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Karnegal
Dec 24, 2005

A display of humility is required of those who still possess such frailties.

-Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite


UPDATED: 3/22/14
!NEWS! Drafting is now available in the alpha and the deck builder had been improved.!NEWS!



What is Hex?
Hex is what is being called an MMOTCG. That is, it is a digital game that combine elements of MMO's and collectible card games. It is made by Cryptozoic Entertainment (CZ), notably the makers of the WoWTCG, which is probably the second most successful adult-focused TCG after Magic: The Gathering. They make other games, like some licensed stuff that niche gamers don't care about, and a couple fun ones like Epic Spell Wars of the Battle Wizards: Duel at Mt. Skullzfyre.

How do I play?
Slow down there, champ. The game isn't out yet. It's Kickstarter juts ended. There will be a closed Alpha for KS backers in the next couple months. It will be followed by a beta (also open to backers). The official launch is aimed for next summer at the latest, but realistically, this looks like a DOTA2 style soft launch. It's been in development for about 2 years at this point.

PvE vs. PvP
The game is divided into PvP and PvE. PvP is essentially a traditional TCG experience with constructed play, drafting, sealed deck play, and other types of games where you play against a human opponent. PvE involves you playing against the computer (sometimes in "raid" of up to 3 people). Cards are also divided into PvP and PvE cards. PvP cards are purchased in booster packs and can be used in PvP or PvE play. PvE cards are earned for free from PvE play, but they cannot be used in PvP. This is in part because some of them produce really unfair or unbalanced effects. PvE is essentially free to play.

PvE


In PvE, you will be able to create a character (or multiple characters if you choose). Right now, it sounds like the race you choose is an aesthetic choice (thought it will give you a different starting city). The races are divided into two factions, the surface dwellers who are essentially the good guys and the subterranean races that are the bad guys. Humans, Orcs, Dwarves, and Elves are stock fantasy races with some minor twists. The Coyotle are essentially Native-American inspired coyote people. The Necrotic are reanimated humans that have been brought back to life by the Hexing Gems (shards of a meteor named Hex that gives the game it's title). The Vennen are an all male race of spider men (the drider type, not the Marvel comics type). Shin’hare are rabbit people inspired by feudal Japan. What determines your abilities is your class. Each class has it's own unique set of charge powers that you choose while leveling up.



What are charge powers you ask? In Hex, whenever your play a resource card, you gain 1 charge. Some cards will also give you additional charges. In games, you'll have an avatar that has powers that can be used by paying charges. Examples include creating creatures or doing damage to your opponent. In PvE, you'll pick different abilities at certain levels (it sounds like you'll be able to respec fairly easily). In PvP, you will also be able to select a champion (though you don't customize like you do in PvE). PvP champions function the same way as those in PvE; you spend charges earned from playing resources and spells to activate their abilities.

What does PvE actually look like


Right now, it looks like you'll move around a map like the above one (this is a dungeon). You'll play against AI decks with your champion (or sometimes a mercenary deck). Each dungeon will have unique cards that aren't available for players to use. This means that the decks you'll play against will be different than anything you would encounter in standard PvP play. Dungeons may have various twists and puzzles that work outside of the standard card playing (they mentioned a sphinx that asks riddles as an example). However, it sounds like you'll generally be playing cards with various tweaks to game rules in order to advance a story and get loot. You'll make decisions that impact your experience (different paths, the opportunity to recruit mercenaries). CZ has said that you can replay dungeons and raids and make different decisions.

Raids? Does that mean I'll need to to spend hours with a bunch of people to get the best stuff?
Short answer: no! You'll unlike an MMO like WoW, raids have no "trash," they're essentially boss runs that you unlock after beating a dungeon. Each raid boss will have a unique loot table and fight mechanics. You will be able to take a group of up to 3 players to combat whatever twisted monsters and villains CZ can think up. You can attempt the raids with less than 3. CZ has said that 2 might be possible with really well-tuned decks, but 1 won't be (although I'm sure it will happen at some point). You can read about a specific raid boss here: http://hextcg.com/dragon-slaying/.

Wait, loot? Like more cards?
Well yes, you can earn cards in PvE, specifically PvE cards. However, the real innovation is the addition of equipment. You can wear 6 pieces of equipment, each will alter specific cards. Tuning your gear and your deck will allow for an incredible range of possibilities. Here is an example of a card with some possible pieces of equipment.


