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Strategic Tea posted:Again look at the end of Fellowship, Aragorn is fighting that fucker who just shot Sean Bean, and he nearly loses. He doesn't wade effortlessly though a hundred orcs to fight a slightly bigger orc with more HP Unless I'm misunderstanding you, that kind of is what happens in the movie. Aragorn easily kills dozens of those orcs before struggling with the one who's pretty clearly established as "the boss". Gah, new page. Guess I can weigh in by saying as a huge Tolkien nerd I don't really mind that nothing in this game makes sense, as long as it's fun to play v  v
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Jan 25, 2014 17:22
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peer posted:Unless I'm misunderstanding you, that kind of is what happens in the movie. Aragorn easily kills dozens of those orcs before struggling with the one who's pretty clearly established as "the boss". Kind of. But at least it looks like it takes effort. He slowly retreats up the stairs before Legolas and Gimli show up. Even though we know he's not going to be killed off by some random guy, impacts have weight, he has to block their swings or get the hell out of the way, he has to knock their shields out the way and get a few hits in before they go down. Tallion just seems to jump all over the screen slashing everywhere, sending ten guys flying with wraith powers. It just doesn't feel like a guy fighting other guys; instead it's a massacre. I don't see how making enemies numerous and easy to slaughter can work with a system that's all about making them individuals with histories and reactions.
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Jan 25, 2014 17:34
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sassassin posted:If this takes place around Gondor/Mordor wouldn't he be a Southern Ranger of Ithilien-type rather than Dunedain (Man of the North) anyway? It's so idiotic to set this in Mordor when there's a whole war going on south, east and north of Mordor. Playing one of Beorns people fighting a guerrilla war in the forests with shape changing mechanic? Defending the lands east of Lonely Mountain against whatever the gently caress is going on there? They could have done the whole "main character dies, is possessed by wraith fights orcs" and set it in the south-east of Mordor without having to put the game in a geographic location where it makes no sense at all. Then they could have had some neat Haradrim enemies too so it's not orcs all day all night.
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Jan 25, 2014 17:44
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Don't get me wrong, I'd be all over a game about Turin Turambar brutally murdering thousand of orcs while unknowingly destroying everything he loves, but the game doesn't seem to have that kind of tone or style.
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Jan 25, 2014 17:58
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Christopher Tolkien isn't going to give up The Silmarillion stuff anyway, so all they can do is make mediocre games in the Third Age.
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Jan 25, 2014 18:13
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I don't know what the gently caress you nerds are talking about both in the books and the films, all the 'heroes' are gutting a poo poo-pile of Orcs/Uruk/Goblins/Evil Brown People with the requisite quasi-difficult-mid-boss thrown in so you feel some tension. Being a ranger with some wraith powers trying to corrupt you so you become a new ringwraith is within "lore" standards.
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Jan 25, 2014 18:40
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Yeah I don't think anyone has problems with the whole Wraith Possession thing. It's more the superpowers being way too over the top for the setting and the location the whole thing takes place in being dumb. The gameplay looks fun though. Assassins Creed but your character also has superpowers from Infamous? Sign me up.
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Jan 25, 2014 19:03
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Video game chooses dumb setting to appeal to dumb fans. Report at 11:00.
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Jan 25, 2014 19:05
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Eh, this could be good, i guess. Kinda feels like this might not have been a lotr game from the start, but whatever, if it is good i'll play it.
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Jan 25, 2014 19:59
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DatonKallandor posted:It's so idiotic to set this in Mordor when there's a whole war going on south, east and north of Mordor. Playing one of Beorns people fighting a guerrilla war in the forests with shape changing mechanic? Defending the lands east of Lonely Mountain against whatever the gently caress is going on there? They could have done the whole "main character dies, is possessed by wraith fights orcs" and set it in the south-east of Mordor without having to put the game in a geographic location where it makes no sense at all. Then they could have had some neat Haradrim enemies too so it's not orcs all day all night. I don't really know or care how much or little sense Mordor makes as a setting, but I do agree that I would have preferred it set somewhere else in Middle-earth. Middle-earth is way more interesting when you embrace all of the cultures that dwell in it. I'd love another globetrotting game, The Third Age was awesome for that. Let me visit Lothlorien and Rohan and I'm a happy dude. Frankly I hope this game does well enough to provoke sequels so we can see all different parts of Middle-earth.
