Arkane posted:

Repeating the same made up thing that the other dude said with different words does not codify it into a fact.

"Common knowledge" guys. Yup, argument's over. It's common knowledge. Move along everyone.

Popular Thug Drink posted:

There are more than enough examples of white people freaking out about Obama because he is a black muslim socialist, and if it bothers you that people talk about this then I suggest you pull your head out of your rear end and try to discuss why white people suck so hard rather than get personally offended on behalf of the white race or whatever stupid poo poo is bothering you at the present time.

Popular Thug Drink posted:

Neither of these are all that unlikely nor incomprehensible, instead of trying to demonstrate why your jimmies are rustled you just assert that the people who said it are dumb and illogical. Great thanks good contribution, I'd like to remind you all that Arkane is a famously limp dicked poster who contributes to that constellation of dead forums dedicated to being angry and upset that SA isn't their own personal hugbox and yet isn't smart enough to get a new alt account or simply stop posting here.

Arkane posted:

So we've downgraded from "most" to "huge" and now "more than enough examples."

Next up on the list is "a few scattered examples over the years."

Them goal posts: they move so fast.

Omi-Polari posted:

The last poll I saw on this reported 17% of registered voters believed Obama is Muslim. Oddly, a majority of that 17% were okay with it. Of course I saw another poll which found that a tiny minority of Americans believe Obama is the Antichrist, including some people who voted for him. Which means there's people who voted for (in their minds) the Antichrist.

Well, in any case I don't think you can really say with certainty that half the United States has intense hatred for the president because he's black. I think you all are reading too many unhinged right-wingers who are relatively few in number but are magnified by the internet and by the media.

SedanChair posted:

Arkane you are a person who has literally chosen to serve evil.

Omi-Polari posted:

Well we live in a highly polarized political environment. For the right, everything Democrats do is further proof there's a communist-in-chief who is taking one step towards a New World Order. For the left, everything Republicans do is further proof of the brownshirt menace on the march, once again. It's Red Scare/Brown Scare. Sure there are a lot of crazies, but I think most Americans are pretty reasonable folks.

Arkane posted:

Republicans HATED Clinton with a passion. Think of the famous conservative voices: pretty much all of them achieved incredible popularity hating on Clinton. Limbaugh, Hannity, Drudge, Coulter. Fox News started during Clinton's presidency. On and on.

Not sure who you are trying to fool by just posting deluded nonsense.

SedanChair posted:

e: I do agree with you though, I don't think anywhere close to half of Americans hate Obama. A large number fear all blacks though, and though some of them would call Obama "one of the good ones" they will always believe his loyalty is first and foremost to blacks, because their loyalty is first and foremost to whites.

VitalSigns posted:

You could mayyyyyyybe convince me that the incessant clamoring to impeach Obama no matter what he does isn't racist...like, if I were really high, I might nod along and go "yeah they did impeach Clinton over a blowjob so sure maybe Republicans are just huge tantrum-throwing babies no matter the color of a Democratic President." I mean, okay.

But you will never, ever convince me that birtherism isn't racist, because that's pure stubborn, resolute refusal to accept him as a Real American based on nothing more than the color of his skin and his scary-sounding name. And considering there are elected, sitting members of Congress who yet refuse to admit Obama is the legitimate President, I'm going to have to say yeah, white people are still pretty racist.

Arkane posted:

I don't think the team thing quite works here, because with an approval rating in the low 40s, there's a lot more liberal dislike of Obama than this thread lets on, and it's definitely not driven by racism. The first black President is also a greatly disliked President, and there are a lot of reasons for that.

VitalSigns posted:

But you will never, ever convince me that birtherism isn't racist, because that's pure stubborn, resolute refusal to accept him as a Real American based on nothing more than the color of his skin and his scary-sounding name. And considering there are elected, sitting members of Congress who yet refuse to admit Obama is the legitimate President, I'm going to have to say yeah, white people are still pretty racist.

Popular Thug Drink posted:

A large portion of why the right dislikes Obama is because he is black, because politically right people in the USA tend to distrust and dislike blah people. This is not a controversial statement, sorry if it triggers your latent white problems or whatever.

