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 WHAT ARE ALL THESE WORDS WHO ARE THE GUYS I NEED TO FOCUS ON I am aware that these OPs can drag on and no one wants to read a bunch of poo poo. So, here are a bunch of dudes you can ask me and each other questions about : DECLAN BIG BOARD PROSPECT LIST FINE 1. Jahlil Okafor, C, Duke 2. Karl Towns, PF, Kentucky 3. Mario Hezonja, SG, Barca 4. Cliff Alexander, PF, Kansas 5. Kelly Oubre, SF, Kansas 6. Emmanuel Mudiay, Disappointment, Guangdong 7. Kristaps Porzingis, Jan Vesely, Sevilla 8. Willie Cauley-Stein, C, Kentucky 9. Sam Dekker, White Guy, Wisconsin 10. Stanley Johnson, SF, Arizona 11. Justise Winslow, SF, Duke 12. Tyus Jones, PG, Duke 13. Montrezl Harrell, C, Louisville 14. Rondae Hollis-Jefferson, SF, Arizona and I'll stop there because if you're wondering who your team is taking with the 20th pick before the season even starts then I just feel bad for you Hi I'm a Cavs fan who hasn't been following the NBA since like oh 2010 for some reason anyways what's the deal with the draft that I've never paid attention to before now The NBA draft is errthang to the NBA. Teams who are excellent drafters tend to do well in the NBA and teams that are poor drafters tend to do very poorly, unless they are the Lakers, in which case they do very poorly after their years of poor drafting has caught up with them. Why is the NBA draft so drat important Generally speaking, rookie contracts are by and large the best bargain in the NBA. Sure, you'll have LeBron James grossly outperforming a max contract or Kevin Durant taking a hometown discount or whatever the gently caress, but for most teams, the best bargain you can get is on a rookie contract. While most picks do not hit their maximum potential by definition, the expected value for a lottery pick tends to be a league average starter/30 MPG player over the course of their contract. that doesn't sound like much who gives a poo poo about drafting the next james posey I could throw out some numbers but basically it allows you to add starting level players at a controlled cost while also retaining their services as they improve vs. signing an MLE player for twice the cost who is less likely to improve. It's impossible to draft perfectly, and a lot of it is up to chance, but drafting intelligently is the only way to build a good team without either resorting to high risk signings (finite, boom or bust) or plunging your team into cap hell (reduces flexibility). So yeah, it matters. The other thing to take into account is that it is relatively simple to rid yourself of players you don't think are working out or otherwise don't want on rookie contracts because their cap hits are smaller if you cut them outright or they're easier to move in trades (and their value tends to be inflated because of UPSIDE). Picks and players on rookie contracts are among the most liquid assets in the NBA. That being said, most draft picks don't turn into superstars, and out of the lottery, most players don't ever develop into starters. So it's important to temper your expectations of what you're drafting and who you're getting. Every raw college player is not a diamond in the rough, and every NBA-ready international guy doesn't crack the rotation right away.
