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jamal posted:Get a different car. I get liking a car, but for $20k, you could get a better car that you'd like a lot more. And which would be a lot more reliable and in every objective sense superior.
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May 21, 2014 02:59
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Just talked to the shop. They stated that they understand the 6.2 doesn't need a computer, but the fact that my current engine does use one somehow makes things difficult. I'm unsure why though. For those folks saying I should get a different car: What car would you suggest? I'm looking for something with a similar style, but more reliable and with the possibility of maintaining it for years to come. Diesel would be nice. I'm leaning towards a 4th gen Impala, but definitely open to ideas. Thanks!
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May 22, 2014 00:01
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Remains Unseen posted:Just talked to the shop. They stated that they understand the 6.2 doesn't need a computer, but the fact that my current engine does use one somehow makes things difficult. I'm unsure why though. If you want diesel, and are willing to spend $20k, get a Jetta TDI. Hell, you can get some awesome vehicles for $20k.
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May 22, 2014 00:04
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CommieGIR posted:If you want diesel, and are willing to spend $20k, get a Jetta TDI. Ah, I'm looking for something of a similar style to my Eldorado though.
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May 22, 2014 01:13
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get a 70' eldo and put a 6.6 Dmax in that fucker.
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May 22, 2014 01:19
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Wait, what? They're saying your current engine uses a computer? I don't know poo poo about the olds diesel, but that feels fishy as hell, a mid 80s diesel from an american manufacturer probably has like 2 or 3 wires going to it. Either way I think you need to find a new shop. It's times like this I wish I had unlimited disposable income because honestly this sounds like a fun project, I'm just on the wrong side of the country to even consider helping.
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May 22, 2014 01:23
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kastein posted:Wait, what? They're saying your current engine uses a computer? I don't know poo poo about the olds diesel, but that feels fishy as hell, a mid 80s diesel from an american manufacturer probably has like 2 or 3 wires going to it. Like he says, find another shop
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May 22, 2014 01:44
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Yeah either the service writer in that shop is horrendously unfamiliar with '80s GM stuff, or they're making up reasons to turn that job down because doing an undocumented conversion in a shop situation can get messy. Like I said both engines are mechanically injected, the closest thing to a computer in your car is the radio. Plus it's not like cars in the '80s had any sort of fancy electronic fun going on, the procedure for installing an engine that doesn't need an ECU into a car that has one is to simply cut all the unneeded wires out of the engine harness at the firewall plug and rock out. For alternatives, G and B bodies are going to be comparable to your Caddy. Regal is probably the closest thing to what you have. Avoid 307 powered cars, they're slow and expensive to fix. Try to find an SBC powered example (all the G bodies and most B bodies had a 305 or 350 option). Turbo Fondant fucked around with this message at 02:49 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 22, 2014 02:47
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Yep, the shop does sound sketchy to me as well. Every shop I have ever dealt with though has been sketchy. Although they did get really good reviews on yelp. Anyone know of a reliable shop in the Puget Sound area that I could take this car to?
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May 22, 2014 03:53
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cursedshitbox posted:get a 70' eldo and put a 6.6 Dmax in that fucker. Man, those 8th gen Eldorados are beautiful. So I would be converting one to diesel? How easy is a gas to diesel conversion?
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May 22, 2014 03:55
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Remains Unseen posted:Yep, the shop does sound sketchy to me as well. Every shop I have ever dealt with though has been sketchy. Although they did get really good reviews on yelp. Isn't 13/14 Inch Dick up in that area? I know there are a substantial number of PNW AI goons around, at least. Don't know if 13's shop does swap stuff, though.
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May 22, 2014 04:12
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This kind of work isn't for a regular car repair place. This is the kind of work for a custom car builder/shop, unless you do it yourself. If you go through a shop, good luck on leaving with only $20k into it.
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May 22, 2014 04:25
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Remains Unseen posted:Man, those 8th gen Eldorados are beautiful. So I would be converting one to diesel? How easy is a gas to diesel conversion? Mind you I've had lots of booze over the years so some of these details are fuzzy the TH425 uses the same bell as the BOP in your car. Same adapter. iirc the front driveline might be in the way of the oil pan. The only issue with that trans is chains stretching. mind you theres a 455 version motorhome that was milled out, and people ran the poo poo out of em...at 90mph. theres also the sister, the toronado. there is PLENTY of space for such a large rear end engine. jesus those things had massive engine bays. I know the swap has been done in a deville of the era.
