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InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

Philosopher King posted:

So what happened this time they just tripped over making a good game?
Er, if you're saying what I think you're saying I didn't mean Payday 2 is bad, I've had loads of fun with it (Halfway through second infamy here). I've been playing it since the day it released and I've watched overkill make bad choices with patches or watched them have their priorities way out of line. I mean it apparently took them almost a year to realize/address the fact that their 30 gig game could actually be compressed down to 10-11 gigs with basically no problems. As for variety I still think they need to work on more free heists.

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Medium Style
Oct 11, 2002

Drowning Rabbit posted:

I may have grinded myself out of the game for at least a day or two. Got to Infamy II, and I'm curious if there is a recommended tree to get your first 10% off for? I picked Mastermind because I felt like I was putting points willy nilly in that tree most of all to get up to Inspire.

Technician was also high on my list of having more skills that may be skippable.

Is there any perceived 'best' order? We don't have a lot of infamy talk in this thread, so I figured I'd start some.

I've been poking around with the skill builder, these would be my suggestions (feel free to point out why I am wrong):

- Go 10% off Mastermind if you want Inspire and doctor bags but want to skip over pistols and Inside Man
- Go 10% off Enforcer if you want the saw or ICTV but don't care about shotguns.
- Go 10% off Technician if you want C4 and only want to waste 4 points on trip mines instead of 7.

Or if you are okay with only saving 2 skill points instead of 3 or 4:
- Go 10% off Technician for the headshot tier bonus and drill speed skills while skipping trip mines entirely.
- Go 10% of Ghost for the move speed tier bonus and are okay with a few basic stealth skills.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.

Philosopher King posted:

I noticed that the game is called Payday and not Heist. Any chance they'll add more variety of missions? I feel kidnapping/extraction of targets is already pretty much there in the engine and all they need to do is connect the dots.

Actually its called "Payday: The Heist", because its a lot harder to copyright a single word. (Same reason its called Magic: The Gathering and not just Magic TCG)

Some kind of kidnapping/extraction would require a heavy addition/rework of the civilian code, and I don't think that's what most players want anyways (see: massive disdain for stealth in this thread)

Instead they're gonna give us more big banks, and more big shootyguns to kill cops with, which most goons agree is a good thing.

The levels as they are though do offer a pretty great amount of variety. There wasn't a ton of variety at launch, but they've like doubled the number of missions since then with free and paid DLC, and you can play the DLC without paying so there's no reason to complain.

InequalityGodzilla posted:

Er, if you're saying what I think you're saying I didn't mean Payday 2 is bad, I've had loads of fun with it (Halfway through second infamy here). I've been playing it since the day it released and I've watched overkill make bad choices with patches or watched them have their priorities way out of line. I mean it apparently took them almost a year to realize/address the fact that their 30 gig game could actually be compressed down to 10-11 gigs with basically no problems. As for variety I still think they need to work on more free heists.

All the heists are free, you just have to pay to get the masks/guns. So... wtf?

Overkill is handling DLC better than pretty much every developer out there.

InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

Medium Style posted:

Or if you are okay with only saving 2 skill points instead of 3 or 4:
- Go 10% off Technician for the headshot tier bonus and drill speed skills while skipping trip mines entirely.
This is what I went with, primarily because I just wanted the kickass technician's mask and because when I first infamy'd I was getting a lot of use out of shaped charges and bulletproof. Honestly I'd recommend against it and just go with ghost infamy instead if you're looking for something more general purpose. Since I started to branch out in my playstyle I've been regretting choosing technician more and more. If you do want to go for c4 though, it's totally worth it.

Zaphod42 posted:

All the heists are free, you just have to pay to get the masks/guns. So... wtf?

Overkill is handling DLC better than pretty much every developer out there.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/306690/
http://store.steampowered.com/app/264610/
Free for the low, low price of $14 bucks total. Yes, I know that you can play them for free if someone else is hosting but that still means someone has to buy them. Look I don't want this to be a derail or an argument or anything so I'll just say I would have preferred it if Overkill had devoted more time and resources to making new heists rather than weapons packs, alright?

