things that might impress guys, from physical self-improvement to career success. I've heard crazy rumours that some of these things even impress women.
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 20:17 |
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Part of Everything posted:Did you have trouble gaining acceptance from your dad or male peers when growing up? That would explain a lot. Dad: Son? Son: Yes, dad? Dad: *SLAMS DOOR* Sperg Some More fucked around with this message at Jan 20, 2013 around 20:49 |
| # ? Jan 20, 2013 20:22 |
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| # ? May 22, 2013 13:35 |
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Safe and Secure! posted:OP, do you think of anyone as a person? Or are men just sources of validation to you, with women being objects to harvest that validation? His problem is that he has overwhelming validation issues that are taking over his life, which includes his ability to form healthy relationships. solovyov posted:Shut your mouth. Women don't poop. So do they just sweat it out?
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| # ? Jan 20, 2013 20:26 |
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