Conot posted:This isn't the impression I got from last episode when Minorin and her brother were out partying with the two high level guys. Why take any of the Hamlin kids out at all? They can't contribute meaningfully to any combat. I was not saying that that is what happened, I was saying that if you farmed the EXP-pots in the way I said you would never run out because your captives would never stop getting them. They might be doing all of this in town because they can't secure a cave/building/whatever outside. In town the captives could just refuse to give the potions to them, so you need either a stick or carrot as motivation. As for why Hamlin is operating they way they are I have no idea, I would assume we will find out as events unfold.
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Nov 10, 2013 02:29
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ViggyNash posted:Makes me hope that there's a Goonfleet equivalent band of weirdos that just mess with people all the time. You mean that Shiroe isn't literally planning to use Log Horizon to help out newbies, form a newbie horde, then blot out the sun and dismantle the standard the guilds set up? Because this is what it seems like to me. Log Horizon is literally a less shitposting goonfleet in the early stages. They're going to corner the market on tasty food too.
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Nov 10, 2013 02:30
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OWLS! posted:I was getting eve-vibes before from this, but drat, this show has everything. Exploiting newbies for personal gain, check. Ruthless market competition, check, guild propaganda and war machine, check. I liked this from the start, but this is starting to grow on me to the point that this is my favorite show of the season. Couldn't agree more. I picked this up at the same time I started watching Accel World after SAO (I swear, I don't have an Anime MMO problem...) and it's night and day comparing the two. My only complaint is that the author spends a significant amount of time explaining the concepts of an MMO to the viewer, and I'm not sure how necessary that is compared to just showing us. We've already seen guild halls, lots of people in the guild halls, I think the viewer 'gets' that guilds are places people belong to. I'd much rather he focus on the characters that belong to those exploitative guilds instead of mechanical explanations. I'd rather know why his friend felt it necessary to be a part of a guild that's fleecing them, treats them so harshly, makes them sleep on the floor, etc... and not so much 'what a guild is.' Still, it's miles better than Accel.
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Nov 10, 2013 04:36
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Pyronic posted:they were hard capped prior to this expansion releasing so its conceivable that they'll be able to level up to 99 or 100 now, but haven't exactly been grinding level appropriate mobs to do so. loving called it. Really happy with this episode, and can't wait for more.
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Nov 10, 2013 06:17
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OWLS! posted:You mean that Shiroe isn't literally planning to use Log Horizon to help out newbies, form a newbie horde, then blot out the sun and dismantle the standard the guilds set up? Because this is what it seems like to me. Log Horizon is literally a less shitposting goonfleet in the early stages. I will be disappointed if this does not happen. Instead of all level 90+ people, have a hoard of newbies destroy a city. Show the power of teamwork! 
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Nov 10, 2013 07:38
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Hamelin, really? That's the name of your evil EXP Pot farming guild? Way to be inconspicuous. You might as well just call it <We Kidnap Lowbies>
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Nov 10, 2013 07:49
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Redcrimson posted:Hamelin, really? That's the name of your evil EXP Pot farming guild? Way to be inconspicuous. You might as well just call it <We Kidnap Lowbies> there's no fighting in cities right? maybe they'll just body block the respawn point with masses of lowbies and prevent them from reinforcing.
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Nov 10, 2013 08:27
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AVeryLargeRadish posted:I was not saying that that is what happened, I was saying that if you farmed the EXP-pots in the way I said you would never run out because your captives would never stop getting them. They might be doing all of this in town because they can't secure a cave/building/whatever outside. In town the captives could just refuse to give the potions to them, so you need either a stick or carrot as motivation. As for why Hamlin is operating they way they are I have no idea, I would assume we will find out as events unfold. Actually, it's easier for newbies to refuse out of town, as if they die they respawn in the church and can easily ask people to protect them there. In town, though, they can't defend themselves if they are are sequestered, and that's even worse if it's a owned house. After all, a owned house means the owner can set rules (they are allowed to hit others, but others can't hit them, they can ban people from entering, etc).
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Nov 10, 2013 08:52
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Arkeus posted:Actually, it's easier for newbies to refuse out of town, as if they die they respawn in the church and can easily ask people to protect them there. Where was this mentioned? I was under the impression that if you attacked someone in town the guards would appear and attack you. I don't remember the show talking about rules players could set for their owned house either.
