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The only way Barão stands a chance is if he can start moving a lot more and keep TJ at a distance. I don't think he's gonna start teeping because of the takedown threat, but any kind of movement at all is gonna cut TJs offense down.
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Jul 3, 2014 06:48
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NippleFloss posted:Barao will probably look better in a rematch provided he can avoid getting his brain scrambled in the first round again. He got knocked senseless early and TJ never have him a chance to recover. You shouldn't get a redo just because you got hit in the first round
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Jul 3, 2014 06:49
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BlindSite posted:First of all he didn't "revert to wrestling as soon as he fought a competent fighter" he reverted to wrestling when he was gassing and felt slow because he was legitimately sick http://www.mmamania.com/2013/12/15/5212200/ufc-on-fox-9-results-chad-mendes-slowed-by-sickness-in-victory-over-nik-lentz. He used to stand flat footed in front of people and throw the most rudimentary one two combinations and leg kicks that lacked serious hip torque. At the very least against guida he showed that he can move his head off the centre line and throw three and four punch combinations now, he's also gotten a lot better at not backing straight out in exchanges and instead moving off his opponents centre. Those things alone represent a big jump in ability. I didn't run out of points in this argument. I got sick. My post torque is significantly below normal, which you can see when in posts where I own people with regdates after 2010
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Jul 3, 2014 06:54
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IMO Barao will probably do better, because his coach is pretty good, and can address problems from the first match
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Jul 3, 2014 06:57
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Barao will probably do better if he doesn't cut stupid amounts of weight. That won't be enough to completely bridge the gap, but I can buy him having a better chance in a rematch if he cuts a reasonable amount.
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Jul 3, 2014 06:59
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Barao will do better if he completely rebuilds his striking game from the ground up over the course of a few months, so that he doesnt get outclassed in every area again
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Jul 3, 2014 07:05
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I dunno I think it's overstated how much of a gap there is. Like if Barão changed up to more of a style of hitting from distance he would win rounds instead of getting blown out the water. I'm not sure it's enough to win but I think he's young enough that he could still change up his game.
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Jul 3, 2014 07:10
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it probably is true that barao would have to improve as much as dillashaw did to beat barao to beat dillashaw
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Jul 3, 2014 07:13
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1st AD posted:I dunno I think it's overstated how much of a gap there is. Like if Barão changed up to more of a style of hitting from distance he would win rounds instead of getting blown out the water. I'm not sure it's enough to win but I think he's young enough that he could still change up his game. His style usually is based on hitting from distance though. he sticks a good jab and leg kicks, occasionally mixes in a spinning back kick, all from outside the gap, and any time someone threatens to come in the gap and trade he just plants his feet flat and starts winging big goofy punches. TJs footwork and angles were good enough that he could get in and out and be basically better than Barao everywhere
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Jul 3, 2014 07:14
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Bundt Cake posted:it probably is true that barao would have to improve as much as dillashaw did to beat barao to beat dillashaw exactly. so it's not impossible but Dillashaw improving that much and putting on that performance was pretty unprecedented
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Jul 3, 2014 07:15
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Bundt Cake posted:I didn't run out of points in this argument. I got sick. My post torque is significantly below normal, which you can see when in posts where I own people with regdates after 2010 i think it is downright unreasonable to suggest that chad is negligibly better than 2.5 years ago. if you're arguing that other people deserve the title shot more, i'd agree. but not being interested at all is just setting yourself up to lose a loving monocle or something in the rematch.
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Jul 3, 2014 07:19
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manyak posted:His style usually is based on hitting from distance though. he sticks a good jab and leg kicks, occasionally mixes in a spinning back kick, all from outside the gap, and any time someone threatens to come in the gap and trade he just plants his feet flat and starts winging big goofy punches. TJs footwork and angles were good enough that he could get in and out and be basically better than Barao everywhere Yeah its the brawling inside the gap that he needs to fix because iirc it was problematic in the McDonald fight and while he does attack from outside he doesn't seem to have footwork to get out of trouble against a guy coming his way. In the past he'd just clock dudes coming in but TJ is probably never gonna get hit like that.
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Jul 3, 2014 07:23
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1st AD posted:Yeah its the brawling inside the gap that he needs to fix because iirc it was problematic in the McDonald fight and while he does attack from outside he doesn't seem to have footwork to get out of trouble against a guy coming his way. In the past he'd just clock dudes coming in but TJ is probably never gonna get hit like that. i wish cub would drop to 135 and fight tj.
