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Best Producer/Showrunner?
This poll is closed.
Verity Lambert 49 7.04%
John Wiles 1 0.14%
Innes Lloyd 1 0.14%
Peter Bryant 3 0.43%
Derrick Sherwin 3 0.43%
Barry Letts 12 1.72%
Phillip Hinchcliffe 62 8.91%
Graham Williams 3 0.43%
John Nathan-Turner 15 2.16%
Philip Segal 3 0.43%
Russel T Davies 106 15.23%
Steven Moffat 114 16.38%
Son Goku 324 46.55%
Total: 696 votes
[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

 
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PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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I know Big Finish use quite a few images from the new series, but can they actually use any of the ideas/themes/monsters from it? If not are they basically building up to the Time War only to never actually deal with it/call it that?

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PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Is there any news regarding them getting the license? The previous company that had them went bankrupt and before Christmas Big Finish kept teasing some big news that unless I missed it never came. Also Moffat loves them so it seems he'd be able to throw some weight around in their favour.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Gaz-L posted:

I haven't listened to any of Gallifrey, but isn't Juliet Landau's version of Romana implied to be from the new series' era? Or did I misunderstand a blurb on some wiki that I may have read, or possibly just dreamt I did?

She's a post Time War version of herself that goes by the name Trey.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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CobiWann posted:

I don’t know…I kind of always saw Clara’s presence throughout the critical points in the Doctor’s life as kind of a “can you top this?”

Moffat's dick waving is the worst thing about his legacy to Doctor Who; the Time Lords coming back and the regeneration limit could've been handled so much better by any other writer, but he just has to pull his knob out, swing it around and dare anyone to do the same.

Of course being Moffat he then goes and wipes it all over an actresses face as well.

The bastard.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Jerusalem posted:

The story doesn't end with the 11th Doctor "The Time Lord Victorious walking away unscathed", it's "The Doctor Victorious walking away finally healed", and I think that is a hugely important difference. It is an embracing of a vital aspect of the character - the Doctor as the person who saves people, who rejects violence and destruction and looks for ways to help people because it is the right thing to do, not because it is "his right".

I still prefer the idea that the Doctor had to horrible things in the Time War and that ending it was a painful, desperate act. It's much more interesting to me that the Doctor would be willing to be the one to pull the trigger if it means saving the universe than being the one who runs away and is presented with another solution by a Deus Ex Machina and Jenna Coleman.

Some tension is actually present in the idea that sometimes the Doctor can actually fail and has to compromise himself, instead of always winning. Hell, the one time the Doctor lost in Moffat's run has been totally glossed over; although I guess by rewriting the Time War Moffat still gets the cock wave of saying Demon's Run was his 'darkest hour'.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Metal Loaf posted:

Has any of the series bible Davies wrote for the revival ever surfaced on the internet? I know that The Writer's Tale is probably much more insightful but I was listening to an interview Paul Cornell gave maybe a couple of years ago and he talked about all the writers being given a copy, and I thought it might be interesting to read. Lacking any flair for writing myself, I've always been quite interested in that sort of behind the scenes stuff.

No, and The Writer's Tale doesn't really cover that unfortunately.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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The reality bomb would erase all of existence, but until it's use a fixed point being broken could put a halt to any plans.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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That doesn't mean it's not the same scene repeated over and over again. It was cool in Pandorica Opens when they inverted it but from then on it's been tiresome.

Wasn't he meant to be trying to be smaller? Why did we piss away half a season on that idea?

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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I maintain that all of that deliberate. Donna left and he became near tyrannical and then finally died to save one single, elderly man.

Eleven's journey on the other hand was very muddled and didn't have the clear arc that Ten did. He basically finished the same character he began as.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Barry Foster posted:

If anything, he became a bit less interesting a character, as the writers dialed back the eccentricity and dialed up the zaniness.

But yeah, two thirds of Eleven's run was a mess thematically, focused more on puzzle boxing and cheap plot twists instead of character development or tonal consistency. It's a drat shame.