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Nov 10, 2013 09:18
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AVeryLargeRadish posted:Where was this mentioned? I was under the impression that if you attacked someone in town the guards would appear and attack you. I don't remember the show talking about rules players could set for their owned house either. If you attack someone in town the guards will appear and attack you, yes. However, consider that 'attacking' has strict definitions (Iirc anything without a weapon isn't considered an attack) and kidnapping someone is fairly easy to do without triggering them. Special rules for places you own are supposed to be mentionned when Shiroe talkes about rented or bought space (for example, Hamelin rents their space in the guild, and can set rules within) but the anime seems to have glossed over it for now. It will probably come up soon (it's not really a spoiler though as it was explained much earlier in the LN).
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Nov 10, 2013 10:08
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User0015 posted:My only complaint is that the author spends a significant amount of time explaining the concepts of an MMO to the viewer, and I'm not sure how necessary that is compared to just showing us. We've already seen guild halls, lots of people in the guild halls, I think the viewer 'gets' that guilds are places people belong to. I'd much rather he focus on the characters that belong to those exploitative guilds instead of mechanical explanations. I'd rather know why his friend felt it necessary to be a part of a guild that's fleecing them, treats them so harshly, makes them sleep on the floor, etc... and not so much 'what a guild is.' They seem to be explaining things so that someone who is completely ignorant of MMOs can follow along. Sure, you and I are coming from years of experience with the concepts and terminology, but this series is airing on Japan's equivalent of PBS. They can't assume everyone is as knowledgeable. Combine that with the fact that the original author was also responsible for Maoyuu. You know, the novel, manga, and anime that went to lengths to explain the potato, something that literally everyone in a first world nation should be expected to be familiar with? Arkeus posted:(it's not really a spoiler though as it was explained much earlier in the LN) It is really a spoiler because this thread was made for the anime, and the vast majority of us have not read the light novels. Please don't drop information that the anime hasn't gotten to yet. Nipponophile fucked around with this message at 10:19 on Nov 10, 2013 |
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Nov 10, 2013 10:15
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OWLS! posted:You mean that Shiroe isn't literally planning to use Log Horizon to help out newbies, form a newbie horde, then blot out the sun and dismantle the standard the guilds set up? Because this is what it seems like to me. Log Horizon is literally a less shitposting goonfleet in the early stages. They're going to corner the market on tasty food too. That sounds like fun.
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Nov 10, 2013 11:49
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Nipponophile posted:Combine that with the fact that the original author was also responsible for Maoyuu. You know, the novel, manga, and anime that went to lengths to explain the potato, something that literally everyone in a first world nation should be expected to be familiar with? To be fair, that potato infodump was given to characters that actually wouldn't know it already. Meanwhile, in Log Horizon, Shiroe is explaining things to... The air?
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Nov 10, 2013 12:23
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OWLS! posted:You mean that Shiroe isn't literally planning to use Log Horizon to help out newbies, form a newbie horde, then blot out the sun and dismantle the standard the guilds set up? Because this is what it seems like to me. Log Horizon is literally a less shitposting goonfleet in the early stages. They're going to corner the market on tasty food too. First they'll corner the food economy, next they overthrow the bourgeoisie elitist players by enabling the proletariat newbies, then comes the dismantling of the MMO's structural integrity. Finally, when all hope is lost, the trolling begins. Are you guys ready for Dragon Den the MMO season, with the upstart Shiro running a burger joint to change the social order? 
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Nov 10, 2013 23:31
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Adelheid posted:To be fair, that potato infodump was given to characters that actually wouldn't know it already. Meanwhile, in Log Horizon, Shiroe is explaining things to... The air? Also, most people aren't exactly familiar with how significant the potato was (as well as other farming methods introduced) in increasing the quality of life of farmers and peasants. Crop rotation, for example, isn't really taught in history classes in the US besides being on a laundry list of significant agricultural developments.
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Nov 11, 2013 01:25
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Nipponophile posted:Combine that with the fact that the original author was also responsible for Maoyuu. You know, the novel, manga, and anime that went to lengths to explain the potato, something that literally everyone in a first world nation should be expected to be familiar with? Hey now, I didn't know that potatoes could become toxic when exposed to the sun, so it taught me something!
