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Crazy Dastard
Aug 30, 2004

"Typhoid, rattlers, and now drownin' in rivers? I think we need ourselves a new leader, or we're goin' the way o' the Donner Party."

TwistedSynapse posted:

Games of this era commonly had not just blank levels possible, but even stat LOSSES.

Would not surprise me AT ALL to see a -1 pop up one time just to make you rage :argh:

Luckily the last game in the series to have stat LOSS on level-up was Wizardry 5. When making Wiz 6 the developers decided to throw out the old 1st Edition D&D thinking and get with the times a bit, so dick moves like stat loss were phased out. Oh, there's plenty of other WTF moments in store, so don't worry.

quote:

Needing some pointers is nothing to be ashamed of in this series, and Wizardry 7 even more so than 6. 6 is, all told, fairly light on outright dick moves. It's hard, yes, but a well built party can handle most of it. It's even fair, after a fashion. Status effects like blindness and silence are hugely useful in both your hands and the enemy's.

By far the biggest dick move status ailment I'd say is petrification, but even it has some saving graces. For instance, statues have pretty high AC so monsters that hit a Stoned character have a hard time doing any damage. On the other hand, turning them back costs 1 Vitality and if they end up dead, resurrection costs another point.

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Luisfe
Aug 17, 2005

Hee-lo-ho!
Update 10

Very well, let's move forward!



: "AN ARMORY, THERE MIGHT BE SOMETHIGN HERE FOR US."



: "A corpse? "



: "Oh, I guess the lack of rotten "



Hm. Well now.





With any luck something will be usable!





Levelling up! SNAKE is now an executioner ninja!


We don't want to pump points into weapon skills then? Fair enough! Let's not!



But he'll be a better theologian now.


He learned a new spell. Not particularly useful though.



And of course we don't have anyone that can use the goddamn hauberk. Samurais did not use metal armor did they?



So let's add poo poo to the swag bags.


Yeah we can't use that poo poo.



Shield is also useless, even if DETPOPE has a shield skill. With zero points. Oh well.




Well that was a thing. We don't have anyone that can use ANYTHING of those things so let's go forward.



There are things in front. More doors.



Empty barracks.



Oh.
If this is the Captain's Den, then what the hell was in that tower?





: "Felpurr wants one of those."




Oh drat it!

Of course it was not the goddamn password.





We can't do poo poo. So let's just move on!




This one. Nothing worked. TINKLEE just refused to actually force it.
SNAKE and STERV are just ham handed and can't unlock anything just yet.



But it doesn't work!




And neither did this!

In the end I just used a goddamn iron key. Damnit.








Well, hopefully this has interesting stuff.




: "I guess this was the jailer's office. This key has a tag that says "Jailer's"."
: "That is quite convenient. "






: "Rats!"
: "We have told you time and again, they are not for eating! You don't know where they have been!"




Let's try the new key in this door!




Well now. It worked! It really worked!


: "A JAIL. IN A ROYAL CASTLE."




Lots and lots of closed doors.



Let's go back to the store and get some things. This sounds appropriately Bishopy.
And of course, I forgot to actually equip it. I'll do that next time.


These dudes were SURPRISINGLY durable.


So far going back to this place is more effective than resting, it takes like 3 rests for TINKLEE to get all her stamina back. This does it in one gulp.




Of course this one does not work. At all.


This goes for STERV.



And next time we should explore this part.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
It's interesting how many passwords there are in this game, and how much equipment you find is just plain not useful for so many classes.

Washout
Jun 27, 2003

"Your toy soldiers are not pigmented to my scrupulous standards. As a result, you are not worthy of my time. Good day sir"

Crazy Dastard posted:

Luckily the last game in the series to have stat LOSS on level-up was Wizardry 5. When making Wiz 6 the developers decided to throw out the old 1st Edition D&D thinking and get with the times a bit, so dick moves like stat loss were phased out. Oh, there's plenty of other WTF moments in store, so don't worry.


By far the biggest dick move status ailment I'd say is petrification, but even it has some saving graces. For instance, statues have pretty high AC so monsters that hit a Stoned character have a hard time doing any damage. On the other hand, turning them back costs 1 Vitality and if they end up dead, resurrection costs another point.

Yeah, don't resurrect or destone anyone, just reload from last save. Unless that character has extra vit and you are going to change classes soon. You can hardcore gently caress yourself by using that life amulet early on to resurrect your newbies before the first class change. If your vit was too low to change to a good class you would have to change to thief or something and then start the progression chain all over again.

