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Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
I'm 20 hours in to the game in the middle of act two and I'm thinking of restarting. :negative:

I think I've spread my skill points out way too much. I was giving everyone eveade and endurance and dabbled a little bit in each magic tree and...

Thinking I'm going to drop my barbarian for a bladedancer, too. Daggers any good, or should I go with swords?

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Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
In fairness, the plots to all the M&M games are pretty forgettable or a bare excuse to string together some dungeons. I've won 4-7 multiple times apiece, and let me see what I can remember.

In Xeen, a dinosaur man who lives on Discworld gives a glowing orb to a pterodactyl. Then a mean skeleton man electrocutes the pterodactyl and you spend the rest of the game hunting him down. Also, a spaceship.

In 6 there are aliens that look like devils. You kill them. Also, a spaceship.

In 7 there's some sort of war between good and evil. You get to pick sides, which changes the color of your interface. Also, a spaceship.

I understand 10 is missing the spaceship, but otherwise sounds like it's par for the course, complete with a opening cinematic which is even worse then 6.


EDIT: Also, best Might and Magic intro cinematic ever:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vLSoU0E07M

Fintilgin fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Jan 29, 2014

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Uh... what just happened? I'm in the Elemental Forge, in an area I explored with my old party with nothing special happening, I cast whispering shadows (coincidence?) and suddenly this goofy circus tune kicks in BA BAH! BabahbahBAH! Bahbababa ba! Ba! Ba! Ba!"

:stare:

No idea what the HELL that was. Nothing out of the ordinary otherwise.

:confused:

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

ZarquonHigardi posted:

Some monsters sometimes do a goofy animation involving song and/or dance instead of their usual idle animation. It seems to be pretty rare, but I've heard an electric guitar at one point or another...

Phew. I was starting to think I was crazy. There were definitely some unrevealed monsters nearby, that must have been it.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

shalcar posted:

Does no-one read credits anymore? The game literally had 8 programmers and 4 content creators. If the budget was more than $1 million I would be absolutely amazed.

I think the quality of the experience sort of raises the bar of what we expect, when in reality I think they pretty much knocked this out of the park. I highly doubt Ubisoft cared if this sank or swam. Yeah, there is an enormous amount of rookie stuff going on, but I would rather that they had spent their time on the game experience with an eye to tighten up graphics and optimisation later than vice versa.

This is where I am. It's a super low budget reboot of a decade+ dead series, using tons of recycled assets from another game to stretch their limited resources. Viewed in that vein the game is pretty phenomenal. Maybe it's just because I went into expecting it to be horrible that I'm so pleasantly surprised. It may not be as huge or epic as 6 or 7, but in my book it's a worthy modern successor to the Xeen games.

I'm really hopeful that it does well enough we get a more polished/ambitious Might and Magic XI. :ohdear:

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Honestly, if you've ever played this sort of game (or any older RPG) before I'd go with warrior. It's tough but fair, you just have to not be afraid to know when to fall back and come back later.

Now that I'm really enjoying myself, I'm preparing myself for the news that sales weren't good enough for M&MXI. If that's the case, at least we got one last real Might & Magic. :3:

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

GuyDudeBroMan posted:

Whats up with the shrines that say "come pray on the day of X". I've visited the shrine before and gotten "the party prays to X" and it was for sure not on the day of X. It was just a random day. Now the shrine says "nothing happens" when I click on it, so I guess I did the right thing.

I made a list of the days, and some of the Gods(?) definitely don't have days named after them. I assume one of the lore books refers to certain days as being sacred to certain gods even if they aren't named after them.

The days go:
Ylda, Ashda, Malda, Elda, Arda, Sylada, Shalda

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
You can tell this is a good game, because all day long at work I just want to get home and keep playing.

It's also got me chomping at the bit to replay 6 & 7, so that's next on the docket.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

JustJeff88 posted:

I was never happy with 6/7/9/X going 4-man party and not shy about saying so.

I've got mixed feelings on party size. I grew up with the Gold Box games, and Xeen was my first M&M, and six seems like a good, natural, fun party size. But when I look at these games from a design point of view, I sort of feel like four person parties is probably better for gameplay. The bigger your party gets the more you can cover all the bases as far as skills go and the more generalist it seems like your party would get. Unless you're going to go Wizardry crazy and have 15 races and 22 classes, it seems like only having four party members forces more hard choices, which makes game play more interesting in the long run, and encourages replayablity, because you can come up with very different party builds instead of being able to GM most/every single skill with any given build.