Popular Thug Drink posted:

As someone who has regular contact with blue collar white middle Americans, it's pretty much a given that they really hate him for reasons they can't quite articulate but he's a Bad President and also they don't trust black people in general.

Arkane posted:

I agree to an extent, but I speculatively think a sizable percentage of those would be equally vitriolic about a white candidate of uncertain birth status.

Arkane posted:

And what if the shoe were on the other foot? Colin Powell born in Hawaii, for instance, to a non-American father. Would there have been a birther movement for the Democrats? Probably nowhere as big, but it's within reason that it would exist.

Arkane posted:

I think there is a tendency to view things in a polarizing fashion. The two parties hate each other. A lot of disgust for Politician A is based on that decades-long hatred, and not because of the color of the politician's skin. That can't be said for everyone, racism still exists (poo poo there was a minority of Dem voters in 2008 who voted for Hillary based on race, per polling) but dressing up ALL or MOST disgust for Politician A because of race is baseless.

Arkane posted:

Is there someone from Guinness watching this thread that I'm unaware of? How many times are you going to repeat the same bullshit line over and over?

Arkane posted:

I agree to an extent, but I speculatively think a sizable percentage of those would be equally vitriolic about a white candidate of uncertain birth status.

Arkane posted:

And what if the shoe were on the other foot? Colin Powell born in Hawaii, for instance, to a non-American father. Would there have been a birther movement for the Democrats? Probably nowhere as big, but it's within reason that it would exist.

Popular Thug Drink posted:

Really though Arkane I'm kind of jealous that I can't live in your world where racism doesn't exist and isn't a thing that way too many people are open and vocal about.

Arkane posted:

That can't be said for everyone, racism still exists (poo poo there was a minority of Dem voters in 2008 who voted for Hillary based on race, per polling) but dressing up ALL or MOST disgust for Politician A because of race is baseless.

Arkane posted:

And FYI, 50 or whatever posts later, it's still baseless! The closest you have come to substantiating it is "I met a bunch of people and they all hate Obama because he's black." Not exactly what you said, but fairly close. I feel bad for you just re-typing that.

E-Tank posted:

Please continue to tell us all how racism is not a big deal you guys, and that white privilege totally can't exist. After all, this is a post racial society, right? You're not racist, you're totally color blind in that regard, Correct?

Omi-Polari posted:

Yeah I agree with your second graf. But the impeachment stuff sounds to me like politics as usual for fringy types.

A Buttery Pastry posted:

I might be misremembering things I've read in D&D, but didn't the Republicans basically start talking about impeachment from day one of the Clinton presidency? And hate groups/right-wing militias also multiplied during his presidency, like they did after Obama came to power. If I remember right, I think there's an argument to be made that at least some of the reaction to Obama comes from a tribal Democrats vs. Republicans hatred, independent of the color of his skin. The way that hatred is then shown is often through classic racist stereotypes and poo poo, but it's not necessarily the primary cause. Obviously this doesn't mean these people aren't racist, but to some degree I think it can be argued they're primarily extremely anti-Democrat due to the polarized American political landscape. Had Hillary become president, they would just have brought out the anti-woman rhetoric instead.

Obviously this also ties into the general ideology of the Republican party, so it's really a lot of things feeding into each other. Basically, ready-made and popular prejudices that conform to the ideology of the party, combined with massive polarization, means the stable state of the Republican base is "massive outrage" whenever there's a Democrat president. Being some sort of minority just dials it up a notch further, but it would still be there without it.

RonMexicosPitbull posted:

E-Tank posted:

Okay then, *you* explain why Obama is the president that the republican controlled congress has basically refused to do anything.

You explain why Obama is the first president to have a white congressman jump up, and shout 'You lie!' when he sat there for Reagan trying his best to not admit to committing high treason.

You explain why Obama is the first president to have a congressman outright come out and say 'Its our job to make sure he's a one term president'.

Genocide Tendency posted:

Because he is a democrat. If it were Hillary, they would still be saying the same thing. If it were some random white dude, take a wild guess what the republicans would say.

But by all means, keep lying to your self and believing that racism and not retarded "they aren't batting for my political team" is why these happen.