Edit: It's pretty cool seeing you map out this map especially, the later ones are going to be nuts.

Washout fucked around with this message at 09:54 on Feb 27, 2014

TwistedSynapse
Dec 31, 2012

Voted Most Purple Wizard
2007, 2009, 2011, and 2014
Yeah I'm curious if you'll be able to keep the mapping thing up as you progress without losing your drat mind.

Also gotta say I'm liking the character interactions, somewhat sparse as they may be. (Not that you need more, it works)

Washout
Jun 27, 2003

"Your toy soldiers are not pigmented to my scrupulous standards. As a result, you are not worthy of my time. Good day sir"
At least it's possible to keep it mapped out in this game. Earlier games with spinners are poo poo would be impossible.

Luisfe
Aug 17, 2005

Hee-lo-ho!
I mapped my way through 4 Etrian Odyssey games. I might be able to handle this.

I am probably not gonna be able to handle this right


Edit: I should get the Etrian 1 remake.

TwistedSynapse
Dec 31, 2012

Voted Most Purple Wizard
2007, 2009, 2011, and 2014

Luisfe posted:

I mapped my way through 4 Etrian Odyssey games. I might be able to handle this.

I am probably not gonna be able to handle this right

In the words of Illidan, YOU ARE NOT PREPARED!

Otoh you managed to get through multiple bullshit dark teleporter mazes in the SMT series, so I dunno!

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


Wait -- I haven't even voted in this game yet!

EO1 has some absolute bullshit maps for a game at least partially about drawing your own map of the dungeon. I wouldn't be too worried. At least the mapping software probably will let you actually label the teleporters in the inevitable teleporter maze, unlike EO1.

Luisfe
Aug 17, 2005

Hee-lo-ho!
Update 11


Well let's see what this does.



It worked! That is a good thing!



Too bad there was nothing.



: "Pope, is thato ne of your relatives there?"
: "DO NOT BE FOOLISH. THAT IS CLEARLY A HUMAN SKELETON. HAVE YOU NOT NOTICED THE BASIC DIFFERENCES IN PROPORTIONS."
: "It was just a joke, you don't have to take everything seriously."
: "BUT I DO."



Hm. A book eh?


Hm. I bet that contains useful information!




I think that was the Judge Dredd faction in Planescape: Torment



Of course, DETPOPE gets the book.


Can be used by anyone. It is special.


The Harmonium can be used only by bards, so STERV gets it!





Everything can be used while in battle. This has no effect though.


But let's see what the Harmonium does.



Well.
He plays the song of his people in the harmonica
and it causes irritation. What, is he foing the crazy frog?





Hopefully this works.


NOPE.



What about this one?



Success!




But there is nothing. Nothing at all.




: "Hm. I seem to have lost the key. I hope it is not needed anymore."

Yeah. They key disappeared. I THINK that means we opened all doors that can be opened with it. Let's go back to Queequeg to see if there is something that can be acquired.





Bought some silly ammo, but did not feel like getting anything else. Let's continue exploring.




No effect on this one.



But on the right one?




Let's have STERV try it.

: "AGH, this feels like the day after eating a sewer slime!"




Cure Lesser Condition did nothing. Resting fixed it though.





Doors.



It seems that STERV is getting quite good at music.




SNAKE still fails a lot at hiding but he is geting better at it.




FINALLY. SNAKE finally opens something with lockpicking. That is a great thing. I think that the more you do it the better the character gets at it, and it does not seem to be as dependant on stamina as TINKLEE's bashing is. Also, TINKLEE recovers a lot of stamina while resting in battle. It takes like 3 rests for her to get the Stamina bar comple on regular rest, so I will be abusing fightrest, I GUESS.



Orc wrasslin'.


Are there even telephones in this setting? I know that earlier Wizardries had credit cards.


Hah!



Hm. Who is Snoopcheri? Who is L'Montes too? We might benefit from searching them.




drat! Enemies have the drat spell too! That does not bode well





This doesn't seem to do much. Does it stop spellcasting from working or something? Does not matter much right now. They all fall.




Blinding powder. Nice.




There is a door though.


And it only took two reloads!


On the next fight there was a level up.


STERV needs to step up his thieving game.


He also learned a new spell.


MONMOON also.



Bad screenshot. It says "Identify". I think that will be useful! Probably should've gone for Detect Secret. Next time I guess.





BOOZE.




