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Roguelike posted:Ahahahaha. What is capcom doing. That jump in is going to destroy people, it's like if Sakura's j.hp was also an ambiguous crossup. p much. It might not actually be in though, it's not in the eventhubs list and some people are saying it's not in the japanese changelist.
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Apr 10, 2014 19:57
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a!n posted:What about Ibuki's DP+P? The jump-awkwardly-into-the-air-and-don't-recover-until-next-full-moon move. you can still kunai during it, so it's not the worst move in the game. Still sucks though.
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Apr 10, 2014 20:08
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Trykt posted:Makoto 
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Apr 10, 2014 20:24
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Puzzle Thing posted:p much. It might not actually be in though, it's not in the eventhubs list and some people are saying it's not in the japanese changelist. Yeah, looking at the japanese changelist it goes right from cr.mk changes to the counter change. Also the japanese list has 16 total changes while srk has 17. Oh well. People are also saying that the Guy 2f reversal change may be a typo in the japanese list. Which is too bad, because a 2f EX Tatsu would be amazing.
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Apr 10, 2014 20:36
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quote:L Banishing Flat start-up reduced from 11F to 8F; changed from -5 to -3 on hit, from -7 to -8 on block Just wanna point out this part is probably incorrect. LP greenhand has been -2 in all the builds so far and already means Gief is punishable by some characters on hit. Being -3 would make him punishable by nearly everyone just for successfully landing a combo!!!!
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Apr 10, 2014 20:50
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I didn't know what the specifics of red focus were or if they've changed here, but that poo poo is wacky. Doing one from neutral has unlimited armor, but doesn't crumple at level 1. Canceling an attack into one has no armor at all, but crumples at level 1. I'm not even sure why they'd let you charge an EX Red Focus, there doesn't seem to be any reason to ever do it.
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Apr 10, 2014 21:08
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Fenn the Fool! posted:Doing one from neutral has unlimited armor, but doesn't crumple at level 1. Canceling an attack into one has no armor at all, but crumples at level 1. Bolded part is the same as normal focus cancels, though. Snicker-Snack fucked around with this message at 21:24 on Apr 10, 2014 |
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Apr 10, 2014 21:15
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Wait, so Dan can gain meter from taunting now?
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Apr 10, 2014 21:15
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I'm an idiot and a moron, so this is probably a stupid question but why is it ok for lp green hand to be punishable on hit? That seems kind of unfair (unless I'm just not seeing the fairness).
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Apr 10, 2014 21:21
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Snicker-Snack posted:Bolded part is the same as normal focus cancels, though. This is the weirdest thing I've ever heard and I wouldn't have believed it had I not just gone and tested it myself. Ryuga Death posted:I'm an idiot and a moron, so this is probably a stupid question but why is it ok for lp green hand to be punishable on hit? That seems kind of unfair (unless I'm just not seeing the fairness). It has been since vanilla (except on counter hit I guess?) and it's always been pretty dumb.
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Apr 10, 2014 21:25
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There are reasonable reasons for moves to be unsafe on hit - the ability to punish them by some characters but not all(I guess this is true for lp greenhands), only punishable when spaced improperly(point blank fireballs), moves that must be used meaty(weird). I can't imagine there is a good reason for this one though... EDIT: As the person above me said, I guess moves that are only for counter-hitting could be a reason also?
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Apr 10, 2014 21:26
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I hope the Viper changes stick and I get to see poo poo like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9aOrlT0ijCA Nodoze fucked around with this message at 22:17 on Apr 10, 2014 |
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Apr 10, 2014 22:14
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Question: in character tier rankings, are those going to matter much if I'm not playing against tournament-level people? Or would there still be a noticeable difference between an S rank and a B rank? I've recently started playing and have been using Rose, but have just been getting crushed by my friends, and have been wondering if it's just me failing (probable) or what...
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Apr 10, 2014 22:33
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Magus42 posted:Question: in character tier rankings, are those going to matter much if I'm not playing against tournament-level people? Or would there still be a noticeable difference between an S rank and a B rank? If you've just started playing, and your friends haven't played for a very long amount of time, it's probably you. Some top-tier characters have stuff that's easy to abuse at low-level, but the tier-lists you're look at are written assuming that the players are on a high level, maybe even as high as possible.
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Apr 10, 2014 22:36
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At that low a skill level, slight discrepancies in player skill are going to matter MUCH more than the actual characters.
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Apr 10, 2014 22:41
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Ryuga Death posted:I'm an idiot and a moron, so this is probably a stupid question but why is it ok for lp green hand to be punishable on hit? That seems kind of unfair (unless I'm just not seeing the fairness). The idea is probably that the move is meant for destroying fireballs, not actually hitting the other person. Green hand is kind of lovely at destroying fireballs in this game though. Another reason is that if it was 0 or better on hit, it would be a pretty ridiculous buff to Gief. Being able to convert a jab into a point-blank mixup situation without spending any meter would be pretty broken on a grappler.