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Jul 3, 2014 07:25
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I wish Cruz would come back and prove who is the best dancer at 135 <alpha-male-dougie.gif>
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Jul 3, 2014 07:28
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You shouldn't get an instant rematch if you got hosed up for 5 rounds and then knocked out, regardless of how good of a champion you were. I want TJ to win for that reason more than any other.
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Jul 3, 2014 07:37
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If Cruz were healthy he would've gotten a shot I think, but 135 is kind of hosed right now since its full of guys that already lost to Barão and Faber and the only guys who have a good claim for a title shot are a cripple and the guy that owns TJ's camp and probably the house he lives in.
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Jul 3, 2014 07:46
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Lord Waffle Beard posted:You shouldn't get a redo just because you got hit in the first round I didn't say he deserved it, just that he'd probably do better.
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Jul 3, 2014 07:55
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Gomi has an opponent: Myles Jury I like that fight but I would like it more if Gomi were younger.
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Jul 3, 2014 08:04
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Aurain posted:You shouldn't get an instant rematch if you got hosed up for 5 rounds and then knocked out, regardless of how good of a champion you were. Why not? Barao was a dominant fighter and the only other challenger is a guy no one cares about and TJ should have his win over him anyway. He's the #1 ranked guy and they might sell a few more PPVs off the rematch.
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Jul 3, 2014 08:09
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MassRafTer posted:Why not? Barao was a dominant fighter and the only other challenger is a guy no one cares about and TJ should have his win over him anyway. He's the #1 ranked guy and they might sell a few more PPVs off the rematch. Because Aurain posted:he got hosed up for 5 rounds and then knocked out That was about as decisive a beating as you can get. It wasn't a Frankie Edgar incredibly close fight situation, and it wasn't an Anderson Silva "was the knockout a fluke? let's find out woops nope, nope it wasnt" situation. It was a complete 5 round domination and then a knockout to cap it off. There's really nothing that TJ needs to prove immediately. I'd love to see them fight down the line, but I'm sick of immediate rematches.
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Jul 3, 2014 08:23
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MassRafTer posted:Why not? Barao was a dominant fighter and the only other challenger is a guy no one cares about and TJ should have his win over him anyway. He's the #1 ranked guy and they might sell a few more PPVs off the rematch. Lol the only ppv that did worse than this one is Mighty Mouse vs Dagestan Nobody cares about bantamweights
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Jul 3, 2014 08:32
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Bulging Nipples posted:Because Anderson Silva was beaten for a round and a half and knocked out, the fluke was added in by people who for good reason couldn't believe Anderson got beaten that way. Tyson got a rematch with Holyfield, Couture got his heavyweight title fight with Sylvia coming off a KO loss in lower weight class (and a LHW title match after a loss for the heavyweight title) and plenty of other fights that were made because there wasn't another great opponent and the fight would draw better. UFC picked the higher ranked and slightly more marketable fighter, it's not some travesty. Is Barao's problem that he survived four rounds? If you lose in a round and a half does your great career then become a factor?
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Jul 3, 2014 08:33
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I'm not devastated about seeing a rematch of a good fight, don't get me wrong, and I fully understand that the UFC is a for profit organisation first and foremost, but I like fight leagues to maintain the illusion of being a fight league where if the #1 contender wins the belt convincingly, the former #2 contender gets the next shot. It's not going to happen like that any time soon, but I like to think that's how it should be. I felt the same way about Anderson vs Weidman 2 as I do about TJ vs Barao 2, for what it's worth. There were no questions left that needed answers by their first fights. The past couple of UFC Embedded episodes have been quite hard to hear for me, the long winding speech of Ronda's was really difficult to make out.
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Jul 3, 2014 08:38
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Aurain posted:
Might be problems on your end there boss, i had no trouble at all
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Jul 3, 2014 08:45
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1st AD posted:Lol the only ppv that did worse than this one is Mighty Mouse vs Dagestan Kevin Iole bumped up UFC 174's numbers from 100k to 125k, meaning it is now only the 2nd worst MMA PPV of the year. we did it, congratulations
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Jul 3, 2014 08:55
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Bubba Smith posted:Kevin Iole bumped up UFC 174's numbers from 100k to 125k, meaning it is now only the 2nd worst MMA PPV of the year. we did it, congratulations Mighty Mouse is calling Joe Silva trying to volunteer and save 176 and doesn't understand why he won't return his calls.
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Jul 3, 2014 09:08
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Mr Baby Jay Penn moves to present new evidence to the court: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZrb2FWJH6k
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Jul 3, 2014 09:17
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The idea of counting Barao out of ANY fight is absurd. Yes, TJ put on one of the most impressive performances in UFC history against him, but that doesn't take away at all from how good Barao is. And now Barao gets to go into the fight knowing what TJ can really do.
