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Archonex posted:Plus, modeling a planet of any decent size and detail every few months is a huge resource drain on a developer team. Add onto that actually making new content, and you're looking at a ridiculously large amount of cash and effort for a MMO being put into development after release. I think it's more realistic than the usual promise of extra content (dungeon, quests, PvP arena, items, pets) every 3-4 months. Rather than all the usual PvE improvements like dungeons, content balancing and quest improvements they're able to focus on churning out another map with similar gameplay instead. From the sounds of this game it's actually pretty low content compared to your usual WOW wannabe and focussed at the kind of person who ignored PvE while levelling in other MMOS (Me) where PvP was available. The Camelot Unchained kickstarter made a big deal out of this and intuitively speaking they have a point. I'd hope this game has a bigger budget than that (and in all likelihood going by the MMO law of averages, this game will be appalling) but hey, PvP is economical and offers more longevity than you can get per hour coding PvE. WRT military tactics, we are all used to PR tard speak, it's no great revelation to say the developer was full of poo poo when it comes down to the nitty gritty of attempts at creating hype.
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Jun 29, 2013 23:07
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While the basic Ork as a free character is a very interesting concept, I don't think it'll be a very good one. The only reason I was willing to sink money into something like Planetside 2 is because the gameplay I was given for free was compelling enough to make me comfortable in that decision. Every time some developer has been willing to talk about the subject, they make it sound like people who pay are divided into basically two groups: the whales who spend obscene amounts and the people who spend nothing at all ever. However, I'd be willing to bet that there exists a middle class from whom the majority of revenue comes from. The people who buy some poo poo, some times, etc. The basic Ork gameplay is going to have to be pretty drat good to make me want to stick around to toss in some cash. They'd probably be better served by having a free option for every race
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Jun 30, 2013 08:24
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Not only that but in PS2 if you're a battle rank 1 dude with your intro gun YOU CAN STILL BE EFFECTIVE. Players in PS2 might have more tactical options than you because they have played longer (or bought a gun which is equivalent to playing longer) etc but they aren't better than you because they have paid to be. Having a system where the only free to play option is literally being 5 times weaker than a paying customer is the antithesis of the PS2 model.
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Jun 30, 2013 11:58
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They're making a mistake advertising the game as F2P and it's going to lead to a lot of disappointment and rage quits when people find out how useless they are as lowly orkboyz. It's probably better to think of the game as something closer to Guild Wars where you pay once and then play forever. edit: The F2P option might as well be considered a free trial. Senjuro fucked around with this message at 12:49 on Jun 30, 2013 |
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Jun 30, 2013 12:44
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I think we all realize that the free Ork Boyz thing will probably be a massive failure if they don't change it. It also wouldn't be so bad if they at least made a free and paid version of each faction even if they made the F2Pers weaker. At least that way you have been playing with and against more powerful people, not just against. Also make the paid classes just a little stronger so they're focuses of attention, not five loving times as powerful. IMPERIUM: Free - Imperial Guardsman Paid - Space Marine/Tech Priest/Commissar ORKS: Free - Ork Boy/Shoota Boy Paid - Nob/Mech Boy/Commando ELDAR: Free - Guardian Paid - Warp Spider/Ranger/Banshee CHAOS: Free - Cultist/Traitor Guardsman Paid - Chaos Space Marine/Lesser Daemon/Sorceror
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Jun 30, 2013 18:16
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I think the free Ork Boyz thing is a spectacular idea...if they'd only make them equal to other starting players. Making them one fifth the strength is just dumb.
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Jun 30, 2013 21:04
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Info on the promised AMA: http://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/1hh5lq/eternal_crusade_incoming_ama/
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Jul 2, 2013 16:45
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The Sharmat posted:I think the free Ork Boyz thing is a spectacular idea...if they'd only make them equal to other starting players. Making them one fifth the strength is just dumb. I'm okay with a Space Marine being five times 'stronger' than an Ork if there were things in place to balance it such as Orks having a number of CC abilities where say two or more could reliably stun/lock a Space Marine down and beat him to death despite the Marine being able to take five times as much damage as them.