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Apr 10, 2014 22:45
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MrJacobs posted:Ultra 1 had that problem, but only if you were hit out of it. Super now HITS ON THE WAY UP so it's no longer the single worst super in the whole drat game. Why the gently caress do I need a command to pick up a mask Because the mask is a double edged sword. Yeah you take more damage, but you deal more damage without it. If you're down to no pixels of life left, why would you ever want to pick the mask up? I avoid picking it up towards the end of my bar often and find this a welcome change.
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Apr 10, 2014 23:06
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Okay, in case there's still any doubt, I looked up the Japanese changelist and confirmed that Juri's jumping HP is unchanged. And yes, I speak and read Japanese, I'm not just squinting at squiggly lines in a table and making a guess. The SRK page is in error. If you would like to see the original Japanese changelist for yourself, the PDF is linked from this page.
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Apr 10, 2014 23:30
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cumtini... on ice posted:If you've just started playing, and your friends haven't played for a very long amount of time, it's probably you. Some top-tier characters have stuff that's easy to abuse at low-level, but the tier-lists you're look at are written assuming that the players are on a high level, maybe even as high as possible. cams posted:At that low a skill level, slight discrepancies in player skill are going to matter MUCH more than the actual characters. That's what I figured, but just wanted to double check - thanks 
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Apr 10, 2014 23:35
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Jmcrofts posted:The idea is probably that the move is meant for destroying fireballs, not actually hitting the other person. Green hand is kind of lovely at destroying fireballs in this game though. That makes sense, I guess that's why ex greenhand is +1 or whatever on hit though I still do wish it caused a knockdown. Was greenhand good for destroying fireballs in other games? It seemed okay in ST but I don't see very many giefs when I watch ST so I don't know how well it does its job there. What would make it better for destroying fireballs? Faster start up?
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Apr 10, 2014 23:40
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Sarchasm posted:Okay, in case there's still any doubt, I looked up the Japanese changelist and confirmed that Juri's jumping HP is unchanged. I think it's this for Juri. 
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Apr 10, 2014 23:46
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Ryuga Death posted:That makes sense, I guess that's why ex greenhand is +1 or whatever on hit though I still do wish it caused a knockdown. Was greenhand good for destroying fireballs in other games? It seemed okay in ST but I don't see very many giefs when I watch ST so I don't know how well it does its job there. It had some uses in Alpha 2 and CvS2. But it was never fantastic or anything, mostly just a way to build meter and move forward during fireball recovery.
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Apr 11, 2014 00:03
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madmac posted:I still don't understand why they decided nerfing Gen was a priority. He was hardly nerfed, though? Unless you mean delayed wake up being a nerf because he's one of the characters who exemplified dumb vortex poo poo. He got more stun in combos, none of his ridiculous buttons were changed, and he'll still have super into ultra for 600 damage. So you have to spend EX meter to get a hard knockdown, except delayed wakeup exists so getting a hard knockdown doesn't really mean poo poo, so you might as well save the meter for FADC combos and super into ultra and play him like a footsies character with an annoying jump instead of a vortex character. Unless you were under the impression Gen was bad, then I don't know what to tell you.
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Apr 11, 2014 00:26
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Magus42 posted:That's what I figured, but just wanted to double check - thanks Up to about 500PP you can win pretty much with any character using only blocks, grabs, sweeps and an understanding of when the opponent moves are punishable. Focus on the basics, be observant and you'll start beating your friends in no time.
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Apr 11, 2014 00:56
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HoboWithAShotgun posted:I think it's this for Juri. Yup, that's it. Diagonal jump HP would be listed in this changelog as 斜めジャンプ 強P, and you can see that there's no corresponding entry for it.
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Apr 11, 2014 02:16
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So... I guess I won't be able to combo after Balrog's jab swing blow anymore? That kinda sucks, although I can really only use that trick once per match anyway before people start looking for it. Also I'm guessing the reduced blockstun for Cammy's EX Cannon Strike and delayed knockdowns is going to gently caress with her rushdown and vortex, huh?
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Apr 11, 2014 02:36
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Magus42 posted:That's what I figured, but just wanted to double check - thanks Rose is a harder character to play too, she's fairly honest in the scheme of how the game is played. She isn't bad, but she requires good footsies to be effective and you might take a beating for a while learning the game with her until you get the hang of it
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Apr 11, 2014 03:48
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Gammatron 64 posted:So... I guess I won't be able to combo after Balrog's jab swing blow anymore? That kinda sucks, although I can really only use that trick once per match anyway before people start looking for it. It's safe on block now, though.
