Search Amazon.com:
Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«33 »
  • Post
  • Reply
Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.


(Thanks to fellow goon Captain Swing for the gif banners)



Quick! Give me the cheat sheet for Blacklist!
-Releases on August 20 (NA)/August 23 (everywhere else), 2013 on PC, PS3, Xbox 360 and WiiU
-Single player campaign, Sam Fisher returns as commander of Forth Echelon
-Co-op campaign that spans over 14 original missions, many of them can be solo'ed
-Spies vs. Mercs, the asymmetrical multiplayer mode introduced in Pandora Tomorrow is back under the helm of the original creator!

What features should I hate?
-Michael Ironside is no longer providing the voice of Sam Fisher
-Airstrikes you can call in with Kinect!
-Mark and Execute is back, but if you're still moving, it's called Killing in Motion now!

Give me the infodump!
PC features:
  • Confirmed that there is a team dedicated for the PC version, but not specifically who. Very likely it is a team within Ubisoft Toronto working on it to optimise the game and create proper control schemes.
  • DX9 and DX11 builds
  • PC features: TXAA, HBAO, higher-resolution shadows, parallax mapping, tessellation (DX11)


Wii U Features:
  • Gamepad can be used for multiple features such as inventory management, to fly the tri-rotor drone, or as the snake cam (to see under doors), mark enemies, hold it up for night vision, and much more.


Overview:
  • Sam Fisher returns as the leader of the new Fourth Echelon (4E).
  • Team members include: Anna Grimsdottir (from the previous games), Charlie Cole (hacker), Isaac Briggs (CIA officer). Also joining the cast is loveable rear end in a top hat Andriy Kobin from Conviction.
  • The plot of the game revolves around a series of attacks on American interests orchestrated by a group of rogue nations: they demand that the United States withdraws its armed forces from every country in the world. Each attack is on a countdown and it is up to Forth Echelon to stop the Blacklist attacks from happening.
  • From what is revealed and shown from trailers the first attack happens in Guam and is very likely Sam Fisher happens to be there as it occurs; this is before he returns at the behest of the President to lead 4E.
  • Sam Fisher, normally a recluse and solo operator is now in charge of an organization; the goal of the dev team/narrative is to show how Sam Fisher has to adapt to a leadership role throughout the game.
  • The hub for 4E is in the C-147B Paladin, a large airplane re-purposed as a mobile HQ. From here you can access everything in the game or wander around the plane (like the SSV Normandy).
  • There is an integrated economy system that runs through all gameplay modes (SP, COOP, SVM). You can earn currency in any game mode and spend them for any game mode with no restrictions.
  • The Strategic Mission Interface (SMI) replaces any main menu present in the game and allows for extremely quick drop-in/drop-out into other gameplay modes without having to dig through menus or sit through quit/confirm screens as well as showing weekly/daily challenges (on ShadowNET) as well as integrating your friends lists and their progress (think Sleeping Dogs).


Gameplay:
  • Blacklist is an attempt to merge the faster, lethal gameplay found in Conviction with the more traditional elements in the older games such as systemic stealth gameplay (yes, that actually had to come back), gadgets, non-lethal and lethal options for players.
    • The developers have gone on to admit that many of the ideas in the final version of Conviction ended up being very half-baked and incomplete. Either way it was a decent base with not much systemic gameplay around it.
  • The devs have three main gameplay pillars: navigation, combat and stealth. The level design and AI should always be challenging one or more of those pillars and the player's mastery of the systems in the game.
  • The goggles return with a full feature set: night vision, sonar and thermal toggle modes. Some upgrades exist to merge thermal and sonar together.
  • Being hidden in the dark is no longer binary and there are different stages, though probably less precise than the older games. The lights on your back, goggles and watch light up brighter the more hidden you are, turn off to let you know you can be seen rather than turning the screen from colour to a black/white filter.
  • Closer Than Ever returns: In Chaos Theory, this is when a different set of animations play as you get closer to an enemy and start stalking over sneaking.
  • Lethal/Non-lethal toggle: Now you have the option to either knock out an enemy or outright kill them. There are pro/cons to each option. The game is supposed to feature almost a hundred different takedown animations depending on stance, context, etc.
  • Picking up bodies: Now you can hide bodies either in dark corners or occasionally in containers. You cannot carry a body while crouched however.
  • Variable speeds: Not as many as the old games but control and precision in movement speed is still required for stealth, especially if you are right behind an enemy. There is an active sprint button that puts you into parkour mode for most things in the environment.
  • The launcher returns (sorta): in the older games there was a launcher attached to a FNF2000 that fired certain gadgets, this is replaced by a crossbow that fires different bolts.
    • The crossbow can fire sticky shockers (non-lethal), EMP bolts (AOE EMPs an area), gas arrows , possibly others.
    • This replaced the launcher from the previous games to accommodate the customization system and not force players to have to pick a weapon that could accommodate a launcher over one without.
    • Other gadgets are simply thrown, like in Conviction. Such as the sticky camera, probably to nerf abuse with firing sticky cameras at people for free KOs.
  • Whistling: Sam can once again attract enemies with a whistle/whisper. What you do with that is up to you.
  • The Knife: instead of a straight double-edged blade, you now have a Karambit which functions nearly the same as any other knife except with occasionally flashier animations, plus you can cut fabrics again to create paths.
  • Mark and Execute/Killing in Motion: A very polarizing feature but with some more depth built into it this time around.
    • The M&E token has its own 'gauge' that fills up to allow you to use the execute portion. A melee takedown is worth 100% while a regular kill is only worth 25%, etc. The gauge is 4 pips.
    • Mark and Execute also works with the crossbow and possibly with whatever ammo it holds for non-lethal use.
  • Gadgets:
    • Sticky Camera: can be upgraded to distract, release sleeping gas or detonate. Can be used to mark enemies.
    • Sticky Noisemaker
    • Proximity Shocker: throwable AOE shocker when there isn't water around to propagate a sticky shocker through multiple enemies.
    • Tri-rotor drone: A small flying drone that operates like a sticky camera except instead of sleeping gas it fires sticky shockers. Can be seen and heard and destroyed.
    • Spider-bot: possibly a late-game gadget that probably replaces the sticky camera/operates similarly enough
    • Sleeping gas grenade
    • Flashbang grenade: flash! bang!
    • Frag Grenade
    • Incendiary Grenade
    • Remote and Proximity mines
  • Customization system: Equipment and their respective upgrades can be purchased for SP/Co-op with the economy system for many of your body armour slots and weapons. There are equipment pieces that vary differently between attributes that affect things like noise generation, armour, gadget capacity, ammo capacity, etc. You are free to mix and match pieces as you choose.
  • Enemy types: rather than simply all the same guard with slightly different AI routines and uniforms, there are some different enemy types that vary wildly and try to force the player to re-evaluate their options.
    • Dogs: Can sense you even if you aren't in line of sight, will bark and cause attention to other guards in the area.
    • Snipers: extremely long distance enemy, you will notice them right away with their laser sight scanning back and forth. Most reports say that regardless of difficulty and armour combination, they will very likely one-shot kill you regardless.
    • Heavies: heavily armoured enemies as the name suggests, they can take more punishment from gunfire, wear a helmet/gas mask (cannot be sleeping gased directly) and cannot be meleed from the front. Also equipped with a shotgun. One mark and execute against him will only remove his helmet and you must follow up somehow, whether it be a gunshot, melee, or your partner's mark and execute.
    • Tech enemies: They actively jam your thermal/sonar vision modes from working unless taken out. They also seem to be as well geared as heavies. If alerted they will release remote controlled cars that search for you and explode.
    • Night vision enemies: The dark is no longer safe!