But, yeah, I always feel a little disappointed, and wish I could roll six guys.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Adam Bowen posted:

Managed to finish this last night and I really can't believe how good this game turned out. I started off pretty slow and very nearly quit at the lighthouse, but after pushing through that I basically played every minute of my free time the last week. The only negative I found was the constant gigantic ambushes that dropped irritating mages 3 squares behind you while forcing you into melee combat from the front. Despite that the game was still super easy on adventurer, but it turned into a bit of a slog as it went on.

Now I really wish I had played the rest of the games in the series back in their day, I started playing the NES version of M&M 1 last night but it's just a bit too aggressively old school for my tastes. Not to mention it's apparently 100+ hours long, I beat M&M X in 35 hours which is about as long as any game should be.



1 on the NES has pretty good graphics, a tolerable interface, and includes an auto-map, but it has a really dumb feature where a square is only added to the auto-map if it's lit up. You can buy torches, but each time you use the torch it goes out as soon as you take a step, meaning you have to use it again every single time you walk onto a new square if you want it added to the auto-map. I've heard that the Genesis version is the best version of 2. 3 is the first of the PC versions that seems to have an OK interface, so maybe the ports of that aren't as necessary as 1 and 2.

Don't feel like you have to play the early ones. I'd skip right to the combined World of Xeen (4 & 5 merged into a single mega game) if you enjoyed X, and see how you like that.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Adam Bowen posted:

I have a really hard time skipping games in a series but given that Xeen doesn't really have any connection to the earlier games, I'll probably do that. It looks like 6 - 8 are pretty much their own entities as well, though I understand 7 has some connection to the party from 3. I'm just worried that Xeen might be way too long for me since it apparently dwarfs X.

Just like X the "stories" of these games are generally irrelevant and forgettable even while playing, and don't really carry on between games to any great extent. You'll miss nothing by picking the one you thinks looks most fun and digging in.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Skippy McPants posted:

How buggy is this game? I've love to try it, but I'm debating whether or not I should wait for a patch.

I've had one quest bug out, a couple freeze-ups where my party was locked in place after changing maps, and some issues with distant models not loading or loading the really low res LOD model. Nothing really major. I just make 'real' saves in addition to quick saving regularly.

I think you'd probably be fine, but if you're really paranoid you could wait. Who knows how long until a patch comes out...

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
They're both really good, although I prefer 7. Honestly, I think I'd start with 6, just because 7 has lots of little improvements that make it harder to go 'backward'.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Apoffys posted:

There are bugs in the game, but it's certainly playable (for most people). I had very low expectations for this game, but it's surprisingly well-made for a low-budget Ubisoft game and I'd recommend giving it a try. The main problems are grid-based movement (but you get used to it) and repetitive voice-acting.

Or, if you're someone of taste and distinction, grid based movement is a big plus. :colbert:

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

THE PWNER posted:

How the gently caress do you beat the crystal spider? Maybe I should get my hunter promoted to pull it but I don't think that works on bosses. I just can't get in range of it.

I think I had regen on, took the first ranged hit, and then backed out of the alley and around the corner to make it close with me.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Yeah, item breakage really should have been cut. Without a skill to mitigate it, or a more granular durability system, it's really just a completely random 'LOL GO BACK TO TOWN' annoyance.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

shalcar posted:

This was how it was in 3-5, but only certain monsters or events broke your gear. I agree it's a mechanic that probably should go though.

It was annoying in 6/7, but at least there it felt like there was something you could do about it. Repair skill basic let you repair non-magic items, if I remember correctly, and each tier (expert/master/gm) let you repair better magic items/artifacts. It felt like part of the game. You could invest in repair on a knight or whatever and avoid having to take poo poo back to town.

If it was a slowly degrading quality that you could top off with cash in town, acting as a sort of gold sink, that'd probably be okay (if annoying), too.

What they've got is just a RNG which sometimes rolls 'gently caress You'.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Space Turtle posted:

I had this problem too. Barks have to be on basically. It sucks.

