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VarXX posted:I think they might just be. Also the little rungs you can hang on are the same model as AC2 as well You mean cubes? I'm not sure what I think of this. Lore butchering games can be pretty good. That FFX rip-off was amusing. But this just makes me think, yet again, that I would like it more if it were based on something else. Or better yet, nothing. A fantasy based Assassin's Creed is interesting but by basing it on Tolkien, they both have to limit themselves and butcher the story.
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Jan 24, 2014 15:10
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VarXX posted:
Eh, I dunno, there's similar animations in the Arkham games as well. Only so many ways you can animate/mocap those fairly specific techniques.
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Jan 24, 2014 15:12
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Roflan posted:You mean cubes? Without the licence they'd probably be working with a smaller budget, which would be just as limiting. The brand guarantees sales (or so the legend goes).
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Jan 24, 2014 15:26
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poptart_fairy posted:Eh, I dunno, there's similar animations in the Arkham games as well. Only so many ways you can animate/mocap those fairly specific techniques. There's really only one way to know for sure. Talion must walk the dinosaur.
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Jan 24, 2014 15:38
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Fonzarelli posted:Can somebody tell me what the problem with the lore is? Keep in mind that i am a normal person and haven't read the Silmarillion. Two sides to the Anduin river(The river Osgiliath, Gondor's former capital, is built on): east and west. East is towards Mordor and towards the Black Gate. East was basically abandoned after the plagues hit Gondor, Minas Ithil was taken by the Nazgul and made into Minas Morgul, and Osgiliath got abandoned for lack of people. Too many Orcs, not enough safety. Gondor did not have enough strength to push back, and this was some time after Sauron had been beaten down by the Last Alliance and thus the power of him and his was at it's worst. So this has continued for a very long while. At the point they say this one is set, The Ringwraiths have been on high alert for a significant period(I'd like to say months, but the book is vague) getting everything ready for Sauron's return to Mordor, Sauron being fully aware of the attack which is coming to 'drive him out of Dol Guldur for good' and is taking appropriate steps. The odds of settlers being in the area were low when Sauron and his servants was at his weakest; at this point they're so small as to need a microscope. By the by, the Silmarillion is actually a good book in itself. It's not just notes and reference material. The stories are good in themselves. You don't have to be a super-nerd or something to enjoy it. Bloodly fucked around with this message at 16:53 on Jan 24, 2014 |
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Jan 24, 2014 16:37
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So after looking at references in a few supplementary resources, Tolkein did allow for possession to exist in Middle Earth, though he pretty much never used it in any explicit way. The Barrow Wights are a possible example of "houseless" spirit (fëar) coming to dwell in bodies (hröar), though obviously dead ones. Tolkein described in the Histories of Middle Earth that one reason why you wouldn't want to contact dead spirits is they may try to take you over. Sauron's nickname the Necromancer presumably (you'd think, anyway) came from his habit of contacting dead spirits, who interestingly enough were mostly elves who had chosen not to go to judgment (humans don't get a choice--they only remain in Middle Earth if they have been cursed to linger). Since Wraiths are listed amongst such cursed spirits, it's possible that overlap would allow them to possess a living person and still fit within the lore, even though that's not something we really see in the books, and is only alluded to in supplementary notes.
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Jan 24, 2014 16:49
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I hope there will be some towns and poo poo you can buy gear from. So far the game looks awesome as poo poo and hope it stays that way.
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Jan 24, 2014 17:07
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Moose King posted:There's really only one way to know for sure.  But, yeah, still not seeing it. Even Darksiders 2 has very similar climbing/shimmying animations to that. When the dud pulls out wrist blades and starts stabbing people in the throat I think we can call plagiarism.
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Jan 24, 2014 17:09
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My doubts about this game were proven wrong once I saw the gameplay trailer and explanation for different systems. I think this can be a good game if I can set the difficulty so that I have to use every advantage I can find.
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Jan 24, 2014 19:10
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Fonzarelli posted:Can somebody tell me what the problem with the lore is? Keep in mind that i am a normal person and haven't read the Silmarillion. Epi Lepi posted:Shadow of Mordor is meant to take place between the events of The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy. Between Sauron's fall at the Battle of Five Armies Sauron didn't have anything to do with the Battle of Five Armies, for one. He was driven out of Dol Guldur, in the southern reaches of Mirkwood, by the White Council. The Lonely Mountain is to the northeast, separated lengthwise by the entire forest, lengthwise. There's other stuff too, like Wraiths not really working that way, Rangers not really being an organized group, magic not working that way, etc. It still can be a fun game, just not necessarily good on the whole in-universe accuracy thing. It just seems like they took an idea for a generic fantasy game and slapped it into LotR.