But is it stealth?
  • The designers have stated that the goal was to create a sandbox-lite feeling within the levels; so even as levels are linear in a sense (as most Splinter Cell levels are), there are plenty of sections that open up and are rife for the player to tackle as they wish to achieve whatever objectives.
  • The developers did not want to 'force' trial-and-error stealth on players throughout the entire game (there are sections with forced ghost stealth) but they are doing their best to encourage stealth by making it more rewarding (points, currency) and trying to make it difficult to tackle enemies head on; you will still get overwhelmed and killed easily even with the improved gunplay if you try to play it simply as a cover shooter.
  • The most drastic change is that all levels open up with the enemy unaware of your presence (or, "by default you are stealth" to quote the devs) whereas in Conviction where 99% of the time the enemy was immediately aware of you are as soon as you passed a predetermined spot in the level.
  • Therefore it is better to see different levels as 'ecosystems' where for all intents and purposes the AI run as if you don't exist or were never there but will react accordingly if they become alerted to your presence.
  • All levels have been carefully crafted and playtested ad nauseum to allow for all playstyles but not with separate "paths". The devs has stated on the record they have 'advocates' that play each level specific to a playstyle and co-ordinate with the level designers to ensure all three playstyles are supported through level design.
  • Levels are 'blackboxes' as explained by the devs, they do a 2d pass (for cover, lines of sight), then 3d pass (for things like ledges, pipes, vents), then light and shadows to ensure levels are full of options, opportunities and obstacles.
  • Stealth is rewarded much more than playing lethally or loudly to where knockouts are worth 66-100% more points (in turn more money) and completely leaving guards undisturbed is worth even more alone.
  • There is a trophy/achievement for completing the game without any kills though there will be sections where you are forced to neutralize the enemy to proceed.

In regards to the AI: (note these are all observational from people who have played the game or from what can be gleaned from videos)
  • Guards will not notice your presence in a level unless you make a mistake or decide to tell them and will go about their way in the world. You will still hear conversations but there are no interrogation dialogues as in the older games or interrogation sequences from Conviction.
  • AI more likely to hear you if you aren't almost completely still or at the slowest speed, even decked out with equipment designed for maximum stealth.
  • AI more aggressive if you disturb the environment, especially if you do something like shoot out a light versus turning it off; they will go to investigate regardless but they might react differently and/or escalate/call for help.
  • There are different AI roles, some that are leaders that will co-ordinate with others to start searches rather than having a bunch of stragglers walk off while others stand still, especially if you caused a ruckus.
  • AI will now hear nearby abductions (character grabs) unlike other games. This also makes it harder to pick off guards slowly one-by-one as they will notice their fellow guards going missing.
  • AI work better when investigating, covering one another rather than roaming alone. If you are spotted they will try to funnel you into compromising positions with cover fire, grenades, etc.
  • AI has better detection and notices things better, you cannot simply walk between blobs of shadows to get to where you want; observation and planning is more important especially if you wish to remain undetected.

The three playstyles:
  • Ghost
    • The style that most old-school players will want to play and the most rewarding of all playstyles. Almost entirely enforced in Perfectionist mode.
    • Everyone has their own definition of what ghosting entails but the game rewards you for non-lethal KOs (takedowns, gadgets, etc.) and leaving enemies alone
  • Panther
    • The optimal style the devs hope some players will play or for people coming in from Conviction.
    • A lethal take on stealth formalized in Conviction, you are rewarded for killing an enemy in stealth by any means or if you slip past enemies alerted to you (but currently cannot find you).
  • Assault
    • If you are detected when you kill an enemy, you will get assault points, knockout or kill or whatever.
  • From latest footage, it looks like a KO (ghost) is worth 150, a stealth kill (panther) is worth around 100-125 and a straight up kill while detected (assault) counts as 'combat kill', only 75 points. There are also points rewarded after points of no return for ghost (enemies undisturbed,this value MAY be greater than simply enemies undisturbed x 150points and may be more for full ghosts) and panther (enemies evaded). Mark and Execute kills also seem to possibly have diminishing returns per kill to discourage use.


