Captain Bravo posted:

Alright, so I've held off on posting my theory as to what's going on, but I feel that the letter seals the deal. The big question, in my mind, is Who is Tenmyoji? It eventually became obvious that he was one of the previous Nonary Game participants, and there were signs heavily pointing towards Junpei... but the letter pretty much confims that it's actually Santa.

Why Santa? For one, it has to be either Santa or Junpei, because the dead lady is Akane. The letter confirms that Quark did not grow up with a Grandma and a Grandpa, Tenmyoji was his only parent. Which means that Tenmyoji's reaction to the dead woman's corpse is because she's the woman he spent his life pursuing until he met Quark.

"Now Captain Bravo," you say, "Wouldn't that imply that Tenmyoji is Junpei? After all, Akane and Santa both escaped at the end of 999." But the fact is, we don't know what actually happened after 999. However, there is one thing we do know.

Junpei knows Alice. He was in the car that picked her up, and he was debriefed at HQ, he knows that she's not All-Ice. Santa doesn't. Tenmyoji confronted Alice about Ice-9 after he realized she had been at the last Nonary game. Santa was privy to the conversations about the frozen corpse and Ice-9. Santa did not meet, or talk to, Alice. So from his perspective, she may very well be that unfrozen egyptian princess. He confronts her with this, claiming that Clover told him, but even leaving aside the fact that Clover had no reason to tell Tenmyoji about the Ice-9 mystery if Ten was actually Junpei he would have known that it was false, and would have no reason to accuse her of it.

And that brings us to the final point, which is that Santa adopts Quark to atone for his inability to protect his sister. Remember, he talked a lot about how he was her Santa Claus, that's where he got his friggin' nickname from. He was unable to save her in the first Nonary game, Junpei had to do that. He was just an accomplice in the second Nonary game, she ran that whole deal. And, if we take my above assumption as correct, she split off from him some time afterwards and he was again alone, unable to protect her as he desperately wished to. Then, he stumbled across Quark, and gets a second chance to be the caretaker he so desperately wished to be. Junpei had no similar compulsion to be a protector, or even if he did it was nowhere near as powerful as Santa's.

So if Akane is the dead woman, how did she end up there? Simple: She's Zero. Everyone keeps saying that Zero Jr. confirmed Zero was a member of the nine participants, but Zero Jr. was addressing everyone in the room. Akane was hiding inside one of the AB rooms. Akane only dies if Sigma and Phi don't pick Alice. What's more, when that happens, the rooms don't shift, implying that whoever killed Akane also moved the rooms around to hide the evidence. That seems like it would imply Alice is the killer, but Alice and Clover both seem in the dark as to who Zero is. What's more, Alice goes over to pick up the blood knife and inspect it, if she stabbed Akane she would have just kept it. No, the reason why choosing Alice results in Akane dying is simple: Without Alice to distract Clover, K cannot sneak away to murder Akane.

Now, again, I know that the hologram in the Director's room seems to implicate Zero as a male. But don't forget, this exact same thing happened in the last game. Guy, in the head honcho's office, fingered as Zero, but actually a Red Herring. What's more, the hologram gives us a disarm code for a bomb. But Zero didn't set the bombs, Dio did. And we know Dio isn't Zero, because he was sent to infiltrate the Nonary game, he wasn't in charge of it. So then who is the man in the hologram? Simple, he's K. Who is loving Junpei.



K and Akane set the whole thing up. K is the man in the hologram, giving false hints to throw Santa off the scent. Akane doesn't want Santa to find her because she ran off with Junpei to have a life together. Junpei is playing the same role Santa was in the last game, the infiltrator and accomplice who people assume is Zero until the final twist. The only problem is, K actually does have amnesia, meaning he doesn't remember setting this whole thing up with Akane. So when he is left alone by Clover, and explores the AB rooms by opening the top seals, he accidentally confronts Akane and murders her before she can explain. He then moves the rooms to cover up the fact that she is killed, something that doesn't happen in the route where she doesn't die.