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Oct 21, 2014 17:36
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| # ¿ Apr 29, 2024 04:46 |
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These are not in any particular order but are grouped together by estimated draft position. The likely order of the picks is wholly dependent on who holds the pick at whatever slot, so while Jahlil Okafor may be the #1 prospect, that's not necessarily who the team picking #1 will end up with. Mario Hezonja (Born the Same Year That Se7en Came Out/Barca)  SG/SF/PG, 6'8, 200 lbs. Pros: Fast, sees the court well, best friends with Dario Saric so if the Sixers draft him that poo poo's gonna be adorable, can ~*~*~*create his own shot*~*~*~, frame could easily add more weight, excellent passer, fits in the Dwyane Wade/Joe Johnson "do it all" mold which is pretty cool, potentially a very good defender, gifted passer, can shoot the lights out Cons: Dumb as rocks. Terrible shot selection. Terminal case of chicken legs. Also fits in the Dwyane Wade/Joe Johnson mold of "bitching to the refs a lot". Offense primarily relies on isolations at this stage. Only plays at a breakneck pace which amplifies that whole "dumb" thing. Givony says he has bad intangibles but whatever who gives a poo poo if he's "aloof" so is every other European player that isn't Ricky Rubio. Projection: Top 3 Don Van Vliet album that best summarizes his potential: Trout Mask Replica Jahlil Okafor (Fr/Duke)  C/PF, 6'11, 272 lbs. Pros: The latest in a grand tradition of pro-ready Okafors, body already appears to be ready for the NBA, decent athlete, allegedly well-spoken which means he will be a darling of sportswriters and crotchety old men everywhere, great hands, already has more post moves than half the centers starting in the NBA, footwork is good, strong, very gifted as a rebounder, excellent finisher, draws fouls at a very good rate Cons: Looks like a melting Tim Duncan. Doesn't really pass much. Pretty boring as a prospect and as a person. Projection: Top 3 Don Van Vliet album that best summarizes his potential: Safe as Milk Karl Towns (Fr/Kentucky)  PF, 7'0, 248 lbs. Pros: Crazy long (7'4 wingspan, 9'5 standing reach), max vert of 37" holy poo poo, good dunkman, rebounds very well, has range out to about 20 feet, actually has offensive skills, oh man he's gonna block so many loving shots dude, appears to be a very willing passer Cons: Dominican, and therefore not trustworthy. That vert is almost definitely a Cody Zeller-type situation where there's no way he'll ever actually use it. Not as aggressive going inside as he should be. Range stops at 20 feet and goes no further. Projection: Top 3 Don Van Vliet album that best summarizes his potential: Bat Chain Puller Declan MacManus fucked around with this message at 23:50 on Nov 19, 2014 |
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Oct 21, 2014 17:36
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kiimo posted:^^^I think he sounds pretty infuriating. Most of the knocks on him are intangibles stuff, and Givony hates dudes with bad intangibles to an almost comical degree (and also loves dudes with good ones). He's already a good shooter and ballhandler and can create his own shot, and he's a decent passer. Defensively, the sky is the limit, even if he doesn't work well in team defenses right now. I'd much rather have him than, say, Sam Dekker
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Oct 21, 2014 18:05
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Hand Knit posted:So who is the Mongolian Derrick Rose or whatever who will be taken in the middle of the first round and make everyone go "what?" I could see Ilimane Diop rising like crazy because he compares to Serge Ibaka (but that's ridiculous because Diop is from Senegal and emigrated to Spain at 14 and Ibaka is Congolese and emigrated to France at 17)
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Oct 21, 2014 18:27
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MourningView posted:That seems really high for Dekker right now. He didn't shoot well last year, and he needs to shoot at an elite level to be worth a lottery pick. He supposedly had a great summer though so hopefully that bounces back. Caris LeVert is also a really good name for an NBA player quote:Glad to see you won't let the Willie Cauley-Stein dream die. Go down with that ship, man. ~I Believe~ DOOP posted:Can the Euro guy shoot? Can anybody in this class shoot? I really hope the Sixers can draft a guy that can shoot. I don't know about any of that but if you need some long athletes I got a few of those if you want
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Oct 23, 2014 00:54
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chunkles posted:Not this years draft but I figure this is the best place for it, what do you think of Tarik Black Declan (or anyone else)? He's been really impressive in preseason. Wee bit undersized post scorer, never played as well as his physical abilities would suggest. Projects to be a good rebounder/interior scorer and not a lot else, although he was a decent defender in college. Probably not going to see a lot of time with Dwight on the court as it would gently caress up the Rockets' spacing big time
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Oct 24, 2014 02:25
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Probably Magic posted:Any relation to DeSagana, or is that just a really common surname over there? Nah, Diop is a really common last name in Senegal.
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Nov 5, 2014 19:36
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I like Delon Wright a bit better than that.