Let's see what Identify does.


Neat. Allows one to see the stats of an item. That could be useful I guess


The map is filling up.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.
A few gameplay notes from this update:

That wine bottle? It will be used (not to say useful - it's not) much, MUCH later in the game.

Itching skin and the harmonium inflict the irritated status condition, which reduces an enemy's armor class.

Detect Secrets is useful-ish if you don't know where everything is already, don't have a high Scouting skill, and aren't compulsively searching everywhere. Not terribly useful, but it does light up one of the icons at the top of the screen.

Washout
Jun 27, 2003

"Your toy soldiers are not pigmented to my scrupulous standards. As a result, you are not worthy of my time. Good day sir"
Are you watching your stats for your first series of class changes yet? You probably need to do some save scumming to get the right stats you need. You should try to do these first ones sometime here after level 6ish. It becomes very hard to level up past 8 or so in the early game, so you have to aim for that as a cutoff when you should be making these first class changes (like with the Samauri for sure wait until at least 8 for some decent spells). Then later on you can worry about the next phase of switches. You keep your existing skills when you switch btw, a great reason to have everyone eventually cycle through ninja to get those skills rolling on most every party member. And good so you can keep pumping your spell skills.

All said though, your bard and a lot of sleep spells will carry you through until even the 3rd or 4th area.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Sterv should never not play the harmonium. Just the image is amazing.

I guess bards don't attract monsters to themselves or anything.

Washout
Jun 27, 2003

"Your toy soldiers are not pigmented to my scrupulous standards. As a result, you are not worthy of my time. Good day sir"

Glazius posted:

Sterv should never not play the harmonium. Just the image is amazing.

I guess bards don't attract monsters to themselves or anything.

Haha how does a cat with giant fangs play a harmonica anyway? I wish I had some kind of artistic ability.

Joke answer: badly, after all it's very irritating.

corn in the bible
Jun 5, 2004

Oh no oh god it's all true!

Washout posted:

Haha how does a cat with giant fangs play a harmonica anyway? I wish I had some kind of artistic ability.

Joke answer: badly, after all it's very irritating.

He's actually very talented, stop being jealous.

SirArthurIV
Feb 15, 2014
Instrument Lesson: The Harmonium is not a harmonica. It's actually something like a small organ. It kind of sounds like an accordion. It's probably a hand pump, since it's apparently portable

Washout
Jun 27, 2003

"Your toy soldiers are not pigmented to my scrupulous standards. As a result, you are not worthy of my time. Good day sir"

SirArthurIV posted:

Instrument Lesson: The Harmonium is not a harmonica. It's actually something like a small organ. It kind of sounds like an accordion. It's probably a hand pump, since it's apparently portable

Man why you gotta ruin my retarded joke.

Scaly Haylie
Dec 25, 2004


I imagine it's something like this. Goddamn, Sterv is just never going to stop being a gigantic dork.

Luisfe
Aug 17, 2005

Hee-lo-ho!
Update 12

Let's ask Queequeg about things.


Hm.


So, the Captain took Snoopcheri away from L'Montes. Interesting.
Let's visit the dude behind the door, maybe he'll be more helpful if we namedrop either.






Are you certain of that?



Nope. Not yet.






Sure. We'll see later.





Yes, that is the name of the game.


Oh come on. He knows that the castle HAS something to do with the Bane of the Cosmic Forge.
But he does not know what the cosmic forge is? Damnit.


: "A DOG? SNOOPCHERI WAS A DOG?"
: "Or a Rawulf! "



L'Montes also sells things.



Can't do much at the moment though. Let's explore other places.




Hm, maybe we can use the key of the Ramm somewhere around here?




NOPE.




Goin' up.




Can't do much but this is quite up.


And SNAKE cannot do poo poo to open it!


TINKLEE is nowhere near strong enough to unjam this one. Hm, it SEEMS like it is possible to pick the lock (just not right now).




Well, can't do poo poo with this particular door. We need to find L'Montes's beloved Snoopcheri.
Dog? Humanoid dog? Thing? We'll see.

Washout
Jun 27, 2003

"Your toy soldiers are not pigmented to my scrupulous standards. As a result, you are not worthy of my time. Good day sir"
Thats amazing, I was totally unable to find information about the dog and had to use spoilers.

Scaly Haylie
Dec 25, 2004

Man, the GIS results for 'snoopcheri' are pretty artsy.

Glazius
Jul 22, 2007

Hail all those who are able,
any mouse can,
any mouse will,
but the Guard prevail.