Watch is actually showing the first episodes Eleven's run today and he's so much more rich and interesting than how he ended up. Everyone makes a big deal of how Matt Smith could feel like a genuine 900 year old man at the drop of a hat but I think that only really applied to this first season. By the time he regenerated he was meant to have faced his darkest day (Demon's Run), relived his slightly less darkest day (Time War), confronted his final death more than any other incarnation (multiple loving times, with it only being evident on Trenzalore that he was out of do-overs), tried to dial back his fame (a plan that failed miserably by the time he was back to fighting every monster in the history of ever) and other countless angsty poo poo but he seemed like a big kid. I really, really hope Capaldi get's a chance to shine without Moffat but I doubt it; he's already setting up another web of puzzle plots he'll want to untangle before another writer gets a chance to run the show.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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It's weird to me that people would go to all that effort to cut out C. Bakes, animate the rain, add in drops from him and then completely poo poo the bed of basic photoshop skills like brightness/contrast.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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If Morris does have a collection of missing Doctor Who episodes and for any reason he isn't handing them over then that's awful. I fully believe that the preservation of film is deeply important for the art world, and turning it into a selfish agenda for any reason is pretty awful.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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James R posted:

Been re-watching Doctor Who since I'm layer up resting after an operation on my ACL and found something that has completely changed my opinion on a character.

I never really liked River Song, despite the fact that she supposedly loved The Doctor is always seemed like she pretty much used him to get out of tight spots in all the episodes she appeared in.

Then I watched 'The Angels Take Manhatten' about ten minutes ago and saw something that literally took my breath away as I'd never noticed it before. Amy turns her back on an angel to say goodbye to The Doctor and he immediately looks distraught and at the grave to see her name appear and almost breaks down completely, all the while Amy's daughter, River Song, who despite being a psychopath has just lost her mother forever, keeps staring at the angels so that The Doctor can grieve.

Nah, River Song can visit Amy and Rory as much as she likes.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Went to the Doctor Who experience (which was amazing) and made a new phone wallpaper from one of the photos.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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James R posted:

I travelled all the way down yesterday to visit it from Glasgow. Hah, that's a crazy coincidence.

I travelled down from Manchester for it, it was my 25th so my girlfriend tolerated my Doctor Who obsession for a little while.

What did you think of it?

I made a point to go and see the Ianto Shrine too (still there) and about six or seven people were there in cosplay as Torchwood characters.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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DoctorWhat posted:

Hideous? Hideous? HIDEOUS!?

You may lack the sharpened aesthetic sense to properly appreciate its precise design sensibilities, but that doesn't excuse passing such uninformed and inaccurate judgement upon what is, I assure you, the very height of sartorial elegance in more... advanced cultures than yours.

You'll be glad to know that when I visited the Doctor Who Exhibit a few weeks back my girlfriend who really doesn't give a gently caress about the show outside of it being her boyfriends obsession immediately fell in love with that outfit more than any other Doctors. It was her favorite exhibit piece by far.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Jerusalem posted:

Thats definitely the worst episode he's ever written, it's shockingly bad compared to even what I would consider his "bad" stories. It's still better than The Unicorn and the Wasp though. :colbert:

The Unicorn and the Wasp is elevated by having Donna in it. A companion who in any single episode contributes more than Moffats do over entire seasons.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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LividLiquid posted:

I unabashedly love Let's Kill Hitler, and for the life of me can't understand why so many people think it's so terrible.

The Doctor puts on a suit and dances with a sonic cane to convince space cops in a human-shaped ship that his killer didn't kill him, and it's amazing and fun. :colbert:

For me I disliked it because it took an entire two seasons worth of development about River Song and breezed passed all that potential in one episode while also proving that she wasn't a strong independent female like Moffat would want us to think but a puppet in the Doctors life in every way possible, even giving up all of her future regenerations so that one day she might get a chance to handle that sonic cane all by herself.

It also has the single sloppiest example of "and this character has always existed" I can think of.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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At least RTD could actually do the job he was hired for. It's going to have been over a year since the last full series aired by the time Capaldi begins and all because Moffat surrounded himself with loving idiots and is one himself. I bet if RTD had still been running the show the 50th would've felt considerably more like a celebration befitting the scale of the achievement rather than the wet fart it ended up being.

