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agarjogger
May 16, 2011
Probably some of you have considered this. There's a lot to talk about, and maybe we can find out together if driving for the rideshare companies is a survivable income on its own. I signed onto Uber about a week ago and have spent maybe 10 hours out on the road trolling for fares. I've had 17 pickups for a total of $252. Uber will pay 80% of that back to me every Thursday, except today because maybe they forgot or I haven't been driving long enough or whatever. If that seems low, it's because taking Uber is dirtass cheap here in Chicago, where a hopefully temporary 25% price cut has led Uber to claim that they are 40% cheaper than your standard yellow cab. In my newbie opinion, this is loving ridiculous since so many Uber drivers are driving new cars, which many of them were duped into buying for the purpose of rideshare driving. Luckily this isn't me, but it's kind of scary letting thirty strangers into my dream car. No choice, I've gotta make rent, but I will never work nights. Somebody brings an open container into your car, you're on the hook.

After my background check and driving record pull came back, getting activated in their westside office took about as much time as buying a small bag of groceries at Trader Joe's. Their setup resembled that of the DMV, because that's apparently how many people they were signing up to drive every day. Many of these people will eventually find their Uber phones deactivated without warning when their driver rating falls below 4.4/5 or some similar number. If you're not unfriendly, not consistently getting lost, and if your driving doesn't make your passengers uneasy, it is not difficult to maintain a serviceable rating. However the difference between 4.6 and 4.8 is huge for you, since passengers are rated as well and you'll find yourself matched to troublemaker passengers if you don't keep your rating quite high. It is important to just try and do a good job and not think about the rating, since that will make you crazy overnight.

So far, the job itself is quite enjoyable and the feeling of freedom kicks rear end. But considering what I'm giving my riders (great service, good conversation, a quick painless ride in a brand new very-comfortable car), the fares are just too low. If you don't give this to your riders, your rating will suffer and you'll get worse passengers who will accelerate the decline of your vehicle. An accident where my/Uber's insurance gives me trouble could easily erase 25% of my annual pay. By the way, insurance is still a complete loving mystery to me. Your personal insurance, no matter how swank, has every reason to deny your claim and cancel your policy if/when they find out you're using your car for rideshare. I know nothing at all of Uber's insurance.

The big X factor is that if you look at it as a job and do a 10 hour shift, you can easily do $300 in fares a day, of which you may see $175 if you have a fuel efficient car. This is what can vary your after-tax take-home anywhere from $12,000 to $36,000 assuming you're working 5-day weeks. In Chicago, NY, SF etc, there is no shortage whatsoever of customers and you just keep picking them up until you're tired or have to pee.

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Not a Children
Oct 9, 2012

Don't need a holster if you never stop shooting.

It sounds like it's decent for making beer money on the side, but if you're in a position to use your brand-new car to rideshare, you could probably make more money with far less risk on that investment. The liability involved just doesn't seem worth it at all.

FrozenVent
May 1, 2009

The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.

agarjogger posted:

Your personal insurance, no matter how swank, has every reason to deny your claim and cancel your policy if/when they find out you're using your car for rideshare. I know nothing at all of Uber's insurance.

Look into this now.

I. Another thread in at an uber driver said their liability coverage is 25k if you're available with no passengers and one million if you have a passenger. That's... Low. And you're right, your insurance won't cover you if you get into an accident while using your vehicle for an undeclared commercial purpose.

I knew a girl in college who totalled her car delivering pizza. She was poo poo out of luck, it was not a good day for her,

slap me silly
Nov 1, 2009
Grimey Drawer
Also maybe pop in here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3647651

agarjogger
May 16, 2011
Oh poo poo, I forgot to check A/T.
Okay so this is my understanding of an Uber partner's incredibly-vague insurance situation.

Accident while getting groceries, road tripping:
Insurance company is very unlikely to discover or probe seriously into your ridesharing activities. Claim accepted. If it does, claim denied.
Accident while logged in and accepting passengers:
You run your private insurance, it will probably go through. If it doesn't, Uber's 50k/100k injury, 25k property policy applies. As discussed in the other thread, this is not very much money.
Accident with a passenger:
Uber's $1M commercial insurance will pay. I have no idea if this has been tested.