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Jul 3, 2014 09:35
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Bundt Cake posted:I didn't run out of points in this argument. I got sick. My post torque is significantly below normal, which you can see when in posts where I own people with regdates after 2010 Haven't run out of your never ending ability to poo poo post instead of actually having something to say about a fighter. cams posted:The idea of counting Barao out of ANY fight is absurd. Yes, TJ put on one of the most impressive performances in UFC history against him, but that doesn't take away at all from how good Barao is. And now Barao gets to go into the fight knowing what TJ can really do. It would be absurd if he had any answer for anything at all Dillashaw did in the first fight.
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Jul 3, 2014 10:13
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MassRafTer posted:Is Barao's problem that he survived four rounds? If you lose in a round and a half does your great career then become a factor? Barao's problem is that he had absolutely nothing for TJ for that entire fight. What did he do to deserve an immediate rematch? It wasn't even close. I'm not saying down the line Barao won't come back better and maybe even beat him, but I didn't see anything that night that would warrant an immediate rematch. But like I said, I'm not a huge fan of immediate rematches. I didn't like all the Frankie Edgar rematches, but I could kind of understand them because the fights were so close. I didn't like the Anderson immediate rematch, but I could understand it because Anderson's title run was a really special accomplishment. Barao was a great champ but his run wasn't close to Anderson's, and that match certainly wasn't close.
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Jul 3, 2014 11:03
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MassRafTer posted:Mighty Mouse is calling Joe Silva trying to volunteer and save 176 and doesn't understand why he won't return his calls. Aw. This made me feel sad. I was at the Verizon Center when Mighty Mouse fought Cruz in 2011 and I feel increasingly privileged to have seen two champs in one bout given that Cruz died immediately after that happened. It's like how I'm forever attached to Houston Alexander except this time I lucked out and get to root for Johnson. (That card also featured light heavyweight Anthony Johnson demolishing lightweight Charlie Brenneman and tallweight Stefan Struve vs. shortweight Pat Barry. It was a fun event)
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Jul 3, 2014 12:23
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I've heard several journalists say that Barao was sick for the first fight so I'm just going to latch onto that idea and watch a TAM get killed in Sacramento
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Jul 3, 2014 14:59
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Aurain posted:You shouldn't get an instant rematch if you got hosed up for 5 rounds and then knocked out, regardless of how good of a champion you were. Yes. Unless it's a deal like Anderson Silva when you know the PPV would sell a gently caress load.
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Jul 3, 2014 16:33
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-Atom- posted:I've heard several journalists say that Barao was sick for the first fight so I'm just going to latch onto that idea and watch a TAM get killed in Sacramento He had a really bad weight cut.
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Jul 3, 2014 17:27
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Marching Powder posted:i think it is downright unreasonable to suggest that chad is negligibly better than 2.5 years ago. if you're arguing that other people deserve the title shot more, i'd agree. but not being interested at all is just setting yourself up to lose a loving monocle or something in the rematch. He may have improved, but thats all based on 2 fights against guys who didnt really even belong in the ufc, a fight where he relied on his wrestling like he always used to and didnt show a great gas tank, and then a fight where he finished Clay Guida, who is an inferior wrestler to him and is legendarily weak on offense. People look at three TKOs and think hes improved, but the guys he decisioned before that were Koch, Swanson, Vasquez, Omgiawa and Yahya, who are all bad asses, and he wouldn't KO them now, except maybe Koch whose chin is cracking
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Jul 3, 2014 18:15
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Oh unless he was sick , exactly sick enough to make him fight like he always did against tough fighters who knew how to grapple-Atom- posted:I've heard several journalists say that Barao was sick for the first fight so I'm just going to latch onto that idea and watch a TAM get killed in Sacramento This illness where fighters perform like they always do is really going around Bundt Cake fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Jul 3, 2014 |
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Jul 3, 2014 18:20
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Bundt Cake posted:This illness where fighters perform like they always do is really going around Think we can get a Kickstarter to make a vaccine and give Clay Guida a shot or two?
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Jul 3, 2014 18:27
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MassRafTer posted:He had a really bad weight cut. He only has himself to blame given the insane amount of weight he cuts.
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Jul 3, 2014 19:05
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Trast posted:He only has himself to blame given the insane amount of weight he cuts. Absolutely.
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Jul 3, 2014 19:13
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Trast posted:He only has himself to blame given the insane amount of weight he cuts. word, I wasn't trying to take anything away from TJ but it really isn't up for debate that the Barao we saw wasn't what we're used to. whether or not that factors into how you view a potential second outing is the only reason why I mentioned it
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Jul 3, 2014 19:18
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