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It took me a full 6 years to realize I was bi because there was just no template for me that the idea of bisexuality was an actual valid thing. I vacillated between thinking I was straight and gay until I got a crush on a female teacher, which combined with earlier crushes on men made me realize what was up. It's also really, really degrading when your attraction to women is seen as entertainment for men and an automatic invitation for a threesome. Smudgie Buggler posted:Many seem to think that just because nobody had any right to stop you doing whatever you like with consensual adults in your own bedroom means that nobody has any right to point out the fact that you like to tie women up and hit them during sex might say something pretty important about you to a lot of people. That you've got a willing participant in your violent pastime is irrelevant - the fact that you have a desire to engage in recreational violence (or hold any other politically problematic proclivity) is absolutely open to critique. BDSM is not "recreational violence" and the idea that engaging in it is in-and-of itself problematic is really troublesome. A dom-sub relationship is a carefully modulated interaction where both partners communicate so they can satisfy each other, and the goal is certainly not permanent harm.
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Jul 2, 2014 03:42
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| # ¿ May 7, 2024 09:19 |
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A big flaming stink posted:look i dont really buy into the general thrust of smudgie's argument but dont pretend bdsm isnt full of problems just like any other type of relationship. theres tons of stories about women being pressured into acts they didnt want to do, or use of the safeword being seen as rude, not to mention the persistent failure of clubs to ostracize predatory members. Yeah, I'm not saying it doesn't have tons of loving problems, just that BDSM doesn't automatically equal someone getting off on actually hurting people. I'm personally very wary of engaging with the "community" and how a lot of rhetoric places subs as literally below doms rather than two people figuring poo poo out. Derail over.
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Jul 2, 2014 04:18
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meat sweats posted:This is the fantasy ideal that doesn't accord with the reality, in which, at a minimum, the same disturbances that make you find abusing people to be erotic will come to bear on your ability to maintain a stable relationship, even assuming everything really is entirely consensual. I don't have to accept everything that is in any way connected to sex as completely healthy and above criticism just because I am gay or support gay rights. All issues of psychological health aside, Johnny Suburb wanting to get in on some oppression tourism because he occasionally spanks his wife and thinks that makes him "queer" is condescending and stupid. I'm a woman in a relationship with a woman, I enjoy BDSM from both sides, and you need to think about your assumptions.
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Jul 2, 2014 05:39
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Edit: ^^^^ I hate people who bring that poo poo into stuff like work and regular conversations as much as you do. Sexual stuff is sexual stuff, BDSM or no.Smudgie Buggler posted:I'm sorry, is BDSM an inescapable and unignorable orientation of base sexual drives that's had those who hold it murdered throughout history for the crime of merely daring to exist? No. It's a set of sexual habits; some harmlessly playful which can be safely ignored, many deeply and undeniably rooted in misogyny and rape culture which should under no circumstances be encouraged or considered healthy to enjoy. Honestly I don't fully know why I enjoy BDSM, and while I'm sure there's some societal component it's very weird looking at yourself and wondering why you like these things. Personally, I think whether your example is messed up depends on what you're envisioning when you think of it. If you're talking about a dom who thinks that their "control" is anything but an agreement between them and their sub that can be canceled at any time and/or who uses an actual proper whip, then yes that is absolutely hosed up. When I think about it I think about dom who knows their control is just for fun, and who's using something like a riding crop and is experienced with using it so they don't cause any permanent damage. If you still think that's messed up, then I don't think we're on the same page in this discussion and it'll probably go nowhere. EDIT 2: Back on topic, the being refused medical care thing for transgender patients is really just insane, especially by ERs and EMTs. Aren't there laws that protect people in general from being denied emergency care? Gyre fucked around with this message at 06:50 on Jul 2, 2014 |
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Jul 2, 2014 06:41
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Smudgie Buggler posted:I don't think that's hosed up, no. But you've also pretty much out and out claimed that you're unwilling to question why you like the idea of sexual violence, even if you don't actually commit meaningful violence. Questioning the reasons why we think we way we do is super important. I agree that I can seem a bit reticent, and I think part of it is that because it's walking a knife edge of idea and practice that it can be very very hard to look at. Thinking you're a good person when you enjoy BDSM can be very hard sometimes and there have been times I've just felt utterly disgusted at some of the more hardcore stuff and wondered whether I'm coming too close to something that isn't good at all. It also probably just has to do with me having difficulty analyzing my own emotions otherwise, which is a pretty constant source of anxiety for me. I do have some ideas on why I like BDSM, but those are more personal than I'm willing to share. I also think a lot on what it is to be a good dom in BDSM and my own philosophy on it, and I agree that such reflection is pretty drat important. I don't think a day goes by when I don't question my views on something.
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Jul 2, 2014 07:42
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The Whole Internet posted:Well work obviously is one thing but among close friends? Sex is something that people naturally talk about if they're comfortable around each other. If a conversation among people who know each other drifts to sexual topics, I think you should be able to say what your fetishes are without people busting your chops about it. No, this happens around women, too. I guess I just meant "non-close friend" conversations. Also, BDSM is kinda complicated in how it's been mainstreamed. From what's I've heard 50 Shades of Grey is basically "this guy has mommy issues, that's why he ties you up" and "safeword? what's that?" along with a lot of patriarchal baggage.
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Jul 2, 2014 08:09
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| # ¿ May 7, 2024 09:19 |
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I've never actually seen it but I understand it is quite sympathetic, though when I read about it I had one problem about how at the end of the movie Maggie Gyllenhaal's character is ordered to not move from her seat for days. There's ordering your sub to do something, and then there's literally ordering them to sit in their own filth and not move their hands or legs for three days. I think it's a very irresponsible order, even if you take care of them after.
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Jul 2, 2014 08:32
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