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Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Motorcycles?!!?

In MY middle earth??!!


Darfur war orphans don't have relationships I guess? I'm 25 and I've been with her for five years. I'm not normally insecure at all, we've always trusted eachother implicitly and I've never had reason to suspect anything like this. I love this girl, we want to live our lives together, she's integrated into my entire life.

About a week ago I began suspecting something but it seemed preposterous; I now have evidence so blatent that I'm struggling to imagine any other explanation. I can't stop shaking and my world feels like it's completely collapsing. I haven't talked to her yet, she comes home in an hour or two and I intend to slink off to my mate's place before she does I can't face the inevitable.

I think I'm posting this because the only people I can talk to about this aren't responding and it feels like I'm going to lose my mind. I'm just shattered. I can't emphasize how ludicrous this would have seemed if someone had proposed it even a few weeks ago.

What do I do e/n? If I'm wrong about this and there is some sort of bizarre, unlikely explanation and she isn't cheating on me, bringing it up directly and starting an argument would end in disaster. If everything is fine, I don't want to endanger my relationship on the basis of (what will then seem like) insane paranoia; she would be insulted and angry that I would think it at all.

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Reene
Aug 26, 2005



What exactly is the proof? Why can't you go "Hey so I have <proof>, could you please explain this?" You don't have to get all up in her face going "YOU CHEATIN'" to start a dialogue about whatever it is you found.

Putting this off will just make it worse, so don't do that. If you are planning on spending the rest of your life with this person then you should be willing to have uncomfortable discussions with them.

Nude Bog Lurker
Jan 2, 2007

King Kong of Megadongs

Gobblin' them mega schlongs

Makin' sure they mega long

Stroke 'em if they mega strong


Next time don't google your ex's name on butt-gently caress-sluts-go-nuts.org, idiot.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Motorcycles?!!?

In MY middle earth??!!


Reene posted:

What exactly is the proof? Why can't you go "Hey so I have <proof>, could you please explain this?" You don't have to get all up in her face going "YOU CHEATIN'" to start a dialogue about whatever it is you found.

Putting this off will just make it worse, so don't do that. If you are planning on spending the rest of your life with this person then you should be willing to have uncomfortable discussions with them.

My proof is the hard part. Since I began suspecting who she was sleeping with I noticed her behaviour changed around this person regarding txting and seeing them. I feel utterly terrible for doing this because it violates our trust but I checked her phone when she was in the shower; they constantly call eachother 'babe' and 'hun' and at one point she said 'I can't wait to see you, can't stop thinking about it'. She sees this person every two or three days and despite them being such 'good mates', they were absent at her birthday party (last night). Every time I mention hanging out with them she brushes it off as being inconvenient or awkward or what have you, despite them living five minutes down the road. I've met and socialise with all of her friends aside from this one.

If I tell her I went through her phone she would lose her poo poo at me, so I don't want to do that unless I have something else that makes me certain. But I don't know how to bring it up in a way that doesn't seem odd and contrived.

Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Dec 22, 2005

Handsome Fighters Never Lose Battles


Good thing she's not your wife. Go on and share what proof you have, or this topic has no legs.

EDIT: Ahh you just did. Sounds like you're in denial, just confront her with the phone evidence anyway. I'm not going to be so bold as to declare it a certainty, but my money's on cheating.

Slavvy
Dec 11, 2012

Motorcycles?!!?

In MY middle earth??!!


Jeffrey posted:

Good thing she's not your wife. Go on and share what proof you have, or this topic has no legs.

EDIT: Ahh you just did. Sounds like you're in denial, just confront her with the phone evidence anyway. I'm not going to be so bold as to declare it a certainty, but my money's on cheating.

Yeah, but you aren't the one betting on your relationship. I've never been much of a gambler, I've always looked back on situations where the stakes were high and though 'I knew I should've taken that chance because in hindsight it seemed so obviously likely to succeed'. My fear of getting things wrong and ruining things for myself out of being foolish and insecure is crippling my actions. I'm now staying the night at my friend's place trying to figure out how to speak to her tomorrow.