Perfectionist Mode:
  • New 4th difficulty to encourage older Splinter Cell gameplay
  • AI has better detection, much deadlier if spotted
  • One-shot one-kill against the player
  • Cannot melee any enemies from the front
  • Cannot see through walls with Sonar goggles
  • No option to "execute" with Mark & Execute; can still mark however
  • Last Known Position ghost is disabled: Surprise! It's been in all the games the entire time! You just couldn't see it until it was in Conviction.


Co-op/Deniable Ops
  • There are 14 distinct co-op missions that are completely different from the single player and SvM maps.
  • Co-op maps were developed by Ubisoft Shanghai (SCPT, SCDA)
  • Your co-op partner is Isaac Briggs, who plays exactly the same as Sam Fisher and has the same customization options.
  • With the exception of the Isaac Briggs missions, many levels can be soloed and can be repeated for points/money for customization.
  • Devs don't want co-op to become a 'follow the leader' mentality where one player knows everything and does the majority of the work; greater emphasis on co-op moves to traverse environment or situations where players are asked/encouraged to split apart for periods of time to accomplish tasks.
  • Mark and Execute no longer works the same in Conviction, you can only execute the targets you have marked. For enemies like the heavy that require two shots to kill will require some timing on behalf of both partners.
  • There will be paths in some of the soloable maps that are inaccessible because they require co-op moves to access.
  • Co-op missions are given by Grim, Isaac Briggs, Charlie and Kobin with their own flavour to it. The Deniable Ops label has been abandoned but analogues are very similar to how they worked in Conviction, but with a better spin on it:
    • The majority of the missions will be narrative based and will feature a mix of play styles. These missions cannot be soloed. (Co-op campaign)
    • Grim's missions are very old school SC (ghost style), there are usually extreme restrictions such as no-kills or instant-fail upon detection. (Infiltration mode but with objectives, no forced terrorist hunt)
    • Kobin's missions are more panther style, not much is revealed. (probably traditional terrorist hunt from Conviction)
    • Charlie's missions are more assault style though they have confirmed they can still be ghosted, but (my note) the overall theme is probably more action-oriented. (maybe a horde mode or that EMP defense mode I never tried)


Spies Vs. Mercs
  • Two versions with similar general map layouts but laid out similarly and lit differently depending on game mode.
  • Original creator of SvM (Gunther Galipot) is back as director of SvM along with Ubisoft Montreal.
  • Basic premise involves the spies (play in third person) hacking 3 terminals in any order, mercs (play in first person) have to prevent that, then teams switch.
  • There will be extensive custom match options provided.
  • Apparent changes since PT/CT/DA SvM:
    • Both sides have unlimited lives so spies trying to kill mercs and burn their lives no longer possible; have to hack instead.
    • Hacks are now initiated on the spot, but wireless after it has started, so the spy can go off and try to hide. The area is cordoned off and the other nodes cannot be hacked simultaneously.
    • The spy who initiates the hack has to stay within the area to finish it; if killed there is a small grace period where someone can continue the hack before it resets.
    • Spies have a knife that can kill mercs up close, but usually difficult. They also have environmental attacks (ledge grabs, death from above) while most merc kills are either weapon-based and they have more humiliating melee finishers.
    • When mercs are killed, they spectate based on security cameras in the level instead of on their teammates.
  • Classic variation (2v2):
    • Extremely light-and-shadow based, maps are lit appropriately that spies can blend or hide in the shadows, more claustrophobic feeling
    • Mercs armed with flashlights, though apparently they can be turned off to hide and ambush spies as well.
    • Spies do not have offensive guns (only a knife), carry only non-lethal weapons like shockers and gadgets; also armed with night vision goggles.
    • Limited to no customization involved, at least with the economy system.
  • Blacklist variation (4v4):
    • Maps aren't lit as extremely as classic mode and the pace is a little faster with 8 players, slightly opened up with less dark shadows and layout.
    • Both sides come with pre-set classes that have their own gadgets and abilities.
    • Takes full advantage of customization with create-a-class slots unlocked fairly soon after playing, similar to SP where you can customize all body slots plus a special ability, total of twelve slots (6 each, 3 available and 3 unlockable)
    • Weapon customization similar or on-par with what exists in Ghost Recon: Future Soldier gunsmith.
    • Spies now can equip regular guns but mercs more armoured, better handling than spies with guns.
    • Spy Presets:
      • Intel Scout - tracks enemies
      • Predator - stronger at CQC, has a digital camo suit that allows you go temporarily go invisible
      • Saboteur - distrupt or take out enemy gadgets and equipment
    • Merc Presets:
      • Peacemaker - strongest merc with extra armour, adrenaline shots to boost stats
      • Hunter - has drones that can be used to mark and track spies or detonate them
      • Distruptor - can distrupt spies equipment and HUD

Big fat list of media:


Screenshots








06/10 -
There is a free mobile companion game out on iOS (and soon to Android) called Spider-Bot.

Sober fucked around with this message at Jul 7, 2013 around 21:49

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.


(Thanks to fellow goon Captain Swing for the awesome gif banners)

What is Splinter Cell?
Splinter Cell is a stealth-action game series where you play Sam Fisher, the grumpiest old US spy. In the world of Splinter Cell, information warfare is everything, or so the cinematics between missions tell me, and it's all up to Sam Fisher to sneak around to places where no others can. In fact, you have the Fifth Freedom, which is basically permission to do whatever it takes to protect your country. For a lot of people, this poster included, Splinter Cell might be one of the first stealth games they were weaned on. Others may have come from other camps, such as the MGS ones, or the Thief series. For Splinter Cell, at least, stealth is encouraged and is used to help you get around levels to complete whatever objectives you have but the series relies on gadgets to help you get around. Things like remote cameras you can shoot onto a wall (that also can produce noise and distract) or being able to fire non-lethal things to incapacitate the enemy. Or you can use sneak up behind them and decide someone's fate, whether that be a knockout blow, a gunshot to the head, or something else. The first game come out in 2002 (2003 on PC), so now the franchise is 10 years old and I also feel old.