Because the game is digital, the actual card text can be altered to account of the equipment. It's important to note that equipment is PvE only in order to keep PvP balanced. Unlike equipment, some cards also have sockets for gems. Each account has infinite gems of all types, these gems alter properties of a card (such as giving a creature +1/+1 or haste). You can change the gems you have socketed in a card between matches. Gems are allowed in PvP.



Alright, what other cool stuff is there?
One of the cool features is the Double Back. Because the cards are digital objects they have have more than 2 sides. Each card has a normal card back, but it can also be flipped again to reach the Double Back



One Each Double back you'll see a set of achievements. Unlock them all will permanently change your card into extended-art version. The back also tracks XP earned through playing the card (maxing the XP will turn the card into a foil), various game stats (damage dealt), and events won with the card.

Again, cards are digital objects so you can do things that are impossible for a paper TCG such as altering a cards stats as it changes zones (giving it a bonus and shuffling it back in), you can put bad cards into your opponent's deck, you can alter cards that have yet to be drawn, etc.

So, it's an MMO, Is there going to be a goon guild?
There sure is! I've already said that I'd start one as soon as possible (backers at the higher tiers are supposedly going to be allowed to reserve guild names early). As several goons have pledged at $500, the whole guild will get a 10% bonus to PvE experience. Guild features haven't all been revealed, but you will have the ability to create a library of decks that members can check out. Playing well in tournaments can reward your guild with a set of the top 8 decks that (while they can't be sold or used in normal PvP) are available for testing with guild mates in guild games. There will certainly be a guild bank that will be filled with donated commons and uncommons so that new players can pick up a bunch of cards to start out with.

What if it doesn't pan out?
Well that's a risk you take with any game. The advantage that Hex has is that it's being made by a company with a long-running successful TCG, it already has a couple million dollars worth of development in it. The game has been called Magic 2.0 by some because it takes proven elements and improves and innovates on them. It comes out right when the Wizards of the Coast Magic patent expires, so concerns about a law suit shutting it down are probably unfounded. The game looks really polished for an alpha build, much better than Magic Online and more expansive than Duels of the Plansewalkers. Yes, the game could fail, but it offers a novel take on the genre, and they're the first full-featured MMOTCG to the table which is a huge advantage. To date, the kickstarter has been an unprecedented success. Normally kickstarter funding charts are an inverse bell curve, but the graph for Hex has been pretty much linear over it's life. Every day people say it will have to slump soon, and every day so far it keeps chugging along.

Isn't the kickstarter going to make the game unapproachable for new players?
I would expect this to be far less true than with most TCGs. The huge amount of product being given out from the kickstarter is probably going to make the price of PvP cards relatively low at launch. Like any TCG you start, you'll have to buy in at some level, but the game is going to have an auction house, so you aren't going to need to throw a ton of cash at boosters unless you want to draft. More importantly, because PvE is either a solo or co-operative experience, other people having big collections isn't going to negatively impact your experience. The lower cost of cards (as compared to paper TCGs) is probably going to make the game more approachable than even Standard Magic. Ultimately, the game is a TCG, and PvP play will cost you some money unless you're committed to farming PvE and selling your legendary gear; however, PvE is supposed to be totally do-able as a free game if you to play it that way.

Aren't TCG's really expensive?
They can be. Hex has a couple things going for it on this front. First, PvE is free-to-play. While you'll be able to buy PvE cards and equipment from the auction house for gold (earned in PvE, or purchased with platinum) or platinum (purchased with cash), the game is being designed so that you can progress through play, building up your deck and equipment as you go. As to PvP play, you will need to spend some money. Hex booster packs are going to retail at $2, and it's reasonable to assume that you'll be able to buy them from the auction house for <$2 (probably $1.50+ unless the market is flooded like it will be at release). CZ is also offering a VIP program where, for $4 a month, you get some benefits like a pack a week, access to a special monthly VIP tournament, and a "goldfishing tool" for testing out a deck without an opponent. Finally, there will be some limited PvP rewards offered in PvE. CZ has mentioned a possible one-time award of a draft set (3 boosters and draft entry), so that you can try out PvP without an investment.

Can I sell my cards for real dollars on the AH?
No. This is a legal nightmare and CZ doesn't want to mess with it. They've essentially said that they do not plan on regulating the secondary market, so they aren't going to clamp down on you for selling your cards. I would expect to see retailers like MTGO traders crop up. You'll probably also see some cardshark type site to facilitate selling to other users.

