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sentrygun posted:Nope. Works perfectly fine with lifesteal. I guess there's the idea that lifesteal isn't needed when you should be permalocking anyone you duel and not getting ganged up on enough to need lifesteal to power through. Not sure I agree with it, but eh. Which is silly because he's a carry. If you are a carry and -you don't have an innate UAM -you don't have a decent innate source of healing -you're not getting a heart then you always want lifesteal at some point. Lifesteal frequently gets overrated, but it's also the king of lategame orbs. And really, considering that S&Y isn't an orb anymore, Mjol only interrupts when it procs, and Skadi always stacks with lifesteal, there only reason to not have lifesteal in the endgame is if you're Phantom Lancer because feedback works with illusions. RndmCnflct posted:It'll only take 1 in 10 people to opt in for dotabuff and DBR to continue. My public profile will be happy to report all your private profile stats. Pfft, as if anyone cares about Dotabuff. Dotaholic, rest in peace, was much better. It even told me how many Divine rapiers I purchased (one every 17 games!), which was far more cause for  than any meaningless DBR number.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 06:31 |
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| # ? May 25, 2013 10:43 |
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Darox posted:Lifesteal frequently gets overrated, but it's also the king of lategame orbs. And really, considering that S&Y isn't an orb anymore, Mjol only interrupts when it procs, and Skadi always stacks with lifesteal, there only reason to not have lifesteal in the endgame is if you're Phantom Lancer because feedback works with illusions. For the most part, I agree. I have seen lifesteal get written off a lot though, so I was just giving my best guess. I still think it's a situational thing, but the number of situations it works in is pretty high.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 06:36 |
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Darox posted:Which is silly because he's a carry. I thought lifesteal only stacked with skadi when you were ranged.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 06:44 |
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Lifesteal just gets a bad rap from people rushing Vlad's on Riki or whatever, when they would have been much better off saving it for their second or even third item.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 06:46 |
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Speaking of Riki, I must have played with the world's most  player ever. Here's his plan:1. Farm to level 6 while dying four times to Slark 2. Once you have permanent invisibility, sit in the middle and do nothing forever while waiting for an opportunity to get a kill. Not once did he bother helping in a teamfight and he died every time he tried to attack someone low on health. Usually because he always targeted Viper of all people. He ended the match at level 7 and proceeded to constantly go "noob team" for the last five or so minutes. I'm sure sitting around waiting for a good opportunity can be used in a somewhat efficient way, but the way this played out I felt like a TF2 match with one of those people who ignore all the objectives in favor of getting more kills.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 06:56 |
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Alpha Phoenix posted:Why does troll have a scoff quote for mask of death? Last I checked HotD was core on him. It's probably a joke. As in the character is trolling you for getting a good item.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 07:03 |
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I literally signed up for this forum to meet people to play a MOBA  That's how poorly organized the average team is. Or rather the average collection of random players. This game is worse than many others in the genre because it's punishing to lose, and winning tends to become a long and terrible landslide. I perceive an issue- and have a bone to pick with lots of middling-skilled players. Probably nobody here does this. They love to rage stopping in the middle of the lane to write a short novel about how some character's item picks are sub-optimal or who should be warding or whatever other bullshit retarded  meta. I don't want to come off as egotistical, and understanding the metagame is great, particularly the push/pull of lanes. Seriously, though:They have the same loving mip-map I do. If someone disappears off of it in another lane there's master logic in imagining the many places and possibilities as to where they might be going. A player should use the wheel and call missing! I always do. But that's no excuse for being totally unaware. I guess I come from a biased perspective being not amazing but proficient at Star-craft 2 where often the only reason you know you're about to get your poo poo rocked is because a massive swarm of little red dots suddenly start dancing around on your magic postage stamp. It's not rocket science. Okay, SS awareness. What else is common. Ward bitching. gently caress off with these people telling me to ward the entire map as Pugna. Guess what- if I spend the entire game running around warding my skill gap might not allow me to also get enough last hits AND keep up on XP to have a scepter within the half hour. It should be enough that my character is using it's free ward ability to protect the danger lane and the other 3/4 of the map should be able to afford a couple wards between three other loving players what with having one player who has an entire lane to farm all to themselves. If I try to do that I might end up a useless piece of fish food in the late game, and that isn't helping anybody! Oh, and then there's the fact that these people are basically approaching the game form a perspective of "win