The Games
(This is post details the older releases)

Splinter Cell

Featuring:
  • The first appearance of Sam Fisher, what else do you need? Probably one of the first games that really relied on shadows as more than just eye-candy.
  • The coolest level where you infiltrate the CIA and you have to ghost it.
  • Some crazy plot which takes place mostly in Georgia (the country)
Should I play it?
If you are new to stealth, I might have to say no, unless you come in with a very open mind. This is especially true if you weren't much of a fan of games until the 360/PS3 generation, as the gameplay may be more aged than you might like. If you are intent on playing it, try finding the Splinter Cell HD Trilogy for consoles, or buy it on PC during a Steam sale or something.

Splinter Cell: Pandora Tomorrow

Featuring:
  • The debut of Spies versus Mercs, an asymmetrical multiplayer mode. Terrible confession time: I was never much of an SvM player.
  • A really cool train mission, but everything else was rather hard to remember. Or I only played through the once.
  • President David Palmer/Snake Doctor as your handler (they had different VOs except Sam this game)
Should I play it?
Sort of the same answer as SC1, as SCPT is basically more of the same. Comes included in the HD rerelease, but for PCs, apparently shadows or something are bugged on modern systems. Your only option seems to be to find a boxed copy, if you really want it, but I found nothing particularly memorable about it. Probably safe to skip.

Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory

Featuring:
  • The goddamn gold standard for stealth games, in my opinion. Best levels, best music (Amon Tobin), best goddamn everything. The Sam Fisher head could've used some work in retrospect, but that is it's only bad mark I can give it.
  • A knife. You use it to shank fools if you so please. Or you can open up tents and stuff and sneak in. In fact, they vastly expanded the gadgets you could use and just generally made stealth gaming more accessible.
  • The voices in your ear not taking everything so goddamn serious: Sam joking about being set up on dates with fat girls via your communications expert, or having her tease you about being an old man, Sam just being grumpy the entire time, or joking about your handler being divorced way too many times while in the middle of a mission.
  • Co-op mode: ran concurrent with the game's story as you played two other different splinter cells. Also, your voice chat could be heard by guards, so whisper.
  • Did I mention it's the best loving Splinter Cell game, if not the best stealth game in recent memory?
Should I play it?
If you weren't paying attention, not sure if this is the game for you. Like I said, this is the best SC game to date, and probably the best stealth game to date (tied with a few others). Most levels are multi-layered and take advantage of the fact you can manipulate the environment with your gadgets or if push comes to shove, you can viciously murder everyone with your knife. Probably the most accessible game as well, though you might be a bit more fragile than you would expect from guy with gun games. You can essentially ghost through all the levels, no one ever even knowing you were there, which is the most satisfying thing to do. Or again, you can viciously murder the hell out of everyone, which is a fun thing sometimes. Co-op is a blast but supposedly the servers for that and SvM are no longer online or something. The characters also fortunately don't take themselves too seriously even with a war on the horizon or whatever the story is about. Comes with the HD Trilogy rerelease or can be found on most DD outlets or Steam for usually 3.50$ during a sale. Whether you are new to stealth, or somehow never played Splinter Cell games, start here. Be warned though, it is a bit hard to go back once you do (to the older games).

Splinter Cell: Double Agent

Featuring:
  • The only decent Sam Fisher head model. Oh, and a semi-hub level that takes place between globe hopping missions.
  • Two versions of the game - X360/PS3/PC and a Gamecube/Wii/PS2/Xbox version that are vastly different. I am told the latter is the superior version, but I only played the former on PC.
  • Day-time stealth: I guess I should give this game something, because there isn't much else I liked about the game. Stealth is simplified to 3 states - green/yellow/red for undetected, suspicious and alert. Maybe because of day time levels, maybe not.
  • You also manipulate loyalty bars but the Double Agent thing is a cover, but at least it provides some interesting X or Y objectives during missions.
  • The world's loving dumbest minigame that you probably want to just youtube or gamefaqs because it's not worth the trouble.
Should I play it?
If you enjoyed Chaos Theory, you might like it. It is the same thing as before, but you might not like it. The story takes some interesting twists and turns at times but not what you were expecting from a Splinter Cell game, though some of the double-agenting is fun at times. The hub building you return to between missions changes and you still have to sneak around it occasionally to do good-guy things. Unfortunately everything is overwrought and melodramatic because of the situation you're in. I have only played it once, so I might be wrong and it might be oodles of fun, but it comes off weak coming from Chaos Theory no matter what. You can find copies on 360/PS3/PC, though apparently the PC port is weak/inferior or something, but you should be able to brute force it. IMO, the weakest game of the series even though it's most like the previous, which is the best, and the following one which is nothing like it.