Tell me more, drat it!
There is a ton of information coming out about this game. CZ has been making daily updates on the KS and are posting new articles on their site every day. You can find it here: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects...ading-card-game and here http://hextcg.com/

Wait, I heard that this game is going to get sued to oblivion by Hasbro. Isn't this a scam?
If it's a scam, it's a terrible scam. Generally, you don't sink 2 million dollars of your money into a kicktstarter that you expect to generate less than 2 million dollars. The idea that this is a scam is dumb. As to the question of them being sued, can you point to any credible news source that would suggest this is likely? No? There are a couple reasons that I, and most other people are not concerned about this. 1.) Their release date is actually after WotC's patent expires. It's hard to sue someone for a patent that you no-longer hold. 2.) Perhaps more significantly, Cryptozoic Entertainment makes the WoW TCG, a game that has been successful for nearly a decade. This game also holds many similarities to MtG. It has sold well and continues to sell well. They have not been sued into the ground by Hasbro. If this was a company coming out of nowhere or a group of guys in their basement, you might have reason for concern. However, we're talking about an established company with a history as a major TCG maker. They've put 2 years and a couple million dollars into the game. It's reasonable to assume that they checked with their lawyers to make sure they weren't pissing that cash away.


Feel free to use this thread to speculate, talk about news, and ask questions about the game.

Let me know if I missed something important for the OP.

NEWS
5/23/13 - The much-coveted Pro Tier (free draft a week for life) is sold out. However, CZ has added 1 year of 1 free draft a week to each of the other $250 tiers. This is no longer a stretch goal.
5/28/13 - CZ is adding a T-poo poo as a KS add-on. Due to a fan vote, the shirt will not include an exclusive card. Instead, everyone who pledged will get copies of the card based on their tier (2-3)
5/31/13 - http://thegeekallstars.libsyn.com/e...ic-s-cory-jones Episode 54 has a lot of new info about the game. Some will go into an OP update, other bullet points are in this post http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...2#post416012335
6/1/13 - Another video here http://angryjoeshow.com/2013/06/hex-mmotcg-aj-pledge/ -touched on economy and guilds as well as some other areas that we've heard about before.
6/8/13 - KS is over (a huge success). Slacker backer option is up. You can still get into Alpha/Beta! http://hextcg.com/donate
3/22/13 - Sorry that this is long out of date, but the beta is progressing. You can now play sealed and draft in the alpha (for free), and the client has been steadily improving. There are still a lot of issues that keep many of us from playing a lot, but it's worth dipping your toes in to see how it's going.

Video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-InJQY3Gu6U - Interview video with some character ration and menu video. Also includes a demo game.

Streaming Games
Next live Twitch feed on Tuesday, June 4th at 5 PM PST

Past Streams
http://www.twitch.tv/hextcg/b/407910948 - Alpha build. Explores the basics. Good for seeing the interface. A couple cards are still buggy.
6/4/13 - http://www.twitch.tv/hextcg/b/412300360 - technical difficulties prevent game play, some questions answered and cards previewed.
6/5/13 - http://www.twitch.tv/hextcg/b/412717902 - 4 decks previewed some general game info
6/7/13 - http://www.twitch.tv/hextcg/b/413840931 - KS celebration, some questions fielded a little bit about what's to come in the next several months.

Karnegal fucked around with this message at Mar 23, 2014 around 03:14

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Karnegal
Dec 24, 2005

A display of humility is required of those who still possess such frailties.

-Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite


Resources

Fan-Database of known cards: http://hex.potion-of-wit.com/

Here is a tentative section of the Warrior skill tree: http://imgur.com/DsZMXnr

FAQ

How do I determine rarity?
Rarity is determined by the color of the oval at the bottom of the card.

White - Common
Green - Uncommon
Blue - Rare
Red - Legendary
Orange - Promo
Grey - PvE AI deck exclusive

The mask/devil face/whatever symbol to the left of some ovals indicates that a card is a PvE card.

I hear that beta starts in September; when is retail launch? Will there be a wipe before launch?
This is still a bit unclear. What we know is that the retail launch will be next summer at the latest. However, CZ has said that they'd like to launch sooner if possible.