E-Tank posted:

And the reason that these things didn't happen before with white democratic presidents is because. . . ?

gradenko_2000 posted:

IIRC militia groups actually went down during the Clinton years as a result of a backlash from the Oklahoma bombing.

Genocide Tendency posted:

Right..

Because they didn't cry to impeach Clinton when he got caught lying about a bj from an intern.

That never happened............

gradenko_2000 posted:

Whether or not the "people who dislike Barack Obama either partially or purely because he is black" figure amounts to less than 50% as the original argument that was made sounds like a lot of semantic quibbling.

Sucrose posted:

Yeah, and that's because they were going up steadily during the Clinton years, until one of them did something so crazy that suddenly the rest of them wanted to distance themselves from the movement as quickly as possible.

E-Tank posted:

Which is not the same thing as the right literally acting like Obama is an uppity ni urban who needs to be put in his place. That's getting into a moral outrage because they have to loving pander to the religious right or else they lose their entire demographic.

drat, the database is giving me issues. I'll have to table this for now.

E-Tank posted:

Okay then, *you* explain why Obama is the president that the republican controlled congress has basically refused to do anything.

You explain why Obama is the first president to have a white congressman jump up, and shout 'You lie!' when he sat there for Reagan trying his best to not admit to committing high treason.

You explain why Obama is the first president to have a congressman outright come out and say 'Its our job to make sure he's a one term president'.

You explain why Obama is so often Hung in effigy, in the manner of lynching and be sure to explain how that's totally not any sort of racism whatsoever, completely disregarding the idea of lynching and how it was basically the go to way of killing black people.

E-Tank posted:

Okay then, *you* explain why Obama is the president that the republican controlled congress has basically refused to do anything.

You explain why Obama is the first president to have a white congressman jump up, and shout 'You lie!' when he sat there for Reagan trying his best to not admit to committing high treason.

You explain why Obama is the first president to have a congressman outright come out and say 'Its our job to make sure he's a one term president'.

Genocide Tendency posted:

Because he is a democrat. If it were Hillary, they would still be saying the same thing. If it were some random white dude, take a wild guess what the republicans would say.

But by all means, keep lying to your self and believing that racism and not retarded "they aren't batting for my political team" is why these 3 happen

A Buttery Pastry posted:

I don't think it's semantic quibbling to point out that all of this poo poo with Obama is standard politics in the US, just flavored and (fueled to some degree) by racial hatred.

VitalSigns posted:

Hey why does the South in general (and rednecks in other states) hate Democrats and big government so much, anyway? FDR was the biggest big government guy of all and they lovvvvvved him.

It seems like a Democrat federal government must have done something really heinous, a total betrayal in the eyes of the South to warrant such hatred and fear. Hmmm, it happened in the 60s...maybe it was Johnson's decision to...........send troops to Vietnam, what do you think?

Ogmius815 posted:

Yeah if only there were some white democratic presidents to form a basis for comparison...

gradenko_2000 posted:

IIRC militia groups actually went down during the Clinton years as a result of a backlash from the Oklahoma bombing.

gradenko_2000 posted:

The post that kicked off this whole shebang was:
"Just look how insane half the country has gone as a result of Obama's election. Those people aren't reacting to Obama as a politician; they're reacting to the fact that his election seemed (and mostly only seemed) to destabilize the established racial hierarchy."

I'm saying just because the number of people reacting to the (perception of) destabilization of racial hierarchy isn't literally "half the country" doesn't mean that there are zero people that reacted to the (perception of) destabilization of racial hierarchy

Genocide Tendency posted:

Hey, why don't you learn to read?

I didn't address rednecks. I didn't address the south. I addressed questions around the republican party and congress's issues when it comes to working with Obama.

OneEightHundred posted:

Our last president was a white dude from Texas that was accused of orchestrating 9/11 and the biggest election fraud in history.

VitalSigns posted:

Yeah, why does the Republican party appeal to those groups so much, anyway, when they used to hate the Republicans with a fiery passion?

It must be that they share a deep-seated ideological belief in small government, low taxes, and a strong national defense; beliefs that just so happened to align in the 1960's for mysterious and unknowable causes.