Stanos
Sep 22, 2009

The best 57 in hockey.
They were on sale like two days ago. :ssh:

Really the only two DLC I'd consider mandatory anyway are the LMG one since LMGs are fantastic when you just need a bullet hose and the courier pack for simpler weapon upgrades that don't rely on a random number generator.

Also armored transport is pretty bad, you could skip it and not miss much outside of maybe the swedish K if you're some stealthlord.

Dog Fat Man Chaser
Jan 13, 2009

maybe being miserable
is not unpredictable
maybe that's
the problem
with me

Philosopher King posted:

I noticed that the game is called Payday and not Heist. Any chance they'll add more variety of missions? I feel kidnapping/extraction of targets is already pretty much there in the engine and all they need to do is connect the dots.

I'm pretty sure this stuff was actually part of the store page description pre-launch/shortly after launch (it said you'd be doing cybercrime and kidnapping and poo poo), which is really funny to me that we still don't have it.

Doctor Shitfaced
Feb 13, 2012

DoctorStrangelove posted:

I can't wait for the Striker to be OP as gently caress even though the gun is a legendary hunk of garbage in real life.

A bit off topic, but why is the gun poo poo in real life?

-Zydeco-
Nov 12, 2007


Philosopher King posted:

Can someone explain the comic in the OP I want to feel like a cool Payday 2 player as well.

It's an edit.

This is the original

Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!

Dog Fat Man Chaser posted:

I'm pretty sure this stuff was actually part of the store page description pre-launch/shortly after launch (it said you'd be doing cybercrime and kidnapping and poo poo), which is really funny to me that we still don't have it.

They've already announced a jailbreak heist coming soon, where players will spring Old Hoxton from a prison transport.

-Zydeco-
Nov 12, 2007


InequalityGodzilla posted:

Look I don't want this to be a derail or an argument or anything so I'll just say I would have preferred it if Overkill had devoted more time and resources to making new heists rather than weapons packs, alright?

There are separate mission and weapon design teams. They're not neglecting one to work on the other, they just aren't a huge company with tons of manpower to churn out maps.

Anonymous Robot
Jun 1, 2007

Lost his leg in Robo War I
Waiting on that super sexy revolver dlc pack. You're running out of other options, OVK.

Crabtree
Oct 17, 2012

ARRRGH! Get that wallet out!
Everybody: Lowtax in a Pickle!
Pickle! Pickle! Pickle! Pickle!

Dinosaur Gum
Just don't expect the map team to match the output of the weapons team because boy-howdy do we need more payed DLC. The new guns and toys will be nice but we can't let any of them be free of charge. That's for the gold models or dumpy pistols.

InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

Stanos posted:

They were on sale like two days ago. :ssh:

Really the only two DLC I'd consider mandatory anyway are the LMG one since LMGs are fantastic when you just need a bullet hose and the courier pack for simpler weapon upgrades that don't rely on a random number generator.

Also armored transport is pretty bad, you could skip it and not miss much outside of maybe the swedish K if you're some stealthlord.
I bought all of them at full price, usually right when they're released :negative:
I'm guess I'm just bitter that I'm an impatient consumer whore.

Doctor Shitfaced posted:

A bit off topic, but why is the gun poo poo in real life?
A massive pain to reload, especially since on the older versions you basically had to slip a shell in, turn a little clockwork mechanism to move the drum, load the next shell, turn it again etc. and then when you finished you had to wind it again to coil the spring that moved the magazine. You got twelve shots but apparently it could take more than a minute to fully reload it, especially if you were inexperienced with it. I've never fired one myself but I've heard people that have say it also has really bad ergonomics (as in, it's uncomfortable to hold and use) and that it's trigger is funky.

Worth noting that like I said this is all second hand and I've never fired one myself. Also they've apparently released newer ones that do away with some of those flaws.

Coolguye posted:

They've already announced a jailbreak heist coming soon, where players will spring Old Hoxton from a prison transport.
I swear if they do this and then DON'T let us replace new Hoxton with him I'm going to be so pissed.