From what I can tell, there is significant exposure to the drivers. Though I think most people, if they looked, would find that they have a fair amount of unaccounted-for exposure to liability. If someone thinks you hosed them, they can always sue and get a better lawyer than you. Though it seems to me that Uber drivers have significantly more than most. I think people are going to keep Ubering because they prefer cash and a cool job, to poverty and a job breaking down boxes at a warehouse.
All that said, I have personal problems paying $220 for an auto insurance policy that could so suddenly disappear out from under me, even if I uber for a month and turn in my phone. I'm going to consider a commercial policy, though 1. it will wreck my earnings and 2. finding a single policy to cover both personal and commercial use is probably not easy at all.
And I can't ask my insurance company about any of this unless I call from a loving pay phone. Uber is looking less and less attractive, and yet significantly more attractive than poverty and a poo poo-rear end job. The fact is these people don't want to be cab drivers, they want to be Uber drivers because the job is presently a blast.

It's kind of sad that most Uber passengers would pay more for an UberX than a cab, and yet the company is trying to drive prices to rock bottom because they know than high unemployment will always send them more drivers. If they just undid their incessant loving fare slashing, I'm sure they could adequately cover everyone associated with the company, including those whose personal policies deny their claims. It's important to remember that Uber is run by a somewhat shady bunch of people, but the risk is unfortunately worth it to me.

sources:
http://blog.uber.com/ridesharinginsurance

Uber’s Controversial Insurance Policy is Secret No More
http://blogs.kqed.org/newsfix/2014/03/25/draft-uber-insurance-policy/
How Many Ride-Share Drivers Are Hiding Status From Insurers?
http://blogs.kqed.org/newsfix/2014/01/20/ride-sharing-insurance-lyft-uberx-sidecar/
Are ‘Ride-Share’ Drivers at Risk of Losing Their Insurance?
http://blogs.kqed.org/newsfix/2013/11/14/can-lyft-uberx-drivers-lose-their-insurance

agarjogger fucked around with this message at 05:28 on Jul 26, 2014

AgrippaNothing
Feb 11, 2006

When flying, please wear a suit and tie just like me.
Just upholding the social conntract!

agarjogger posted:

The big X factor is that if you look at it as a job and do a 10 hour shift, you can easily do $300 in fares a day, of which you may see $175 if you have a fuel efficient car. This is what can vary your after-tax take-home anywhere from $12,000 to $36,000 assuming you're working 5-day weeks. In Chicago, NY, SF etc, there is no shortage whatsoever of customers and you just keep picking them up until you're tired or have to pee.

And your 17.50 an hour avg goes in the toilet if you have a lousy day, get sick or just take some time off. And you better factor in the increased maintenance and the cost a new fancy ride in a year or two to keep up your customer appeal in which case this is a losing proposition. Then don't forget the potential black hole insurance could leave you in. Uber is terrible. Don't be a sucker.

posh spaz
Jul 25, 2014
I think Aristotle is right. Sometimes regulations are put in place to protect both customers and service providers. While I think the medallion system is pretty dysfunctional in most cities, proper cab services at least have the liability insurance issue sorted, and the limited medallions (in theory) keep the fares high enough you can actually make a living driving. I think most of this implicit subsidy ends up going to the cab company, but still.

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X
I do not understand why Über doesn't buy something like a 100/300/100 policy for the drivers, and the 1MM CSL for when passengers are in the car...

agarjogger
May 16, 2011
Yesterday I picked up three big guys. They had me stop at a wine store and wait five minutes, and then proceed to drop all three of them off in spread-out locations on the North Side. Traffic was heavy, trip was just over an hour.
$17.32.
If Uber is having reservations about covering their drivers adequately, this is why. Their pricing is stupidly and unnecessarily cheap, since they're playing games.

AgrippaNothing
Feb 11, 2006

When flying, please wear a suit and tie just like me.
Just upholding the social conntract!
Town car service with prices at or below taxis. The only way to make money on the company level is to cut the overhead to the bone and what you can't cut you make your contract labor force carry.