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Nov 7, 2014 03:18
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Mario Hezonja (Born the Same Year That Se7en Came Out/Barca) SG/SF/PG, 6'8, 200 lbs. Pros: Fast, sees the court well, best friends with Dario Saric so if the Sixers draft him that poo poo's gonna be adorable, can ~*~*~*create his own shot*~*~*~, frame could easily add more weight, excellent passer, fits in the Dwyane Wade/Joe Johnson "do it all" mold which is pretty cool, potentially a very good defender, gifted passer, can shoot the lights out Cons: Dumb as rocks. Terrible shot selection. Terminal case of chicken legs. Also fits in the Dwyane Wade/Joe Johnson mold of "bitching to the refs a lot". Offense primarily relies on isolations at this stage. Only plays at a breakneck pace which amplifies that whole "dumb" thing. Givony says he has bad intangibles but whatever who gives a poo poo if he's "aloof" so is every other European player that isn't Ricky Rubio. Projection: Top 3 Don Van Vliet album that best summarizes his potential: Trout Mask Replica Jahlil Okafor (Fr/Duke) C/PF, 6'11, 272 lbs. Pros: The latest in a grand tradition of pro-ready Okafors, body already appears to be ready for the NBA, decent athlete, allegedly well-spoken which means he will be a darling of sportswriters and crotchety old men everywhere, great hands, already has more post moves than half the centers starting in the NBA, footwork is good, strong, very gifted as a rebounder, excellent finisher, draws fouls at a very good rate Cons: Looks like a melting Tim Duncan. Doesn't really pass much. Pretty boring as a prospect and as a person. Projection: Top 3 Don Van Vliet album that best summarizes his potential: Safe as Milk Karl Towns (Fr/Kentucky) PF, 7'0, 248 lbs. Pros: Crazy long (7'4 wingspan, 9'5 standing reach), max vert of 37" holy poo poo, good dunkman, rebounds very well, has range out to about 20 feet, actually has offensive skills, oh man he's gonna block so many loving shots dude, appears to be a very willing passer Cons: Dominican, and therefore not trustworthy. That vert is almost definitely a Cody Zeller-type situation where there's no way he'll ever actually use it. Not as aggressive going inside as he should be. Range stops at 20 feet and goes no further. Projection: Top 3 Don Van Vliet album that best summarizes his potential: Bat Chain Puller
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Nov 19, 2014 16:23
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MourningView posted:They have terrible players everywhere so drafting nothing but centers isn't really ideal. And maybe they really like Mudiay, who is currently destroying china, whatever the gently caress that is supposed to mean. It means he's at least as good as a bajillion years old crazy Starbury and/or Yi Jianlian
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Nov 19, 2014 16:24
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^^I try not to oversellstraight up brolic posted:Cons: Dominican, and therefore not trustworthy. gently caress Washington Heights yo
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Nov 19, 2014 16:48
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DOOP posted:I kinda want Sixers to draft Mario so I could a starting five of The "this lineup will be so good in four years" lineup. But hey that poo poo worked for OKC so there are definitely worse plans, it's just that you, you know, need people to actually play at some point.
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Nov 19, 2014 17:30
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MourningView posted:As long as one of them turns into one of the two best basketball players on earth it's a fool-proof plan. I don't expect them to have the next Russell Westbrook on their hands but you never know.
