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ROSS MY SALAD posted:The ball is already starting to rotate. A couple of frames before that, you can't even see the laces of the ball. The ball starts to move, showing the laces, right before the forearm is down  The ball does shift, but at what point do we acknowledge that a ball can shift slightly within the carrier's hand while still being considered in control of the carrier?
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Oct 24, 2014 17:18
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That frame usage is a tad dishonest because I believe SA2k is right - the ball moved a hair before his arm touched the ground. San Diego is scary to me. Miami needs to stop that incredible passing team, which might be a huge issue. Luckily we have a tune up game in JAX but they are riding high so we can't look past them. Getting dion Jordan up to speed for San Diego will be huge
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Oct 24, 2014 17:19
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It bothers me that Mike Carey was an NFL ref as recently as a year ago and is considered the TV expert yet if what Toaster Beef says is true was completely wrong on the rule since he kept talking about the elbow and never mentioned the forearm as far as I can remember How many refs actually know the correct rule?
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Oct 24, 2014 17:20
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Toaster Beef posted:
The point is that the ball MOVES. If it had been ruled down by contact I don't think you can call it a fumble, but I certainly don't think you can REVERSE the call of a fumble on the field
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Oct 24, 2014 17:21
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ROSS MY SALAD posted:The point is that the ball MOVES. If it had been ruled down by contact I don't think you can call it a fumble, but I certainly don't think you can REVERSE the call of a fumble on the field I'm totally willing to admit that, yeah. I don't think there's enough there to reverse a call. I just think it wasn't a fumble. Like, I think the right call was eventually made but I don't think they had enough to overturn the wrong call.
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Oct 24, 2014 17:22
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Intruder posted:It bothers me that Mike Carey was an NFL ref as recently as a year ago and is considered the TV expert yet if what Toaster Beef says is true was completely wrong on the rule since he kept talking about the elbow and never mentioned the forearm as far as I can remember every other ref I've ever seen do the TV expert role has known about it when it had come up, as far as I can remember. I'm going to assume Carey just blows and is dumb, especially considering he was the dude who had that awful "what we can't see is the bad intention behind the touch" line.
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Oct 24, 2014 17:31
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It's clearly not a fumble and it alarms me that Mike Carey was ever an NFL ref when he's wrong half the time on TV. Maybe he's better when he's closer to the action on the field, because he was actually my favorite ref before he retired.
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Oct 24, 2014 17:31
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AAA DOLFAN posted:That frame usage is a tad dishonest because I believe SA2k is right - the ball moved a hair before his arm touched the ground. "That frame usage is dishonest because I think otherwise" I think the problem here is when do you call a ball loose? If you call it loose and loss of control the instant the ball moves even a little, then you could call it a fumble. Watching it, to me, he has his hands on the ball and it doesn't genuinely pop truly loose until his forearm is well down. The ball moves early, but it doesn't feel loose for a while later. I don't think he genuinely loses control until his arm is down, even if the ball was moving a bit earlier. Febreeze fucked around with this message at 17:39 on Oct 24, 2014 |
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Oct 24, 2014 17:32
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Febreeze posted:I think the problem here is when do you call a ball loose? If you call it loose and loss of control the instant the ball moves even a little, then you could call it a fumble. Watching it, to me, he has his hands on the ball and it doesn't genuinely pop truly loose until his forearm is well down. The ball moves early, but it doesn't feel loose for a while later. I think it straddles the line but his arm and hands are still holding the ball pretty tight despite the movement until later. farthouse bros  But seriously, this. It has to be accepted that a ball's going to move somewhat when there's a dude clawing at it. It's hard to place an exact marker where a ball actually falls out of the carrier's control, but we can't rely on slight movement to be indicative of it.