And they still can't make enough so they slash prices more to gain market share. Transport is a poo poo business. What I really can't understand is how this issue keeps getting framed as a "tech" issue. The buzz of course makes it seem like this form of exploitation is something we all have to get on board with or else the Japanese will eat our lunch! The flat rate cab service I use ~6 times a month has an app too. Same poo poo but the driver isn't assuming as much of the financial risk and isn't using their own car.

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X

agarjogger posted:

Yesterday I picked up three big guys. They had me stop at a wine store and wait five minutes, and then proceed to drop all three of them off in spread-out locations on the North Side. Traffic was heavy, trip was just over an hour.
$17.32.
If Uber is having reservations about covering their drivers adequately, this is why. Their pricing is stupidly and unnecessarily cheap, since they're playing games.
I can do lots of jobs for more than $10/hr in my pocket... That's pretty raw.

I also didn't realize it was so drat cheap. My city doesn't have Über.

agarjogger
May 16, 2011
Well to contrast, I just did two 45 min highway trips for a total of $110. So it seems like the rule to making money in Uber is, don't hit traffic ever. Seems like they favor mileage over time to an insane degree. If I can find a pattern which lets me repeat this: city to suburbs, suburbs to city, I could easily pay for my car by this time next year.

Jesus, my diesel car gets 45 mpg on the freeway and 20 in heavy city traffic. I'm definitely going to stat this out and see where I've gotta be and when, to get the high-mileage rides outside of rush hour.

agarjogger fucked around with this message at 05:40 on Jul 27, 2014

Jastiger
Oct 11, 2008

by FactsAreUseless
Insurance goon chiming to say that any personal insurance coverage will absolutely NOT cover you in the event that you're transporting people for money in your vehicle. Also, if you're willing to put yourself out there for any kind of liability for ride sharing, and you keep bare minimum liability limits, you're wrong. You're transporting people you don't know and can be found responsible for their injuries if you are found to be at fault-even if they are in your car or otherwise. If you're going to be doing your own "business" it seems silly to barely protect yourself when you're not using the car for that business, especially since damaging the car and being out of commission for a while is worse than not simply being able to get to work that day.

If Uber isn't providing insurance for you to drive people around, you're taking on a HUGE risk.

agarjogger
May 16, 2011
I have excellent insurance with huge limits, but why even bother pointing that out if, as you say, it won't ever help me if I get in a wreck. The fact is Uber drivers have been in plenty of accidents on and off the clock, and almost all of their claims have gone through. Yes it sucks to be paying so much for a policy that could be so easily invalidated. Once I know I'll be making enough money to pay the premiums, I will look into commercial insurance. But I'm not even sure policies yet exist that could be sold to an Uber driver.

I understand completely the risk and the fact that this is a bad financial deal for the vast majority of drivers. But I have no skills, just an asset, and I need to be converting that asset to cash now to keep a roof over my head. You might, appropriately, advise me to sell the car and use the money to keep bills paid and go to trucking school. But I have a fun job and a sweet car, and it would be loving tough to give that up for something which is much worse everywhere but on a spreadsheet.

e: Honestly though, when I'm keeping the doors locked for a few extra seconds to make sure the passenger doesn't open one onto a bicycle. Yes I understand this is loving precarious, and I'm be totally happy to do this for five months, and then quit and be able to finish college on the income.
I understand this is the financial forum and I am making a bad financial move by driving for Uber, because of the liability. But every day I am gaining confidence and basic job competence, which I will use to finish college and/or acquire skills. I was honestly an e/n poster incapable of any of that before I started driving.

agarjogger fucked around with this message at 05:54 on Jul 27, 2014

RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS
Dec 21, 2010
What "job competence" are you gaining by driving people around exactly?

agarjogger
May 16, 2011

RICHUNCLEPENNYBAGS posted:

What "job competence" are you gaining by driving people around exactly?

Taxi is not a dead-simple job to be doing. No service job is simple, especially one with the stakes of driving-for-hire.
I have to decide which rides to accept by sizing people up. I have to maintain an extremely high rating by providing excellent service, because I'll need a buffer against the low ratings that will inevitably result from refusing rides, which the app gives me no easy way to do. Which I must do if I am to slow the depreciation of the car. I have to do what I say I'm going to do and be where I say I'm going to be. I have to learn traffic patterns and people patterns, that is when the trains come in, when there's an accident or a transit outage or a weather event. I have to obtain a very granular knowledge of the city, knowing which condo towers have good passengers and what time they go to work and come back.