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Apr 11, 2014 03:49
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So I'm thinking of picking up Chun li and was wondering what exactly should I anti air with in v.2012? I've been mostly using far MK, close MK, close HK, crouching MP if I realize they start to press buttons high to beat my anti air, jump back MP (which seems to be her most consistent air to air in jump ins that I don't anticipate) and jump forward HP when I feel I can. Results are mixed at best. Any other tips?
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Apr 11, 2014 05:14
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Chun has about six or seven different buttons for anti-airs and they're all highly situational, there's not really a good single choice.
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Apr 11, 2014 06:20
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flatluigi posted:Chun has about six or seven different buttons for anti-airs and they're all highly situational, there's not really a good single choice. Yeah, I know that, but i don't know which ones are the best for any given situation. I'm just wondering if any of the buttons I'm currently using has a better alternative for the ranges they are effective at.
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Apr 11, 2014 07:33
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Trykt posted:Just wanna point out this part is probably incorrect. LP greenhand has been -2 in all the builds so far and already means Gief is punishable by some characters on hit. Being -3 would make him punishable by nearly everyone just for successfully landing a combo!!!!
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Apr 11, 2014 07:33
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bebaloorpabopalo posted:It's safe on block now, though. Yeah, I think I'll take having a less risky overhead over getting free Ultras off of it.
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Apr 11, 2014 13:41
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Gammatron 64 posted:Yeah, I think I'll take having a less risky overhead over getting free Ultras off of it. Plus you can still combo to Ultra off the HK and EX versions of it.
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Apr 11, 2014 15:09
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Ryuga Death posted:That makes sense, I guess that's why ex greenhand is +1 or whatever on hit though I still do wish it caused a knockdown. Was greenhand good for destroying fireballs in other games? It seemed okay in ST but I don't see very many giefs when I watch ST so I don't know how well it does its job there. In ST, it was hard but if you did it right you could destroy a fireball and end up close enough to SPD them out of the fireball recovery. It's pretty badass. Green-hand in sf4 doesn't have a particularly big hitbox or a lot of active frames, so it's just pretty rare that there will ever be a situation where you can get through a fireball with it. As someone mentioned it does still have use for moving forward quickly when the other guy is knocked down or otherwise incapacitated.
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Apr 11, 2014 16:35
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So I wanna bring up something that IMO counts as a system change even though it's not listed that way. Basically everyone with what you'd consider a Dragon Punch type move is now unsafe when they FADC it on block (-5, a relatively minor punish but CAN mean you get comboed into Ultra), UNLESS they do the EX version of the move. Notable exceptions include Dan, Yang, Viper, and Guile (possibly others), they still get to do invincible reversals, spend 2 bars, and stay safe. Everyone else has to spend 3, which is interesting because it's really just bringing them in line with characters that already had to spend 3 bars to reversal and stay safe like Dudley and Gouken. On top of this, no character is capable of "hit confirming" their meterless DP by waiting until the 2nd or 3rd hit to cancel it. Previously Ken and Akuma could decide to bully you by just walking up and doing fierce DP and letting it rock if they see you got hit, and cancelling it to stay safe if you blocked it. Again, it's still possible to do this with the EX version of multi-hitting DPs (except for Oni) which brings them in line with the expensive version of this that Ryu and Seth could already do. Just kind of wanted to lay out the way they're homogenizing the options off DP for most characters, and that the exceptions are interesting. 3 bars is gonna be a really important amount of meter to have on standby in USF4, because it's now what's required to safely attempt a reversal into ultra combo, plus it also lets anyone combo into ultra via ex red focus (which is especially useful for charge characters), possibly even off throwing out a poke during footsies. Trykt fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Apr 16, 2014 |
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Apr 11, 2014 16:48
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So I started the Trials for Dudley last night as a way to try him out... at first I was thinking they were worthless because they were so easy.... then I hit 16/17 or so... uggggh. Next thing I knew, it was 2 hours later and I still can't clear 23... x.x This is a nice mode for learning a bit about a character.
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Apr 11, 2014 17:30
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Magus42 posted:This is a nice mode for learning a bit about a character. Doesn't most of the trial mode stuff not work in the actual game because it reverts to Super when doing the trials?
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Apr 11, 2014 18:48
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I am not an expert but I think they mostly all work (with maybe a few exceptions) it's just that they're not really combos you would do in an actual match for the most part. Useful stuff like Ryu's cr.MP, cr.MP, sweep is there sometimes, but also you get stuff like 4 Vega crouching jabs combo which is pretty difficult for basically no gain at all. I have read that a lot of Juri players use her higher numbered combos as execution warmups and I suppose a lot of that could apply to other characters as well.
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Apr 11, 2014 19:14
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Just droppin this in here for bebo~ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qxDr53bvDo
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Apr 11, 2014 21:05
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