We know that CZ has said once Kickstarter rewards are given out and the store opens, there will be no wipe. It is possible (not confirmed) that the beta will be two phases. In the first phase it will be a free-play testing environment that allows them to make sure everything works and interacts as intended and the big bugs are ironed out. After this, there would be a wipe. After the wipe players would receive their KS rewards, and there would be no further wipes (a soft launch, if you will).

When is Alpha, how long will it run? !!update!!
We are currently in the middle of the alpha. End date is undetermined. Right now the focus is on getting PvP working well and out of the door. PvE will follow.

Are there dungeon lockouts like in WoW?
No. CZ does not want to discourage you from playing.

Karnegal fucked around with this message at Mar 23, 2014 around 03:23

pumpinglemma
Apr 28, 2009

DD: Fondly regard abomination.


Nice OP! One thing you might like to mention is that every dungeon has its own set of AI-exclusive cards (see e.g. here), so PVE is a totally different game from standard PVP against the AI.

BenRGamer
Oct 29, 2011

What the fuck, Sabin!?


So, this is looking incredibly awesome. As I said in the kickstarter thread, I went through High School playing the hell out of Magic the Gathering, watching the demo match they have on the kickstarter page got me amped up to pledge to King on the game, but I'm kinda looking over the $250 tiers. Are they really worth over twice the price of the King yier?

And, yeah, nice OP.

Zonekeeper
Oct 27, 2007


I really like Cryptozoic's reaction to the Pro Player tier whiners - Rather than acquiesce to them, they doubled down on the decision to expand the free drafts and did what was best for the community as a whole.

This feels like a tone-setting act - they aren't going to pander to the loud minorities in the playerbase at any point. They're going to make the game the best they can, loud assholes be damned.

Karnegal
Dec 24, 2005

A display of humility is required of those who still possess such frailties.

-Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite


pumpinglemma posted:

Nice OP! One thing you might like to mention is that every dungeon has its own set of AI-exclusive cards (see e.g. here), so PVE is a totally different game from standard PVP against the AI.

Good call, I wrote a little in there.

Zonekeeper posted:

I really like Cryptozoic's reaction to the Pro Player tier whiners - Rather than acquiesce to them, they doubled down on the decision to expand the free drafts and did what was best for the community as a whole.

This feels like a tone-setting act - they aren't going to pander to the loud minorities in the playerbase at any point. They're going to make the game the best they can, loud assholes be damned.

Yeah this seems like a smart move to me. It doesn't seem like anyone was so mad that they actually dropped their pro tier, which is a good indication that CZ is correct in their assertion that they aren't devaluing it.

BenRGamer posted:

So, this is looking incredibly awesome. As I said in the kickstarter thread, I went through High School playing the hell out of Magic the Gathering, watching the demo match they have on the kickstarter page got me amped up to pledge to King on the game, but I'm kinda looking over the $250 tiers. Are they really worth over twice the price of the King yier?

And, yeah, nice OP.

They've added 1 free draft a week for a year to the other $250 tiers. I think that adds a lot o value to them. The Dungeon Crawler Tier is appealing to PvE players and seems like a good value if you think you'll do a lot of PvE play. If you just want to maximize value, the Collector tier may be the best choice. You'll get your 1 draft a week, and the amount of collector tier exclusive cards will always be small (2110 or if every tier from collector up sells out). People are going to want playsets if any of the alternate arts are of tournament staples and those should command a decent resale price. We're talking about 300-500 potential play sets depending on how many collector tiers sell.

Lone Goat
Apr 16, 2003

When life gives you lemons, suplex those lemons.

There's a good mockup of a skill tree here if you want to use that instead.

Also, there's a typo in the title, the game's name is "Hex: Shards of Fate"

Karnegal
Dec 24, 2005

A display of humility is required of those who still possess such frailties.

-Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite


Lone Goat posted:

There's a good mockup of a skill tree here if you want to use that instead.

Also, there's a typo in the title, the game's name is "Hex: Shards of Fate"

Well gently caress.

I wasn't sure if I should throw the skill tree in the op because it's giant. Maybe I'll toss it in the second post


VVVVVV Orange is for Promos

Karnegal fucked around with this message at May 24, 2013 around 00:25

Captain Capitalism
Jul 28, 2009



I was excited for this, and I got in on the 500 level before it sold out so yay for free drafts.

I do have a question I haven't figured out anywhere else, what are the rarities? I noticed that a lot of cards have colors for their collector level, but I count something like 4-5 of them. Is this right?

Grey - Common
Green - Uncommon
Blue - Rare
Red - Legendary
Yellow - ?