Splinter Cell: Conviction

Featuring:
  • HoboSam FisherPanther: The crystallization of "Panther" stealth, aka Predatory Stealth. If you've played the Batman: Arkham games, it's similar except you have a gun and you murder the poo poo out of everyone instead of knocking them unconscious. Seen by the hardcore stealth fans as the loving worst thing ever, the developers wanted to take stealth in another direction, away from "grandma" stealth where you sit and wait and move slowly and plan to "panther" where you might do some planning, but you end up viciously murdering everyone without them knowing (at least hopefully).
  • A storyline reminiscent of 24. You basically play Jack Bauer who wants revenge throughout the whole game, so some of it is memorable.
  • Mark and Execute: Basically an extension of Panther Stealth that most people find completely repulsive one way or another because it either makes stealth too easy by letting you murder up to three or four people at the press of a button, or it just makes games seem like they play themselves. Basically you can mark guards, a nice way to keep track of them. If you melee kill one, you can now 'execute' and whichever marked targets are in line-of-sight and range will get instantly murdered in a cinematic fashion.
  • Some cool interrogation scenes, projected text (think Fringe, etc.) in the missions.
  • Black and White to go stealth: some people liked it, most of the hardcore at it since it basically removed your night vision goggles (at least the mode), it looked hideous to most and it made their game/stealth accessible to those filthy common denominators.
  • Also they removed SvM, so you can get mad at that.
  • Very familiar guards
Should I play it?
If you like going on everyone, then you should. If for some reason Chaos Theory doesn't sit well with you, or you think the gameplay from it has aged too much to be fun, find someone to punch you in the junk, then try again. If it still doesn't appeal to you, I guess you could try Conviction, since it's basically Jack Bauer: The Game (not to be confused with 24: The Game on PS2). Certain elements like Last Known Position or going Black and White are supposed to make stealth more accessible somehow. Occasionally the work, but unlike stealth in the previous games, the whole point here is to sneak around mostly to figure out who to gently caress up, and then promptly gently caress them up. There may be an option to go loud with weapons, but that sounds suicidal regardless. The story/single player is meh, but the Deniable Ops mode (co-op or solo) is fun, or so I hear, as it plays more like Chaos Theory - get detected and you're done for/fail, featuring more sandboxy missions as well.


Useful Links
The official Splinter Cell site
Splinter Cell on Wikipedia
The Splinter Cell Wikia
The Stealth Letters: Part 1 and Part 2, a talk with the designers on some stealth games ... about stealth. Featuring the designers on Mark of the Ninja, Monaco, Blacklist (which gives me hope they'll do stealth justice again) and Dishonored.

Sober fucked around with this message at Jun 11, 2013 around 17:01

Utnayan
Sep 26, 2002


I really enjoyed Splinter Cell 1-3. Double Agent was an ok game, but as you said, the latter versions were supposedly very superior (I never played that version - only the 360 version which was underwhelming) and Conviction lost Merc Vs Spy multiplayer for a co-op story mode and turned Sam Fisher into Jason Bourne. I actually did my first and only midnight release pick up for conviction when it came out I was so fired up for it. All in all, it wasn't a bad game, just different for the series, but you could basically take Batman Arkham asylum, reskin it, and have Conviction.

The highlight of this series for me was Pandora Tomorrow playing with Goons that I still keep in regular contact with today, which then progressed a tad into Chaos Theory. But folks like HardKarma, Dextor, Dvlos, Megaman Jockstrap, Wafflezone, Dogen, and others I am forgetting - is absolutely * The * best time I have ever had in a multiplayer Xbox game. They also would give maps out for free and expanded the game a bit. But really, it was an awesome and fresh take on multiplayer, and I really hope it returns in all it's Pandora Tomorrow glory in Blacklist. With that said, it is going to be weird controlling a Sam Fisher without Ironside voicing him directly.

Utnayan fucked around with this message at Feb 6, 2013 around 21:47

Yodzilla
Apr 29, 2005

Now who looks even dumber?


Sober posted:

The world's loving dumbest minigame that you probably want to just youtube or gamefaqs because it's not worth the trouble.

I thought for sure you were going to link to the mine building minigame but drat I must have blocked out the hacking one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=couhcrdC7Qc#t=266s

gently caress Double Agent. That was one of the first 360 games I owned and I hated every second of it.


e: I remember Pandora Tomorrow being mostly good but the last level was buggy as gently caress for me for some reason. Maybe it got patched at some point but I distinctly remember having to run through that level murdering everyone because they could see me through walls and all kinds of other crap.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.



Great timing since I've just started trying to get into Chaos Theory and I'm struggling a bit with getting used to the keyboard controls. Is is possible (or even recommended) to try and "ghost" through the game on a first playthrough or should I just take things as they come?

Utnayan
Sep 26, 2002


Jerusalem posted:

Great timing since I've just started trying to get into Chaos Theory and I'm struggling a bit with getting used to the keyboard controls. Is is possible (or even recommended) to try and "ghost" through the game on a first playthrough or should I just take things as they come?

I would grab an Xbox USB Wired controller. It will play a lot better for you.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.



Utnayan posted:

I would grab an Xbox USB Wired controller. It will play a lot better for you.

I had exactly the opposite reaction, I'd held off playing it for a year till I got a controller and when I finally got one, the game felt awful using it (plus not every action has an associated button). I actually prefer kb/m in most games anyway, I was just having trouble getting my head around all the various things you can do in the game, even after watching the video tutorials.

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

FLAVA FLAV!!!!!

I remember playing the Chaos Theory versus like mad. It was very fun initially, but after a while, people got super good and some of the problems with balance started appearing in the game. Like many of the maps were usually lovely for one side.

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.

Jerusalem posted:

Great timing since I've just started trying to get into Chaos Theory and I'm struggling a bit with getting used to the keyboard controls. Is is possible (or even recommended) to try and "ghost" through the game on a first playthrough or should I just take things as they come?
The thing about games like SC or Hitman where everyone goes on about how the only true path is doing it a certain way are full of poo poo out super patient. For SCCT, it's doable since 100% really has a lot of leeway like allowing nonlethal takedowns ( though true ghosting is not touching anyone at all). Plus you can quicksave/quickload at will, but the charm of ghosting really comes from familiarity first, so just take it as it comes IMO. The levels are great enough that they warrant replaying.

diarmuidqq
Aug 13, 2006



I'm super depressed about Ironside not being the voice of Fisher in the new game. I've grown so used to his gravelly sarcasm that it's going to be weird hearing someone else, it might not feel like Fisher any more

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005



One of the many great things about Chaos Theory is, like Deus Ex, the many different ways you can approach a mission.Also, I like my stealth games on the grandma side rather than the panther side - I like to take my time and either ghost through a level or knock everyone out.