He'll, Moffat kissed half of the budget away on a gimmick that had been dropped by the BBC by the time the episode aired. It was old before it's time.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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jng2058 posted:

I'd been under the impression that the limited number of episodes in 2013 was because of the BBC, not because that's what Moffat wanted. Unless you think that RTD would have been able to fight for more episodes better than Moffat could or something?

When Moffat took over he hired a few of his friends to help run the show and their lovely attitude ended up pushing away the last remains of the RTD production crew.

Moffat and his pals ended up running the show into massive amounts of debt that meant the BBC had to split their prize show into two blocks of episodes each year so that they could give it a fair budget and pay off the loving mountain of poo poo that Moffat managed to build up.

A lot of Moffat's people got fired and the RTD people got asked to return but the damage was already done and the show has been suffering from production crew turn over ever since; not a single Moffat season has passed with the same people behind the scenes, with the obvious exception.

Eventually the split season format got so bad that it meant that 2013 could only have a few episodes in it while still remaining profitable and the wait until Capaldi begins his tenure is basically to reset the finances of the show and begin again, with a full season and no break.

Don't get excited about having a Christmas special anymore though, that's been folded into the regular series order to keep cost from spiraling again, so now you only get 12 episodes a year instead of 13, assuming your lucky.

The BBC is still paying off the debt that Moffat built up in one single season of the show and because of that Doctor Who has a brand suffers. The 50th episode was beaten in the ratings by Eastenders, where as when RTD ran the show he managed to get two episodes with larger budgets in which to send off himself and Tennant and they aired in prime time slots on Christmas and New Years. You couldn't move in the UK that year without seeing Doctor Who everywhere; it was a bigger and bolder event than the 50th was and that's because RTD is simply a better show runner than Moffat.

You can debate their writing quality, but it's silly to argue that Doctor Who wasn't better off with RTD making production decisions.

PriorMarcus fucked around with this message at 01:27 on May 12, 2014

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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It will still be a Christmas themed episode airing on Christmas day, just slotted into the normal series instead of another episode.

Also a yearly Halloween special would be much better suited to Doctor Who.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Does no one else remember the massive plot point that Saxon got elected not because of his policies but because the Arc Angel network had brainwashed everyone into doing so?

It at least made more sense and had more of a set-up than that dumb poo poo with the Silence and the Computer Church as far as villain backstories go and it had the benefit of actually being shown on screen rather than explained away in dialogue from Sexy Strong Submissive Slut #34.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Metal Loaf posted:

I believe he cut it because it would've been "too cruel", but I think he made a mistake.

Yeah, I wish he had kept this in as well. If he'd kept all of the things like that in then the Doctor's arc would've been evident enough that we wouldn't be debating whether it was a mistake or not.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Astroman posted:

Dammit, don't wreck another console room! :mad:

No, please do, the current one is loving poo poo. It's easily the ugliest console room of the entire shows history.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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I'm glad you finally got it man.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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DoctorWhat posted:

THE ONE TIME YOU HAVE A CHANCE TO BE REASONABLY NEGATIVE :argh:

The fabrics feel fine and the lining is positively luxurious. It's just too tight around the back.

Well I wouldn't order it for myself, but I spend a poo poo load on Lego and Big Finish, so I totally understand why someone would spend money on something that brings them joy, even if other people wouldn't understand.

Also, sometimes things just need a little adjusting, so it's not so big of a deal, just a shame it won't be more comfortable in time for convention season.

Are you still heading down to the Doctor Who Experience with it?

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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The_Doctor posted:

Oh ok, that's good to know then. I shall blame your potato you took the photo with.

I mean, obviously it still looks better than the stuff they made Tennant's blue suit with. That's the absolute nadir of cheap fabrics, like some Gap-quality polyester blazer material.

What company is it?

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Barry Foster posted:

On the plus side, here's a fan-made trailer for the 8th series. I'd poo poo a brick if Capaldi's first series was as calm, reflective and considered as this lovely bit of work.