So why the Nonary game to begin with? What even is the purpose here? Simple, the purpose is to defuse the bombs. Akane and Junpei were living in the facility, working to create the cure for the virus. Dio breaks in to learn what he can, and then blow it to hell and back. Akane and Junpei realize that the only way to save the facility, and the last hope for humanity, is to run another Nonary game and depend on espers to figure it out. They had already captured Clover, Alice, and Sigma years ago to keep in cold storage as esper aces-in-the-hole. They just had to put Clover into a similar situation so her powers would be able to save the day. The thing they didn't bank on is Clover's powers being subsumed by Sigma. So Junpei would have his memories wiped, to be in the same situation, doubling their chances of success. They contacted Santa, and convinced him that if he signed up and didn't spill the beans they would guarantee a good life and a cure for Quark, so he jumped at the chance. Dio was already in the facility, they just had to knock his rear end out, and that brought them to 7. They tapped a medical researcher who was desperate for a cure, Luna, and constructed the final member as their failsafe, Phi.

Junpei recorded a message with the only password they had been able to deduce, Bomb #1, then locked himself in the suit and did whatever bullshit was required to give him Amnesia. Akane knocks out Dio, brings in Tenmyoji, Quark, and Luna, activates Phi, and defrosts Sigma, Clover, and Alice. Phi and Zero are instructed that no matter what, they must always play their part to the hilt. The danger must be real, to activate the latent esper powers in Sigma, Junpei, and Clover. Even if their actions or inactions doom everyone, they must remain hopeful that one of the other timelines will receive the information needed to succeed. Phi drags everyone into their cells, sits down beside Sigma, and the game begins...

DopeGhoti posted:

Yeah. We can totally trust this about as far as we can throw a fit.

"I totally promised that I would not open the door. Quark, open the door."

Fedule posted:

Alright, in the interests of keeping things moving along while I'm actually up on this I've closed the poll; going back and betraying Tenmyouji (in round 3) has the nod.

Glazius posted:

Man, I wonder if Ten and Clover have been in cahoots this whole time.

lotus circle posted:

It's hard to really peg a "Safe End" onto this game I find. With 999 Safe End was the only route necessary to unlock True End. The other routes gave you information about certain characters, but they weren't crucial to finishing the game.

With VLR, I would say every route is necessary to get a full understanding of the plot. Certain routes less than others, but none of them feel superfluous. I would say the only route that comes close to that is Clover's, which is fitting because her presence in the game as a whole is superfluous and only done because she was a fan favorite in 999.

BlazeEmblem posted:

Great job being a dick to Quark, guys!

Fedule posted:

Worth it.

RelentlessImp posted:

Tenmyouji so very needs another loving betrayal after pulling that poo poo. Him and Quark can rot in this place. And Quark's poo poo is just annoying. "I know grandpa is condemning you all to a slow death, but he's a good guy, really!" gently caress off! If you assholes had just agreed to all Ally we'd be out of here already! Die in a fire, Quark! Get hosed, Tenmyouji! "Good People Die"? How about "Irredeemable Assholes Die"? "I want to be a good person"? Like hell! You all want to be backstabbing chickenshits! Beat Dio into a mass of twitching flesh barely covering nerve endings! Stomp Clover's ribcage into her heart, if it even loving exists! Butcher Tenmyouji for food! Take Quark's hat away and claim his powers for your own! Sigma, wake the gently caress up and realize the power you wield and use it to make these people's lives as miserable as they've made yours! ALL OF THEM DESERVE DEATH! REAP THE CRIMSON HARVEST!


tl;dr: I did not care for this at all.

RelentlessImp posted:

Tenmyouji so very needs another loving betrayal after pulling that poo poo. Him and Quark can rot in this place. And Quark's poo poo is just annoying. "I know grandpa is condemning you all to a slow death, but he's a good guy, really!" gently caress off! If you assholes had just agreed to all Ally we'd be out of here already! Die in a fire, Quark! Get hosed, Tenmyouji! "Good People Die"? How about "Irredeemable Assholes Die"? "I want to be a good person"? Like hell! You all want to be backstabbing chickenshits! Beat Dio into a mass of twitching flesh barely covering nerve endings! Stomp Clover's ribcage into her heart, if it even loving exists! Butcher Tenmyouji for food! Take Quark's hat away and claim his powers for your own! Sigma, wake the gently caress up and realize the power you wield and use it to make these people's lives as miserable as they've made yours! ALL OF THEM DESERVE DEATH! REAP THE CRIMSON HARVEST!


tl;dr: I did not care for this at all.