Reene
Aug 26, 2005



If you're to the point where you're snooping on their phone (which isn't okay) then the trust is gone and you should probably just break up.

Vindicator
Jul 23, 2007



Let me get this straight. You have 'proof' that your fiancee is cheating on you, but instead of confronting her, you want to do what amounts to playing some bizarre game of hide and seek so that you don't have to see or talk to her and so the relationship doesn't end?

Face up to her. Either pack your poo poo or pack her poo poo, and when she walks through the front door, tell her you know what's going on and either you or her will not be spending the night there.

PS. I hope your 'proof' is actually proof. I think you're probably right but it's not absolute by any stretch.

Hyzenth1ay
Oct 24, 2008


That's... not proof, though? She's definitely having inappropriate conversations but you've got no real proof she's cheating.

Relax. Have a rest (take Benadryl if you can't sleep; no drinking). Talk with her tomorrow.

Kim Jong ill
Jul 28, 2010

NORTH KOREA IS ONLY KOREA.

Her friend was probably balls deep in your fiancee whilst you made this post and whenever else she could get away your pussy rear end. You should pack all your things and avoid confrontation at all costs, he's likely bigger, stronger and a more satisfying sexual partner than you and could probably beat you up.

Emacs Headroom
Aug 2, 2003



Slavvy posted:

What do I do e/n? If I'm wrong about this and there is some sort of bizarre, unlikely explanation and she isn't cheating on me, bringing it up directly and starting an argument would end in disaster. If everything is fine, I don't want to endanger my relationship on the basis of (what will then seem like) insane paranoia; she would be insulted and angry that I would think it at all.

Slavvy posted:

If I tell her I went through her phone she would lose her poo poo at me, so I don't want to do that unless I have something else that makes me certain. But I don't know how to bring it up in a way that doesn't seem odd and contrived.

This is not healthy. I hope you can see this to some extent. Yeah couples shouldn't snoop through each others texts / e-mails, but if you someone does it should be a "let's have a conversation about what the hell is bugging you" situation, not a "You bastard how dare you touch my phone!? We're through!!" situation.

It sounds like you're trapped living in fear of your own S/O. I really try not to be the E/N poster that immediately falls back to "therapy" and "sever" in every thread, but you're giving us some pretty big signs here.

At the very least try to grow some balls and have a conversation. Try to stay on topic and deal with your feelings about her and this dude first, before she launches into how you suck so much for suspecting her and reading her stuff (which it sounds like you expect she will). Also make preparations for a life apart, since I wouldn't bet money on your relationship lasting at this point.


edit: comedy option -- demand to smell her dick

Coffee Wolf
Oct 12, 2007

Mmmmm Banana


Slavvy posted:

My proof is the hard part. Since I began suspecting who she was sleeping with I noticed her behaviour changed around this person regarding txting and seeing them. I feel utterly terrible for doing this because it violates our trust but I checked her phone when she was in the shower; they constantly call eachother 'babe' and 'hun' and at one point she said 'I can't wait to see you, can't stop thinking about it'. She sees this person every two or three days and despite them being such 'good mates', they were absent at her birthday party (last night). Every time I mention hanging out with them she brushes it off as being inconvenient or awkward or what have you, despite them living five minutes down the road. I've met and socialise with all of her friends aside from this one.

If I tell her I went through her phone she would lose her poo poo at me, so I don't want to do that unless I have something else that makes me certain. But I don't know how to bring it up in a way that doesn't seem odd and contrived.

This sounds familiar enough for me. If I could gamble on this, I would go all in that you are right. You would be better off to confront her sooner than later.

Gibbis Fourthmeal
May 22, 2006


You already knew something was wrong before you went through her phone.