The level of service people have come to expect from UberX is pretty absurd, and you have to keep a ton of things in mind to make sure you're providing it. Doing this job is absolutely taking me from a NEET to someone prepared to do a 9-5. I no longer have any desire to sleep in, because that means there's some other gently caress out there eating my lunch and picking up all the easy fares. And doing this job in heavy traffic without getting tickets is mentally taxing and complicated.

There is also a law pending in my statehouse which would force Uber to become the primary insurance provider whenever I have the app enabled. This would force them to raise fares to taxi level, and would generally be excellent for me.

Here is an in-depth article from the insurance industry that confirms that the insurance ambiguity/gap will be resolved in the states which have accepted rideshare as a fact, and a welcome one. Uber is resisting liability, but the insurance providers are making the company a target for pressure. They are pissed mainly that a bunch of their policies are mispriced, and they are seeking to resolve that with Uber, not with me
http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/national/2014/06/27/332942.htm

agarjogger fucked around with this message at 06:36 on Jul 27, 2014

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X

agarjogger posted:

Well to contrast, I just did two 45 min highway trips for a total of $110. So it seems like the rule to making money in Uber is, don't hit traffic ever. Seems like they favor mileage over time to an insane degree. If I can find a pattern which lets me repeat this: city to suburbs, suburbs to city, I could easily pay for my car by this time next year.

Jesus, my diesel car gets 45 mpg on the freeway and 20 in heavy city traffic. I'm definitely going to stat this out and see where I've gotta be and when, to get the high-mileage rides outside of rush hour.
What type of diesel gets that bad of city mileage?

agarjogger
May 16, 2011

SiGmA_X posted:

What type of diesel gets that bad of city mileage?

No car gets very good MPG if you're not moving. That's stop-and-go traffic. I doubt EPA city MPG is calculated with that amount of idling/crawling. My car is rated much higher in the city, but taxi use is not typical use at all. I'm already learning how much I can coast without irritating the passenger, and which lights I can shut off the engine at.

posh spaz
Jul 25, 2014

agarjogger posted:

This would force them to raise fares to taxi level, and would generally be excellent for me.

Huh? I thought Uber's whole deal was being cheaper than taxis. There are already Uber-like apps that work with proper taxi companies and car services. If you lose that price advantage I'm not sure it's viable anymore, if it even is currently viable. I can't say without knowing all of the costs and risks involved.

agarjogger
May 16, 2011

posh spaz posted:

Huh? I thought Uber's whole deal was being cheaper than taxis. There are already Uber-like apps that work with proper taxi companies and car services. If you lose that price advantage I'm not sure it's viable anymore, if it even is currently viable. I can't say without knowing all of the costs and risks involved.

The Uber app itself will let you summon a traditional taxi, one which is simply a yellow cab with the Uberphone on board. I don't know what to tell you, people loving love UberX and a random-rear end dude in a random-rear end car. Since in the taxi industry, a random dude in a random car means a significantly cooler dude in a significantly nicer car. I've had more people complaining about being undercharged than anything else (besides my route choice). Of course they will rarely offer a tip, since the Uber corp. beats it into their head not to. gently caress you, Uber. I guess I can say anything I like about them without fear of retribution, since according to them they're not my employer.

They're also obsessively creepy and excessively internet-literate, and I'd be surprised if I wasn't deactivated in a year for trying to get the Uber driver's forum to stop willingly lapping up so much bullshit from passengers and the company.

agarjogger
May 16, 2011
I don't know though. If there were a clear way to graduate from this UberX poo poo into something safer, better, more stable. I'd do it in a heartbeat. This is the first job I'm genuinely good at, and it makes me feel awesome.

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X

agarjogger posted:

I don't know though. If there were a clear way to graduate from this UberX poo poo into something safer, better, more stable. I'd do it in a heartbeat. This is the first job I'm genuinely good at, and it makes me feel awesome.
Get a CDL? Become a 'wheelman'?

agarjogger
May 16, 2011

SiGmA_X posted:

Get a CDL? Become a 'wheelman'?

