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Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

cletepurcel posted:

I feel having a literal Western flashback would have cheapened the show's great modern Western element. Still, probably would have worked better than the plane crash.

Are people not fans of the plane crash? It's definitely an unrealistic event but I thought it worked fine in context, and that the episode lead-ins were appropriately surreal and disturbing. It was a fine if blunt way of getting across the message that whatever Walt's self delusions, producing gobs of meth really does effect the world outside of him in a profoundly horrible way (shocking!).

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Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

tbp posted:

They do explain why. Gus was a general under Pinochet.

And they had to explain because it was vital to the storyline.

Gus as a general?

Buh?

Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

Gus seems way too young/jittery in the first flashback to his meeting with Eladio to have ever held a senior military position. I figured (along with most everyone else, I assume) that he had strong criminal connections back home, but that was it.

Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

Todd never struck me as a full on psychopath, although perhaps I don't have a full enough understanding of what that means outside of typical movie parlance. He shows something approaching genuine affection for Lydia, he didn't seem to take any special pleasure out of killing; when he tells Walt and Jesse that he killed the kid because he thought he had to, he genuinely seems to believe it, which is frightening in its own way. His murder of Andrea also seemed purely utilitarian, and he does choose both to reward Jesse with ice cream and to let him sleep without the tarp. Not to say that he isn't hosed in the head, but my impression was that he was either dim or somewhere on the low end of the autistic spectrum, and the rest was the mental damage that comes from being raised by a bunch of deranged nazis in a life of crime. He seemed a deliberate counterpart to Jesse: the boyish demeanor without the nice middle class upbringing.

On the other hand, you could interpret his kindly behavior towards the imprisoned Jesse as a symptom of obsessively controlling behavior, which (I believe) is supposed to be a classic symptom of psychopathy, so there's that.

Fuligin
Oct 27, 2010

wait what the fuck??

Count Chocula posted:

" His murder of Andrea also seemed purely utilitarian"

It's amazing how many people in this thread and characters on the show can justify the murder of innocents because they were 'neccesary'. Maybe that's the real split between Walt/Todd/Gus and Jesse/maybe Mike (since he didn't let Lydia kill his people). The former have a 'utilitarian' view of murder, though the only utility they maximize is the utility to themselves. The latter see murder as an evil they commit - listen to Jesse's speech in 'Problem Dog' - but not one they can justify. And then fans either accept Walt/Gus/Toods character's rationalizations (which went back as far as Combo's killing, since Walt didn't care too much) or let the murders affect them.

I feel like I'm late to the party on all this. Was there much great discussion or quotes from when the show was running?

I'm not sure how you interpreted that as supporting the murder of an innocent character, but don't let that stop you from smugging out.

e: Although I have no problem with Skyler as a character, it's not that hard to see why people might dislike her without necessarily being women haters. As noted, she's ultimately a hypocrite, although I think most of us are inclined to be generally sympathetic to her position at the end of the series. She cheats on Walt, and since we're more inclined by default to support Walt (as the main character) that's liable to color opinions as well, even if a little adultery is small potatoes compared to what he's getting up to. Personally I was totally won over to her when she finally loses it at Bennecke for being a self righteous moron.

Fuligin fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Nov 13, 2013

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