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First, my case includes two points: defending others and gotcha scum hunting on Opo. Your entire post history today revolves around defending Foo, going as far as casing Opo with a gotcha based on his Foo vote. Here's where it starts: Quidnose posted:This is a lovely turbo, what is happening You can read it yourself from there. Actually, I don't care if you read it. Others can read it from there.
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Jul 29, 2014 21:43
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That is patently untrue. The post I quoted is the only piece of defense of Foo I have posted. The burden of proof is on you, not me, not anyone else. You are being lazy, and if you can't provide analysis and quotes beyond the single quote I have made, you have no case.
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Jul 29, 2014 22:10
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Ok:Quidnose posted:This is a lovely turbo [on Foo], what is happening [MADE WITHOUT ANY COMMENTS REGARDING MERK'S CASE ON FOO] Quidnose posted:Both of these are better arguments than this Foo thing. Quidnose posted:[MADE IMMEDIATELY AFTER HAL EXPLAINS HIS TURBO VOTE ON FOO WHICH ACTIVELY DISCREDITS HAL'S VOTE ON FOO AND IMPLICITLY DEFENDS FOO:] Back this up with why you felt this way before you voted for Foo. Quidnose posted:[MADE IMMEDIATELY AFTER OPOP VOTES FOO WHICH ACTIVELY DISCREDITS OPO'S VOTE ON FOO AND IMPLICITLY DEFENDS FOO:] Opop is doing his standard "hide on the sidelines commenting on random crap that doesn't relate to the game and follow along stuff that looks like it is viable" shtick. Bad vibes. I'm happy with my jokevote morphing into a serious one. Quidnose posted:ALSO [HERE IS SOME GOTCHA SCUM HUNTING BASED 100% ON OPO'S VOTE ON FOO, WHICH I AM ACTIVELY DISCREDITING WHILE IMPLICITLY DEFENDING FOO]: Quidnose posted:I don't KNOW Foo is town, but his responses look like how I would be reacting if I was pissed at a lovely turbo. And the votes on him are primarily apathy driven, afai have seen.
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Jul 29, 2014 22:31
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"Others" apparently only means Foo. You've literally done nothing but defend Foo all day, almost every single one of your posts is either actively or implicitly defending Foo.
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Jul 29, 2014 22:32
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Disagree with the implicit stuff, also disagree with the gotcha casing, but thank you for actually playing some mafia.
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Jul 29, 2014 22:35
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merk posted:Ok: Y'know, I like this reasoning, I don't like Quid's erroneous and practically nonexistent defense. ##vote Quidnose CHOO CHOO
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Jul 29, 2014 23:23
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Eh, his aggressive attitude about how wrong I was when he didn't need to be aggressive since the game is stagnant cuts the other way for me. ##vote Foo
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Jul 29, 2014 23:27
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merk posted:Eh, his aggressive attitude about how wrong I was when he didn't need to be aggressive since the game is stagnant cuts the other way for me. I don't know, I feel the other way. Come deadline I'll vote foo if it comes to that or no lynch, sure.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:29
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Quidnose posted:Yes merk, my modus operandi was to claim miller out the gate in hopes I could ride it as scum. Good work. I will ask a question about this, though: Why do you think claiming Miller makes you Town? You act like it's a foregone conclusion that you're Town because you claimed Miller. As I mentioned, I've done this successfully numerous times as Scum. Why can't you be doing that?