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Jan 24, 2014 19:29
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S-Alpha posted:Sauron didn't have anything to do with the Battle of Five Armies, for one. He was driven out of Dol Guldur, in the southern reaches of Mirkwood, by the White Council. The Lonely Mountain is to the northeast, separated lengthwise by the entire forest, lengthwise. eems like they took an idea for a generic fantasy game and slapped it into LotR. That's my bad I never read the Hobbit and I always forget the assault on Dol Guldur and the Battle of Five Armies were two separate confrontations that happened to happen at the same time. S-Alpha posted:like Wraiths not really working that way, Rangers not really being an organized group, magic not working that way, etc. Can you elaborate on this? I haven't seen anything so far that contradicts how Rangers are portrayed in the books. The magic thing is just video game stuff that spergs are just gonna have to deal with. Epi Lepi fucked around with this message at 19:36 on Jan 24, 2014 |
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Jan 24, 2014 19:32
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If this takes place around Gondor/Mordor wouldn't he be a Southern Ranger of Ithilien-type rather than Dunedain (Man of the North) anyway? Not that the bloodlines are much different, it's only ~3000 years of division.
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Jan 24, 2014 19:42
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I'm no longer uncomfortable with my knowledge of the Elder Scrolls' history. Thank you guys. 
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Jan 24, 2014 20:16
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Ah, I thought that Battle of Five Armies thing was official word from the developers on the setting. Nevermind that, then.Epi Lepi posted:Can you elaborate on this? I haven't seen anything so far that contradicts how Rangers are portrayed in the books. Rangers, generally, are extremely solitary, and when Aragon, their leader, put out a call for help from them, he only got a couple to come, because they so rarely work in groups or gather together. sassassin brings up a good point on the Southern Ranger thing, though, I forgot about them. I tend to associate the the Rangers on the whole with the Dunedain. Epi Lepi posted:The magic thing is just video game stuff that spergs are just gonna have to deal with. That's fine, it makes for a more interesting game that way, I was just answering the question on lore issues. It could definitely be worse.
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Jan 24, 2014 20:22
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S-Alpha posted:It could definitely be worse. It could be The Third Age where the final boss is you literally fighting Sauron's Eye on top of Barad-dur. Oh who am I kidding it was awesome.
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Jan 24, 2014 20:33
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Bloodly posted:Here's how I understand it, looking over the book: You forgot the bit about tanks.
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Jan 24, 2014 20:37
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Al Cu Ad Solte posted:It could be The Third Age where the final boss is you literally fighting Sauron's Eye on top of Barad-dur. Oh who am I kidding it was awesome. The best part is it came out of loving nowhere, I don't remember any sort of "ON TO FIGHT SAURON HIMSELF" or anything, just one minute fighting in Pelenor Fields, the next you're punching out a giant loving Eye.
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Jan 24, 2014 20:39
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Al Cu Ad Solte posted:It could be The Third Age where the final boss is you literally fighting Sauron's Eye on top of Barad-dur. Oh who am I kidding it was awesome. That's the best fight in the history of all the LotR games and I will hear nothing contrary. 
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Jan 24, 2014 20:39
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Magic in Tolkiens world isn't what you think of as magic in most settings. The short, and inaccurate TL;DR of it is that magic is the expenditure of will to overcome the will of whatever you want to affect. This means that magic is limited to effecting things that have spirits or souls. It also means that magic is utterly corrupting, as you need to exert your will over someone elses to perform it. Magic can only effect what seem like inanimate things because those things aren't as inanimate as they seem(everything has either an inherent or adopted soul). The most important thing to take away from that is that magic, which Tolkien often used as a stand-in for technology, is inherently corrupting...
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Jan 24, 2014 21:46
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Roflan posted:Magic in Tolkiens world isn't what you think of as magic in most settings. The short, and inaccurate TL;DR of it is that magic is the expenditure of will to overcome the will of whatever you want to affect. This means that magic is limited to effecting things that have spirits or souls. It also means that magic is utterly corrupting, as you need to exert your will over someone elses to perform it. Magic can only effect what seem like inanimate things because those things aren't as inanimate as they seem(everything has either an inherent or adopted soul). Yeah, Gandalf never threw fireballs at anything in the books... Oh wait, he did. At every opportunity, right up to the point the balrog killed him.