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Jul 2, 2013 17:55
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Kegslayer posted:I'm okay with a Space Marine being five times 'stronger' than an Ork if there were things in place to balance it such as Orks having a number of CC abilities where say two or more could reliably stun/lock a Space Marine down and beat him to death despite the Marine being able to take five times as much damage as them. Lore wise it is a cool concept but for actual game play it is just not going to work. No one is going to enjoy the time investment of playing a game where you get poo poo on unless you have overwhelming population just to tea bag someone. And lets be fair we still do not have the technical means to have large numbers of players on screen in a small area without suffering either massive performance problems or having the game engine simply not render players to you after a certain distance. They are talking about Strike squads having 100 people that would mean the Orks would have close to 500 people to equal the same power. You can't jam 600 people in one Hex in PS2 without the game suffering immensely.
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Jul 2, 2013 18:01
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The Sharmat posted:I think the free Ork Boyz thing is a spectacular idea...if they'd only make them equal to other starting players. Making them one fifth the strength is just dumb. It's an interesting gimmick that unfortunately shits all over itself. Assuming this even goes live, they'd probably see significant numbers of orks in the first month, followed by a sharp decline because people aren't orks. Dying over and over and over again, because you are constitutionally underpowered compared to your opponents, stinks. I can see dedicated troll crews, say along the lines of 'Sumfing Orky' or 'Reddit Ones iz Fasta', but they're just as likely to slough members when the need for organization to be effective starts to chafe.
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Jul 2, 2013 19:48
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Kegslayer posted:I'm okay with a Space Marine being five times 'stronger' than an Ork if there were things in place to balance it such as Orks having a number of CC abilities where say two or more could reliably stun/lock a Space Marine down and beat him to death despite the Marine being able to take five times as much damage as them. This is utterly untenable. If you have skilled and organized ork players this creates a situation where the marine player hammers on his keyboard in frustrated rage while he slowly gets picked to death while not being able to respond. If you have unskilled and unorganized ork players they'll never have the coordination required to properly disable chain someone to death like that so the marine will just break one or more of them in half the moment they gently caress up and accidentally layer their crowd control cooldowns or whatever and then the disable train falls apart. You create a situation where the options for an Ork are "play perfectly in sync with friends or die" and a lotto effect for marine players where if you happen to run into an organized group you get to watch yourself slowly bleed to death helplessly. Even then this only takes into account solo marine vs group of orks. What about situations where there's a whole squad of marines? Does the disable chain hold up if half your orks die before they close into range? Do the orks have ranged disables? Can you reliably split a whole mob of orks up cleanly so they can effectively lock down a group of marines? You really can't design a PvP game with a bunch of different classes/factions where everyone controls one character and still have titanic power discrepancies between characters built-in and have it be anything approaching balanced.
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Jul 2, 2013 23:18
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The increased CC thing was just an idea, you could say give the Orks an instant respawn timer or turn every Ork into a bomb squig on death or whatever. Considering we have little to no information about this game, I just think it's a little premature to bitch about the game design. If they make Space Marines literally five times better than any other class, than nobody is going to play anything but Space Marines. edit: BadLlama posted:No it is plenty early to bitch about a game design that makes F2P players 80% less powerful than a paying player. There is absolutely no way to justify it despite how much lore/teamwork/SEALTEAM6 poo poo they throw at you. You don't think it's a bit premature to start bitching based on one comment made in one interview for a game that has barely started development? We don't really have any solid information about the game aside from the fact that it's in development and it's coming out in two years time. Kegslayer fucked around with this message at 02:57 on Jul 3, 2013 |
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Jul 3, 2013 00:24
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Kegslayer posted:The increased CC thing was just an idea, you could say give the Orks an instant respawn timer or turn every Ork into a bomb squig on death or whatever. Considering we have little to no information about this game, I just think it's a little premature to bitch about the game design. No it is plenty early to bitch about a game design that makes F2P players 80% less powerful than a paying player. There is absolutely no way to justify it despite how much lore/teamwork/SEALTEAM6 poo poo they throw at you. I say this as someone that constantly shells money out on F2P titles. Free players should not be X% less powerful because they will "Make up for it in numbers" BadLlama fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Jul 3, 2013 |
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Jul 3, 2013 00:31
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It reminds me of playing NetWar so long ago, when the paying players would roll around with Helicopters and Tanks while the F2P people were slaughtered. You can only convince non-payers to be part of this economy of murder for so long. Space Marines are just as capable of teaming up as Orks are. Whatever, it'll likely be radically different by the time anything approaching beta or release rolls around.