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Nov 19, 2014 17:45
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euphronius posted:declan add the blurbs into the second post. People love blurbs. That's what the second post is there for. I used to do them five at a time but now I think I'll do them like three at a time since it takes half the time (something about doing five at once makes me sloppy and disorganized) and also because I'm tired on my days off and it's all I can do to get caught up on college games, highlights, and various DX stuff that I cobble together into an "opinion". E: As far as the Sixers go, I'd rather have Okafor than Embiid or Noel so I could see the Sixers moving one of them for a vet and a pick Declan MacManus fucked around with this message at 23:53 on Nov 19, 2014 |
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Nov 19, 2014 23:48
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Noel is conceivably quick enough to step out on the perimeter against stretch fours, and it's impossible to say where Embiid will be in a year's time (but if he's recovered fully than he should be able to do the same). It will be a bad defensive team for a while though
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Nov 20, 2014 00:44
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kiimo posted:Disagree. oh you do huh go loving figure
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Nov 20, 2014 03:51
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The Glumslinger posted:According to RealGm, these are the CBA league leaders in PPG: It's super dope If Coach K wasn't such a self-involved dickwad then Self would easily be my least favorite college basketball coach EvanTH posted:I was looking around for some gameplay videos of Okafor (how they work in the set, mistakes as well as successes) instead of those 1000 dunks HUGE UPSIDE capital letters videos and youtube keeps showing me new videos of Thon Maker while I'm reading that age discussion in the NBA thread and it's freaking me the hell out holy poo poo College preseason tends to be against the cuppyest of cupcakes. It's sort of like D-League in that if you look bad it's really bad but if you look okay-to-good then you might still be really terrible. euphronius posted:How easy is marijuana to get in China. Not at all. Maybe opium is the right drug for Beas
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Dec 1, 2014 00:39
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euphronius posted:Oubre got a whole six minutes. Self wings tend to do better in the pros than their college performance would suggest, and Self bigs tend to do worse. It's not a 1:1 sure thing like Boeheim's defensive coaching being garbage, but that's how things trend. It's very hard to grade out Kansas prospects reliably. Of course it is hard to grade out any prospects reliably but whatever
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Dec 1, 2014 16:10
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kiimo posted:His body shape just screams "goon". NBA strength training can work miracles.
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Dec 11, 2014 05:50
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  you can do maaaaagic, you can do anything your heart desires MourningView posted:It's just an ACL tear, it's not going to end his career. He was a big prospect out of high school, but he was super raw as a freshman and hasn't improved much skill wise. He might have been able to sneak into the end of the first if he'd left as a freshman when he was still thought to have a ton of potential, but his stock really tanked once he started playing college games. He's really athletic but he's ultimately a hustle power forward stuck in a small forwards body. Someone will probably give him a shot in the second round after next year, which is probably not much better than he was going to do anyway. Wait why are we talking about my boy James McAdoo?
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Dec 15, 2014 04:35
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MourningView posted:Declan was right and I was wrong about Cauley-Stein. This is very big of you but let it be known that Willie and I forgive the haterzz. Also yes gently caress the Harrison twins they are the worst, they make me want to overrate UK bigs more than I already do because they are sandbagging that offense Probably Magic posted:Not necessarily draft commentary, but if Kentucky started with a smaller point guard, they wouldn't be having such a tough time in their first halfs, IMO. The big PG dream will never die. Ulis is clearly better but I assume Cal is more concerned with UK's defense which would (probably) be worse with Ulis on the floor. Not that they couldn't hide him pretty well but well there you go. And like everyone else has said they're so stacked that it really doesn't matter.
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Dec 30, 2014 15:22
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Igor Strelkov posted:So he's the number one pick because he's not just a very good post scorer, he's the best one in a generation or two? That makes more sense. He's near impossible to defend in post-up situations 1-on-1 and if you double team him he's also an excellent passer. He can also create a little bit as a face-up guy and is an excellent rebounder. Defense is kind of a question mark and he'll probably be bad in his first few seasons because his lateral quickness isn't otherworldly or anything but he can still be a net positive. euphronius posted:Seems really light on guards in the lottery. The guard prospects in this class aren't all that amazing The Glumslinger posted:He's probably the best post prospect since Duncan He has the goony face of a superstar
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Dec 31, 2014 21:48
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DOOP posted:Oh yeah. I don't expect the Miami pick to remain at 15 (or higher), but I hope it does It's top 10 protected so you know, not too much higher I assume the Sixers are going to sell at least one if not more of those picks and trade them down the line for future seconds and/or marginal veterans from teams trying to shed salary.