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Jan 25, 2014 00:00
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sassassin posted:Yeah, Gandalf never threw fireballs at anything in the books... Gandalf was also literally an angel/lesser-god so he's kindof a bad case for how magic worked generally
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Jan 25, 2014 00:10
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Yeah, most of the reason he was so powerful in the Two Towers and Return of the King was because he literally shed his old body and took on a new, more powerful form. That's a bit out of the grasp for even Elves to accomplish. But I'm hardly a lore-sperg and if this game is as fluid and expansive as I hope it will be then I don't care if they give me Sith Lightning to zap orcs with.
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Jan 25, 2014 00:15
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nutranurse posted:Yeah, most of the reason he was so powerful in the Two Towers and Return of the King was because he literally shed his old body and took on a new, more powerful form. That's a bit out of the grasp for even Elves to accomplish. Actually Gandalf kept the same body, else he would have lost the Ring of Power given to him by Cirdan. Unless it's like Dark Souls and he had to climb back up the drat mountain and find his bloodstain to gain back all his old poo poo.
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Jan 25, 2014 00:42
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I watched the gameplay preview video and it looks like the final boss is going to be Sauron maybe? I am not super knowledgeable about these things but is there any way in which that is not incredibly dumb?
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Jan 25, 2014 04:12
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Pwnstar posted:I watched the gameplay preview video and it looks like the final boss is going to be Sauron maybe? I am not super knowledgeable about these things but is there any way in which that is not incredibly dumb? It'd be the dumbest, but if we're getting a super ranger that's haunted by a SPOOKEMS, screw it, go all the way! It probably won't be that though.  At the craziest, the final boss will be a ring wraith, and at the tamest, it'll be an orc general that was part of the raid that killed "everyone you ever loved."
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Jan 25, 2014 04:20
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numptyboy posted:You forgot the bit about tanks. 'Engines' get mentioned several times(It's always the phrasing 'And they built engines' or 'engines came with them') at various points in the Silmarillion, but that's so vague it could be anything.
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Jan 25, 2014 04:22
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Bloodly posted:'Engines' get mentioned several times(It's always the phrasing 'And they built engines' or 'engines came with them') at various points in the Silmarillion, but that's so vague it could be anything. Unless my memory fails me and the book states something more explicit, I'm pretty sure that means siege engines, like the giant battering ram that was used to bash down the doors of Minas Tirith.
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Jan 25, 2014 04:24
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S-Alpha posted:Sauron didn't have anything to do with the Battle of Five Armies, for one. He was driven out of Dol Guldur, in the southern reaches of Mirkwood, by the White Council. I keep thinking Peter Jackson is going to have the White Council drive the Necromancer out of Dol Guldur only to somehow have him show up at the Lonely Mountain for the Battle of Five Armies in order to give Gandalf a reason to show up and smite more asses.
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Jan 25, 2014 04:24
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Al Cu Ad Solte posted:Actually Gandalf kept the same body, else he would have lost the Ring of Power given to him by Cirdan. Unless it's like Dark Souls and he had to climb back up the drat mountain and find his bloodstain to gain back all his old poo poo. It was always my impression that the body was semi-new or at least after Gandalf beat the Balrog and semi-died in the process he trained with King Kai long enough to unlock more of his powers. Hence Gandalf the White.
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Jan 25, 2014 04:32
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MonsieurChoc posted:Here's my prediction: this game is going to be Colonial Marines level of bad. Except this game doesn't have the backing of a fandom or steaming hype trains to be a gigantic fall like CM.
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Jan 25, 2014 09:47
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nutranurse posted:It was always my impression that the body was semi-new or at least after Gandalf beat the Balrog and semi-died in the process he trained with King Kai long enough to unlock more of his powers. Hence Gandalf the White. The unlocking of Gandalf's powers was fairly literal - Wizards are Maiar squeezed into mortal bodies and with most of their power locked off so they can guide events without accidentally breaking everything. When Gandalf died poo poo was clearly hitting the fan so he got sent back with fewer limitations.