OBi
Feb 27, 2005

HQ BN A CO BEARMAT
2001-2005. The POG-est.

Sweet the Hex thread is up. Good job on the OP.

I was reading through the cards from the rewards in more detail. I already want a Replicators Gambit / Pack Raptor deck.

Lone Goat
Apr 16, 2003

When life gives you lemons, suplex those lemons.

Karnegal posted:

Well gently caress.

I wasn't sure if I should throw the skill tree in the op because it's giant. Maybe I'll toss it in the second post
Just send Winnie a PM asking him to fix it.

Yeah, it's enormous. How about just include a link to it with HERE IS A SAMPLE TREE?

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


OBi posted:

I was reading through the cards from the rewards in more detail. I already want a Replicators Gambit / Pack Raptor deck.

That was my thought exactly after seeing those two cards.

There will surely be balance passes, though. For example, assuming you can pay 0 for an X cost, Orson's Dream with its first equipment is basically an infinity/infinity creature as soon as you play it, and with its second equipment it's very difficult to actually get rid of (needs a global or something that makes the owner target it for destruction).

Hell, Pack Raptor is incredibly strong by itself. It's a Plague Rats for 2 less cost that generates more of itself AND has a special ability that I'm assuming is first strike (it isn't haste; that's called speed in Hex). I'm not expecting it to survive until release as 1-cost.

Zurai fucked around with this message at May 24, 2013 around 01:22

King Burgundy
Sep 17, 2003

"You can fight!"
"Thank you!"

Yeah, as a busy guy with a family, I can't tell you how excited I am at the potential of actually being able to do drafts on my own schedule whenever I can find the time. Pretty pumped for this game.

torgo
Aug 12, 2003


I'm excited for this. It is eerily like my dreams of a Shandalar MMO, which I've been wanting since the Microprose MTG game was released. The PvE side seems to be mostly single player and played out on a static map, but I'll take it. The dungeons sound amazing. An orc arena dungeon plays like a straight gauntlet, but you earn favor with the "crowd" by drawing first blood or come from behind victories. The more favor, the better the rewards. Another dungeon is full of Mark Rosewater style MTG puzzles(supposedly randomized enough so you can't just look up the solution). It seems like they are really going all out on what could have just been a throwaway to entice the F2P market segment.

As an aside, anyone interested in the sold out tiers should download Check4Change(Firefox) or the equivalent for your browser and set it to watch the tier you want. The sold out tiers actually open up quite a bit as people change tiers or back out. With some luck, you can probably get one without wearing out your F5 button.

SilverMike
Sep 16, 2007
TBD

Zurai posted:

Hell, Pack Raptor is incredibly strong by itself. It's a Plague Rats for 2 less cost that generates more of itself AND has a special ability that I'm assuming is first strike (it isn't haste; that's called speed in Hex). I'm not expecting it to survive until release as 1-cost.

On the other hand, every time you play one, you clutter your deck with four more of them so you'd better have a way to speed up card draw or you can enjoy the horrors of a bloated deck in a genre where controlling what you draw is godly. 1 cost really might be suitable for them.

0 cost Orson's changes are just silly though.

Veyrall
Apr 23, 2010

The greatest poet this
side of the cyberpocalypse


I'm glad the gameplay seems good, because the flavor is three kinds of rear end in a lot of cases. I mean, the Shin'Hare are a near clone of the Skaven. The Dwarves are Goblins. There's a race of peaceful, spiritualistic furries with nary a trace of irony that are shaping up to be the Mary-Sues of the setting. The humans are the exact same humans we've gotten in every setting. The elves are the exact same elves that we've gotten in every setting. I mean, it's still early, and Magic's flavor wasn't so enthralling when it was first released, but goddamn.

The Vennen are a bit cool though. Spider-Orcs is a legitimate thing I haven't seen before.

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


We have seen almost nothing of the flavor of the game. There's one very brief page on each major race and that's about it.

And the Vennen are just male orc-drider Drow.

pumpinglemma
Apr 28, 2009

DD: Fondly regard abomination.


Veyrall posted:

I'm glad the gameplay seems good, because the flavor is three kinds of rear end in a lot of cases. I mean, the Shin'Hare are a near clone of the Skaven. The Dwarves are Goblins. There's a race of peaceful, spiritualistic furries with nary a trace of irony that are shaping up to be the Mary-Sues of the setting. The humans are the exact same humans we've gotten in every setting. The elves are the exact same elves that we've gotten in every setting. I mean, it's still early, and Magic's flavor wasn't so enthralling when it was first released, but goddamn.