Crabtree posted:

Just don't expect the map team to match the output of the weapons team because boy-howdy do we need more payed DLC. The new guns and toys will be nice but we can't let any of them be free of charge. That's for the gold models or dumpy pistols.
Hey now, I swear by the Sig Sauer (or Signature whatever they call it). That thing has all the versatility of the Crosskill while improving it in basically every way. And since I'm mostly specced as a mastermind and I got gunslinger aced I'm doing more damage per shot than my fully modded out Car-4.

InequalityGodzilla fucked around with this message at 19:04 on Jul 1, 2014

Anonymous Robot
Jun 1, 2007

Lost his leg in Robo War I
Anybody have an extra copy left over from the sale? PM me and I'll buy it from you.

Psion
Dec 13, 2002

eVeN I KnOw wHaT CoRnEr gAs iS

Anonymous Robot posted:

Waiting on that super sexy revolver dlc pack. You're running out of other options, OVK.

It'll be gage dual wield pack first.

Medium Style
Oct 11, 2002

InequalityGodzilla posted:

This is what I went with, primarily because I just wanted the kickass technician's mask and because when I first infamy'd I was getting a lot of use out of shaped charges and bulletproof. Honestly I'd recommend against it and just go with ghost infamy instead if you're looking for something more general purpose. Since I started to branch out in my playstyle I've been regretting choosing technician more and more. If you do want to go for c4 though, it's totally worth it.

I don't think it really matters too much. No matter which skill tree you choose, the most you're going to get out of it is 3 or 4 rescued skill points and a mask. As long as you are able to ditch a skill you didn't want while wearing a cool mask, I say you made a fine choice.

Baconface
Sep 13, 2005
Bacon = Love
Just got this game.
Been loving it. Only been able to stealth one mission so far !
Well one and a half where we got 80% of the vault in GO Bank emptied stealthy until someone didn't answer the phone or something !!
But it was still a success!

Will join steam group looking forward to playing with goons.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

If there's anything more important than my ego around, I want it caught and shot now.

InequalityGodzilla posted:

I bought all of them at full price, usually right when they're released :negative:
I'm guess I'm just bitter that I'm an impatient consumer whore.

If you'd pre-ordered like a true consumer whore you'd get armored transport free! :cheeky: (I did)

Bolow
Feb 27, 2007

I have no qualms paying full price for the DLC because Overkill for better or worse has been supporting the poo poo out of this game

DISCO KING
Oct 30, 2012

STILL
TRYING
TOO
HARD

Baconface posted:

Only been able to stealth one mission so far
GO Bank
didn't answer the phone
still a success

gently caress you :colbert:

I can't wait for another game to imply the KSG and the Striker aren't horrible piles of poo poo. If they don't add jams for the KSG and half a minute of clearing a jam on a stupid gimmick shotgun I'm gonna be so mad. :manning:

InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

^^^^^^^^^^
"This drill shotgun is worthless!"

Medium Style posted:

I don't think it really matters too much. No matter which skill tree you choose, the most you're going to get out of it is 3 or 4 rescued skill points and a mask. As long as you are able to ditch a skill you didn't want while wearing a cool mask, I say you made a fine choice.
Well, I actually ditched a whole bunch of skills in technician I didn't want. Got tired of being "The guy who brings C4" so I basically went from playing almost solely tech for my first playthrough and most of my first infamy to a Ghost-mastermind mix with a handful of tech and enforcer skills for utility's sake.

Baconface posted:

Will join steam group looking forward to playing with goons.
You should definitely join the goon group. You learn from people like Fellis who've played the living crap out of this game, if you're still low level they can get you to mid 40's in like 1/2 an hour and they're generally smarter and more communicative than pubbies.

Zaphod42 posted:

If you'd pre-ordered like a true consumer whore you'd get armored transport free! :cheeky: (I did)
Now that I think of it I'm almost certain I did. I know for certain I've been playing it since the day it released and I don't seem to remember ever actually buying armored transport, plus I preorder a lot. Still paid full price for almost every other DLC though. THe only one I didn't pay full price on was the soundtrack :negative:

Edit:

Bolow posted:

I have no qualms paying full price for the DLC because Overkill for better or worse has been supporting the poo poo out of this game
That's a fair point I guess. Even if they've made some gently caress ups here and there they're still dutifully cranking out content which is more than I could say for a lot of other games I've bought.