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Jul 3, 2013 06:21
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BadLlama posted:I say this as someone that constantly shells money out on F2P titles. Free players should not be X% less powerful because they will "Make up for it in numbers" Maybe the Ork faction gets a crapload of AI players? It sounded like they had such a system down for the Tyranid, so maybe that's their compensation?
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Jul 3, 2013 16:22
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This game smells like bigger Vaporware then DNF....
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Jul 4, 2013 02:14
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Hal_2005 posted:This game smells like bigger Vaporware then DNF.... This isn't the first "Let's make a 40k MMO!" attempt. It probably won't be the last.
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Jul 4, 2013 14:35
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It better not be the last.
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Jul 4, 2013 20:42
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First AMA is up http://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer40k/comments/1hov7m/hi_we_are_the_dev_team_for_the_upcoming_mmorpg/
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Jul 5, 2013 14:58
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There will be another AMA later today. Senjuro fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Jul 5, 2013 |
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Jul 5, 2013 17:27
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quote:We're a premium game (think Guild Wars 2), with a free-to-play option. We will never offer pay-to-win in the cash shop. Players who opt for the free-to-play option will be able to unlock different classes through microtransactions, but buying the game will give you access to everything. I guess the payment scheme makes some sense now. quote:There is a growing concern among 40k players that the game will be incredibly unbalanced since it's suppose to take five Ork players to kill one Space Marine player. Harabeck fucked around with this message at 18:30 on Jul 5, 2013 |
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Jul 5, 2013 18:22
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That's some amazing backepdaling.
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Jul 5, 2013 18:34
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Collision detection confirmed! This was one of Warhammer Online's few saving graces. It allows you to make actual battle lines and it gives tanks a role in PvP.
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Jul 5, 2013 18:53
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Senjuro posted:Collision detection confirmed! This was one of Warhammer Online's few saving graces. It allows you to make actual battle lines and it gives tanks a role in PvP. Eh, the big battles were all about AoE, and tank walls did nothing to help against that.
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Jul 5, 2013 19:03
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Call me a butt but I think as long as 5 orks counted as 1 space marine in matchmaking it would be pretty fun to have 5 people gang up on one dude because you would easily have the tactical advantage of numbers. Kinda like in a Halo free for all when one dude got the tank everyone immediately tried to blow that guy up.Harabeck posted:Eh, the big battles were all about AoE, and tank walls did nothing to help against that. It enabled our ironbreakers to completely clog up the keep wall while we bright wizards rolled our faces across our keyboards to rain firey death upon our foes without threat of anything sneaking onto the ramparts  . When you can't just run through the tank, tanks and well everyone have a ton more peeling power.
puberty worked me over fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Jul 5, 2013 |
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Jul 5, 2013 19:08
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The Ork Boyz thing is pretty terrible and will certainly make people just try it for an hour and quit. The good thing is, they've already started backpedaling off it a bit and the game isn't so far along that they can't change it. I'm sure they will backpedal from this idea completely. Otherwise, a lot of the other stuff sounds cool. I'm glad they are taking their inspiration from a mix of Plantside 2 and Space Marine. I could definitely get into a game like that, especially considering you can unlock the bulk of stuff with a 1 time game purchase and them separately buy a bunch of tacky and gaudy items to equip.
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Jul 5, 2013 19:51
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Things are looking up if they are "clairifying" issues people have been discussing, maybe JUST maybe this will work. Only time will tell.