The Vennen are a bit cool though. Spider-Orcs is a legitimate thing I haven't seen before.

Really? The shin'hare seem completely different from skaven to me - the only real points of comparison are the fast breeding and the "cannon fodder" attitude towards most of the population. And dwarves who ride giant ants and are trying to literally undermine the entire surface world are goblins now? (The coyotle do look like Furry Sues at the moment, though.)

signalnoise
Mar 7, 2008

Distinguishing Features:
Expensive and gaudy
clothes, overweight, and
a scruffy beard.

Soooo, straight up, nothing you do for free can net you anything for PvP? Is that correct

King Burgundy
Sep 17, 2003

"You can fight!"
"Thank you!"

signalnoise posted:

Soooo, straight up, nothing you do for free can net you anything for PvP? Is that correct

Correct. Sort of. Theoretically you could sell cards you earn in PVE on the AH and buy PVP cards though?

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


I'm actually reasonably certain they've said that while most cards gained through PvE are PvE-only, not all of them are. Also, you get in-game currency via PvE.

rinski
Sep 12, 2007

Yes, so use your strongest attacks, but whatever you do, don't hit the shell!!


Veyrall posted:

I'm glad the gameplay seems good, because the flavor is three kinds of rear end in a lot of cases. I mean, the Shin'Hare are a near clone of the Skaven. The Dwarves are Goblins. There's a race of peaceful, spiritualistic furries with nary a trace of irony that are shaping up to be the Mary-Sues of the setting. The humans are the exact same humans we've gotten in every setting. The elves are the exact same elves that we've gotten in every setting. I mean, it's still early, and Magic's flavor wasn't so enthralling when it was first released, but goddamn.

The Vennen are a bit cool though. Spider-Orcs is a legitimate thing I haven't seen before.

Like you said, I think that's something that will likely come with time, and it's something people have mentioned to them. I mean, the game kind of blatantly rips off other games, subtly and overtly. One of their cards is a functional reprint of Man-o'-war. I'm hopeful that, once the game gets going, they'll have a bit more leeway to develop it in their own unique way.

Even if they don't, it'll be Magic 2 with a better online multiplayer client. That in and of itself seems worthwhile.

Ass Catchcum
Dec 21, 2008
I REALLY NEED TO SHUT THE FUCK UP FOREVER.

I can't wait for this game to be out. In at $250 and free drafting for life. Eat it, WOTC.

Hieronymous Alloy
Jan 30, 2009


Why?! Why?! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market ?!!!


signalnoise posted:

Soooo, straight up, nothing you do for free can net you anything for PvP? Is that correct

You can still play against other people with PvE cards, just not in tournaments or under formal rules. There's apparently going to be at least two separate pvp formats, one "anything goes" and informal and one more formal with rules about what cards you can and can't etc.

I agree that the game races seem really hackneyed ("Driders, but MALE") but what I care about is gameplay. Blizzard-style MMO's are always hackneyed as gently caress because that's what has mass appeal. Everybody knows what an orc is.

rinski posted:

Like you said, I think that's something that will likely come with time, and it's something people have mentioned to them. I mean, the game kind of blatantly rips off other games, subtly and overtly. One of their cards is a functional reprint of Man-o'-war. I'm hopeful that, once the game gets going, they'll have a bit more leeway to develop it in their own unique way.

Even if they don't, it'll be Magic 2 with a better online multiplayer client. That in and of itself seems worthwhile.


That, and a chance to start over at the ground floor of a new game without having to deal with two decade's worth of crazy rear end cards. This is finally my chance to get in at the start and be That Guy who has the crazy cards that only came out in the first print set or whatever. This is my chance to be part of the problem. I'm in for more of a preorder buy than I care to admit.

Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at May 24, 2013 around 03:39

Pinwiz11
Jan 26, 2009

Do we have a picture of Paul McCartney?


I'm intrigued by the mention of PvPvE tournaments where you can use all of your PvE cards and champions. It should be a riot to watch.

Meanwhile, they're brilliant about the number of free packs they're passing out. I did some calculations with the 300 packs I'll be getting at launch, and if I just draft them (excluding the free drafts) they would get just under $200 in "tickets" out of me by the time I was done if I won an average of 1.5 packs a draft. I don't see myself doing 200 drafts of just Set 1, so we'll see how they decide to handle Blocks.

e: Also, drafts will probably run $6 at market price...