Slavvy posted:

My proof is the hard part. Since I began suspecting who she was sleeping with I noticed her behaviour changed around this person regarding txting and seeing them. [...] She sees this person every two or three days and despite them being such 'good mates', they were absent at her birthday party (last night). Every time I mention hanging out with them she brushes it off as being inconvenient or awkward or what have you, despite them living five minutes down the road. I've met and socialise with all of her friends aside from this one.

The goons that are shocked and appalled that you would look at her phone under these circumstances are probably also cheaters.

bunnybean
Mar 31, 2010



Emacs Headroom posted:

This is not healthy. I hope you can see this to some extent. Yeah couples shouldn't snoop through each others texts / e-mails, but if you someone does it should be a "let's have a conversation about what the hell is bugging you" situation, not a "You bastard how dare you touch my phone!? We're through!!" situation.

It sounds like you're trapped living in fear of your own S/O. I really try not to be the E/N poster that immediately falls back to "therapy" and "sever" in every thread, but you're giving us some pretty big signs here.

At the very least try to grow some balls and have a conversation. Try to stay on topic and deal with your feelings about her and this dude first, before she launches into how you suck so much for suspecting her and reading her stuff (which it sounds like you expect she will). Also make preparations for a life apart, since I wouldn't bet money on your relationship lasting at this point.
Pretty much all of this. This was supposed to be your wife soon. It's not common to file for divorce based on "he looked at my phone!" I mean yeah, be pissed, but if she'd end the relationship over it, that already says a lot about her commitment.

Of course, she is currently sitting at home likely wondering WTF is up and concocting a better story because you won't confront her.

Ktb
Feb 24, 2006


Gibbis Fourthmeal posted:

The goons that are shocked and appalled that you would look at her phone under these circumstances are probably also cheaters.

I have never cheated and don't think I ever would. I would probably break up with someone who went through my phone like this rather than talking to me though. It's a pretty massive red flag for a relationship. At best it's happened because there's a complete lack of trust. At worst it's the start of a downward spiral into an unbalanced relationship with a controlling partner. I have had friends whose relationships have soured pretty badly this way and ended up very unhealthy or even abusive so I would see any signs pointing down that road as deeply concerning.

I'm not weird about my phone, and my partner uses it from time to time, to find his phone or to answer calls when I am driving. But if I found him deliberately searching through it when I wasn't about I would be very upset. I trust him not to cheat on me and I also trust him to come to me with any concerns/problems in our relationship and not sneak around behind my back. Equally I would not go through a partner's phone and would take any concerns straight to them. If I can't trust their explanations/reassurances then there's no future in the relationship anyway whether they're cheating or not.

From people I have known that have done the phone checking thing, I have never known it to have a happy ending. You will never find proof that someone isn't cheating and it doesn't seem like the sort of thing where you look, find nothing and are satisfied. It only seems to cause more problems and raise more questions. Snooping on a partner is never going to fix the trust issues, just make them worse. Then you can end up in a situation where you are ever more suspicious but won't break up till you find proof so you stay in a relationship that is increasingly miserable and distrustful. As far as I'm concerned, once the trust is gone, it'd be best to just call it over rather than watch it die slowly and painfully.

I'm not saying he's a bad person for looking at her phone, I can understand why he did but it does pretty much mean the relationship is unhealthy and probably should be over. If you can't take your concerns directly to your partner because you don't trust them to be honest with you then what is the point of continuing the relationship anyway?

Emacs Headroom
Aug 2, 2003



Ktb posted:

At worst it's the start of a downward spiral into an unbalanced relationship with a controlling partner. I have had friends whose relationships have soured pretty badly this way and ended up very unhealthy or even abusive so I would see any signs pointing down that road as deeply concerning.
...
From people I have known that have done the phone checking thing, I have never known it to have a happy ending. You will never find proof that someone isn't cheating and it doesn't seem like the sort of thing where you look, find nothing and are satisfied. It only seems to cause more problems and raise more questions.