Yes, definitely. As soon as I've got the cash, people skills, and city knowledge I want from driving UberX, I'm saving my car and running as fast as I can into a real job with a real company.

Though conditions do seem likely to improve for UberX drivers, since IMO they couldn't be much worse.

AgrippaNothing
Feb 11, 2006

When flying, please wear a suit and tie just like me.
Just upholding the social conntract!
Oh they can get worse. As soon as you see any improvement, they will start charging you a usage fee just to turn on your drat phone and blame it on the government caps that will inevitably get put into place. I can imagine a lot of ways that company could get shittier.

Get out dude. The risk alone is just stupid and you are losing ground everyday if you count how hard you are beating up your vehicle.

posh spaz
Jul 25, 2014
The OP did say Uber saved him from being a spergy basement baby. I think that's a bargain at any price.

Non-sequitur #1: Does the lack of an umlaut in "Uber" drive anyone else crazy?

Non-sequitur #2: A long time ago I volunteered at a non-profit that provided counseling and legal services for torture survivors. A lot of them were east African, and many of them ended up driving cabs once their asylum paperwork came through, since that was one of the few jobs they could get. I don't mean to be a Luddite, but man, "disrupting" the taxi industry so white guys want to drive cabs again seems pretty messed up.

Jalumibnkrayal
Apr 16, 2008

Ramrod XTreme
I have no idea if it's any better, but have you considered signing up for Instacart or Taskrabbit? Instead of ferrying around strangers, you'll ferry around strange people's groceries and laundry! I have no idea how the pay compares but on the upside these services don't discourage tips.

Jastiger
Oct 11, 2008

by FactsAreUseless

agarjogger posted:

I have excellent insurance with huge limits, but why even bother pointing that out if, as you say, it won't ever help me if I get in a wreck. The fact is Uber drivers have been in plenty of accidents on and off the clock, and almost all of their claims have gone through. Yes it sucks to be paying so much for a policy that could be so easily invalidated. Once I know I'll be making enough money to pay the premiums, I will look into commercial insurance. But I'm not even sure policies yet exist that could be sold to an Uber driver.

I understand completely the risk and the fact that this is a bad financial deal for the vast majority of drivers. But I have no skills, just an asset, and I need to be converting that asset to cash now to keep a roof over my head. You might, appropriately, advise me to sell the car and use the money to keep bills paid and go to trucking school. But I have a fun job and a sweet car, and it would be loving tough to give that up for something which is much worse everywhere but on a spreadsheet.

e: Honestly though, when I'm keeping the doors locked for a few extra seconds to make sure the passenger doesn't open one onto a bicycle. Yes I understand this is loving precarious, and I'm be totally happy to do this for five months, and then quit and be able to finish college on the income.
I understand this is the financial forum and I am making a bad financial move by driving for Uber, because of the liability. But every day I am gaining confidence and basic job competence, which I will use to finish college and/or acquire skills. I was honestly an e/n poster incapable of any of that before I started driving.

My point was that you should just get a commercial policy and not use a personal vehicle for business at all. You're paying for a personal policy and then need a commercial policy on the same car. You're double paying and taking a huge risk either way because all a company needs to say is "Nope, he was working on that accident" or "Nope, he wasn't working on that accident". Its a terrible idea to use a personal vehicle like that in such a large capacity.

I say have a higher personal limit because you're more likely to be in your car more than someone not doing this, so if you DO get in an accident you have far more to lose in a "personal" accident than anyone else using a car for strictly personal reasons. Basically by using the personal car for more than just personal things makes the risks for all things higher since an accident directly disrupts your business and directly translates to a higher risk for yourself and any company insuring you.

Space Gopher
Jul 31, 2006

BLITHERING IDIOT AND HARDCORE DURIAN APOLOGIST. LET ME TELL YOU WHY THIS SHIT DON'T STINK EVEN THOUGH WE ALL KNOW IT DOES BECAUSE I'M SUPER CULTURED.

SiGmA_X posted:

I do not understand why Über doesn't buy something like a 100/300/100 policy for the drivers, and the 1MM CSL for when passengers are in the car...