...Also is your avatar the Terminal Lance moto tat?

InequalityGodzilla fucked around with this message at 19:29 on Jul 1, 2014

Bolow
Feb 27, 2007

InequalityGodzilla posted:



That's a fair point I guess. Even if they've made some gently caress ups here and there they're still dutifully cranking out content which is more than I could say for a lot of other games I've bought.

...Also is your avatar the Terminal Lance moto tat?

Yes someone bought it for me as a joke and I'm way too loving lazy to change it

InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

Alright, I've got a couple questions about some skills usefulness and gameplay specifics since I tend to only occasionally pop into this thread, meaning I'm not up to date on what's considered useful or not. So here we go:
* Weapon threat, what exactly does it do. I've heard lots of people saying lots of different things. Does it make the cops more likely to focus on you? More likely to dive for cover when you start shooting, what?
Edit: Looked through John Murdoch's guide in the OP out of curiosity, apparently it does both :shrug:

* Does Fast learner aced affect you as well, or only your crew mates? Again, I've heard lots of different opinions on it and I want to know if those 3 points are worth it.

* Does anyone know the specifics of how Underdog in the enforcer's tree works? Like at what distance from enemies are you considered "surrounded?" Because it sounds useful but I've always been wary of acing it since it could mean they have to be at spitting distance for it to actually work.

What do you think of this build: http://goo.gl/5N4gg9
My memory is fuzzy but I believe it's more or less my current build. I like it for the most part but I'm starting to consider dropping the various melee skills because while I love my knife it just isn't as useful as I'd hoped it'd be due to cops being able to bitchslap you for like a 3rd of your health on higher difficulties. But on the other hand with gunslinger and my modded out Car-4 it's actually difficult for me to damage a cop enough to joker him without killing him, which is something I have been using the knife for. Rapidly stab 'em 3-4 times and then shout them down. Also I intend to ace inspire and at least get basic pistol messiah but after that where do you think I should go from there? I'm thinking of dumping my remaining 30 something points into ghost skills, seem like a good idea?

Dezztroy
Dec 28, 2012

InequalityGodzilla posted:

I swear if they do this and then DON'T let us replace new Hoxton with him I'm going to be so pissed.

During Gamespot's E3 demo, Almir was pretty cagey about this. He implied that the jailbreak might not go as planned.

FAUXTON
Jun 2, 2005

spero che tu stia bene

Primary shotguns are poo poo because they replace rifles with less effective shotgun functionality.

The loco owns because it replaces pistols/SMGs with a loving shotgun.

Brainamp
Sep 4, 2011

More Zen than Zenyatta

InequalityGodzilla posted:

* Does Fast learner aced affect you as well, or only your crew mates? Again, I've heard lots of different opinions on it and I want to know if those 3 points are worth it.

A crew bonus affects everyone in the crew.

Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!
Crew bonuses don't stack, though, so if you have two guys with Fast Learner Ace in the crew then someone is wasting skill points. Not something to be concerned about if you're not playing with a regular group, but important to note.

InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

Coolguye posted:

Crew bonuses don't stack, though, so if you have two guys with Fast Learner Ace in the crew then someone is wasting skill points. Not something to be concerned about if you're not playing with a regular group, but important to note.
I'm one of the few goons who rarely has a problem playing with pubbies, and even if I didn't it's still a pain to figure out if someone else has it. I'll keep it aced for simplicity's sake.

Brainamp posted:

A crew bonus affects everyone in the crew.
Well when you put it like that it just makes me sound stupid.

Bocc Kob
Oct 26, 2010
Getting the itch to reinstall and shootmans again. Are the stabbin' knives consumables or does it replace a weapon? Can I rock a knife/shovel combo? :ese:

Opposing Farce
Apr 1, 2010

Ever since our drop-off service, I never read a book.
There's always something else around, plus I owe the library nineteen bucks.