I agree it's not a good thing and it's a sign of problems with communication and trust. But if you're in a very serious relationship (in or heading for marriage) I wouldn't assume snooping alone meant things were unsalvageable. I think if you can recognize there's a problem you have a chance of working through it, as long as both people are on board.

Also some people are just nosy by nature (my wife is a little bit like this), and it doesn't necessarily mean they're controlling.

But none of this is really germane to the OP, so I'll stop yammering now.

Pick
Jul 19, 2009


Under the aforementioned circumstances, checking her phone actually seemed pretty prudent. It's not a nice thing to do, never is, but what is he supposed to do? Marry a woman who he (understandably) believes is seeing someone else?

HelloIAmYourHeart
Dec 29, 2008

Send us signals in the glow
of night windows


Slavvy posted:

But I don't know how to bring it up in a way that doesn't seem odd and contrived.

You could just be like, "Hey, your behavior regarding your friend is weird and I'm concerned" and state your case with the examples you gave there and leave out the phone stuff.

Or you could just break up.

dongsweep
Nov 27, 2004

~ P * R * I * D * E ~

Pick posted:

Under the aforementioned circumstances, checking her phone actually seemed pretty prudent. It's not a nice thing to do, never is, but what is he supposed to do? Marry a woman who he (understandably) believes is seeing someone else?

Yeah, I think people are too quick to jump on the whole "you checked phone, trust gone, relationship over" bandwagon. If it was eating him alive because of a ton of little inklings here and there (like all the previously mentioned data about them never hanging out together, her changing her attitude, etc.) then I think it was fair for him to confirm/deny his concerns. It isn't some random inspection, it was warranted.

I feel bad for you OP, it doesn't sound good. Muster up your anger, save face, confront her and be prepared to cut completely. If this person is cheating on you when you are supposed to be at one of the most enlightened states of your relationship then it will definitely be worse in ten or more years when a relationship is harder to maintain and takes more effort then just loving through everything.

By all means, do NOT let her get the upper hand in the conversation when you divulge the phone-confirmation. You are in the right here, you deserve answers, you deserve to walk out with dignity and know you can find someone better. May take awhile, but you will.

If you are capable of getting one person to marry you then you obviously have something going for you, you can find someone else that doesn't cheat. Plenty women do not.

Paperfeed
Apr 14, 2008


I think this is something that is really hard to judge. Sure it's easy to say "I'd confront my partner with any relationship issues, we trust each-other completely" but it's a what-if situation. The moment you're getting weird vibes from the partner you so wholly gave your trust and are seriously tripping up how they're acting I doubt it's so easy. Why? Because there's something going on that's causing that trust you have to be in doubt.

Let's put it this way: You trust your partner completely and then all of a sudden there are multiple clear signs that something *might* be going on. This is causing damage to your trust. Of course it depends on what kind of signs we're talking about, and what you're basing your doubt on. In this guy's case he strongly noticed a behavioral change specifically around one person. He became suspicious as the flags kept on raising and decided to try and confirm his suspicions. Unfortunately for him it appears his guts were right.

Basically what I'm saying is that I can understand someone going through their partners phone after getting a lot of signs that something is up. I'd say 99% of the time I've heard these stories, their 'instinct' has been right. If you spend years with a person you're bound to feel these sudden changes in behavior, etc. Unless they're exceptionally good at being a psychopath.

I'm saying this as someone that had their phone snooped through (and that has never snooped through someone else's phone). Note that in my case the situation was bit different because it was my crazy already-ex-girlfriend that snooped through my phone.

CravingSolace
Mar 3, 2012


Instead of just asking her about it and talking to her, you violated her privacy and went through her phone. Is she cheating? Probably. If you hadn't found anything in her phone, would your suspicions have gone away? I don't think so. You don't trust her. You have no business considering marriage with her. If you two can't be honest with one another then do yourselves a favor and break up with her.