It's true that Deniable Ops is a bit closer to old-school SC...I quite like it. I even made some melee-only Deniable Ops walkthroughs starting here, but my approach is fairly slow and methodical (i.e., probably boring). I thought the single player campaign for Conviction was pretty terrible, though. I disliked Double Agent but the first time I played it, I don't think my computer could handle it because the framerate was pretty dismal. That aside, it lacked a lot of the freedom of Chaos Theory...it really felt like you were being shoehorned in the way they wanted you to play the game. The obstacle course at the beginning was pretty goofy too.

Dice Dingus
May 3, 2010


Thank you for reminding me how many hours of my high school years I burned on running around blindly as a merc and getting completely ruined by my best friend while screaming like a slasher flick victim.

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005



Plank posted:

I'm super depressed about Ironside not being the voice of Fisher in the new game. I've grown so used to his gravelly sarcasm that it's going to be weird hearing someone else, it might not feel like Fisher any more

I suppose the 'official' explanation is that Ironside is a pacifist and he doesn't like the gun-happy direction the games are taking:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqDIDMqxH1o

But the real reason probably has something to do with "gimme mo money!"

pengun101
Feb 14, 2012


Seventh Arrow posted:

I suppose the 'official' explanation is that Ironside is a pacifist and he doesn't like the gun-happy direction the games are taking:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqDIDMqxH1o

But the real reason probably has something to do with "gimme mo money!"

Yeah, It's disappointing that he won't be in the new one, but on the other hand Blacklist still looks pretty good.

DEAR RICHARD
Feb 5, 2009

IT'S TIME FOR MY TOOLS


I actually just bought a copy of Chaos Theory last night for Xbox from Amazon. I figure $3.50 was more than justifiable.

Cinematic
Feb 26, 2006


One of my favorite parts of Chaos Theory is Sam loving with guards when he interrogates them. Some quality black humor, its too bad they kind of stopped doing that in Double Agent (maybe they didn't, that game is a blur to me) and completely stopped doing it in Conviction.

Smarmy Coworker
May 10, 2008

by XyloJW


Chaos Theory co-op over XBL (or split screen I GUESS) was the best thing in the entire world, forever. Just two spies dicking around, doing whatever. Walking up behind guards and whispering into the microphone so that they freak and turn around, only to get punched in the face or knifed. Good times.

Dice Dingus
May 3, 2010


ARACHNOTRON posted:

Chaos Theory co-op over XBL (or split screen I GUESS) was the best thing in the entire world, forever. Just two spies dicking around, doing whatever. Walking up behind guards and whispering into the microphone so that they freak and turn around, only to get punched in the face or knifed. Good times.

I never had friends patient enough for me. I could spend a couple hours on a particularly good mission, just so that I could soak in the ambiance and do absolutely everything right.

Something about the way Chaos Theory depicted offices and other ordinary places in their brief abandonment by night coupled with that soundtrack are probably a big part of why I'm such a sucker for corporate espionage stories and other cyberpunkery.

skooma512
Feb 8, 2012


I've played the first 3 at least 5 times. They are very good games.

Just wish they didn't have the shadow bug on Pandora for PC. I don't feel like dusting off my PS2 just for that.

TyroneGoldstein
Mar 30, 2005

Yo that security guard looks like Malcolm X!

Seventh Arrow posted:

One of the many great things about Chaos Theory is, like Deus Ex, the many different ways you can approach a mission.Also, I like my stealth games on the grandma side rather than the panther side - I like to take my time and either ghost through a level or knock everyone out.

It's true that Deniable Ops is a bit closer to old-school SC...I quite like it. I even made some melee-only Deniable Ops walkthroughs starting here, but my approach is fairly slow and methodical (i.e., probably boring). I thought the single player campaign for Conviction was pretty terrible, though. I disliked Double Agent but the first time I played it, I don't think my computer could handle it because the framerate was pretty dismal. That aside, it lacked a lot of the freedom of Chaos Theory...it really felt like you were being shoehorned in the way they wanted you to play the game. The obstacle course at the beginning was pretty goofy too.

That's the great thing I found about Conviction. I played the story once (God that Iraq segment was absolutely atrocious. Just horrible), but deniable Ops became a really nice drink beer and play after work thing for me. It was a hoot taking out baddies in sequence. Still, it doesn't make up for the change up in the game format.

Edit: Also, those videos are great, well done!

TyroneGoldstein fucked around with this message at Feb 7, 2013 around 03:32

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.

In regards to Ironside not being the voice anymore though, from what I could glean from videos from the devs, he's still there: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlUnTcjlkd8#t=10s

I think it's more of him supervising the character of Sam Fisher if anything. It seems like he's heavily invested in Sam Fisher that he doesn't really want to see him turn into a generic action hero even if he can't really commit to doing the full mo-cap experience. Looks like they changed the voice actress for Grim as well too. Ah well, can't have everything I guess.

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005



Cinematic posted:

One of my favorite parts of Chaos Theory is Sam loving with guards when he interrogates them. Some quality black humor, its too bad they kind of stopped doing that in Double Agent (maybe they didn't, that game is a blur to me) and completely stopped doing it in Conviction.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aM3Cl5wBgNU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSBRvZz-0_o

Best game ever

Alteisen
Jun 4, 2007



I have no hope for Blacklist, the whole game just screams we want the Call of Duty audience.

No Ironside is just the icing on the poo poo cake.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.



Wow, the mouse-wheel adjustment for walking speed makes a big difference in Chaos Theory. I made it through the lighthouse and got what I felt was a fairly respectable 75% score. I enjoyed the little touches, especially the guy who tells the story about the thunder storm when he was a child, and tells Fisher (if you choose to interrogate him) that he's been waiting for him to come out of the storm for him all his life.

In my end of level stats it said I killed somebody, when I made a conscious effort not to. Can people die if left out in the environment? Literally the only thing I can think of that might have killed somebody was that they were unconscious and left out in the rain with their mouth open!

Chafey
Jun 14, 2005

greenface does not understand


As someone who played through and beat every game up through Chaos Theory, I am so very, very excited about blacklist. I just couldn't play more than an hour of Double Agent, the gameplay seemed way too dated by the time I finally got around to it, and conviction was okay for a little while but I had way too much fun with MGS4 to really warrant more attention. I can't wait to knife through some more fools tents.