WE ARE ALL AWARE THAT SOMEBODY FORGOT TO BATHE THE BRIGANDS, RIGHT?!?!

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Grimrock was awesome, and I'm excited about Grimrock II, but yeah, the combat in the old Dungeon Master style games is nowhere near as fun as M&M/Wizardry style.

I'm really crossing my fingers this does well enough to get a sequel. They can reuse and build on this (a M&M tradition) and have something really amazing for XI.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Found this hilarious old trailer for the CD version of World of Xeen, and thought some of the rest of you might appreciate it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qa7AF9rs6c
(The fun starts at ~0:20

You spoiled kids with your fancy, big-budget, live-action video game trailers. This is how we rolled back in 1994. :c00l:

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Arkeus posted:

The patch is up folks.

Oh good, gonna go cash in that pirate treaty quest that has been sitting unsolved for a dozen hours because I visited the Crag 'too early'.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Adam Bowen posted:

The story was incredibly weak, probably because they were afraid to touch any sci-fi stuff or anything that might make the game weird at all. There's nothing worse than generic fantasy that actually takes itself seriously.

Which is a shame, because the goofy 90s sci-fi stuff was fun. If they gave me the reigns of a M&M game, I'd just go whole hog. Screw keeping the sci-fi for a 'twist' at the end. I'd set it on a loving Ringworld where the orcs have ray guns and there are robot dragons and have the cover art/concept art done by Boris Vallejo. Xeen writ large, unapologetically.

I guarantee you that would get press and attention and get people to give the game a look. No possible way it could be worse then blandly safe, generic fantasy. I'd also give it a goofy catchphrase for the trailers like: "Real Heroes take turns!"

:colbert:


(If you're reading this M&M guys, loving do this for XI. )

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Tufty posted:

This is currently on sale on Steam. I've played M&M VII and really enjoyed my time with it, and I absolutely adore Wizardry 8. Is M&M X: Legacy worth buying at the £15 price point?

Yes. It's closer to the older Xeen style games, but it's an honest to god Might and Magic game.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Since this is kinda the M&M thread, I've never really played a Heroes game, although I got the V bundle with Tribes of the East a couple Steam sales ago. Should I just play that or should I pick up the VI bundle while it's 75% off?

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
I've got III on GOG, I think, but couldn't really get into it when I tried it a while back. Same with the new Kings Bounty. But when I'm in the mood, I'll try those two titles again and save my nine bucks. :)

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Tabletops posted:

Seemed like there were some that were just impossible to open.

Specifically two or 3 perception checks in the tower of enigma and somewhere else.

Had around ~12 perception on my guys, I think I tried about 100 times and didn't get it.

May indicate a simple minimum for opening, not sure.

Yeah, you definitely need more then 12. I think some have a minimum in the 30s somewhere? I put perception up in that range for my Paladin and have the secret door follower north forest dog, and have been able to open them all either on the first try or after 2-3 attempts.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
So I finally find the obelisk treasure and it's just a one-handed sword, which appears to be worse then the one my crusader is already using. Nothing else. :smith:


Also, I've noticed an upsurge in odd bugs since the patch. Travel costs at the stables and docks display as -1, I've had character portraits vanish, and if I try to run around in the NW mountains every step grinds like it's loading a new zone but turning is smooth and normal.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Yeah, I felt like somewhere in the late teens level wise, gold simply ceased to be an issue. I've got 100,000+ now and I could dump a bunch into potions, but I don't even really need potions anymore, my Druid is so loving good at keeping the party alive.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

ShadowHawk posted:

Buy weapons and armor from the shop, they're often upgrades.

I did! Every other chest starts dropping multi thousand gold on you after a while.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
As a heads up to anyone playing or replaying MM7, there are some utilities online that will let you up the resolution and change how the textures/graphics are displayed so they're more colorful and vibrant. I can't really offer a tutorial because it's been ages since I set it up, but here's a link to the tool I THINK I used, but it's been a long time and it took some fiddling.

This is the original, at 640x480


Here it is at roughly double the resolution at 1280x1024 with enhanced colors. I believe you can just tweak the original for better colors too, without changing the resolution.