Also, being afraid she'll yell at you for snooping through her phone (which she would) to the point where you can't bring yourself to tell her is a bad sign. Thank God you two aren't already married.

Break up and sever.

CravingSolace
Mar 3, 2012


Paperfeed posted:

I think this is something that is really hard to judge. Sure it's easy to say "I'd confront my partner with any relationship issues, we trust each-other completely" but it's a what-if situation. The moment you're getting weird vibes from the partner you so wholly gave your trust and are seriously tripping up how they're acting I doubt it's so easy. Why? Because there's something going on that's causing that trust you have to be in doubt.

Let's put it this way: You trust your partner completely and then all of a sudden there are multiple clear signs that something *might* be going on. This is causing damage to your trust. Of course it depends on what kind of signs we're talking about, and what you're basing your doubt on. In this guy's case he strongly noticed a behavioral change specifically around one person. He became suspicious as the flags kept on raising and decided to try and confirm his suspicions. Unfortunately for him it appears his guts were right.

Basically what I'm saying is that I can understand someone going through their partners phone after getting a lot of signs that something is up. I'd say 99% of the time I've heard these stories, their 'instinct' has been right. If you spend years with a person you're bound to feel these sudden changes in behavior, etc. Unless they're exceptionally good at being a psychopath.

I'm saying this as someone that had their phone snooped through (and that has never snooped through someone else's phone). Note that in my case the situation was bit different because it was my crazy already-ex-girlfriend that snooped through my phone.

I call bullshit.

I've had weird vibes from my husband once and sat down and talked to him about it like an adult. Turns out my fears weren't true (thankfully). If you have a gut feeling that your partner is cheating and you jump to violating your partner's privacy before talking to them first, then the relationship is already hosed.

Devyl
Mar 27, 2005

It slices!

It dices!

It makes Julienne fries!


Slavvy posted:

at one point she said 'I can't wait to see you, can't stop thinking about it'.

Sorry, but almost no one says that to someone they aren't sleeping/being with. There is no other real explanation for this. ESPECIALLY if she doesn't want to visit him/her as friends with you along and tries to come up with reasons not to. Also, you've been in a relationship 5 years with her. If she isn't comfortable with the idea of the two of you sharing phones by now, then imagine how easy it would be to hide something like cheating on you. Oh wait...

jabby
Oct 27, 2010


Pick posted:

Under the aforementioned circumstances, checking her phone actually seemed pretty prudent. It's not a nice thing to do, never is, but what is he supposed to do? Marry a woman who he (understandably) believes is seeing someone else?

If he has reason to believe she's cheating, that's already a bad sign. He should have talked to her and outright asked her what was going on. If she admits it, maybe they can work through it. If she said 'nothing' and he didn't believe her then they should break up since he doesn't trust her.

Going through someone's phone is unnecessary. It might confirm your suspicion they are cheating but an absence of evidence won't prove they aren't. Don't marry someone you don't trust.

Kallisti Applecore
Jul 22, 2007


My ex was like this, a self-proclaimed "Very private person" and would get super pissed if he thought I'd checked his phone or looked at emails. I don't know if this is always the case or not, but for him it meant there was so much to hide. And when he'd angrily explain what I'd seen (after a while I felt I had legit reasons to look. Like once he actually left a very damning Facebook conversation on his computer & I went to turn it off after he left for work), he'd gaslight the poo poo out of it. "That's not what you saw." "You're jumping to conclusions." "She said that to me, not me to her [referencing a "come by my place later" comment"]." ETC.

Oh, and was he cheating? You better believe it, buddy. The coworker who got pregnant with his child kind of says it all.

Bite the bullet & talk to her but be ready for a poo poo storm. Then get thee to the Breakup Thread. I'm truly sorry. I went through hell a hell of distrust with my ex for over a year before I finally severed.

gnarlyhotep
Sep 30, 2008

Mental toughness is the ability to accept the fact that you're human and that you're going to make mistakes -lots of 'em- all your life.