a war by doing exactly what your enemy expects". I mean really? It's terrible in this genre. So many games I just mute people soloing because I can't stand to listen to their masterstroke about how we'll turn the game around if the player who is already shut down so bad they're probably hosed outright should buy my team two wards instead of saving for another 200 health that they probably desperately need or whatever. Never mind the fact that seeing them roll across the river through our jungle isn't going to do shitall if the players are still so incompetent they can't get in position to square off on equal footing in time. I seriously see people blaming metagame mechanics for a loss and then reporting each-other in a poo poo-flinging fest after a forty minute game that didn't have one square 5v5 trade in it. In general what makes me love this game compared to it's cohorts is it's flexibility. Characters have powers that break the mold. It has endless potential. I wish people would stop trying to shove it in a little box. I mean gently caress, a while back I played this game with some random Russian guys and only one other English speaker. Our team was Lifestealer, Spirit Breaker, Wisp, Tiny, and Nature's Prophet. I poo poo you not, we won the game without "laning". The moment we all hit 6 it was just surprise sex-town. Wisp would pop me in as Tiny and I would immediately use him as a motherfucking ball and chain. I'm sure you know about spirit breaker and Nai'ax. All five of us just teleported directly to every tower and teamed them down, even without creep support, even against back door protection. We didn't ward, communicate, jungle. The other team wasn't bad, either; they just couldn't figure out what to do about us forcing team-fights at level 6 under their towers by teleporting into them over and over as a group. We died a lot too. But we spent gold first. They probably played a better "metagame" - but guess who wins when the first half dozen team fights are two versus four and five? It's more about intuition and common sense than skill, honestly. The fog hides things. Sometimes they're other players. Imagine! Divine Disclaimer fucked around with this message at Jan 24, 2013 around 08:36 |
| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:28 |
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Heh, you called dotes a MOBA.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:31 |
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Observer Wards and de-warding enemy wards are more important than getting Aghanim's scepter, hope this helps.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:32 |
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black metal hugbox posted:Heh, you called dotes a MOBA. It's a shame that in the always-stupid debates on what to call this genre, nobody ever dismisses Dota 2 as "just a DOTA clone."
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:40 |
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Zenephant posted:Observer Wards and de-warding enemy wards are more important than getting Aghanim's scepter, hope this helps. In very organized play, yes. In the average match-make against people who play fairly casually? What's more important? Knowing they're about to steamroll your face in a tight little pack? Or being smart enough to actually use that information in a productive way? I don't really mean to knock warding in itself, no. It's just that so many games I play my team is totally incapable of using that information in any meaningful way. I don't think the average pub solo player even realizes warding enemy jungles to pick off junglers is a thing. I would know, I ward my balls off. I play heroes with free wards and ward my wards with wards made of other, smaller wards. I do usually pick half the map to be responsible for, though (surprise, the half my rear end be in); and I feel like asking the people on the opposite side of the map to handle a few wards on their own isn't being unrealistic. I am also usually the only player that buys wards.  Kalos posted:It's a shame that in the always-stupid debates on what to call this genre, nobody ever dismisses Dota 2 as "just a DOTA clone." Is there a problem with that genre name? I don't get it. I guess the acronym is a bit dumb. I feel like most people know what I mean when I say that, though. Divine Disclaimer fucked around with this message at Jan 24, 2013 around 08:47 |
| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:40 |
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Is it just me or is PL absolutely insane now? This is a pretty good example I feel. The endgame stats are pretty misleading, but watch and you'll see what I mean. This was a very close game where I as Antimage was ahead on levels and farm against their PL. But he's just much stronger than any other hard carry right now. Our team has a bunch of AoE to counter his images, and I went BF, but once he has Heart they are just beefy as gently caress, and he doesn't need any damage items other than Diffusal to have insane DPS thanks to his absurd stat growth. And compared to other hard carries like AM, Merc, and Void, he is MUCH stronger in the laning phase, thanks to a good nuke/CC and a great escape. He also has literally the best farming capability in the game. And to top it all off, the relative difficulty in ganking him makes him an absolute beast against all but the most well-organised teams. When do we get a balance patch? Also, I'm having some trouble with my Axe game. I'm often able to dominate the early game by semi-jungling and ganking whenever the lane gets pushed, but in the mid and game I fall off. I end up starting Tranq's/Soul Ring to support Battle Hunger, but spending this much money on regen makes me much squishier than Axe needs to be. So I need to buy HP items (before Blink, either a Sange to Halberd later, or just a Vit Booster), but then I`m putting off Blink for a looong time. Any suggestions?