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Jul 29, 2014 23:29
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Merk is grasping at straws and retroactively attempting to shoehorn a case onto me after making a bold statement he couldn't back up. I'd like to reiterate that I've only made one statement that could actually be a defense of Foo, and it is the one that I quoted. To breakdown Merk's "casework": quote:This is a lovely turbo [on Foo], what is happening [MADE WITHOUT ANY COMMENTS REGARDING MERK'S CASE ON FOO] Why would I comment on your initial case if that's not what I had an issue with, and instead had an issue with the resulting turbo? I can think you make a valid point and still think the turbo is poo poo. The two are not tied together, and I would have no reason to comment on it if I came back to the thread and saw a bunch of people voting shittily and without thought. Making this about your case and a defense of Foo is ridiculous. quote:Quidnose posted: Both were. Also, how is this a defense of Foo? This is, again, an analysis of people's play, not a defense of Foo. You're reaching. Also, you managed to miss THE ONLY POST I MADE DEFENDING FOO when quoting from that very same post. How the gently caress did you do that? quote:[MADE IMMEDIATELY AFTER HAL EXPLAINS HIS TURBO VOTE ON FOO WHICH ACTIVELY DISCREDITS HAL'S VOTE ON FOO AND IMPLICITLY DEFENDS FOO:] Back this up with why you felt this way before you voted for Foo. OR: I thought Hal was being lazy and voting shittiliy with no reason and I wanted him to back up his vote, which I saw as one that had no thought put into it. Not an implicit defense of Foo, it is a poke at Hal. I do this with him all the time. This is also misleading. This quote was not made immediately after Hal posted his reasoning; I was catching up on the game and commenting on lots of things. This post in question is actually the third in a row of cathcup from top to bottom that you have "analyzed." How did you miss that too? quote:Quidnose posted: "Why didn't you check your role PM" is gotcha scum-hunting. "I have read your reasoning here and I feel you are being disingenuous and trying to buddy up to Merk with the way you are phrasing this while at the same time covering your rear end" is called reading the thread and making a case. quote:Quidnose posted: You completely ignore the fact that this is in response to someone DIRECTLY asking me "why do you seem to know Foo is going to flip town?" Should I not have answered said question? Your case is poo poo. And still lazy.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:34
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merk posted:I will ask a question about this, though: Why do you think claiming Miller makes you Town? You act like it's a foregone conclusion that you're Town because you claimed Miller. As I mentioned, I've done this successfully numerous times as Scum. Why can't you be doing that? Because I have never done this as a gambit, and have no reason as a scum team member to play this as a gambit. I would not draw unneeded attention to myself and open myself up to getting policy lynched later in the game. Would be a bad strategy for me. Might work for you, but it isn't one I would take.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:35
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No one policy lynches Millers on SA Mafia.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:36
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What I don't understand from your end, merk, is why, with so many people weighing in on issues, you are seeming to say the only scummy things that have happened are Foo tossing his vote around a lot and my defending foo. Is that really it? You have yet to explain why my Opop case is a "gotcha" case beyond dismissing it as invalid, and are completely ignoring kaschei's suspicions of Hal. Why?
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Jul 29, 2014 23:37
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If you can find a game in the last two years where there was a literal policy lynch of a Miller (the majority of players justified the vote as nothing more than a policy lynch), I will not vote you for the rest of the game. I'd actually like to engage in this exercise because the Discussion Thread needs this misconception to be debunked.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:37
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merk posted:No one policy lynches Millers on SA Mafia. If we get to a point where we have very few town and scum members yet, I have seen games where millers have still been alive and the response of players has been "time to test the miller claim." If the game has changed in the six months I've been gone, then fine.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:38
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Quidnose posted:What I don't understand from your end, merk, is why, with so many people weighing in on issues, you are seeming to say the only scummy things that have happened are Foo tossing his vote around a lot and my defending foo. Is that really it? You have yet to explain why my Opop case is a "gotcha" case beyond dismissing it as invalid, and are completely ignoring kaschei's suspicions of Hal. Why? Those are the things that have stood out. I haven't really looked at kaschei or Hal because the Foo case is good and your rabid defense of Foo is jumping off the page.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:38
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Quidnose posted:If we get to a point where we have very few town and scum members yet, I have seen games where millers have still been alive and the response of players has been "time to test the miller claim." If the game has changed in the six months I've been gone, then fine. This has never happened.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:39
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kaschei posted:This is just a "have you stopped beating your wife" question, you pretend to invite a defense of Foo but you're just trying to get someone to stop expressing their doubts about this vote. I guess this isn't bad. I'd probably vote with it if the Foo thing dies, but I would much prefer Foo.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:40
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merk posted:This has never happened. for what relative little I've been here I can corroborate- any time something like this has happened it's been in the context of scummy play + a miller claim, not solely based on a miller claim.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:40
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merk posted:Those are the things that have stood out. I haven't really looked at kaschei or Hal because the Foo case is good and your rabid defense of Foo is jumping off the page. Rabid? Come off it. Nothing subjectively "implicit" can be rabid, and that's the majority of your case.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:41
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apostateCourier posted:for what relative little I've been here I can corroborate- any time something like this has happened it's been in the context of scummy play + a miller claim, not solely based on a miller claim. Yeah, that makes sense. It was scummy play that someone is lazily tacking on 'and he's a Miller and welp welp gotta test it' to the end of a case to try to make it sound more persuasive. That I would definitely believe. I'm going to....