OP is this one of those deals where you asked her to marry you way too soon and you've been "engaged" for years?

Odrade
May 1, 2009


HelloIAmYourHeart posted:

You could just be like, "Hey, your behavior regarding your friend is weird and I'm concerned" and state your case with the examples you gave there and leave out the phone stuff.

I'd do this. Ask her to tell you honestly if there's anything you need to worry about. The message you quoted isn't exactly any more proof than what you already had; her behaviour around this person is weird and evasive and it's obvious to you.

If she seems to still be evasive, you need to decide what you want to do. Either way, if she's not doing anything wrong and is completely in love with you she's not going to split up with you because you've honestly brought concerns about your relationship to her. Try to make sure at least one of your friends is in the loop so they can give you support if it all goes pair shaped and look out for you in case she does mess you about.

You're right that the phone thing wasn't your finest hour. You know this, it's an understandable thing to do but hasn't really confirmed anything and is generally uncool. You've doubtless got enough on your plate that you're feeling down on yourself about though so don't sweat this too much.

LogisticEarth
Mar 28, 2004

Someone once told me, "Time is a flat circle".


I really don't see why the OP checking his fiance's phone is a problem. At that stage, you should be comfortable enough with the other person to be sharing phone details, emails, mail, etc. You're trusting this other person enough to be getting married after all. My fiance and I share access to most of our stuff, if you don't trust them with that, then why are you trusting them with marriage?

The OP was suspicious, he checked something that he should have access to, and he came up with indications that supported his suspicions. The only trust violated was if/when the fiance was cheating on him and didn't tell him about it.

I understand that "personal spaces" are important in a relationship, but if those spaces are being used to hide infidelity or other transgressions, then there's no problem in violating them.

LobsterTick
Jul 11, 2011

"We did something this year that was not based on animosity."

Snooping through her phone is pretty drat bad, but it's nothing compared to her regulary cheating. It's like if you decided to mess with someone by leaving a bag of poo poo in their closet and found a multiated corpse of your cat who you thought ran away there.

Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Dec 22, 2005

Handsome Fighters Never Lose Battles


LogisticEarth posted:

I really don't see why the OP checking his fiance's phone is a problem. At that stage, you should be comfortable enough with the other person to be sharing phone details, emails, mail, etc. You're trusting this other person enough to be getting married after all. My fiance and I share access to most of our stuff, if you don't trust them with that, then why are you trusting them with marriage?

The OP was suspicious, he checked something that he should have access to, and he came up with indications that supported his suspicions. The only trust violated was if/when the fiance was cheating on him and didn't tell him about it.

I understand that "personal spaces" are important in a relationship, but if those spaces are being used to hide infidelity or other transgressions, then there's no problem in violating them.

I don't think this is really true. Just because you are getting married doesn't mean you don't have a right to private communication. I'd be tempted to call a relationship where one isn't allowed that abusive.

OP, the reason you don't want to confront her isn't fear of her reaction to the phone snooping, it is fear that you are right. You know you have to do it so just suck it up and have that conversation, unless you want to continue being cuckolded by some random dude.

conrack
Oct 4, 2006


I'm currently in the fallout of a similar situation. Lots more backstory, but I went through her phone while she was in the shower and saw that she had been staying with a guy from work sometimes while she was supposed to be staying with a friend. Confronted her with a bullshit explanation, she denied but came clean after I told her I went through her phone. Claims no sex, cut him off for a while after that but has since started talking to him again. I told her I can't deal with it anymore, we're exchanging some stuff in a couple hours. It sucks, but her going behind your back is irreconcilable and more telling on her character than her reaction to your confrontation. Sever and move on.

I should post my own thread, been avoiding because it is a really dumb story. Off to do that now.

Devyl
Mar 27, 2005

It slices!

It dices!

It makes Julienne fries!


Jeffrey posted:

I don't think this is really true. Just because you are getting married doesn't mean you don't have a right to private communication. I'd be tempted to call a relationship where one isn't allowed that abusive.