Pinwiz11 fucked around with this message at May 24, 2013 around 03:51

Captain Capitalism
Jul 28, 2009



They've said a draft is about 7 dollars: 2 for a pack and a 1 dollar entry fee.

For people worrying about card interactions, remember that equipment is PvE only, and that Dream Bear is a PvE only card anyways. You can tell which is which because PvE cards have a yellow mask next to their collector number, PvP do not. The fact they can errata cards digitally is kind of neat, but I am a little leery of them changing the text post release.

Surmy
May 25, 2010

Congratulations on not getting fit in 2011!

Pretty happy that I got in at Grand King Tier. Hopefully there will be enough people joining up to start a goon guild.

thiswayliesmadness
Dec 3, 2009

"Well 'umie, as a 'ead-dockta da first thing I recommend iz we get rid of da source of yer problem!"


I'd like to jump in for $250, but probably settle for just King tier unless they get some big bumps or I get a good dose of spare cash.

Out of the tiers left, Collectors and Guild Master seem the most tempting. Extra free cards are always great and hopefully be some nice rare ones tossed out. Guild Master's +10% exp should be great in the long run, but might actually be able to keep friends interested for more than a few months with all those boosters (or find a way to sneak them back to yourself...). I would jump on Dungeon Crawler if it wasn't just on the bosses for the dungeon, since you might not always run into them. More loot is always tempting but too bad it only works in PvP for special stuff. Raid leader feels like something you'd just want a few guild buddies having.

Here's looking forward to Hex Goon Guild!

BenRGamer
Oct 29, 2011

What the fuck, Sabin!?


thiswayliesmadness posted:

I'd like to jump in for $250, but probably settle for just King tier unless they get some big bumps or I get a good dose of spare cash.

Apparently all of the $250 tiers get the Pro-Player tier reward for a year.

M. Night Skymall
Mar 22, 2012


Surmy posted:

Pretty happy that I got in at Grand King Tier. Hopefully there will be enough people joining up to start a goon guild.

Given the enthusiasm in the TG and video game kickstarter threads I think we'll be OK on the goon guild front. I'm at King atm, I think with how much money they have they'll get enough to produce at least 2 years of sets even if nothing else happens. I think the market is kind of ripe for this kind of game with the huge surge in popularity that MTG has seen at game stores lately. Too bad WoTC didn't see fit to capitalize on it but I'd rather play mini games when I have time to go out to a game store and being able to play TCGs during downtime at home will be awesome.

signalnoise
Mar 7, 2008

Distinguishing Features:
Expensive and gaudy
clothes, overweight, and
a scruffy beard.

BenRGamer posted:

Apparently all of the $250 tiers get the Pro-Player tier reward for a year.

I'd like to see a breakdown/calculation of the total dollar value of all the tiers at this point. I am tempted to get the Dungeon Crawler tier. I dunno maybe I get some sick overtime at work

M. Night Skymall
Mar 22, 2012


signalnoise posted:

I'd like to see a breakdown/calculation of the total dollar value of all the tiers at this point. I am tempted to get the Dungeon Crawler tier. I dunno maybe I get some sick overtime at work

It's hard to evaluate them because, no one knows wtf 100% more gold and drops in PvE is worth. Add $312 for the 1 year of free drafts to all the $250 tiers besides Pro Player and whatever you think their particular perk is worth and that's it. The collector tier could be worth a fortune due to limited availability or nothing because no one gives a gently caress about the alternate art. Impossible to say.

BambooEarpick
Sep 3, 2008


Hey there. So, I think maybe my reading comprehension is terrible or something but can someone explain to me what Spectral Lotus does?

So, for [0], it basically cycles itself. Then, if I briefcase it, I gain +3/+0 (Me? Like, myself?), gain 3 THRESHOLD (I forget what this is again), and it comes back to my hand except as a Spectral Tiger.

THRESHOLD is not a resource, right? It's, like, different colours or whatever? So I gain 3 of them -- does it have a colour?

Zonekeeper
Oct 27, 2007


HiggsBoson81 posted:

It's hard to evaluate them because, no one knows wtf 100% more gold and drops in PvE is worth. Add $312 for the 1 year of free drafts to all the $250 tiers besides Pro Player and whatever you think their particular perk is worth and that's it. The collector tier could be worth a fortune due to limited availability or nothing because no one gives a gently caress about the alternate art. Impossible to say.