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May 22, 2014 04:35
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I don't think the chains really stretch on TH425s. I've heard of them outlasting several transmission rebuilds. GM put a lot of engineering effort into getting those right, and then had the Hurst Hairy Olds to showcase that. I keep hounding my buddy to rebuild an old TH425 out of a motorhome because I want to see how those chains hold up.
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May 22, 2014 05:18
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I think I finally found a shop that is interested in putting in the Detroit 6.2. They quoted around 5-6k for the swap, which is much cheaper than I expected. The shop wanted to know if there is a specific engine code/engine type needed here, as it sounds like there might be various types or variations of the 6.2. Any thoughts on that? Thanks again for the help everyone! 
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Jun 12, 2014 23:51
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I totally get wanting to keep the car and put a new engine in, 20k is ludicrous though. You need a good long chat with your new shop, find out what is and isn't included in that quote. Get an agreement on warranty, cost overruns, timing etc. Do you have another car to use while this happens?
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Jun 14, 2014 10:13
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Remains Unseen posted:Diesel would be nice. Why?
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Jun 14, 2014 12:20
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All this car needs is a head gasket job, right? Why not have the head gaskets replaced and get new grade 9 head bolts? Talk about scope creep.
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Jun 14, 2014 14:01
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Psycho Donut Killer posted:All this car needs is a head gasket job, right? Why not have the head gaskets replaced and get new grade 9 head bolts? Talk about scope creep. Because at the end of the day you still have a terrible engine. Also, the 20k figure was one man's estimate thrown in the circle early in the thread, it's not the absolute set-in-stone figure for accomplishing this. OP: I don't know any specific RPO codes but you absolutely want something '88 or later ('88 was the year they got all the reliability issues worked out), and '90-up will get you a little better performance and fuel economy. Turbo Fondant fucked around with this message at 15:30 on Jun 14, 2014 |
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Jun 14, 2014 15:24
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Yeah, it's significantly cheaper given that there already are adapters to get the engine mated up to the transmission. Not designing some form of custom torque converter saves a whole lot, the last custom torque converter I had priced out was over $4,000. Engine mounts, cooling, fuel lines and exhaust don't need nearly the precision as the rotating assembly.
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Jun 14, 2014 16:47
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The thing is with good head gaskets and good head bolts and a water fuel separator they are not are arguably not a terrible engine.
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Jun 14, 2014 17:22
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Psycho Donut Killer posted:The thing is with good head gaskets and good head bolts and a water fuel separator they are not are arguably not a terrible engine. This. The motor wasn't terrible, GM MADE it terrible. You can easily make the engine reliable and fairly perky.
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Jun 14, 2014 18:26
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Cakefool posted:I totally get wanting to keep the car and put a new engine in, 20k is ludicrous though. The new quote was only 5k! I was thinking this isn't too bad. What do you think? I'll definitely ask those questions though to the new shop. Unfortunately I don't have another car to use, but I don't mind biking everywhere in the mean time. Keeps me in shape.
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Jun 16, 2014 06:48
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dissss posted:Why? Good question. I eventually wanted to run this car on veggie oil, mainly because I thought it would be a cool idea. Maybe it's a dumb project, but I thought having a ridiculous looking cadi that runs on veggie oil would be the coolest thing ever.
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Jun 16, 2014 06:49
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Psycho Donut Killer posted:All this car needs is a head gasket job, right? Why not have the head gaskets replaced and get new grade 9 head bolts? Talk about scope creep. It did...but the current shop has told me that no more head gaskets exist for this thing...and it is likely that the cylinder head is cracked as well.
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Jun 16, 2014 06:50
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Remains Unseen posted:It did...but the current shop has told me that no more head gaskets exist for this thing That's not true http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/raframecatalog.php?carcode=1026009&parttype=5412 It's even on sale buy buy buy!
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Jun 16, 2014 07:44
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Remains Unseen posted:It did...but the current shop has told me that no more head gaskets exist for this thing...and it is likely that the cylinder head is cracked as well.  That's code for "we don't want to touch it"
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Jun 16, 2014 07:48
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Remains Unseen posted:The new quote was only 5k! I was thinking this isn't too bad. What do you think? Seems like a good price for a custom engine swap. Ask them for pics of any other conversions they have done. You don't want this thing hacked up by some hillbilly who thinks they know how to do an engine swap.