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Jan 25, 2014 22:59
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The nemesis system basically just sounds like an expanded version of the investigation tasks in the first Assassin's Creed, where you had to do a number of different objectives before you could get to your main target. It didn't work in that game because it was super shallow and there were only like 5 different tasks, but it was still an interesting idea with loads of potential. Obviously it's going to be heavily scripted judging by that walkthrough, but let's say that each scenario has a number of different outcomes based on what you do and how you perform in the tasks leading up to it. Nothing on a massive scale, obviously, but things that will maybe change the area you fight in, or the amount of foes, the positioning of the target, or even other factors like having allies. I think it's a super cool idea, and even if there are only like 5 different "main" targets, it still leaves a lot of room for variation. The question is then if something is optional, is there ever any reason not to do it? Do you have limited time, or can your percentage go down? Are failure states organic, or is something like the target fleeing set in stone? If there's a dynamic component to the campaign, even a slight one, that could be really promising. Either way, I would have written this game and all of its ideas off if Monolith wasn't making it. Because Monolith are loving awesome, and I'm glad they actually seem to be working on a real game again. Hope it turns out well. Hakkesshu fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Jan 26, 2014 |
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Jan 25, 2014 23:51
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Looks fun, huge fan of the movies so I'm interested. Dubious about the Nemesis System which has been mentioned here before, it sounds a cool concept and it could be a neat gimmick but I doubt it will have much depth to it. Also as Epi Lepi said I have the feeling they're planning a series of games, although I'm solely basing this on the main title being Middle Earth: Subtitle.
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Jan 26, 2014 00:20
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Blacktoll posted:I don't know what the gently caress you nerds are talking about both in the books and the films, all the 'heroes' are gutting a poo poo-pile of Orcs/Uruk/Goblins/Evil Brown People with the requisite quasi-difficult-mid-boss thrown in so you feel some tension. Who said anything about ringwraiths? The only wraith I've seen looks like he is a ghost from the road under the mountain that they went through to summon the army of the dead.
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Jan 27, 2014 15:50
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Barrow-wights are sort of like wraiths but are just ghosts really? There are a few ghosty people but I think the ringwraiths are up there in terms of power and longevity.
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Jan 27, 2014 20:34
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CountingWizard posted:Who said anything about ringwraiths? The only wraith I've seen looks like he is a ghost from the road under the mountain that they went through to summon the army of the dead. Yeah, that's exactly what the wraith in the trailer looked like to me. Now I hope there is a skull-avalanche special ability.
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Jan 27, 2014 21:29
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Am I really the only one that just is looking forward to possessing motherfuckers and starting huge fights in orc strongholds while everyone in charge tries to figure out what the gently caress? I feel like the whole 'sneak up on assholes and convert them to your side' bit is being overlooked here in favor of 'wahh, my lore immersion. '
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Jan 28, 2014 09:17
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Screw the haters, this game looks fun 
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Jan 28, 2014 09:35
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If this game stayed true to lore instead of hacking and slashing your dumb rear end would wind up about to die until Gandalf comes in to save you at the last second because Tolkein was poo poo at writing his characters out of bad situations.
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Jan 28, 2014 09:45
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Blast of Confetti posted:If this game stayed true to lore instead of hacking and slashing your dumb rear end would wind up about to die until Gandalf comes in to save you at the last second because Tolkein was poo poo at writing his characters out of bad situations. I'm having a Too Human image of Gandalf descending from the heavens and cradling you away in an agonizing minute long sequence each time you lose all your health.
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Jan 28, 2014 15:42
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Blast of Confetti posted:If this game stayed true to lore instead of hacking and slashing your dumb rear end would wind up about to die until Eagles swoop down to save you at the last second because Tolkein was poo poo at writing his characters out of bad situations. Edited for accuracy. Every single damm time someone gets stuck, eagles.
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Jan 28, 2014 16:58
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This game looks cool, except video of the combat makes it look like once again the enemies politely take turns fighting you one at a time. I hope they tweak that formula a bit.
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Jan 28, 2014 17:58
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Blast of Confetti posted:If this game stayed true to lore instead of hacking and slashing your dumb rear end would wind up about to die until Gandalf comes in to save you at the last second because Tolkein was poo poo at writing his characters out of bad situations. Also someone you didn't meet until halfway to three quarters of the way through the story would take all the glory of whatever happens at the end. The fact that the Hobbit Movie got split in three probably exaggerates this but we're introduced to our protagonists, Bilbo and Thorin and his company in the beginning, but Bard is the one who kills Smaug and we don't meet him till Laketown, and Thrain is the dwarf who ends up being King Under the Mountain instead of any of Thorin's Company and we haven't even met him yet in the movies and he hasn't been reference. I haven't actually read the Hobbit so I don't know if it works better or not in that format. Personally I don't think it's very good storytelling.
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Jan 28, 2014 19:53
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Epi Lepi posted:Personally I don't think it's very good storytelling. The movies or the book?
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Jan 28, 2014 20:05
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Tyrannosaurus posted:The movies or the book? Both? My problem is that Thrain and Bard are introduced to perform roles that one of the protagonists we meet in the beginning of the book should have performed, and that they're introduced late in the narrative. Again, to be fair I haven't read the Hobbit so I only know in general what's going to happen in the last movie so maybe it works better in the book.
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Jan 28, 2014 21:17
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So you're saying that every story should conform to certain standards? That there shouldn't be any experimentation? Personally, I like it more when stories mix it up a bit. Not every protagonist should be the hero of the story, sometimes there isn't a happy ending, and a villain shouldn't necessarily be evil. Some of the best books/movies/games in the history of their respective medium have been known to mix it up, and were better for it.