BIPOLAR EDIT: I'm actually really not that interested in Blacklist, I guess I saw some cliff climbing or something? Those instakill chains look kinda cool, I dunno though it's probably gonna just go under my radar when it's released.

Chafey fucked around with this message at Feb 7, 2013 around 11:11

LordPants
Mar 5, 2011

Four more years boys, four more years.


I used to get the "Nighty-Night" button and the "Break the fool's neck" button mixed up sometimes. I guess that could have been it?

Ninja fetus
Jan 22, 2005
Legalize murder

I'm not sure about this one. Conviction took the Call of modern warfare approach. It felt very little like Splinter cell to me and I hated it. Pretty much every succesful series gets the OMG EPIC CINEMATIC experience these days and I really don't like it.

DJ Ramshackle
Nov 26, 2009

Not really a DJ

not quite a ramshackle


I used to hate Pandora Tomorrow when it came out because I believe they swapped the jump and crouch buttons from the first game on Xbox so I would constantly gently caress up and get spotted. I do love all the games though, I even dug Double Agent. Chaos Theory reigns supreme. The choice with Shetland was badass.

GUI
Nov 5, 2005



I'm sure Blacklist will be fun on its own, but the fact that in the previews they more or less said that they made all the shooty and killing features before the non-lethal ones says a bit about the direction they want the series to go. There was also one of the people involved in the game in the GiantBomb forums last year talking about how they want it to be a blockbuster that appeals to a large audience, so I'm expecting Conviction but with the ability to not kill people shoe-horned in.
At the very least I hope they avoid making Sam a bloodthirsty red-blooded-American-kill-all-foreigners douchebag like the previews are making him look like.

rizuhbull
Mar 30, 2011



When the xbox came out Splinter Cell was one of the first games that actually felt next-gen. Plus it had that totally cringe-worthy "name of the game" opening. It was 2002's Dragula. But yeah, next gen. Lighting that affected gameplay, intricate character movements like wall jumping, so much attention to detail coupled with ridiculously high production values. Yeah it was on a bunch of platforms but if you really wanted to play it in all it's glory you needed it on Xbox.

I gamefly'd the HD collection a couple months ago. Way more difficult than a modern gamer would think. I beat it as a young teenager but gave up after a few tries during the CIA mission (I think it was). Games today really do spoil us. Even on normal, the original Splinter Cell will gently caress your poo poo. I think most of it's difficulty came from it's linearity. There was really only one, maybe two at most, ways to get through the sections. I remember Chaos Theory's co-op was worse if you had the PS2 version. Man, all those sweet co-op moves you could do with a partner. Why don't we have that in gaming anymore? It had so many features that no one bothers with now-a-days. It's sad how advanced games got, only to have it recess. Last-generation was the golden age of games . Pupils looked around, faces contorted, enemies would writhe and suffer on the ground (Hitman Blood Money). You could even give voice commands to your A.I. Squad in Socom, and they were pretty drat competent about it too! You could do all that with a $30 headset that came with the game. You didn't need no poo poo tracking $150+ bullshit (gently caress you, Kinect and Move).

Conviction is a fun game, but it's a bad Splinter Cell. It's the DMC of Devil May Cry. A good game on it's own, but a poo poo return. Splinter Cell had those Hollywood-climactic moments too, but they were always spread out, usually towards the end of the game. The contrast between stealth and wrecking fools was glorious. It's the rock show moment in Alan Wake, that big payoff. Plus it made the game's memorable. I remember reading the previews for Conviction. Ubisoft had all these ambitious ideas like melee weapons and whatnot. Someone should post that stuff if you can find it. I'd like to know I'm not the only one to remember.

rizuhbull fucked around with this message at Feb 7, 2013 around 12:07

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.

The Bank mission from Chaos Theory is still fantastic, which I played last night. Infiltrating it is a bit one-way (well you could go through a front door I suppose), but as soon as you step inside, you pretty much have free reign of the building and a ton of objectives to do, some in any order you wish, others are objectives of opportunity. Hell, I must've replayed this mission like 4, 5 times and I never realized there was another path to get around, even avoiding an entire wing that I used to always go through to get to an objective - you can skulk around through some vents I never found to get where you want, which blew my mind that I completely missed it (or at least forgot about it).

Also the banter from Sam and the crew throughout the mission was just absolutely great.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f0902iSlnw0 one good playthrough, not too much commentary, all stealth on expert. The bank mission is so drat good.

Dice Dingus
May 3, 2010


rizuhbull posted:

When the xbox came out Splinter Cell was one of the first games that actually felt next-gen. Plus it had that totally cringe-worthy "name of the game" opening. It was 2002's Dragula. But yeah, next gen. Lighting that affected gameplay, intricate character movements like wall jumping, so much attention to detail coupled with ridiculously high production values. Yeah it was on a bunch of platforms but if you really wanted to play it in all it's glory you needed it on Xbox.

I gamefly'd the HD collection a couple months ago. Way more difficult than a modern gamer would think. I beat it as a young teenager but gave up after a few tries during the CIA mission (I think it was). Games today really do spoil us. Even on normal, the original Splinter Cell will gently caress your poo poo. I think most of it's difficulty came from it's linearity. There was really only one, maybe two at most, ways to get through the sections. I remember Chaos Theory's co-op was worse if you had the PS2 version. Man, all those sweet co-op moves you could do with a partner. Why don't we have that in gaming anymore? It had so many features that no one bothers with now-a-days. It's sad how advanced games got, only to have it recess. Last-generation was the golden age of games . Pupils looked around, faces contorted, enemies would writhe and suffer on the ground (Hitman Blood Money). You could even give voice commands to your A.I. Squad in Socom, and they were pretty drat competent about it too! You could do all that with a $30 headset that came with the game. You didn't need no poo poo tracking $150+ bullshit (gently caress you, Kinect and Move).