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Jul 5, 2013 20:03
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Extra posted:It enabled our ironbreakers to completely clog up the keep wall while we bright wizards rolled our faces across our keyboards to rain firey death upon our foes without threat of anything sneaking onto the ramparts Incidentally a huge reason why Keep battles were horribly unfun and why high level RvR(based around keep battles!) was garbage was because there was no real way to take keeps without an insane numerical advantage. That may have been "realistic" but was also loving terrible for gameplay.  I guess that the Eternal Crusade people realized that they should clap a trap on their CEO's mouth.
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Jul 5, 2013 20:28
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Kanos posted:Incidentally a huge reason why Keep battles were horribly unfun and why high level RvR(based around keep battles!) was garbage was because there was no real way to take keeps without an insane numerical advantage. That may have been "realistic" but was also loving terrible for gameplay. From my perspective, as a tank in Warhammer Online, it was the most fun I ever had in an MMO. I was the front line. I kept the group alive, sometimes even more so than the healer. I was the bulwark against the terror. I am willing to forgive a lot of bad things about the game if they let me do that in a 40k setting. VVVV Hell yeah. Senjuro fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Jul 5, 2013 |
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Jul 5, 2013 21:08
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Terminator lines anyone? Speaking of, do we have any idea of specializations? Ive heard suggestions of chaplains and psykers, what about apothecaries or techmarines? (please let me be a warpsmith) E: just read their responses in the ama. I guess they want to. gently caress yeah Hencoe fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Jul 5, 2013 |
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Jul 5, 2013 21:16
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Probably too soon to say since it looks like most things about the game are still barely past the initial concept stage.
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Jul 5, 2013 21:29
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That interview posted earlier in the thread was goddamn hilarious. But it's a good thing they're telling us their terrible ideas before it's too late to change them. Anyway, I'd love to play as a Commissar who's basically a much weaker character on his own, but gets something like 8 AI-controlled guardsmen (with an option for reinforcements) who you can give orders to, or execute for buffs and so on.
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Jul 5, 2013 23:40
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Harabeck posted:I guess the payment scheme makes some sense now. A thug with an axe is a devastating force in melee combat, an armoured super soldier with a laser axe had better watch out  .
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Jul 6, 2013 04:57
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The (normal) Ork classes should all be Nobz, just different genetics. So slugga boy nobz, flash gitz nobz, kommando nobz, big meks, etc, etc. Then regardless of what class you pick when you get to level cap you can become a warboss.
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Jul 8, 2013 08:34
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Liberatore posted:That interview posted earlier in the thread was goddamn hilarious. But it's a good thing they're telling us their terrible ideas before it's too late to change them. Exactly, they could still do the '5 Orcs to kill a Marine' thing, just have so if you choose Orcs, you are a Nob and you have 3 Boyz who follow you around like pets. Similarly you could be a Commissar with 7 Guardsmen who follow you, or an Eldar Warlock/ Exarch with 2 guardians. And Marines would just be solo. Companion AI is pretty advanced from what it used to be, and this would seem like a good idea if they want to make it more canon in terms of character power.
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Jul 8, 2013 09:48
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The only correct choice for a "companion NPC" Ork is a Grot Herder.
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Jul 8, 2013 10:33
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trashcangammy posted:A thug with an axe is a devastating force in melee combat, an armoured super soldier with a laser axe had better watch out What Tac marine has a power axe in his back pocket?
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Jul 8, 2013 19:39
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Hencoe posted:What Tac marine has a power axe in his back pocket? Blood Angels, for starters!
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Jul 8, 2013 20:22
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Liberatore posted:That interview posted earlier in the thread was goddamn hilarious. But it's a good thing they're telling us their terrible ideas before it's too late to change them. Going to buy the smelly psychic blank henchmen for 20 bucks off the cash shop and laugh as eldar try their silly psy attacks against me.
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Jul 8, 2013 21:36
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I hope we can make vehicle squads of Leman Russ Battletanks and hopefully our shots can deviate random directs and kill all our friendly troops for maximum 40k realism.
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Jul 8, 2013 21:41
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