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Oct 24, 2014 17:37
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Febreeze posted:"That frame usage is dishonest because I think otherwise" It's situational. The ball starts rotatting specifically because the defender's hand is ripping it loose. The rotation of the ball, caused by the defender's rip, starts before the forearm comes down. I think a slight amount of movement can be considered losing control if the movement is directly caused by a defensive motion. You have to look at every case seperately
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Oct 24, 2014 17:37
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Febreeze posted:"That frame usage is dishonest because I think otherwise" You're misquoting me and rightfully misunderstood what I was saying. Ball moved before the hand down. Now the opinion part? That's "what is considered a movement" in this regard? For me, it's the fact it moved as a result of the defender hitting him before he was "down", as explained in the rules. Using that frame is dishonest because it's used under the assumption that the ball had not moved yet. Gif would be best. But it made no actual difference so alas The officiating was just so bad though. Like really bad. Ah well such Is life. Denver will steam roll most AFC teams Amy Pole Her fucked around with this message at 17:43 on Oct 24, 2014 |
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Oct 24, 2014 17:40
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ROSS MY SALAD posted:Mathews played against the Cardinals and like two plays against Seattle denver has a better rush d than both of those teams 
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Oct 24, 2014 17:41
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I see SA2k's point on the defender having a role but I'm not sure if that's in the rulebook or not. If it is, then I switch my stance. But if it's not I think it's too close.  While the ball is moving, it really doesn't feel like it's no longer controlled till his thumb starts moving, and by that time his arm is down. It almost seems like he has a good grip on the ball until the point of the football passes his thumb, and that's when it pops out. ROSS MY SALAD posted:I guess the crux of the matter is where you think it should be ruled a fumble. When the ball starts moving, or when it pops out. I'm biased in this situation so no one should listen to me, I'm probably dumb I guess what we need to know is what the official stance is. I always thought a fumble was on total loss of control, and it doesn't look like that happens till his elbow is down. Febreeze fucked around with this message at 17:54 on Oct 24, 2014 |
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Oct 24, 2014 17:48
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Febreeze posted:But if it's not I think it's too close. Well in that case they should probably have stuck with the ruling on the field, which was a fumble.
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Oct 24, 2014 17:49
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Febreeze posted:I see SA2k's point on the defender having a role but I'm not sure if that's in the rulebook or not. If it is, then I switch my stance. I guess the crux of the matter is where you think it should be ruled a fumble. When the ball starts moving, or when it pops out. I'm biased in this situation so no one should listen to me, I'm probably dumb
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Oct 24, 2014 17:51
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After review, the bullet which struck President Kennedy was the same bullet that struck Governor Connally and was fired from the Texas Schoolbook Depository. There was no second shooter. The ruling on the field is a lone gunman.
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Oct 24, 2014 17:52
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The jolt caused by his forearm hitting the ground with a grown man on top of him could've also contributed to it ultimately popping out rather than just jostling around in his possession. Calling it a fumble when it "starts moving" is way too open to interpretation.
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Oct 24, 2014 17:57
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If the Chargers had won handily we wouldn't even be arguing about this dumb non-fumble because the OP wouldn't have been a big baby and named the thread after it. Instead here we are. There are like half a dozen terrible calls and non-calls every single game and if you're going to be a big salty baby over them even when your team was otherwise shellacked then you're going to have a bad time because officiating isn't going to magically get better anytime soon.
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Oct 24, 2014 18:23
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rrrrrrrrrrrt posted:If the Chargers had won handily we wouldn't even be arguing about this dumb non-fumble because the OP wouldn't have been a big baby and named the thread after it. Instead here we are. There are like half a dozen terrible calls and non-calls every single game and if you're going to be a big salty baby over them even when your team was otherwise shellacked then you're going to have a bad time because officiating isn't going to magically get better anytime soon. You're talking about the guy who wrote a big weepy letter addressed to Ed "Guns" Hochuli.
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Oct 24, 2014 18:27
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rrrrrrrrrrrt posted:If the Chargers had won handily we wouldn't even be arguing about this dumb non-fumble because the OP wouldn't have been a big baby and named the thread after it. Instead here we are. There are like half a dozen terrible calls and non-calls every single game and if you're going to be a big salty baby over them even when your team was otherwise shellacked then you're going to have a bad time because officiating isn't going to magically get better anytime soon. Well you're dumb because it was a pretty big moment in the game. If it was a fumble, that gives SD the ball with crazy good field position and more importantly Peyton on the bench.