Considering Moffat is still in charge and that the only trailer we've had has been a shadowy Doctor in an exploding TARDIS I think it's safe to say that anyone wanted calm, reflective and considered is poo poo out of luck.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Astroman posted:

Yep, where Nick Briggs shines isn't in his writing, but in his ability to find good writers and directors. I wasn't kidding when I said he may be one of the best showrunners Doctor Who has ever had. His tenure at BF the past few years has been top notch.

Oh my God. That's it; that's who should take over Moffat. Spend a season or so with him serving alongside Moffat, and then hand the series over to him with an already established supporting crew.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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DoctorWhat posted:

Should I post The Coat in WAYWT?

Probably not.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Maybe it was an accident and RTD never actually thought stuff through?

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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DoctorWhat posted:

Nah. Let them use the Dark Eyes costume, they just got it!

It doesn't look like a new costume?

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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marktheando posted:

I thought that was silly so I pretend it didn't happen, just like the Doctor using regeneration energy to kill spaceships, oh when the Master turned him into a goblin. Uh, I mean that was clearly some kind of dream or fantasy, as shown by the appearance of Amy Pond.

Yeah, but Moffat wrote most of that wank so it gets a pass.

I can ssee why, during the Time War, regeneration energy became destructive, but having it be powerful enough to destroy an entire Dalek Capital ship was loving stupid.

Also, that brings me to another problem I had with Matt Smith's swan song: it doesn't feel like an ending befitting his Doctor at all. Maybe if Amy was still around and the long stretches of time between seeing each other were more poetic it could've worked better, but Eleven was always a magician. He'd find a solution to a problem despite all the odds. Having him defeated saved by two outside forces (Clara and the Timelords fairy dust) was kind of a poo poo way for his final actions to be initiated, especially because so much of the set-up felt more fitting to David Tennant and came out of loving nowhere.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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MrFlibble posted:

He was used as a character in the IDW comic series, but saying anything more than that would be a spoiler.

I'll probably never read it; go on...

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Cerv posted:

nah, shite ideas should be brushed under the rug and forgotten about not shoe-horned into even more stories.


realised that was ambiguous - i'm talking about xmas town not the mara

But how would we continue without knowing that the Doctor lost his leg to a Tsunami Snake and had to replace it would a wooden Cyberman one?

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Bicyclops posted:

Look, man. Think of the hundreds of dollars you spent on that coat.

What? What! WHAT?!

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Morally what's the difference between being the 'man who never would' with a gun and then destroying an entire Dalek fleet with your magic regeneration beams?

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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DoctorWhat posted:

So the Ianto Shrine is apparantly a real thing that exists and it's got fresh flowers all over and???

I feel odd sleeping six minutes from such tragicallly misdirected efforts. No one should care so much about Torchwood.

EDIT: as soon as I posted this, some attractive young women came up to the shrine to peruse the fanart. I may have to reconsider my positions.

Yeah, it's weird as gently caress and a little sad. They still hold yearly meetings there.

PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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Honestly, that was probably it: an offer to record some lines for the episode with stock footage used still for the visuals.

Either that or more paintings in the Under Gallery of aging passed Doctors.

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PriorMarcus
Oct 17, 2008

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DoctorWhat posted:

The combination of Night of the Doctor getting made and John Hurt's performance more-or-less got me to be okay with the War Doctor as A Thing.

I'm preaching to the choir really given your AV but man, the War Doctor loving sucks. The idea that the Eighth Doctor ran away from the Time War for so long and in the end needed to regenerate is rubbish. I know Moffat has his fan wanking reason that no one wants 'their' Doctor to be the one who destroyed Gallifrey so he invented one (but really it's because Eccleston told him to shove it) but it's such a silly, needless retcon. It's made even loving dumber by the fact that the Doctor actual never shuts the gently caress up about the Time War.

I didn't want MY Doctor to be a massive loving coward that let billions die rather than join the fight but that's what I got. McGann would've knocked it out the park. That's the Doctor we missed out on Moffat, not John Hurt.

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