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Jul 29, 2014 23:41
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Quidnose posted:Rabid? Come off it. Nothing subjectively "implicit" can be rabid, and that's the majority of your case. I don't really care anymore. Arguing with you isn't helping since I'm not even voting you and you aren't even voting me. If you want Opo lynched, make a case that is persuasive. I think we're going to end up lynching Foo as it is right now.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:43
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That miller post is super gloaty
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Jul 29, 2014 23:43
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merk posted:If you can find a game in the last two years where there was a literal policy lynch of a Miller (the majority of players justified the vote as nothing more than a policy lynch), I will not vote you for the rest of the game. I'd actually like to engage in this exercise because the Discussion Thread needs this misconception to be debunked.  Dear Discussion Thread,If you are reading this game, post this quote there and put up the challenge. It's time that this stupidity get debunked. For this game, my comment really started just diving into a General Mafia Argument rather than anything helpful, so it isn't worth pursuing any longer here. However, it is worth pursuing in the Discussion Thread by people not in this game.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:44
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Opop, link me to a game recently where you were town, because your play right now is identical to your scum play in the game we just finished.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:44
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Opopanax posted:That miller post is super gloaty It seems in character to me. Didn't move the needle either way.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:44
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Quidnose posted:Opop, link me to a game recently where you were town, because your play right now is identical to your scum play in the game we just finished. votefinder is a thing you can use to find games that players play. I know it's hard.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:45
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http://votefinder.org/player/Opopanax Here you go. Go hog wild.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:45
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merk posted:votefinder is a thing you can use to find games that players play. I know it's hard. I just clicked through 15 games trying to find a game with a miller in it to disprove you and now I want Opop to do the work 
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Jul 29, 2014 23:45
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You are absolutely insufferable, merk.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:45
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merk posted:votefinder is a thing you can use to find games that players play. I know it's hard. Look man, he doesn't want to read all of them to see which one he was town in. It's only 80% likely any one he picks will fit the criteria.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:46
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Quidnose posted:You are absolutely insufferable, merk. It takes less time to find a game yourself where Opo was Town than to ask him and wait for his response. Persuasively case the guy if you want him lynched. Setting him out on scavenger hunts is 100% unhelpful. On top of that, asking him to find games so you can try to make a meta read of him is even higher than 100% unhelpful.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:47
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Hey Hal, what does your SA Profile say? Can you paste it for me?
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Jul 29, 2014 23:47
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Here's mine in case you need it (I can't continue to play this game until I get yours): The Greatest Mafia Champion About merk There have been 32226 posts made by merk, an average of 7.88 posts per day, since registering on May 19, 2003. merk claims to be a male. This moron has not provided any additional info. The lack of a gender-specific pronoun here is in no way intended as sexism. Contact Information Message Send a private message ICQ not set AIM not set Yahoo! not set Home Page http://merk Additional Info Member Since May 19, 2003 Post Count 32226 Post Rate 7.88 per day Last Post Jul 29, 2014 16:47 Interests 44242117
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Jul 29, 2014 23:48
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Fine. Tell me why my case on Opop is bad beyond "it's a gotcha case," and if that's what you're going to say, back it up. As far as I am concerned, I have already cased him.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:48
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Quidnose posted:Opop, link me to a game recently where you were town, because your play right now is identical to your scum play in the game we just finished. Here's my last one
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Jul 29, 2014 23:51
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Troll away, gents. Gonna win us the game for sure, and not a distraction at all.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:52
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Quidnose posted:Fine. Tell me why my case on Opop is bad beyond "it's a gotcha case," and if that's what you're going to say, back it up. As far as I am concerned, I have already cased him. It's based off of what looks like a misconception by Opo rather than faked content by Opo. You caught him in an error.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:53
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Quidnose posted:Troll away, gents. Gonna win us the game for sure, and not a distraction at all. Vote Foo so we can lynch a scum on day 1.
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Jul 29, 2014 23:53
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Why does votefinder say "it takes 6 votes to merk!"
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Jul 29, 2014 23:56
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