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Jan 29, 2014 00:04
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Epi Lepi posted:Both? My problem is that Thrain and Bard are introduced to perform roles that one of the protagonists we meet in the beginning of the book should have performed, and that they're introduced late in the narrative. Again, to be fair I haven't read the Hobbit so I only know in general what's going to happen in the last movie so maybe it works better in the book. Killing the dragon is not actually the point of The Hobbit. One of the 'protagonists' killing it would in fact tell an entirely different story.
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Jan 29, 2014 00:10
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He didn't read the book. The story Peter Jackson is telling, though, is definitely out there...
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Jan 29, 2014 01:21
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If they actually get this Nemesis system working, I'd like to see it put into a Punisher game. I want a New York underworld that reacts and changes based on the carnage Frank Castle wreaks.
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Jan 29, 2014 03:11
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Quiet Python posted:If they actually get this Nemesis system working, I'd like to see it put into a Punisher game. Punisher wouldn't leave anyone alive.
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Jan 29, 2014 10:20
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Drakenel posted:Am I really the only one that just is looking forward to possessing motherfuckers and starting huge fights in orc strongholds while everyone in charge tries to figure out what the gently caress? I feel like the whole 'sneak up on assholes and convert them to your side' bit is being overlooked here in favor of 'wahh, my lore immersion. gently caress no, I want orcs pissing themselves on command to announce my presence at their gates 
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Jan 29, 2014 10:55
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Yeah, I'd say that this game got me interested but then I've never been much of a Tolkien buff so I don't really give a drat about any eventual lore fuckery.
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Jan 29, 2014 10:59
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Capn Beeb posted:gently caress no, I want orcs pissing themselves on command to announce my presence at their gates Yeah, if the Nemesis system works out, I'm tempted to pick one orc and see just how much you can torment the bastard. Could be pretty funny if the system has them comment on everything you did to them when they see you - "You burned my face, cut off my toes and fingers one at a time, shot me repeatedly, doodled on me with a sword...". Or since they apparently have an option to terrorize them into spreading your reputation, dub one "The Mouth of Talion" and keep randomly dropping in on him to reinforce the message. The potential for creative sadism would definitely enhance a sandbox-style game, especially since I'm getting very strong "the PC is NOT a very good guy" vibes, at least out of the wraith/revenge thing anyway. If all those wraith "superpowers" end with the guy getting himself killed off or falling to the Shadow while chasing vengeance, that would be lore friendly enough for me; "using the tools of the enemy turns you into the enemy" is certainly a big LOTR theme.
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Jan 30, 2014 09:01
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Drakenel posted:Am I really the only one that just is looking forward to possessing motherfuckers and starting huge fights in orc strongholds while everyone in charge tries to figure out what the gently caress? I feel like the whole 'sneak up on assholes and convert them to your side' bit is being overlooked here in favor of 'wahh, my lore immersion. For me it's not so much that it breaks the lore as that it doesn't really seem like an interesting use of the Middle Earth license, at least, in my limited experience with Tolkien and Jackson's work.
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Jan 30, 2014 10:53
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"Well we have all of Middle Earth open to us, where in it should we set this game?" "The shittiest part."
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Jan 30, 2014 11:08
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Drakenel posted:Am I really the only one that just is looking forward to possessing motherfuckers and starting huge fights in orc strongholds while everyone in charge tries to figure out what the gently caress? I feel like the whole 'sneak up on assholes and convert them to your side' bit is being overlooked here in favor of 'wahh, my lore immersion. I don't really get why people expect a Tolkien-level experience for a video game. Movies are barely there enough as it is. If it helps the lore-buffs any, I kinda think of this as derivative fiction based on the movies, instead of the books. That makes it a derivative of a derivative of a classic piece of literature and Silmarillion is no longer canon and anything can happen.
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Jan 30, 2014 12:47
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Viridiant posted:"Well we have all of Middle Earth open to us, where in it should we set this game?" You say that, but getting to see occupied Mordor is really exciting.
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Jan 30, 2014 18:35
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I thought all LOTR lore had to be approved by Tolkien's estate. Is that not the case?
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Jan 30, 2014 18:59
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For people who don't give a gently caress about the lore would you still buy this game if it wasn't linked to Tolkien? Because I feel like a lot of people wouldn't and that's what is perplexing.
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Jan 30, 2014 20:46
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Tyrannosaurus posted:For people who don't give a gently caress about the lore would you still buy this game if it wasn't linked to Tolkien? Because I feel like a lot of people wouldn't and that's what is perplexing. Probably yeah, I would. To me Tolkien is 'generic fantasy #whatever' setting, even if it is probably the most prolific.
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Jan 30, 2014 21:03
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Tyrannosaurus posted:For people who don't give a gently caress about the lore would you still buy this game if it wasn't linked to Tolkien? Because I feel like a lot of people wouldn't and that's what is perplexing. Yeah, assuming it's good. Like I said earlier, I'm pretty much only interested in it because Monolith is making it. I could not give less of a gently caress about how it relates to Lord of the Rings; in fact, that's probably going to end up detracting from the game if I had to guess.
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Jan 30, 2014 21:08
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