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:41 |
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Okay, I've got a slew of questions. One, the build of Huskar says you want Helm of the Dominator. Why? I grabbed an Alpha Wolf, which apparently has a bad rear end buff, but beyond that I don't get how it's worth the 1850 gold or whatever on him when I could just get the regular Mask and save 950? Two, I played as Spectre, and I don't get Spectre. I couldn't farm for a Radiance so I went for Diffusal, but why is Radiance so good on her? Does it multiply per guy created with the ult or something? I guess she's an okay carry but I feel like I like Drow better, and that's saying something. Three, what is orbwalking? I don't even really get the idea of orbs but this is mentioned a few places and I thought I should ask.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:45 |
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Kalos posted:It's a shame that in the always-stupid debates on what to call this genre, nobody ever dismisses Dota 2 as "just a DOTA clone." The professional term is Fast Action Real Time Strategy games. Only new people call these games mobas.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:46 |
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Pugna shouldn't be doing all the warding himself, also you shouldn't be using Nether Ward as an observer ward (lol)
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:46 |
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gowb posted:Pugna shouldn't be doing all the warding himself, also you shouldn't be using Nether Ward as an observer ward (lol) It can often serve both purposes. When top lane radiant, for example, it's sight range is large enough such that it can be placed towards the anterior end of the enemy tower on the opposite side of the trees where it will likely spot people coming around that kill-box sort of spot and also be where it can zap a retreating out-world that doesn't realize it's there as someone dives his tower for a gank, for example. I guess that's absurdly specific, but you get the gist. He's not the best example either. I mean you can't tell me you've never dropped a venomancer ward for a little extra personal protection. Sometimes you only need a couple extra seconds of warning, of course that doesn't cover the river- but if I am in that far I am ready to throw down anyway. Otherwise I step back closer to the bridge. Divine Disclaimer fucked around with this message at Jan 24, 2013 around 08:52 |
| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:49 |
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What owns is using the nether ward to block off a narrow path and then decrepifying it so it can't be destroyed. Then you TP out while typing "cya shitlords"
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 08:53 |
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Troll is amazing. He's everything I ever wanted. Watching him land a bash and then just flip the gently caress out attacking a hundred times a second makes me laugh. You know that Sand King comic, where he mentions how he'll get a Blink Dagger by simply existing? Well, it's like that. "You think I'm just harassing you? Well, I have five fervor stacks and the moment I hit six, I'm going to unleash the loving fury. Enjoy these moments, they will be your last!" edit: Then you just murder three people and it's just this, with Troll doing the screaming: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhkNLHictW8 Milky Moor fucked around with this message at Jan 24, 2013 around 09:07 |
| # ? Jan 24, 2013 09:05 |
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Divine Disclaimer posted:It can often serve both purposes. When top lane radiant, for example, it's sight range is large enough such that it can be placed towards the anterior end of the enemy tower on the opposite side of the trees where it will likely spot people coming around that kill-box sort of spot and also be where it can zap a retreating out-world that doesn't realize it's there as someone dives his tower for a gank, for example. I guess that's absurdly specific, but you get the gist. Veno is different. Pugnas ward is so good and has a long cooldown so you want it to be in the perfect place, which is rarely where you need an observer ward
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 09:08 |
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Arcaeris posted:Okay, I've got a slew of questions. 1. You can build it into a Satanic later which is great on Huskar. It's also useful for stacking your ancients with your dominated creep. 2. Yes, Radiance does propagate to illusions, but you mainly get it because Spectre farms like poo poo so it helps with that and it also synergizes well with her passive (Dispersion) to do a lot of AoE damage in team fights. Also, Spectre is pretty bad right now, she needs way too much farm to do anything and is completely useless while laning. Just about every carry is better than her. 3. Orbs, now called Unique Attack Modifiers in Dota 2, are effects that are applied to your auto attacks. Things like Eye of Skadi, Diffusal Blade, etc. Several heroes have them and orb walking is when you manually cast the orb spell to avoid drawing tower or creep aggro. This lets you harass or kill people under a tower. Drow's Frost Arrows are an orb. The wiki covers them in way more depth than I care to type out: http://www.dota2wiki.com/wiki/Unique_Attack_Modifiers
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 09:13 |
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Divine Disclaimer posted:He's not the best example either. I mean you can't tell me you've never dropped a venomancer ward for a little extra personal protection. Venomancer wards only cost like 20 mana and have an extremely short cooldown. They also give vision around a fairly large area. None of these things apply to Nether Ward.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 09:34 |
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ten dollar bitcoin posted:Venomancer wards only cost like 20 mana and have an extremely short cooldown. They also give vision around a fairly large area. None of these things apply to Nether Ward. Also nether ward is placed at your feet and veno wards have like a 1000 cast range. They are both called wards though!