Conviction is a fun game, but it's a bad Splinter Cell. It's the DMC of Devil May Cry. A good game on it's own, but a poo poo return. Splinter Cell had those Hollywood-climactic moments too, but they were always spread out, usually towards the end of the game. The contrast between stealth and wrecking fools was glorious. It's the rock show moment in Alan Wake, that big payoff. Plus it made the game's memorable. I remember reading the previews for Conviction. Ubisoft had all these ambitious ideas like melee weapons and whatnot. Someone should post that stuff if you can find it. I'd like to know I'm not the only one to remember.

Thanks to you dweebs I popped Chaos Theory into my 360 last night, and you aren't kidding, I couldn't get through the Maria Narcissa without raising an alarm thanks to all those drat narrow corridors and fiddly angled lights.
But it also reminded me why ever since this game I've always loved the stealth class in any game that gives you option, Sam Fisher. The man who can slip inside anyplace, anywhere, and not just accomplish a mission quietly, but so quietly that nobody even knew there was an infiltration.
He's grim, nihilistic even (what else drives a guy with a daughter to go on one-man suicide missions?), but he makes his own fun.
Much more fun than ROGUE MAN ON THE EDGE DEAD DAUGHTER Sam from the recent games.

...Also, it's set in the near future of 2007.

lolasaurusrex
Feb 8, 2013



I'm actually half way through the first game as we speak. I completely ignored these games when I played on consoles, it's only now that I have a decent PC that I'm playing through them.

I agree that the first one is somewhat inaccessible. The keyboard controls are really clunky, it makes controlling Sam feel like a glass tank. The game itself is awesome though, which more than makes up for it.

I really enjoy playing as a character who isn't a cold blooded killer. The non-lethal approach is emphasised in the tutorial, which just isn't something you see these days. I'll be very disappointed if I get all the way to Blacklist just to find out the gave SC the CoD treatment.

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.

There seem to be moments where you have to kind of shoot your way through, or the enemy knows you are there even in all the previous SC games when you cross a certain threshold in a mission.

The same guy I linked earlier seemed to be very good about stealthing through everything but even the first game has moments where the enemy will always know you are there (he actually cheesed a script on an earlier mission to get by, but obviously not the intended effect). Obviously Chaos Theory is probably a lot better about being able to ghost it but it's not like them adding action moments to the games are the devs viciously raping the series or anything.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6ILf8kxGpM#t=1342s - SC1 spoilers of course

You got to shoot up fools here apparently as he said he spent hours trying to non-lethal his way through most of that mission, and no one else seemed to be able to figure a way out either.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.



I think I spent roughly 4 hours total doing the bank mission in Chaos Theory trying to get it exactly right. Not because I felt I had to, but because I really wanted to. Getting through every objective without hurting anyone or alerting anyone (other than freaking out a couple of guards with whistles to lead them away from their workstations) or setting off any alarms was so satisfying. Are the other levels as good as the bank? Because that was a blast.

Nelson Mandingo
Mar 27, 2005



I was just talking to a friend another day about Splinter Cell. It's a shame that Ubisoft doesn't do a kickstarter for old school Rainbow Six games and a Splinter Cell with a serious focus on stealth. I'd chip in $60 for each of them. Chaos Theory really is the gold standard for a stealth game. Maybe the next Thief won't be utter crap!...I hope.


Probably my favorite moment of Splinter Cell Chaos Theory was in Kokubo Sosho. I always intentionally get captured so Sam can surprise his torturer. It's always a serious and hilarious moment. Imagine you were that guy, what utter terror you'd feel? I think what's even cooler is the fact you can avoid capture entirely. It really was just a good game.

Nelson Mandingo fucked around with this message at Feb 12, 2013 around 07:23

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.

Jerusalem posted:

I think I spent roughly 4 hours total doing the bank mission in Chaos Theory trying to get it exactly right. Not because I felt I had to, but because I really wanted to. Getting through every objective without hurting anyone or alerting anyone (other than freaking out a couple of guards with whistles to lead them away from their workstations) or setting off any alarms was so satisfying. Are the other levels as good as the bank? Because that was a blast.
Bank is absolutely top tier fun. There is a mission after the next (mission 5, aka Displace) has the same feel to the level, but not entirely open/non-linear as Bank was. I've almost finished replaying it (trying to ghost the end of Bathhouse is a chore IMO, flashbacks are hitting me again), but I can't recall if the last mission is like that or not, though the mission after Bank is still pretty drat good (Penthouse).

I wouldn't always completely expect large open buildings in Splinter Cell, that was always more of a Hitman (Blood Money) thing. Most of the missions area still fairly linear in CT, but usually with tons of paths to get to where you need to go, which is what I hope they are going to do right with the next game.

On a weird note, I did see there were ghosting videos of Conviction on Youtube, so it looks doable. (well, as far as it would let you ghost, there seem to be quite a few forced moments where you have to clear rooms to progress).

Sober
Nov 19, 2011

First touch: Life.
Second touch: Dead again. Forever.

Double post to bump because I found some recent news on Blacklist:

http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming...cell-blacklist/

Talks a bunch about stealth coming back, about the Mocap/VO actors they are using (Sam and Grim are both replaced much to probably most of our chagrin), there's a bit on why features in Ubi games seem to melt into one another, and they talk about how Ubi is in charge of the Splinter Cell movie and Tom Hardy is in it.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.



Ugh, 85% on the Displace level in Chaos Theory because I didn't use the EEV to listen in on the two guards talking about Milan Nedich. I DID listen to their conversation, just not with the EEV, and kind of assumed that it was just the start of finding out more about him in the level otherwise.

Does it change anything in the cutscene that follows or the Hokkaido level or is just extra added flavor to the game?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Seventh Arrow
Jan 26, 2005



As far as I know, it doesn't change any of the content at all.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«33 »