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Splicer posted:It was: It's in the post you quoted, you need Retraced Image + ________. That said, even in silver-bordered land you need some pretty serious bending of the rules to make it work. You can't fetch non-Magic cards with Death Wish to begin with (for the same reason you can't name "orange" when asked to name a color; magic cards don't use plain language definitions for terms like "card"), and on top of that you'd have to convince the opponent that non-Magic cards have a name that the game can work with. (Obviously this is much easier with a Yugioh card or something than with the two of clubs).
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Mar 18, 2013 19:24
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The other weird thing about the "removed from game" zone was that, while it originally was pretty accurately named, it got less and less so as time went on and they started printing cards with functionality similar to for example Fiend Hunter (noted above) so that sometimes the cards were "removed from the game" and then came back later, which just seems strange. It got to the point where WOTC itself realized the absurdity and started riffing on it itself, for example with the silver-bordered card AWOL:AWOL posted:Remove target attacking creature from the game. Then remove it from the removed-from-game zone and put it into the absolutely-removed-from-the-freaking-game-forever zone.
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Mar 19, 2013 18:36
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Another nice bit of Magic absurdity, this one potentially doable in a tournament game. Take this guy: -He's a medium-sized creature with the Golem type -When he comes into play, he brings two friends with him, also medium-sized Golem-type creatures -Whenever any Golem-type creature gets targeted by a spell, a bunch of copies get made so that the spell targets every golem-type creature He saw a bit of play - three medium-sized creatures for five mana is a good deal, but his third ability is mostly a down-side. If they have a spell that kills a target creature, it clears them all out. But, what if instead we target one of them with this card:  Assuming you have enough mana, this card lets you target a creature and make five copies of the creature. So, if we target a golem with this card, we get: -Five copies of Precursor Golem (6 total) -Ten of his Golem-token friends (from targeting the original golems he came with) (12 total) -Ten additional golem-token friends (from the 5 copies of Precursor coming into play) (22 total) Pretty cool, but we're just getting started. Let's take that board and cast Rite of Replication with kicker targeting a Golem again. Precursor Golem's ability is what's called a triggered ability. That means that when the condition is met it triggers and does whatever it does. There's no restriction that each event only causes one trigger, even if they're identical triggers off of copies of the same card. So now, each of our six Precursor Golems copies the spell targeting every other Golem. So we end up with one Golem targeted by one Rite of Replication, and every other Golem in play targeted by six copies. Let's assume the initial target was one of the friends rather than an actual Precursor Golem: -You copy one friend five times (total 27 friends) -You copy 21 friends 30 times each (+630 friends, total 657) -You copy each of the six Precursor Golems 30 times (+180 Precursors, total 186) -Each of the 180 new Precursor Golems brings 2 friends (+360 friends, total 1017) Since each of the creatures we've made has 3 power, we now have a little over 3500 power on the table. Given players start with 20 life, that's probably more than you'll ever need. We could of course cast a third Rite of Replication but that's just silly. Instead, let's take advantage of the fact that every creature Rite of Replication makes is a token creature to seriously boost our production:   Both of these cards double the number of creature tokens we make whenever we make creature tokens. These effects are exponential in Magic, not additive, so if we have two of these in play we get four times the creature tokens, and if we have three we get eight and so forth. Let's say we have three. Then when we play the original Precursor Golem we get 16 friends, and when we play the first Rite of Replication we get +40 Precursor Golems and +80 friends. Needless to say, the second Rite now creates some stupid numbers of Golems. But if we really want to boost our numbers through the roof, it'd help a lot if we could get more copies of Doubling Season and/or Parallel Lives, in addition to getting more Golems...   There we go! With Opalescence, we can turn our Doubling Seasons and/or Parallel Lives into creatures, and with Xenograft (which is also a creature) we can give all our creatures the Golem type. Now when we cast that first Rite of Replication, we end up with: -41 Precursor Golems -96 Golem friends -123 "Double your Tokens" cards -41 Xenografts (Xenograft is mostly just along for the ride here, but you have to copy it, and the creature types stack, so you might as well have Mutant Ninja Turtle Golems or whatever you think is funny) Now when we do it again, we really need to go with scientific notation. If we target a Golem friend, we get (5*(2123)) copies of that golem, and (5*41*(2123)) copies of everything else. Assuming I'm reading my Windows calculator right, that's about 5*1037 copies of the original friend, plus 2*1039 copies of each of the 260 other creatures in play, which is roughly 5.5*1041 total creatures. According to a quick google search, the number of atoms in the observable universe is in the 1087-1088 range. If we have a third Rite of Replication, we blow that number out of the water. For those who are into practical applications, this means the game state is impossible to represent with actual individual tokens. (Of course, it was before the third Rite as well.) If you get an opponent who's willing to play along, you can also do this to crash Magic Online, though that isn't all that hard.
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Mar 19, 2013 19:32
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I ran out of word count and math ability, but the numbers in the above post are mostly estimates and a little low for the late ones. Once your Rites are copying Doubling Seasons it gets very hard to figure out because the order in which Rites resolve matters a lot; copies of Doubling Season get created and then double all the Rites that resolve after and it becomes a real clusterfuck. Basically those numbers are a bit low for the last scenario, though you still probably need three Rites to exceed the number of atoms in the observable universe.
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Mar 19, 2013 19:41
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Cactrot posted:Planeswalkers come into play with a number of loyalty counters indicated in the lower right, the + abilites add loyalty counters and the - abilities remove them, when a planeswalker has 0 loyalty counters on it, it dies. You also can only use one ability per turn, as a sorcery, and need to be able to remove enough counters to use a - ability. And they can be attacked like another player and damage makes them lose loyalty.
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Mar 19, 2013 21:55
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