Zaggitz posted:

Toxxupation posted:

doctor who stinks and you all stink for liking it, imo

A jargogle posted:

And he'd have an equally valid claim on those things. It'd be awkward for sure to sort out, but I think a reasonable person could manage to.

Bobulus posted:

Wait, so your claim is that Jimmy2.0 isn't the same person because he didn't 'earn' a good life? It almost sounds like you're saying that the value of a person's life is not the decisions they make, but how much toil they did.

MrL_JaKiri posted:

What determines "whether you've earned it"? The atoms in your body change over time, and even if they didn't there's no difference between one carbon 12 molecule and another other than the energy, so it's not like even the same physical object did them things even if you're not talking teleportation/similar.

[edit: made before your most recent post but still relevant]

Filox posted:

So to you the most important aspect is physical? This is not the body that was there on that first date (and all the rest or them) with the wife, therefore it's not the same person? Even though both of them have exactly the same memories of the events?

I come down on the other side. All we are, ultimately, is a collection of memories. If your memories and experiences were different, you could/would have ended up a different person. If we made a ganger of you and gave it a false set of memories, or no memories at all but only practical knowledge and abilities (able to walk and talk and add 2+2, but otherwise a blank slate) I'd say not you. But since its memories as exactly the same as yours, then it's another you, no less valid, and yes, having a potential claim to your life and family. In an ideal world, it would be up to your family which copy they wanted to keep in the house - and that's a scary thought. Maybe the Ganger-you would be a more sympathetic or empathetic individual due to the experience of being a ganger, while you-original might end up looking like an rear end in a top hat they don't want to live with because you're so mean to your ganger.

Cloning-with-memories is a conundrum, because it creates issues just like those and even creating memory-bearing clones is a horrible and cruel thing to do. What if you woke up one day and someone told you that your life is not yours because you're not "real", you're just a copy of Adder Moray? Because that's exactly what happens to the gangers. What if you were terminally ill (and living in a sci-fi show) and you were offered the chance to continue your existence by having your mind downloaded into an android body? Would the android be the New You, a valid continuation of your life and existence, or a fakity-fake with no legitimate claim to your identity because it's not the body that you lived in before the disease? Or would the android you be The One True Adder Moray because your old body had conveniently died, so there was still only one of you?

Jackson Lake's situation isn't comparable because he came to identify as the Doctor through trauma and mental contamination from information files, not from the Doctor's memories out of the Doctor's head. If you want to go that way, Donna was the better example (and doomed to fail because the Doctor's actual Time Lord consciousness was imposed on a human brain that couldn't contain it.)

SiKboy posted:

Unfortunately by later today many of the cells in your body will be different, so although you will share many memories with the poster "Adder Moray", you will not actually have any right to that username. Careful adder moray+ doesnt get banned for account sharing!

Bicyclops posted:

Talking about how we define sentience in a thread about a science fiction show isn't really a derail as much as it is an inevitability. It's always interesting to see how people look at it, though.

Bicyclops posted:

Gaming pessimism is the most boring thing on the planet.

DoctorWhat posted:

the only gaming thing i know to be absolutely true is that Roy is our Boy.

Bicyclops posted:

But which one? There are two now!!

thexerox123 posted:

(I was trying to find the picture of the Brazzers Doctor surfing the TARDIS, but I give up.)