Bocc Kob posted:

Getting the itch to reinstall and shootmans again. Are the stabbin' knives consumables or does it replace a weapon? Can I rock a knife/shovel combo? :ese:

The knives are a replacement for your melee attack. Presumably the shovel will be as well.

Coolguye
Jul 6, 2011

Required by his programming!
Knives are melee, so they 'replace' your weapon butt. However, knives require charging to have more effect than a pigeon making GBS threads on the cop's sleeve, and that is impractical in a firefight.

I'm hoping the baton and/or shovel will not suffer from the same problems, because as it stands getting into a melee with cops is the biggest mistake you could make.

InequalityGodzilla
May 31, 2012

Bocc Kob posted:

Getting the itch to reinstall and shootmans again. Are the stabbin' knives consumables or does it replace a weapon? Can I rock a knife/shovel combo? :ese:
Completely seperate from the previous weapon sets. You have a whole new melee weapon category now. And honestly knives are really, really situational weapon and cops can hit back like a train. Also good news if it's been a long time since you last installed it: they reduced the game size by 2/3rds.

PantsOptional
Dec 27, 2012

All I wanna do is make you bounce
Stabbin' knives take up the melee weapon slot, as would the shovel.

Looking at the guesses on the upcoming shotguns and I'm intrigued to see that one of them has two magazines between which you can switch. It would be interesting to see if we could have one magazine loaded with explosive and one with regular ammo.

watho
Aug 2, 2013


The real world will, again tomorrow, function and run without me.

Bocc Kob posted:

Getting the itch to reinstall and shootmans again. Are the stabbin' knives consumables or does it replace a weapon? Can I rock a knife/shovel combo? :ese:

Melee weapons are their own equip slot. The weapon butt is pretty much the best but I will use the shovel regardless if it sucks.

The Cheshire Cat
Jun 10, 2008

Fun Shoe

Bocc Kob posted:

Getting the itch to reinstall and shootmans again. Are the stabbin' knives consumables or does it replace a weapon? Can I rock a knife/shovel combo? :ese:

Knives go in the melee slot, replacing fists/pistolwhipping. I imagine the shovel and baton will go there as well, so you'll have to choose which you want to use.

Unrelated, I've been kind of messing around while I get used to the game and I've sort of settled on a mastermind/enforcer build to shoot for: http://goo.gl/dMXQpc

Does it look like I'm missing anything vital there, or have picked up stuff that's not as useful as it sounds? I haven't actually had a chance to try out most of those skills yet but I'm going for a kind of general medictank kind of thing. I'll probably be using assault rifles and sniper rifles as primaries since I like them the best, if that makes any difference beyond the one weapon-specific skill I grabbed. The one thing I'm torn on is the 4 points in the tech tree - I'm tempted to pick up the saw with them instead. I know it's situationally useful at best but those 4 points aren't a huge loss and it's something that will come in handy for safe deposit boxes. Plus it'd be nice to be able to saw open ATMS in those levels that are filled with them.

The Cheshire Cat fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Jul 1, 2014

-Zydeco-
Nov 12, 2007


InequalityGodzilla posted:

* Weapon threat, what exactly does it do. I've heard lots of people saying lots of different things. Does it make the cops more likely to focus on you? More likely to dive for cover when you start shooting, what?
Threat affects cop suppression. When you see cops diving cor cover or hiding behind something they are being suppressed. Some people like suppression, some don't. Diving cops are harder to hit, but they aren't shooting back, so it comes down to how you like them to act.

quote:

* Does Fast learner aced affect you as well, or only your crew mates? Again, I've heard lots of different opinions on it and I want to know if those 3 points are worth it.
Non aced only affects you. Aced affects you and your crew and stacks with the non aced bonus. If you aren't 100 then it's worth it with the caveat that a lot of people will have it aced. So, if someone in your normal cre has it aced you don't need to.

quote:

* Does anyone know the specifics of how Underdog in the enforcer's tree works? Like at what distance from enemies are you considered "surrounded?" Because it sounds useful but I've always been wary of acing it since it could mean they have to be at spitting distance for it to actually work.
I want to say within 10' or so. It would help indoors such as the inside bank or day three of framing frames, but would be worthless on more open maps such as ED 1. I like it since it helps in the OH poo poo! situations where you're taking the most damage and need to dish out the most in return.