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Nov 11, 2013 03:49
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khy posted:Hey now, I didn't know that potatoes could become toxic when exposed to the sun, so it taught me something! 
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Nov 11, 2013 10:44
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Nipponophile posted:They seem to be explaining things so that someone who is completely ignorant of MMOs can follow along. Sure, you and I are coming from years of experience with the concepts and terminology, but this series is airing on Japan's equivalent of PBS. They can't assume everyone is as knowledgeable. I didn't, but it sounds like the focus mattered a lot to the story as far as potatos go. I think my only beef with the show, albeit minor, is the author spends a lot of time explaining gameplay and MMO mechanics, but doesn't really dig into the characters themselves. Maybe he just wants to warm everyone up to the world first before really exploring how the characters deal with this different world. For example: the taste of food spanned multiple episodes as a side plot. But, I'm all for doing both at once, otherwise you get the issue that .hack//sign had, which is awful pacing with a really good story buried underneath. For another example, Shiroe obviously had issues with guilds in general, but as much as the author talks about guilds in the general sense, I would have rather seen Shiroe dealing with a really lovely guild and the consequences of joining one as a way to introduce the audience to one: Maybe he was part of a hardcore raiding guild and due to personal drama, abandoned both it and guilds in general, while seeking to reclaim that close knit feeling by forming a band of like-minded adventurers that turned into the Tea Party. The author might even do this later on, once he feels like we have a grasp of what a 'guild' is first, but it definitely feels like a weakness the author has when trying to accustom his viewers to his world. Even a side character would work, simply as a way of showing the audience not only what a guild is, but how it can go bad. He can even contrast this with the current guild Shiroe is helping, to tell the audience guilds can be good, or bad, or somewhere between, and why that is the case. The show is interesting so far, so I want to know more about the characters. For an author, that's the best thing an audience can want.
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Nov 11, 2013 20:07
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User0015 posted:For another example, Shiroe obviously had issues with guilds in general... I may be wrong, but I was under the impression that Shiroe didn't like people in general because they would do nothing but ask him how to get item x or how to finish quest y as soon as they found out he was a high level player. They showed that often in episodes where a Shiroe-silhouette is gradually surrounded by statusscreen-head people. It's not necessarily that he didn't like guilds specifically. It's more like: Shiroe doesn't like people. Guilds are groups of people. Shiroe doesn't like guilds. Either that or I missed where it was implied/said that he specifically didn't like guilds. I was half-asleep watching the last episode. v  v
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Nov 11, 2013 22:50
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Pretty much that I think. Shiroe just isn't confident with other people. A party is simpler, you group up, go do a thing, and if it's fun, you can do it again next time, or with anyone else, if anything goes wrong, the group splits up and everyone goes their own way. A guild is more permanent, he'd feel obligated and responsible, and constantly worrying about what people thought. I mean, just look at how much trouble he had with even reaching out to other people, like the twins, or even the crescent moon alliance. Even to offer his help when they so clearly need it, because he's worried he'd be intruding.
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Nov 11, 2013 23:07
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He mentioned it in this episode that he didn't like guilds because they all just wanted to use his status as an elite player.
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Nov 12, 2013 18:12
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I thought there was more to it than that. He also mentions enjoying the attention, but then backtracked with, "no, that's not quite right either..." I thought. I'll just watch it again.  In either case, I hope the author gets better at melding world building with character building and less Shiroe's soliloquies to deliver things to the audience. Pacing for anime is often on the weak side, and it can really make a story come alive when it's done well. Attack on Titan definitely blew me away in that regard.
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Nov 12, 2013 20:01
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New episode, McShiroe's is open for business. A lot of this stuff was already kinda predicted by the preview from last episode, but I wonder how the whole buying buildings thing is going to come in to play... by the way that "Every building in the game can be bought" was phrased, I wonder if hes planning to buy the building which has all the guild halls in it, and effectively evict the Hamelin to get the newbies out. And Akatsuki continues to be abused for the good of the plan. RIP Akatsuki Also, this show is REALLY fond of its unrequited love, so far we have Akatsuki > Shiroe Twoswords Crescent Moon guy > Marie Marie > Naoutsugu (?) Serara > Nyanters And possibly Shiroe > Unnamed Hat lady from DTP Arianya fucked around with this message at 16:39 on Nov 16, 2013 |
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Nov 16, 2013 16:30
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Conot posted:And possibly Hm? The credits have her named as Kanami, at least.