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 10:23 |
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Arcaeris posted:Okay, I've got a slew of questions. On Huskar in particular the Mask of Death by itself is all you need to farm the jungle indefinitely once you have a couple ranks of Berserker's Blood. Helm of the Dominator is a good item though. Spectre is in a weird spot balance-wise. She is total rear end in the lane, and only really starts being even vaguely a threat around levels 7-10, and that's with farm. She can become an obnoxious, inescapable, nigh-invincible carry with a global presence once she gets really fat but it can be difficult to get there. Radiance and Diffusal are on her recommended items list because of how they interact with illusions. Radiance doesn't double up when there's multiple sources of it in the same place, but illusions can help spread the Radiance burn over a large area. Illusions get the full mana burn effect of Diffusal Blade, so it makes her ult more threatening while also helping her chase with the active.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 10:30 |
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Divine Disclaimer posted:I literally signed up for this forum to meet people to play a MOBA  J4GIs this the first one for the #dota thread? P.S. Pugna's Netherward has like an 80 gold bounty, you really don't want to be placing it like that, imho. Veno is a completely different story. Something you CAN do with it, however, is run into a juke lane as you escape and drop it behind you to buy 2s to tp. MotherFuckingT-REX fucked around with this message at Jan 24, 2013 around 11:08 |
| # ? Jan 24, 2013 10:43 |
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Play with friends, they said. I was playing with a friend the other day, I picked SF and after going mid I realized nobody had bought any wards or courier (He was support and we had another one too). I was solo mid vs a lvl1 bottle Tinker who had both wards and courier, with no way to deny him rune control 
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 11:13 |
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I never played WC3 Dota or Starcraft or any other dotalike before, so forgive me for my ignorance of how things work in other games. My question is, is there ever likely to be a more casual integrated team ladder/tourney system in Dota 2? I know there's already support for teams but it's not quite what I had in mind. It's pretty much serious, full-time players only as evidenced by the fact that there's a slot for a "team owner", and you can only sign up 5 players which will never work for people who are holding down jobs/trying to complete college/whatever. I'd want to see support for teams of, say, 10 where you can mix and match players from your pool for any given ladder game. You would have regular, automated tournaments that teams can sign up for for smaller (non pro-level) prizes, or just queue for matches specifically vs other teams and the results would affect your ladder ranking. Guild Wars 1 did all of this but I was never that interested in PvP in that game. If it were implemented in dotes on the other hand I'd be all over it.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 12:44 |
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Maugrim posted:I never played WC3 Dota or Starcraft or any other dotalike before, so forgive me for my ignorance of how things work in other games. My question is, is there ever likely to be a more casual integrated team ladder/tourney system in Dota 2? Probably somewhere down the pipeline.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 12:52 |
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Hookshotting into an Earthshaker and activating Battery Assault as he tries to cast spells that are mechanically impossible to get out in between ministuns is one of those Best Feelings.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:02 |
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Pureauthor posted:Hookshotting into an Earthshaker and activating Battery Assault as he tries to cast spells that are mechanically impossible to get out in between ministuns is one of those Best Feelings. It's more satisfying doing it to a Naga trying to get her ult off.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:07 |
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ten dollar bitcoin posted:Venomancer wards only cost like 20 mana and have an extremely short cooldown. They also give vision around a fairly large area. None of these things apply to Nether Ward. Not to mention that Nether Wards give an obscene amount of gold when killed by an enemy hero. They aren't something you want to use for scouting--quite the opposite. Much better to hide them in some trees where no hero will see it and get zapped repeatedly. Veno's Serpent Ward on the other hand is like... half scouting half pushing. Only gives around 10-20 gold and can really save your rear end.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:11 |