I picked the Dungeon Crawler tier in the hopes of using my winnings to "double dip" and purchase the exclusives off the AH until I have playsets of them all. I have no idea if it's feasible, but if I manage to pull it off my double rewards are all profit from that point on.

OBi
Feb 27, 2005

HQ BN A CO BEARMAT
2001-2005. The POG-est.

BambooEarpick posted:

Hey there. So, I think maybe my reading comprehension is terrible or something but can someone explain to me what Spectral Lotus does?

So, for [0], it basically cycles itself. Then, if I briefcase it, I gain +3/+0 (Me? Like, myself?), gain 3 THRESHOLD (I forget what this is again), and it comes back to my hand except as a Spectral Tiger.

THRESHOLD is not a resource, right? It's, like, different colours or whatever? So I gain 3 of them -- does it have a colour?

It's a Black Lotus (Sac for 3 mana) from Magic on steroids. If I'm right about the mechanics it not only gives you the mana and draws you a card when it enters the battlefield, but the threshold permanently helps you cast future cards with strict color requirements. On top of that it goes back to your hand as a decent tiger troop that also draws you a card. So if you can use it to cast itself you end up with a free 3/1 and 2 (+1 net) cards without using any of your mana, or you could use that 3 mana for something else even more broken.

It's pretty nutso, which explains why you get one per day and it's PvE only. Oh and you'll be able to re-combine 4 Black Tigers into a Black Lotus, but only if you have the garden.

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


BambooEarpick posted:

Hey there. So, I think maybe my reading comprehension is terrible or something but can someone explain to me what Spectral Lotus does?

So, for [0], it basically cycles itself. Then, if I briefcase it, I gain +3/+0 (Me? Like, myself?), gain 3 THRESHOLD (I forget what this is again), and it comes back to my hand except as a Spectral Tiger.

THRESHOLD is not a resource, right? It's, like, different colours or whatever? So I gain 3 of them -- does it have a colour?

None of these terms are explained yet, but my understanding is that Spectral Lotus gives you 3 temporary resources (the 3/0) and 3 temporary works-as-any-color dots. Basically the same thing as the Black Lotus. Note that this is entirely guesswork made by examining the cards we've been shown. For example, check the 9-tailed monkey mercenary reward; one of its high-level abilities gives you "+[9/9]" resources at the end of your turn under a specific condition. Similarly, the [THRESHOLD] uses the same format as [WILD] and [SAPPHIRE] in other mercenaries, except that "threshold" isn't a standard gem type.

BambooEarpick
Sep 3, 2008


Ah, thanks for the clarification; it makes sense when you put it that way.
And I guess getting a 3/1 for 0 that double can-trips is ok.

OBi
Feb 27, 2005

HQ BN A CO BEARMAT
2001-2005. The POG-est.

I think the [+3/+0] indicates it gives you 3 mana without giving your champion 3 charge, which 3 individually played resources would. I'm also guessing that [THRESHOLD] represents a variable [WILD]/[SAPPHIRE] effect where you choose which color to gain 3 threshold of. It says nothing about the threshold being temporary though.

Falcon2001
Oct 10, 2004
|Geek|

I'm honestly super excited about this and just upped to one of the 250 tiers. Mostly because this is the game I wanted MTGO to be for a super long time and they're absolutely right when they say 'why the heck hasn't anyone else done this yet?'.

As far as I'm concerned this is the best news in a long time (plus SolForge, but I feel like this is going to be a lot more of traditional mtg feel.)

With my current schedule I just can't really find time to play IRL with card games anymore even though I love them, and stuff like OCTGN and other things online are just not as fun without the collecting aspect.

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SilverMike
Sep 16, 2007
TBD

I remember theorycrafting Type 1 Magic and using Lotuses for ridiculous perfect Turn 1 setups. The way I'm reading the Phantasmal Grips equipment on this would give you a very good shot at pulling all the parts of a complex and expensive setup together once every four days. If you assume a draw where you're able to eventually pull all four of your Lotuses, you're looking at 12 mana and threshold with 7-10 random cards left in your hand and 1-4 Black Tigers, and the ability to cycle out some of those cards up to 4 times to fish for your combo.

If the theorycrafter in you isn't drooling at that setup being legitimately possible in a game I don't know what to say to you.

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