FAUXTON posted:

Primary shotguns are poo poo because they replace rifles with less effective shotgun functionality.

I will fight you! :argh:
The Reinfeld is a pale shadow of it's former self, but the Izmah (with shotgun perks) can shut down whole assault waves with ease, and keep it's self fed via drops better than any assault rifle. My favorite setup is the Izmah and Loco. Never need ammo and if I shoot it dies.

-Zydeco- fucked around with this message at 20:51 on Jul 1, 2014

Opposing Farce
Apr 1, 2010

Ever since our drop-off service, I never read a book.
There's always something else around, plus I owe the library nineteen bucks.
There's something I've been wondering about I want to double-check on. I've noticed putting a silencer on a weapon (or on the pistols at least) gives it a threat rating of 0, but from a mechanical perspective that threat rating is separate from whether or not the gun will alert guards, right? So if I put on a silencer and then a slide or something that adds +2 threat or whatever, the gun will still be silent?

Mushball
May 23, 2012
Oh cool, shotguns are getting some nice things their way! I really miss my launch day shotguns and sending cops flying out of the windows of Rats 1 will never stop being funny. If there is an option to select a slug payload for my shotgun to get that old 30m range back, I will be the happiest shotgun wielding heister.


Opposing Farce posted:

There's something I've been wondering about I want to double-check on. I've noticed putting a silencer on a weapon (or on the pistols at least) gives it a threat rating of 0, but from a mechanical perspective that threat rating is separate from whether or not the gun will alert guards, right? So if I put on a silencer and then a slide or something that adds +2 threat or whatever, the gun will still be silent?

I have a crosskill with a supressor and the vent slide that gives +2 threat and its has a threat rating of 0. Don't worry about it, the gun will be silent when you fire it.

Mushball fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Jul 1, 2014

Legit Businessman
Sep 2, 2007


The Cheshire Cat posted:

Knives go in the melee slot, replacing fists/pistolwhipping. I imagine the shovel and baton will go there as well, so you'll have to choose which you want to use.

Unrelated, I've been kind of messing around while I get used to the game and I've sort of settled on a mastermind/enforcer build to shoot for: http://goo.gl/dMXQpc

Does it look like I'm missing anything vital there, or have picked up stuff that's not as useful as it sounds? I haven't actually had a chance to try out most of those skills yet but I'm going for a kind of general medictank kind of thing. I'll probably be using assault rifles and sniper rifles as primaries since I like them the best, if that makes any difference beyond the one weapon-specific skill I grabbed. The one thing I'm torn on is the 4 points in the tech tree - I'm tempted to pick up the saw with them instead. I know it's situationally useful at best but those 4 points aren't a huge loss and it's something that will come in handy for safe deposit boxes. Plus it'd be nice to be able to saw open ATMS in those levels that are filled with them.

http://goo.gl/v0ANW8

My thoughts on the changes between your build and the one I suggested:
Control Freak - Acing it is absolutely overkill (and not the good kind either). It's useful on a handful of maps (bank heist style maps), totally not necessary. I don't know if you like shotguns, but they are aweseome (and soon to be more awesome, thanks to some dlc), so I included them. I also gave you some ghost skills (mainly to get to the movement bonus).

I hope you like it.

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communism bitch
Apr 24, 2009
Do you dudes know any fix for the incredibly frustrating issue I get of basically never being able to join lobbies or games? I always get "Lost connection to host", or at best get put into an empty lobby (which should have other players). I was told it might be an issue with my firewall, but disabling that entirely didn't help matters.
I can host lobbies and people seem able to join just fine, but if the match goes over multiple days there's basically a 90% chance of all of them getting dropped as soon as we hit the lobby for day 2.

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