Because commercial insurance is really expensive. Personal vehicles really aren't used all that much: people drive them somewhere, then park and do something. Commercial cars are used more or less continually while the operator is working, so they have a lot more chances to get into accidents. Plus, the operator of a commercial passenger vehicle is subject to pressures from their fares to do dangerous things. Would you normally do 15 over the speed of traffic in a rainstorm? What if you had somebody screaming at you to get to the airport right now, and if they miss their flight (that they're already running late for) they'll give you one star that could get you fired?

Uber's whole business model is based on shifting as much risk and expense as possible onto their pseudo-employees: capital costs like vehicle purchase, expenses like maintenance, and risks like breakdowns and accidents. A traditional taxi company will assume most of these (although they certainly have their own ways to screw over drivers, too). When you look at everything they do, Uber ends up seeming like some Marxist stereotype of a corporation designed to screw and exploit their employees as hard as possible.

Stanos
Sep 22, 2009

The best 57 in hockey.

Aristotle Animes posted:

And your 17.50 an hour avg goes in the toilet if you have a lousy day, get sick or just take some time off. And you better factor in the increased maintenance and the cost a new fancy ride in a year or two to keep up your customer appeal in which case this is a losing proposition. Then don't forget the potential black hole insurance could leave you in. Uber is terrible. Don't be a sucker.

Don't forget you're a 1099 contractor so you have to pay all your own taxes too!

UberX is a sucker's bet. Don't do it. If you like being a taxi or want to move onto something legit, get a CDL/Chauffeur's license.

AgrippaNothing
Feb 11, 2006

When flying, please wear a suit and tie just like me.
Just upholding the social conntract!

Stanos posted:

Don't forget you're a 1099 contractor so you have to pay all your own taxes too!

UberX is a sucker's bet. Don't do it. If you like being a taxi or want to move onto something legit, get a CDL/Chauffeur's license.

I was kinda hoping that figure already included that, but, yeah you'll get knocked pretty hard if it wasn't!

agarjogger
May 16, 2011

Aristotle Animes posted:

I was kinda hoping that figure already included that, but, yeah you'll get knocked pretty hard if it wasn't!

I assumed a 19% income tax in that. Due to the way surge works, and the way people use cabs, a ten hour shift isn't really the way to do it. You go out to drive when people go out to do stuff.

Even if I were to somehow net minimum wage these next few months, it's still well worth it. It's getting me out of bed and on my feet and slowly lifting my horrible depression. Well worth the sucker's bet, at least to me. Obviously if I get T-boned and insurance says LMAO DENIED, I lost the game but still learned a ton about my city and its people.

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X

agarjogger posted:

I assumed a 19% income tax in that. Due to the way surge works, and the way people use cabs, a ten hour shift isn't really the way to do it. You go out to drive when people go out to do stuff.

Even if I were to somehow net minimum wage these next few months, it's still well worth it. It's getting me out of bed and on my feet and slowly lifting my horrible depression. Well worth the sucker's bet, at least to me. Obviously if I get T-boned and insurance says LMAO DENIED, I lost the game but still learned a ton about my city and its people.

How do you get 19%? SE is 15.3%... You think your fed and state tax rate is only a total of 3.7%?? I think you likely need to recalculate that.

agarjogger
May 16, 2011
Let me get back to you when I manage to find someone on the drivers' forum who can actually produce evidence of their effective tax owed and paid. There are some deductions against depreciation available to people using their cars for work. I still believe that in two or three cities, mine included, driving forty hour weeks and being very savvy about your pickup pattern can lead to an after-everything take-home of near $20/hr.

Says here that half of the S/E tax can be deducted from, and there is a $.56 per mile deduction. Which would appear to knock out half the self-employment tax.

agarjogger fucked around with this message at 06:17 on Jul 28, 2014

FrozenVent
May 1, 2009

The Boeing 737-200QC is the undisputed workhorse of the skies.

agarjogger posted:

Let me get back to you when I manage to find someone on the drivers' forum who can actually produce evidence of their effective tax owed and paid. There are some deductions against depreciation available to people using their cars for work. I still believe that in two or three cities, mine included, driving forty hour weeks and being very savvy about your pickup pattern can lead to an after-everything take-home of near $20/hr.*

*Minus the actuarial cost of the ridonkulous liability you're taking on.

agarjogger
May 16, 2011
Hah, I'm ready to happily admit that this job is a loving loser. A mortgage on my car, a mortgage on my future. Fine. I need cash and something which gets my rear end out of bed on time and onto the street. The moment I find a job that pays $12, I'm out, my car and lawyer will certainly thank me.