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Jan 2, 2015 00:38
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My latest draft crush is  Tyrone Wallace from Cal
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Jan 8, 2015 05:16
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Redgrendel2001 posted:Caris Levert out for the rest of the season. Probably doesn't affect his stock too too much. I'd keep an eye on Zak Irvin who's going to be receiving a ton of touches (not that he wasn't getting a decent workload to begin with). There's also Aubrey Dawkins who I thiiiink got promoted to the starting lineup but he's probably a marginal prospect at best (at a glance it looks like he can shoot). Please feel free to quote that when he starts dropping 30 a game.
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Jan 21, 2015 20:04
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LARGE THE HEAD posted:Kevon Looney is awful, and is DraftExpress' No. 11-ranked draft-eligible player. I can't reconcile this. He's actually ninth, and he's shortlisted for the Wayman Tisdale Memorial Good Player and Smooth Jazz Bassist Award or w/e He rebounds really well and gets to the line at a pretty good clip. They're probably looking at him and thinking "yet another small rebounder/garbageman" which is a surprisingly successful mold in the NBA
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Jan 25, 2015 03:14
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Doltos posted:Can anyone tell me where they think the Knicks are ending up and who'd be a good fit for them? We might have a serviceable sixth and seventh man combo of Galloway and Hardaway Jr. for the future but outside of Melo the team is basically a dumpster fire. Knicks need literally anyone at any position and will finish in the bottom three of the NBA (most likely). Best players are Okafor, Towns, and Mudiay. D'Angelo Russell rocketed up a bunch of people's draft boards but I haven't had the chance to watch any of his footage.
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Jan 30, 2015 03:38
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euphronius posted:I hope you all watched the Hezjona tape from DE Next to oversized PGs and athletic defensive bigs, raw Euro athletes are my rushmore I have not been able to follow the draft or even college basketball as closely as I'd like this year :/
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Feb 18, 2015 18:37
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MourningView posted:Unless he's like completely horrible when he comes back, sure. He's super athletic and has a lot of "great intangibles" bullshit around him. If he gives his teammates enough handshakes and has An NBA Caliber Strength and Conditioning Program maybe he'll turn into Horace Grant
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Feb 18, 2015 18:43
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WhyteRyce posted:Declan, as resident Caulie-Stein fan, talk him up to me and how he'll fix the Kings Well, in theory he compliments Cousins very well, since while Cousins is (at times) excellent at defending the pick and roll, and with WCS behind him to protect the rim, he can gamble a bit on the perimeter and chase guys around. Offensively, it's a bit more difficult to see how they fit together (Cousins excels at putting the ball on the floor and passing, WCS is a garbageman/roll guy, and neither of them are especially good at either posting up or stretching the floor) but WCS figures to be a low usage player on offense, especially if Gay and Cousins are there (moreso if they trade for Dragic). There's also the possibility that Boogie develops a midrange jumper (he seems to hover around 40% from that range although it's been pretty up and down from year to year) but a lot of his value comes from him crashing the boards so I don't know if you want him hanging out on the outside. That being said he makes so much sense on defense that you should probably draft him anyways and figure out the offense later.
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Feb 19, 2015 02:47
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BIZORT posted:It was my own understanding that a big part of what made Cousins go from potentially great to great is not shooting so many of those midrange shots and just going down low and doing what he does best more frequently. Why would you draft a less skillful guy who'd take up more space down low and force Cousins out to the midrange area again? I know he's improved from there and some low usage guy won't be the one necessarily forcing a guy like Cousins out but look at Omer Asik. He's low usage and not particularly offensively skilled so the only area he's respected is near the basket, forcing others away from him. Also, what is the benefit of having a 280lbs guy like Cousins gambling on the perimeter defensively? Cousins is disruptive in passing lanes and is a useful help defender whereas he's weaker in iso and in the low post. As it stands Cousins has a lot of double teams so in theory he could pass out to WCS if teams try to cheat off of him. I don't know how they would necessarily work out the offense there but Cousins is taking about as many shots from outside as he always has (about 65% from inside of 10 feet, about 35% from outside of 10 feet, same as the rest of his career) so it's unlikely that his improvement is as simple as "stopped taking bad shots".