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Jun 16, 2014 15:51
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Remains Unseen posted:Good question. I eventually wanted to run this car on veggie oil, mainly because I thought it would be a cool idea. Maybe it's a dumb project, but I thought having a ridiculous looking cadi that runs on veggie oil would be the coolest thing ever. I don't know anything specifically about 6.2 and SVO/biodiesel but most motors need some modifications as svo/bio will eat most of the older factory rubber components, like, o-rings, hoses, some gaskets etc. You'll want a oil pre-heat setup, and possibly a second tank and hardware for fuel switching if you have any kind of cool weather driving needs. You'd be foolish not to get that stuff plumbed in while the engine swap is happening. Also, if you want any chance of longevity and reliability out of the engine on svo, you are going to need to ph balance, filter and dry that oil, so budget garage space, equipment, time and money to make that happen.
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Jun 16, 2014 18:58
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kastein posted:Seems like a good price for a custom engine swap. On top of this - you're also doing a swap that few people (if anyone) has ever attempted, so you also need to account for the inevitable point where some component takes two or three revisions to make right.
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Jun 16, 2014 21:07
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Remains Unseen posted:It did...but the current shop has told me that no more head gaskets exist for this thing...and it is likely that the cylinder head is cracked as well. So get the head checked by a reputable machine shop, they'll tell you what state it's in. If it's good or only needs skimming get gaskets and updated head bolts and rejoice in saving $4-19k. If it's bad find a good head and do the same. Both are cheaper and more reliable than an undocumented swap and you'll probably be driving your car this year, versus possibly never when you scrap it in debt and frustration. Cool car by the way, diesel caddy is stupid enough to be brilliant in my damaged mind.
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Jun 18, 2014 07:23
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Thought I would post an update. I found a shop that will do the swap for 5K. What's the most I should pay for a 6.2 Detroit? If we have to buy a truck to pull it out of, what truck should I look for? The only item that this shop mentioned: will a 6.2 be too tall for my car? Thanks!
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Jul 1, 2014 22:03
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Cakefool posted:So get the head checked by a reputable machine shop, they'll tell you what state it's in. If it's good or only needs skimming get gaskets and updated head bolts and rejoice in saving $4-19k. If it's bad find a good head and do the same. Both are cheaper and more reliable than an undocumented swap and you'll probably be driving your car this year, versus possibly never when you scrap it in debt and frustration. Apparently no machine shop will look at the head...that's what shop A is telling me at least. Sounds like a load of horseshit to me. I'll see what shop B has to say about that as well.
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Jul 2, 2014 01:37
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Find a shop that does diesel trucks?
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Jul 3, 2014 07:00
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Remains Unseen posted:Apparently no machine shop will look at the head...that's what shop A is telling me at least. Sounds like a load of horseshit to me. I'll see what shop B has to say about that as well. Bullshit. Most machine shops will look at cracked heads, and at least tell you if its salvageable. Someone is lying to you, machine shops don't turn away potential customers on a whim.
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Jul 4, 2014 19:19
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A head is a head is a head. There is nothing magical unicorn-fart about it just because you're a filthy derv user. Something's fishy.
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Jul 4, 2014 21:22
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If you're so set on style and diesel, why don't you check out an 80s Mercedes diesel with the OM617? They're going on 30 years old, so there's gonna be some issues, but those engines are legendary for their reliability. You can probably find one in good shape for less than the cost of at least the Olds engine swap and the MB motor will probably live longer than you.
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Jul 5, 2014 14:38
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I finally got some more information about why the shop refuses to try and fix the head gasket. They said that since the block can warp, no machine shop will work on it. I'm either going to try and proceed with putting the 6.2 in there, or do the Chevy Blazer chassis swap. The new shop is concerned about the extra weight and height of a 6.2. Thoughts?
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Jul 9, 2014 19:48
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Remains Unseen posted:I finally got some more information about why the shop refuses to try and fix the head gasket. They said that since the block can warp, no machine shop will work on it. So you were told that the shop won't try to replace the head gasket because it might give them more work that they get paid for? This isn't hard: you pull the heads and check both them and the block to see if they're straight. If the head aren't, they get sent to the machine shop to see if they can be decked far enough to be flat again within minimum spec. If the block mating surfaces aren't flat they quote you on any of the various way of fixing that, up to and including sending the block to the same machine shop to be decked flat. Any shop that won't do a partial teardown to determine this either doesn't want your business or is ramrodding the easiest/most profitable jobs that they would prefer to do on you.
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Jul 9, 2014 20:24
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Find another shop. Find another shop. Find another shop. Find another shop. Find another shop.
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Jul 9, 2014 20:48
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