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Oct 24, 2014 18:28
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I feel like there were 2-3 other bad calls that favored Denver
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Oct 24, 2014 18:30
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Pron on VHS posted:I feel like there were 2-3 other bad calls that favored Denver I thought the defensive holding on the Weddle interception was really iffy Edit: And the non call on Gates in the end zone that was clear DPI
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Oct 24, 2014 18:33
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Yeahhhh it was the Weddle call, I thought that was much worse than the no fumble which was a really close one
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Oct 24, 2014 18:40
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excidium posted:Well you're dumb because it was a pretty big moment in the game. If it was a fumble, that gives SD the ball with crazy good field position and more importantly Peyton on the bench. Mmhmm. Yep. That correct non-call was a big moment; however, I feel it was eclipsed by other big moments. Such as the Broncos scoring 5 touchdowns pretty easily.
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Oct 24, 2014 18:41
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rrrrrrrrrrrt posted:Mmhmm. Yep. That correct non-call was a big moment; however, I feel it was eclipsed by other big moments. Such as the Broncos scoring 5 touchdowns pretty easily. Yep, we sure did lose. No need to be a dick for no reason.
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Oct 24, 2014 18:44
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Jesus, the chargers lost because they had no loving running game and they couldn't keep denver off the field. But I know it feels good to blame the refs and all
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Oct 24, 2014 19:43
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Withnail posted:Jesus, the chargers lost because they had no loving running game and they couldn't keep denver off the field. But I know it feels good to blame the refs and all There is a difference between disagreeing with calls and saying that a team lost because of those calls. They might have changed the game, they might not have. The Chargers lost because Denver thoroughly outplayed them
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Oct 24, 2014 19:50
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Jesus christ what the gently caress are you idiots doing discussing the game and effects of what happened in the game in the thread about discussing the game and effects of what happened in the game.
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Oct 24, 2014 20:09
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Fresh take rrrrrrrrrt great job regulating us now hang up and listen By hang "up" I mean yourself
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Oct 24, 2014 20:19
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AAA DOLFAN posted:Fresh take rrrrrrrrrt great job regulating us now hang up and listen 
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Oct 24, 2014 20:25
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You'd think we'd learn complaining about the refs is dumb because everybody dumps on the fans of the screwed team until it's their turn then they forget all about that because were dumb fans. That said, Golden Tate made that catch 
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Oct 24, 2014 20:27
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The refs made all the right calls hth
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Oct 24, 2014 20:35
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AAA DOLFAN posted:Fresh take rrrrrrrrrt great job regulating us now hang up and listen it's rrrrrrrrrrrt not rrrrrrrrrt geez learn how to spell
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Oct 24, 2014 21:23
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DO YALL WANT A HAM posted:I was at the game and near the end of the 4th quarter during a timeout, they showed Aqib Talib on the jumbotron dancing to "Jump Around", which naturally got the entire stadium excited. As soon as the timeout was over and the Broncos lined up at the line of scrimmage, Peyton frantically gestured for the crowd to be quiet (the jumbotron briefly showed Talib doing the same thing). Alas, they still got a false start, which lead to Peyton throwing a tantrum. If you watch the video, you can hear Peyton drop the f-bomb at 00:21
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Oct 24, 2014 21:28
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Toaster Beef posted:
uh this uh gif is uh uh
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Oct 24, 2014 21:31
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Eifert Posting posted:Holy poo poo that concussion. Fire someone. Look at this e-doctor! Hey doc I got a shoulder stinger, can you immediately write me a scrip for concussion meds and Fibromyalgia pills over the internet? You guy do know that stingers can gently caress you up bad for 3 seconds and be fine immediately afterwards, right? Jesus christ. Look at how he took both hits, right on the shoulder. You guys ever had a stinger? They loving hurt like mad but it's not a concussion.
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Oct 24, 2014 21:38
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Earthy Ape Unit posted:Look at this e-doctor! "I give a hot gay gently caress what congress says, legalize weed now dude!" Goku said before slamming down the phone
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Oct 24, 2014 21:42
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Earthy Ape Unit posted:Look at this e-doctor! This This right here Don't do this
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Oct 24, 2014 21:42
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Intruder posted:This he's a really lovely gimmick account so you might as well just give him his weekly ban
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Oct 24, 2014 21:43
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Intruder posted:This Intruder is a cool dude
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Oct 24, 2014 21:43
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