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Jan 25, 2014 10:08
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Is that from the appendices? Because it's not in the actual book. He's sent back because his task isn't finished, even 'the White' is entirely coincidental and adopted by Gandalf to symbolically usurp Saruman's former position as head of the order (shortly before literally doing it). You'd expect a maiar with 'fewer limitations' to not get destroyed by a Nazgul. Power-level chat is always retarded
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Jan 25, 2014 10:17
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SirDrone posted:Except this game doesn't have the backing of a fandom or steaming hype trains to be a gigantic fall like CM. I was being overly negative because this just feels like such a slap in the face to the world of Tolkien. I've calmed down now, and the game might prove as good as everyone else seems to think. I still think it seems like a bad idea. And I think it's telling that the Devs mention things like Arkham or Red Dead as inspirations instead of, you know, Tolkien.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:01
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MonsieurChoc posted:I was being overly negative because this just feels like such a slap in the face to the world of Tolkien. I've calmed down now, and the game might prove as good as everyone else seems to think. I still think it seems like a bad idea. And I think it's telling that the Devs mention things like Arkham or Red Dead as inspirations instead of, you know, Tolkien. Tolkien is a wordy, boring, dry motherfucker though. There are games that are wordy, boring, and dry, but the game where you play as a super assassin's creed ranger ghoster isn't one of them.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:04
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MonsieurChoc posted:I was being overly negative because this just feels like such a slap in the face to the world of Tolkien. I've calmed down now, and the game might prove as good as everyone else seems to think. I still think it seems like a bad idea. And I think it's telling that the Devs mention things like Arkham or Red Dead as inspirations instead of, you know, Tolkien. Saying you were inspired by Tolkein in the press for a LOTR game seems a little... redundant. I kind of figure that they'll be pulling a lot from his stuff based on the title. And besides, it's a game where you slash up orcs, not read a paragraph about the veins on a leaf. I'd like to know about the systems involved in slashing up orcs. The combat actually looks really good, but I'm worried it'll get too much like the AC series, where you have to put in a serious effort towards failure to end up dying.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:23
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poptart_fairy posted:Eh, I dunno, there's similar animations in the Arkham games as well. Only so many ways you can animate/mocap those fairly specific techniques. The tightrope seems pretty obvious. AC has a pretty different model for them and the one Talions walking on is a dead ringer. Though it's a simple enough model to create, a producer could have just said to make them look similar. A couple of the peg to peg jumps are straight out of AC too.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:43
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How to put how I am about this? I'm interested to see how they explain it and how it plays out. It's as ridiculous as The Third Age, which had the main character be an unknowing triple-agent and your plucky band killing Mumakils with swords whilst on foot from the ground. This is why I'm interested. It'll probably play decently well, too.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:49
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Calaveron posted:Tolkien is a wordy, boring, dry motherfucker though. There are games that are wordy, boring, and dry, but the game where you play as a super assassin's creed ranger ghoster isn't one of them. Yeah, you sure showed me there. Tolkien is a terrible writer, which is why he'S been completely forgotten by history. Oh, wait! He's actually a great writer, and while his style is obviously not your thing, that doesn't mean it's bad. And this terribly cliche angry white dude murdering thousands game is a bad fit for his world. Game might turn out good against my expectations, but it shouldn't have been a LotR game.
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Jan 25, 2014 16:50
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I hope this turns out to be a really cool game to play. I also hope it totally screws around with Tolkien lore all over the place. The more controversy it generates the more likely it is ( pending its a decent game ) to be a success. That and knocking Tolkien's work off the pedestal might be good for a change.
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Jan 25, 2014 17:05
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Calaveron posted:Tolkien is a wordy, boring, dry motherfucker though. There are games that are wordy, boring, and dry, but the game where you play as a super assassin's creed ranger ghoster isn't one of them. I think it's the assassin's creed ranger ghoster thing that will be the problem. For LOTR spergs like me, it's not the kind of setting where you run around and kill twenty orcs with wraith explosions then stab another thirty in the face. Combat doesn't look like it has any weight to it. It's just a slaughter. Even in the films, compare Aragorn vs. the Uruk captain at the end of Fellowship. (The Hobbit films don't count )And that's also what I think will kill the histories they try to give your enemies. If combat had some challenge and weight to it, if it was toned down from an action slaughterfest, the system could be really cool. In the preview, you can't tell mook from mook until they become the target and get to stand out a bit more in a later level. And who cares about some individual when you easily mow them down by the hundreds? Again look at the end of Fellowship, Aragorn is fighting that fucker who just shot Sean Bean, and he nearly loses. He doesn't wade effortlessly though a hundred orcs to fight a slightly bigger orc with more HP, at which point subtitles inform us Aragorn burned his house down few years ago. Also rangerchat - I think it's pretty clear Tallion is a ranger of Gondor, aka one of Faramir's lot. I never got the impression they were anything more than scouts/eliteforestxxspecialopsxx?
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