I HAD it running at 1920x1200, but I seem to remember that I got lots of crashes and oddities at widescreen resolutions, like I don't think the inventory worked right at all.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Anyone else found a 'Dangerous Cave' in the NE mountains that isn't enterable? I push spacebar but my party just stays outdoors with no message.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

ZarquonHigardi posted:

If it's the one I think it is, that cave is related to the Dwarven Might class quest. You could go in there before getting the quest and break it, so their "solution" was to not let you in until you have the quest.

Oh. Not sure why we can't become 'Honorary' classes like in M&M 6 and 7.

Also, it may be a bug, but I definitely just had respawning happen to me. The Temple of Meow fully restocked with enemies. Haven't seen if anyplace else has.

EDIT: Interesting. Despite the fact the puzzles were solved and chests opened, a small segment near the end of the dungeon was unmapped, as though I had never stepped there. The same thing happened in the Tower of Enigmas. One part of one hall 'unmapped'. I wonder if this is related to the respawn?

EDIT EDIT: A second Kilrah spawned after killing the first, except he doesn't attack and just stands there, and I can't poison/attack/interact with him at all. :raise:

Fintilgin fucked around with this message at 02:47 on Feb 26, 2014

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Doctor Schnabel posted:

The .csv files in StaticData, as Nakar also noticed, is a real treasure trove if you want to tailor the game to your preferences. Annoyed that only Freemages have access to Dark? Okay, give it to Shamans or whoever via CharacterClassStaticData.csv. Use the same file to give your Paladin the two handed weapons skill. Want to change the duration of Whispering Shadows? PartyBuffs.csv. Wanna change starting spells? Try the very bottom of SkillEffects.csv.

Huh. I might have to make some fun custom classes on some eventual replay.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Washout posted:

Yeah I've had the money hirling for a while now but I've finally been able to afford my skills and spells that I need, so I'll switch to her.

Also while in the hidden city I killed the crystal spider and it dropped 3 pieces of ashas breath armor from the chest, helm, boots, and gloves. My dagger master now deals obscene damage, getting gm daggers is going to make her sick, but going to be awhile.

Fully outfitted dagger blademaster with all the Asha's Breath stuff puts out ludicrous damage. I think I've got a dagger with does the same effect too. Groups of enemies just melt. My Blademaster puts out so much damage I often feel like my other party members are just there to support/heal her.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
I honestly don't miss bows, as I didn't put any on my second party. If monsters have ranged they hit hard, so I'd rather duck around a corner and let them come to me. Trading shots at a distance seems like a losing proposition. If they don't have ranged I'm buffing up or closing the distance.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Washout posted:

What is up with these more modern games being so drat short? I was really hoping for something that really harkened back to the old RPG games but this game was just so short. It seems like the modern developers are scared to make a game that has 80+ hours of gameplay like the old days. All the modern rpg's I've played recently have been like this. I hear blackguards is also really short. I have to go back and play older games to get anything that takes more than a week to beat. I just get into liking the game and the system and then bam it's over. Banner Saga especially pissed me off. I guess I expected this game to be as involved as Wizardry 8 since the spell and character system was really involved.

A little bit of replayability in the form of the promotion quests, but having the entire rest of the game be exactly the same (whole game is set encounters and no randoms ugh) is pretty much deterring me from wanting to play it again.

Even with all my criticism, this is probably still the best RPG I've played since skyrim.

Honestly, I think part of it is that it's a budget reboot. If we get a Might and Magic XI that can use the code/work from X as a base, I wouldn't be at all surprised to see it bigger.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

-Blackadder- posted:

I was fiending so hard for a game like this I almost went out and bought a 3DS and a few of those Etrian Odyssey games.

I actually did this. They're Very Good Games. But they are very... anime/JRPG. It was refreshing to have a new 'western' take on the genre in M&MX, where all my characters don't look like seven year old children.

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!

Janissary Hop posted:

The survey is worth filling out so you can tell them no, you don't loving want a Might and Magic moba or collectible monster Pokemon game.

This, a thousand times, this.

Also, I requested paper dolls, arcomage, and a return of sci-fi elements.

Worth a shot!

Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Even if we never get a M&M XI, this was a nice love letter and fine send off to a classic series, and one that was incredibly unlikely to happen.

Godspeed, (real) Might and Magic. :unsmith:

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Fintilgin
Sep 29, 2004

Fintilgin sweeps!
Get back to me when they do HD Xeen or HD 6/7.

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