OP, the reason you don't want to confront her isn't fear of her reaction to the phone snooping, it is fear that you are right. You know you have to do it so just suck it up and have that conversation, unless you want to continue being cuckolded by some random dude.

Everyone deserves privacy, but come the gently caress on. They planned on getting married and spending the rest of their lives together. Why would it be necessary to hide phone & e-mail conversations? Here's how I see it: I'm currently in a long-term relationship (3 1/2 years) and we share everything. I respect her privacy and she respects mine. However, we both know each other's passwords for e-mail accounts, Facebook, and the like. We know each others' unlock codes for our phones. We have a mutual understanding that we can access each others' accounts if we want to because we TRUST EACH OTHER. If you can't trust your significant other with something as simple as text messages on a phone, then you shouldn't be with them; period.

Paperfeed
Apr 14, 2008


CravingSolace posted:

I call bullshit.

I've had weird vibes from my husband once and sat down and talked to him about it like an adult. Turns out my fears weren't true (thankfully). If you have a gut feeling that your partner is cheating and you jump to violating your partner's privacy before talking to them first, then the relationship is already hosed.

Oh, don't misunderstand me, I'm not advocating snooping on phones. I totally recommend talking about it, if only because the reaction you get could also be very telling, before taking any other 'drastic' steps. But I don't think it's always a black and white situation (again, based on what you build your suspicions upon, how drastic the signs are, etc).

Regardless, this guy should just confront his fiancee with his feelings.

cda
Jan 2, 2010


If you want to salvage the relationship, you're going to need couples counseling no matter what. If you don't, well, that's understandable.

But just be aware that cheaters don't usually confess the truth when they're confronted and innocent partners don't have anything to confess, so your discussion is probably going to go roughly the same way whether she's cheating or not. If she is (seems like a good bet) she might change her texting habits but that's probably about it.

If I were you, I'd bring up the phone snooping, but not because of the "proof" it uncovered. Bring it up in the interests of full disclosure, because that's how healthy relationships work and regardless of how she's acting, you will probably feel better in the long run if you do the right things. Then, as much as possible, drop the phone thing and focus on the other behaviors that she's exhibiting which worry you. And insist on counseling regardless. If she doesn't want to work through this then that's pretty much all you need to know.

jabby
Oct 27, 2010


Devyl posted:

Everyone deserves privacy, but come the gently caress on. They planned on getting married and spending the rest of their lives together. Why would it be necessary to hide phone & e-mail conversations? Here's how I see it: I'm currently in a long-term relationship (3 1/2 years) and we share everything. I respect her privacy and she respects mine. However, we both know each other's passwords for e-mail accounts, Facebook, and the like. We know each others' unlock codes for our phones. We have a mutual understanding that we can access each others' accounts if we want to because we TRUST EACH OTHER. If you can't trust your significant other with something as simple as text messages on a phone, then you shouldn't be with them; period.

You might not be hiding stuff in a relationship, but there is a difference between using your partners phone to make calls or looking through their messages when they know you're doing it, and doing it behind their back because you suspect them of cheating.

Think of it like this: your partner might not mind you using her phone, but she probably would mind if every time she got a text you asked to see it and every time she got a call you came close and listened. It's the difference between them being open and you actively keeping tabs on what they do. One is a sign of trust on their part, one displays a lack of trust on yours.

Devyl
Mar 27, 2005

It slices!

It dices!

It makes Julienne fries!


jabby posted:

You might not be hiding stuff in a relationship, but there is a difference between using your partners phone to make calls or looking through their messages when they know you're doing it, and doing it behind their back because you suspect them of cheating.

Think of it like this: your partner might not mind you using her phone, but she probably would mind if every time she got a text you asked to see it and every time she got a call you came close and listened. It's the difference between them being open and you actively keeping tabs on what they do. One is a sign of trust on their part, one displays a lack of trust on yours.