RelentlessImp posted:

Tenmyouji so very needs another loving betrayal after pulling that poo poo. Him and Quark can rot in this place. And Quark's poo poo is just annoying. "I know grandpa is condemning you all to a slow death, but he's a good guy, really!" gently caress off! If you assholes had just agreed to all Ally we'd be out of here already! Die in a fire, Quark! Get hosed, Tenmyouji! "Good People Die"? How about "Irredeemable Assholes Die"? "I want to be a good person"? Like hell! You all want to be backstabbing chickenshits! Beat Dio into a mass of twitching flesh barely covering nerve endings! Stomp Clover's ribcage into her heart, if it even loving exists! Butcher Tenmyouji for food! Take Quark's hat away and claim his powers for your own! Sigma, wake the gently caress up and realize the power you wield and use it to make these people's lives as miserable as they've made yours! ALL OF THEM DESERVE DEATH! REAP THE CRIMSON HARVEST!


tl;dr: I did not care for this at all.

RelentlessImp posted:

Tenmyouji so very needs another loving betrayal after pulling that poo poo. Him and Quark can rot in this place. And Quark's poo poo is just annoying. "I know grandpa is condemning you all to a slow death, but he's a good guy, really!" gently caress off! If you assholes had just agreed to all Ally we'd be out of here already! Die in a fire, Quark! Get hosed, Tenmyouji! "Good People Die"? How about "Irredeemable Assholes Die"? "I want to be a good person"? Like hell! You all want to be backstabbing chickenshits! Beat Dio into a mass of twitching flesh barely covering nerve endings! Stomp Clover's ribcage into her heart, if it even loving exists! Butcher Tenmyouji for food! Take Quark's hat away and claim his powers for your own! Sigma, wake the gently caress up and realize the power you wield and use it to make these people's lives as miserable as they've made yours! ALL OF THEM DESERVE DEATH! REAP THE CRIMSON HARVEST!


tl;dr: I did not care for this at all.

SyntheticPolygon posted:

Why are you so mad at this path in particular? Honestly this felt like one of the most cordial decisions yet. At the very least I feel like everyone's choice was fairly logical considering their motivations and such.

RelentlessImp posted:

wrote a letter to you to try and not make you angry that he's killing you.

Waffleman_ posted:

It's just a video game. A video game you're not even loving playing, man.

RelentlessImp posted:

That's the sign of good writing. Don't get me wrong, I am loving the hell out of this as much as anyone else. But I hate these people. If they were just a little more flat, a little less despicable in actions, a little less understandable, then they wouldn't inspire nearly as much disgust or interest. I was expressing my opinion of the characters, not the game, and the fact that I'm moved to express such vitriol is only a point in the game's favor.

Waffleman_ posted:

You throwing a temper tantrum over 1s and 0s is not good writing, it's you having some issue other than the game that you're taking out on us.

BlazeEmblem posted:

Great job being a dick to Quark, guys!

Hobgoblin2099 posted:

Given that a plot lock of one of the ending routes was betraying Phi just to see what would happen, I think it's safe to say that the goal of this game is to be a dick to as many people as possible.

RelentlessImp posted:

Glazius posted:

Does everybody just... trust Zero Sr. that escape is impossible? I suppose he's still got the remote needles if we get rambunctious.

ApplesandOranges posted:

Unless Alice dies again, in which case she'd probably flip everyone the bird and throw the switch.

Zoe posted:

Oh god I so want to see this now. Or at least I hope there's something somewhere on one of these paths to rival Axe Ending, it would help to redeem the character for me. Though you just know she'll be smiling as she does it.

Fedule posted:

RelentlessImp posted:

Tenmyouji so very needs another loving betrayal after pulling that poo poo. Him and Quark can rot in this place. And Quark's poo poo is just annoying. "I know grandpa is condemning you all to a slow death, but he's a good guy, really!" gently caress off! If you assholes had just agreed to all Ally we'd be out of here already! Die in a fire, Quark! Get hosed, Tenmyouji! "Good People Die"? How about "Irredeemable Assholes Die"? "I want to be a good person"? Like hell! You all want to be backstabbing chickenshits! Beat Dio into a mass of twitching flesh barely covering nerve endings! Stomp Clover's ribcage into her heart, if it even loving exists! Butcher Tenmyouji for food! Take Quark's hat away and claim his powers for your own! Sigma, wake the gently caress up and realize the power you wield and use it to make these people's lives as miserable as they've made yours! ALL OF THEM DESERVE DEATH! REAP THE CRIMSON HARVEST!


tl;dr: I did not care for this at all.

Glazius posted:

Does everybody just... trust Zero Sr. that escape is impossible? I suppose he's still got the remote needles if we get rambunctious.