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Feb 19, 2015 03:45
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I dunno, how often did Brand have his back to the basket? I really don't remember, it feels like a decade since he was good Okafor is pretty much constantly in the low post (and for good reason, pretty much no one can stop him there) but also does pretty well when he puts the ball on the floor. He's also a pretty good passer. Offensively, he'll probably be a weird hybrid of Al Jefferson and DeMarcus Cousins. Defensively, he'll probably be a hybrid of Big Al and a folding chair Fake edit: ooh have a chart 
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Feb 19, 2015 04:07
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I would not bet the farm on an injured Embiid over a healthy Okafor.kiimo posted:edit: and failing. If he stays healthy Embiid can be transcendental. I don't think people who haven't watched him every game understand the rate at which he excelled. It was insane to watch, every week some new amazing thing happened like he'd been doing it for years. He'll never be Anthony Davis but most anything else is possible. Including him becoming a taller Tyrus Thomas
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Feb 24, 2015 16:18
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Given that MCW is a starting caliber point guard I don't necessarily think it was wise for the Sixers to move him for a first round pick that they might not even see until 2018 if the Lakers rebuild goes as scheduled. Bird in the hand, etc. Plus that roster is loving dreadful and they're not going to have anyone to build around besides Embiid who is most likely not going to be ready to shoulder the load for an awful team while also developing good basketball habits. It's cool they have a bunch of firsts but you know who else had a bunch of first round picks? The Cavs
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Feb 26, 2015 06:48
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Lockback posted:Cavs turned their cap room that they had because they didn't have many Vets into Lebron James and their firsts into a very sought after Kevin Love and now they look like they could make the Finals. I'm not sure what went wrong with that plan? Up until the part where they pulled a free agent coup out of their asses it was going pretty awful with almost zero chance of improvement My point is the Sixers don't have a LeBron James they can trick into walking onto their team and they might be stuck with whatever their equivalent of Kyrie Irving and a bunch of scrubs is MourningView posted:I don't know that he's an especially good one. I don't really love how the Sixers are building their team on the whole, but getting a likely high first rounder for a guard who can't shoot at all and was having his value inflated by getting to shoot a lot on a bad team seems okay. The issue I see is that if their current trend holds they're probably going to replace him with a guy who is exactly the same and then either be stuck with another deeply flawed lottery pick or just kick the can even further down the road while talking about ASSETS. I don't think MCW is any great prize but he's certainly better than Tony Wroten and Ish loving Smith. It just doesn't seem like they have anything to build around if they don't hit on all of their many, many draft picks. Not that you should build around MCW, of course, but he could certainly be a contributor. Also he's a Syracuse player who's a good defender how could they possibly throw that away It's interesting to see a team exactly how certain people here think one should be run.
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Feb 26, 2015 19:56
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ragle posted:MCW is a replacement caliber point guard. His shooting is insanely terrible. He can run an offense and defend the position. He's a bad shooter but that doesn't make him replacement level. The other guys the Sixers have at point guard are replacement level (except Tony Wroten who is unreplaceable in my heart)
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Feb 26, 2015 22:32
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Rookie pay scale is more or less set in stone if I'm remembering right. In any case it almost always makes more sense to come out early, both to insulate yourself from injury and also to finish your rookie deal as soon as possible to maximize your earning potential.
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Feb 27, 2015 00:40
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Redgrendel2001 posted:Yeah, I guess he would be trying to push up from the 3/4 spot to the 2/3 spot; marginal gains in my opinion. Mudiay won't move up anymore than he has. It's just whether or not the other dudes fall. He's kind of in a position similar to Exum last year.
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Mar 2, 2015 07:32
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Redgrendel2001 posted:Thanks; I haven't gotten to see much of Winslow yet. I really like Hezonja and DX tends to underrate athleticism (but I tend to overrate it). His biggest problems are tunnel-vision and inconsistent defense.
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Mar 5, 2015 04:19
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Portis has good size but he's underwhelming from a strength/speed standpoint. Not slow, not weak, just average on both points.
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Mar 11, 2015 20:05
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