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Nov 16, 2013 17:09
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So many shiny glasses...
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Nov 16, 2013 18:52
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Conot posted:New episode, McShiroe's is open for business. Well, it's clear that the "set your own rules inside your own territory" thing that they spent an awkward amount of time on this episode is going to play a major part in this. If, for example, you can't use skills then you can't force people to craft for you, etc. I got the impression that he was going to buy the whole city though.
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Nov 16, 2013 19:52
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Clarste posted:Well, it's clear that the "set your own rules inside your own territory" thing that they spent an awkward amount of time on this episode is going to play a major part in this. If, for example, you can't use skills then you can't force people to craft for you, etc. I got the impression that he was going to buy the whole city though. Him staring at the Guild Hall at the end is more indicative that he's just going to buy that instead of the whole city, in my opinion.
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Nov 16, 2013 20:50
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pandaK posted:Him staring at the Guild Hall at the end is more indicative that he's just going to buy that instead of the whole city, in my opinion. On the other hand, he mentioned the city being purchasable, and he's constantly talking about changing the entire city rather than just weeding out the bad apple guilds.
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Nov 16, 2013 20:54
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Im so hyped to see what Shiroe's master plan is if Cresent Burger is just the setup phase.
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Nov 16, 2013 21:23
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Redcrimson posted:So many shiny glasses... The true power behind Log Horizon.
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Nov 16, 2013 23:22
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Haven't watched Ep7 yet, but I thought the anime cliche of shiny glasses/people pushing up their glasses was that they were always, always the villain. Calling it now: Shiroe will reign over the town as a tyrant until the city fits his 'image' of perfection. He's the villain all along.
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Nov 17, 2013 05:10
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Well, he is basically Lelouching it at this point. Accountant Lady even calls him out on it.
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Nov 17, 2013 05:21
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Shiroe isn't going to become an actual villain, in a large part because they've made too many jokes about him being a "villain".
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Nov 17, 2013 05:40
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I think it's less Lelouch than L-Elf, but not a cold as ice badass.
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Nov 17, 2013 05:48
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The Devil Tesla posted:Shiroe isn't going to become an actual villain, in a large part because they've made too many jokes about him being a "villain". I hadn't watched it when I posted that. Then I watch it and they literally call him out on being a villain, heh.
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Nov 17, 2013 06:04
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Shiroe is lucky he's not dealing with goons, if they weren't already selling edible food they'd flood the market with cheap food to ruin his plan.
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Nov 18, 2013 11:44
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I don't understand why Nyanta is the only person in the entire game that can make tasty food. Also, I think that the whole buying the guild-hall or area thing has more to it than explained. I believe you get an entire zone. That's why it's so pricey. You own the zone and can make up your own rules, etc. Ideally, you'd be able to parse out said owned zone, keep non-guild folks out, and let people level at the different segments without fear of being PK'd or challenged by others.
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Nov 18, 2013 13:38
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Dan7el posted:I don't understand why Nyanta is the only person in the entire game that can make tasty food. I think most people stopped trying to make food the real world way after their attempts ended in some kind of colored slime, without factoring in cooking difficulty and their chef level.
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Nov 18, 2013 13:41
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Dan7el posted:I don't understand why Nyanta is the only person in the entire game that can make tasty food. He's not. We saw in this episode that Crescent Moon has managed to get together a whole kitchen of cooks who can make tasty food without destroying it. Nyanta's advantage seems to be that he's a talented real-world cook as well, which lets him provide others who only have the adequate in-game skills some useful advice.
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Nov 18, 2013 13:45
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Darth Walrus posted:He's not. We saw in this episode that Crescent Moon has managed to get together a whole kitchen of cooks who can make tasty food without destroying it. Nyanta's advantage seems to be that he's a talented real-world cook as well, which lets him provide others who only have the adequate in-game skills some useful advice. Some kind of bonus when your real life and character skills match huh.
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Nov 18, 2013 13:54
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