Clapping Larry
Why do I have the feeling Snoopcheri is that goat we heard at that one gate?

Luisfe
Aug 17, 2005

Hee-lo-ho!
I think I am STARTING to like the CGA Grid Cartographer theme. What have you done to me.

Teriferin
Oct 30, 2012
It feels right, for some reason.

SirArthurIV
Feb 15, 2014
It matches everyone's portrait. It feels...correct. Like it was meant for the game and made with the same graphical limitations.

wafflemoose
Apr 10, 2009

It fits with the game's gaudy color pallete.

Luisfe
Aug 17, 2005

Hee-lo-ho!
3 updates in one page is kind of heavy isn't it. Next update on the next page because it already takes long enough to load for me, haha.

PureRok
Mar 27, 2010

Good as new.
Having the next update on the next page does seem like a good idea.

Rulebook Heavily
Sep 18, 2010

by FactsAreUseless
Time to ask people for a new theme? (White on black.)

Crazy Dastard
Aug 30, 2004

"Typhoid, rattlers, and now drownin' in rivers? I think we need ourselves a new leader, or we're goin' the way o' the Donner Party."

Rulebook Heavily posted:

Time to ask people for a new theme? (White on black.)

I'd say Parchment personally. I'm using the parchment theme to map out The Bard's Tale 2 (which has almost as many spinners, teleporters, magical darkness, one-way walls etc. as an early Wizardry game) and it looks snazzy as gently caress.

corn in the bible
Jun 5, 2004

Oh no oh god it's all true!

Luisfe posted:

I think I am STARTING to like the CGA Grid Cartographer theme. What have you done to me.

Personally, it hurts my eyes. But that's just me.

Pyrogenesis
Feb 19, 2013

I don't really care (papyrus could be fitting but that has some size issues I understand), as long as we get to the next page/update.

inscrutable horse
May 20, 2010

Parsing sage, rotating time



I'd love a return to the "vanilla" yellow-on-blue theme. The CGA theme really strains the eyes, and the others... meh :geno:

dismas
Jul 31, 2008


I don't care but I do appreciate the mapping!

Really enjoying the LP. I've never made it through a Wizardry game so it's fun to see someone else struggle through it.

corn in the bible
Jun 5, 2004

Oh no oh god it's all true!

dismas posted:

I don't care but I do appreciate the mapping!


I do too. Someone else did a Wizardry 4 LP, and used premade maps, because you basically have to for W4, but it's interesting seeing it done for real.

Tylana
May 5, 2011

Pillbug
I can't help but assume Snoopcheri is either a beagle, or a mouse. Maybe Ultima6 warped me in my youth?

With the maps, I think being used to the map style is more useful than having a good style. It's about ease of access to the information it's giving.

Best of luck getting to a new page! I'm not sure how much discussion this LP will bring. But time will tell.

JamieTheD
Nov 4, 2011

LPer, Reviewer, Mad Welshman

(Yes, that's a self portrait)
I'd actually planned to do (at some point) an informative type LP of 6 and 7, but honestly, this is much more entertaining... Although I hope fellow goons will inform you of Dead Man Walking scenarios and where to save for the alternate endings before they happen.

As to the map, I think, if the size issues can be dealt with, Parchment is a good, traditional one, but if not, the yellow and black is perfectly fine for purpose.

If you want, once you've irrevocably finished a level (I suspect you're close to that point with level 1, haven't checked), do you want me to post bits from the cluebook? I'd be happy to do so, because the Cluebook for Wizardry 6 is... Interesting. But this final trilogy in the European series is definitely my favourite of the whole lot, and is just the kind of bonkers I loved in old CRPGs!

Thesaya
May 17, 2011

I am a Plant.
I really think Snoopcherie will turn out to be a goat.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.

JamieTheD posted:

I'd actually planned to do (at some point) an informative type LP of 6 and 7, but honestly, this is much more entertaining... Although I hope fellow goons will inform you of Dead Man Walking scenarios and where to save for the alternate endings before they happen.

Count me in for having had the same on and off plans for doing an informative LP. Godspeed, Luisfe, you crazy bastard.

I was planning on doing a rundown of the various ending paths when the time to choose comes up, as different endings lead into different starts for 7.

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Luisfe
Aug 17, 2005

Hee-lo-ho!
In any case, any change of map theme would be seen in the update after the next one (because all the materials for the next one have already been captured and whatnot)

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