Still, things could get better. My state could make Uber the primary insurer with taxi limits ($350,000), and they could cut the bottom 40% of drivers with little impact on service. And I wish it weren't so central to my decision, but UberX is a fun-rear end job.

Still, the moment I have the cash to do it, I should look into driving professionally, with a proper license and a proper company. There's a fair bit of up-front investment involved in that, and I am terrified to unseal my credit card. I go back to school in January to finish my half-finished degree.

agarjogger fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Jul 28, 2014

SiGmA_X
May 3, 2004
SiGmA_X

agarjogger posted:

Let me get back to you when I manage to find someone on the drivers' forum who can actually produce evidence of their effective tax owed and paid. There are some deductions against depreciation available to people using their cars for work. I still believe that in two or three cities, mine included, driving forty hour weeks and being very savvy about your pickup pattern can lead to an after-everything take-home of near $20/hr.

Says here that half of the S/E tax can be deducted from, and there is a $.56 per mile deduction. Which would appear to knock out half the self-employment tax.
Mileage and depreciation yes, unsure about the half of SE tho? Do you have a link?

agarjogger
May 16, 2011

SiGmA_X posted:

Mileage and depreciation yes, unsure about the half of SE tho? Do you have a link?

Not really, just some random-rear end on the driver forums. I also just found another guy who says that deduction is not permitted for livery drivers. The period in which I think I'm going to do this has shrunk from 5 months to 2, since UberX drivers apparently pay a fuckton of tax (the ones who stick around long enough to file an annual return, which I cannot seem to find). The $6,000 or so I should net driving UberX, would represent a simple withdrawal from the value of my vehicle, which is still better than selling it. In eight weeks or so, I should be well-prepared to drive a town car, and have the cash to make that happen.

Thanks for the reality check. gently caress this loving company and every god damned thing emanating from the SF area. I'll stick around the thread and let you guys know if I am somehow grossing $500 a day by being a top-rated/prioritized driver. Then maybe we can run the numbers again?

It's just so sad how, time after time, libertarian shitheads make a basically decent thing and have to corrupt it immediately.

agarjogger fucked around with this message at 06:42 on Jul 28, 2014

Droo
Jun 25, 2003

You deduct 1/2 of self employment tax from your federal taxable income. You still pay it.

Deducting it will save you like 1-2% of your total income in federal tax owed, whereas 1/2 of SE tax is like 7.5 percent or something.

Kiwi Ghost Chips
Feb 19, 2011

Start using the best desktop environment now!
Choose KDE!

It's supposed to provide parity with regular employers, since they can deduct the 1/2 of FICA that they pay, but it's a vary minor deduction overall.

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agarjogger
May 16, 2011
from the Uber drivers' forum:

quote:

My few fast food requests have been from passengers seating in the back seat, so I pull up to the speaker so THEY can order from the back seat and then pull up to the window so THEY can pay and get their change and food, all from the comfort of the back seat. I haven't had any front-seat fast food rides yet.

I had two interesting fast food situations a few nights ago. On the first one the girl didn't like the way I positioned the vehicle at the Jack in the Box so she could order. She said drivers usually order for her. I told her I do it that way so the order doesn't get messed up and the money exchange is handled by her directly. She was acting like she was a princess and I was her chauffeur and servant.

And my last ride of the night was a 1:30 am ride to Taco Bell and back. Turns out Taco Bell was closed, so the girl was not happy with the $19.90 she had to pay Uber for the 4 mile / 16 minute round trip to a closed Taco Bell.

In your case, do you order their fast food, or do you let them order and pay from the back window? Is there any Uber guidance on this?

I can only guess this guy lives in some lovely burb and is being used by the same bunch of drunk teenagers to run to the drive through. This is an example of a deranged driver who is so laid-low by the rating system, that he will comply with almost any passenger request without hesitation.

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