Right. I understand that. Checking each and every text message and e-mail is very unhealthy and extremely obsessive. I'm just saying it's really odd for long-term couples to not share security information. If I was dating someone for 3-4 months then yeah, I wouldn't be handing out passwords & unlock codes for my stuff either. But if you plan on spending your lives together and you've already been together for years (like we have), why not? There's been several times when I've had to have my significant other send an e-mail for me while I was on the road or make a phone call for me because I was driving. Plus I guess it just helps we have nothing to hide from each other

Eggplant Wizard
Jul 8, 2005


i loev catte


Devyl posted:

Right. I understand that. Checking each and every text message and e-mail is very unhealthy and extremely obsessive. I'm just saying it's really odd for long-term couples to not share security information. If I was dating someone for 3-4 months then yeah, I wouldn't be handing out passwords & unlock codes for my stuff either. But if you plan on spending your lives together and you've already been together for years (like we have), why not? There's been several times when I've had to have my significant other send an e-mail for me while I was on the road or make a phone call for me because I was driving. Plus I guess it just helps we have nothing to hide from each other

I've been with my boyfriend for 10 years, lived together for 2, and we do not share passwords and stuff. On the extremely rare occasion I have needed him to do something like that for me, I've given him a password and then changed it. It's not that I distrust him; it just seems weird to share my password with anyone. It'd be weird to just log in to each other's things like that. We have a common password for things we both need access to. We haven't got anything to hide but it's not necessary to share everything like that. I wouldn't take it as a prerequisite for determining if a relationship is healthy or not.

CravingSolace
Mar 3, 2012


Devyl posted:

Right. I understand that. Checking each and every text message and e-mail is very unhealthy and extremely obsessive. I'm just saying it's really odd for long-term couples to not share security information. If I was dating someone for 3-4 months then yeah, I wouldn't be handing out passwords & unlock codes for my stuff either. But if you plan on spending your lives together and you've already been together for years (like we have), why not? There's been several times when I've had to have my significant other send an e-mail for me while I was on the road or make a phone call for me because I was driving. Plus I guess it just helps we have nothing to hide from each other

Wait, what? I've been married for three years now, and while I know the passwords to help pay bills online, I don't know his email or Facebook passwords because it's none of my business, I trust him, and it shouldn't matter. You can be in it for the long-haul and still respect someone's privacy.

Edit:
Sometimes I'll use his phone to make a call if mine is dead, or he'll ask me to read a text if he gets one and is busy, but I still don't go through it because I respect him and his right to privacy.

Castle Bidimar
Mar 27, 2012

by T. Finninho


Ask yourself if you think she has, because it doesn't matter whether she has or hasn't, its about your comfort. If you do, leave her straight up. Set it so you can completely cut in an instant. Don't even tell her why, just that it's over.

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Emacs Headroom
Aug 2, 2003



LogisticEarth posted:

I really don't see why the OP checking his fiance's phone is a problem. At that stage, you should be comfortable enough with the other person to be sharing phone details, emails, mail, etc. You're trusting this other person enough to be getting married after all. My fiance and I share access to most of our stuff, if you don't trust them with that, then why are you trusting them with marriage?

The OP was suspicious, he checked something that he should have access to, and he came up with indications that supported his suspicions. The only trust violated was if/when the fiance was cheating on him and didn't tell him about it.

I understand that "personal spaces" are important in a relationship, but if those spaces are being used to hide infidelity or other transgressions, then there's no problem in violating them.

I kinda feel this way. I stopped giving that much of a poo poo about text or e-mail privacy after getting married, along with not farting in front of each other and all that other stuff that seems to be relevant when you're single or dating.

But I do recognize that different people have different feelings about privacy. Maybe every couple has to define their own boundaries on this, and there's no Universal Moral Correct standard for it.

edit: but I will say that suspecting cheating, but being too scared to talk to the person about it definitely indicates serious, probably irrecoverable problems

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