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Azzents posted:It's more satisfying doing it to a Naga trying to get her ult off. You are obligated to announce "NO VOCALS, TIME FOR A DRUM SOLO" when you do this.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:12 |
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Maugrim posted:I never played WC3 Dota or Starcraft or any other dotalike before, so forgive me for my ignorance of how things work in other games. My question is, is there ever likely to be a more casual integrated team ladder/tourney system in Dota 2? You can register more than 5 players to a team, for example the team I am registered on has 6 people currently. I don't know what the upper limit is off the top of my head, but yeah it is somewhat low. This is not a Clan system, though adding that as well would be cool. Secondly, Warcraft 3 Ladder had a system of automated tournaments that occurred regularly, and it would be cool if Dota2 got something similar, but that seems like a feature that will come in a year or two, if at all.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:27 |
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I'd like some feedback on this match if someone is bored enough. I was Puck and I did great mid but I couldn't for the life of me gank PL and he ended up snowballing, we kept losing fights while trying to gank him and Naix and we couldn't really push against them, until we inevitably lost the carry arms race. You'd think Puck with some reveal would be one of the best heroes to gank PL, but apparently I just can't deal with him
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:31 |
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Was wondering where the thread disappeared to. Thought there was some unseen locking reason. Anyway, I've got yet another stupid question: what exactly do people mean when they say queuing? In yet another match, the enemy instalocked Pudge, Sniper, Drow and Clinkz. Fifth chose Shadow Shaman later. I've had more than enough of the first three lately, so I decide I'm gonna experiment with Silencer. Lo and behold as I get an unstoppable streak against both Pudge and Clinkz, who proceed ragequit at level 6 in a solo top lane. They even had some nice plans and hook placement, but Last Word is just such an amazing spell. So now I'm confused why most people don't usually pick Silencer? Did I get lucky and not really get focused down by the team or something? Or maybe I just got lucky in a public match and am gloating too much. But I always enjoy turnabouts like this after a losing streak.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:34 |
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HGH posted:I've got yet another stupid question: what exactly do people mean when they say queuing? It can either mean they are queuing for Public Matchmaking, or they are Shift+Queuing spells. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say you heard it in the context of queuing for matchmaking. i.e.: Time to queue up! Just got done queuing! second context: Queuing epicenter+blink dagger
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:37 |
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The irritating part is not his skill build, but that he gave us a bit of trouble when trying to deal with him.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:39 |
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Elman posted:I'd like some feedback on this match if someone is bored enough. I was Puck and I did great mid but I couldn't for the life of me gank PL and he ended up snowballing, we kept losing fights while trying to gank him and Naix and we couldn't really push against them, until we inevitably lost the carry arms race. Frankly it looks like your team poo poo the bed. 3-10 Tiny who didn't go mid and seems very confused about which Tiny build he's going for (Drum/Phase/Yasha or Arcane/Blink), Mirana participating in 7 kills out of 31 and building a Hood, Ursa with BoT and Basher before BKB  I don't know. You could have stopped for a Mek before or after the Blink but it doesn't look like your team was doing their job at all.
TheQat fucked around with this message at Jan 24, 2013 around 13:44 |
| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:41 |
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:51 |
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Someone link the news article that suggests valve are clamping down on the API? I can't find it.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:54 |
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| # ? May 25, 2013 10:43 |
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Pureauthor posted:Hookshotting into an Earthshaker and activating Battery Assault as he tries to cast spells that are mechanically impossible to get out in between ministuns is one of those Best Feelings. Coldsnap vs an Ogre Magi is also fun.
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| # ? Jan 24, 2013 13:56 |
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