|
There's actually very little in the Bible about hell, and everything translated to 'hell' is referring to a metaphorical trash fire or something similar. I think "eternal fire" is used once but there's no reason to assume a fire that burns eternally also burns without destroying. The Parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man is usually pointed to as backing up the concept of hell, but parables aren't meant to be taken literally.
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 18:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 18, 2024 03:09 |
|
|
there should be some sort of rule where if you look at a post and have to ask yourself why someone typed so many retarded words that poster gets probated
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 18:51
|
|
|
i havent read the thread but posts like this:Germstore posted:There's actually very little in the Bible about hell, and everything translated to 'hell' is referring to a metaphorical trash fire or something similar. I think "eternal fire" is used once but there's no reason to assume a fire that burns eternally also burns without destroying. The Parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man is usually pointed to as backing up the concept of hell, but parables aren't meant to be taken literally. and the op
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 18:52
|
|
|
i'm pretty confident as a member of a species that is barely removed from poo poo-flinging monkeys that i fully comprehend Justice and that if there is a universal creator of any kind that it would pretty much agree with me about stuff
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 18:56
|
|
|
hell is earth, death is heaven
|
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 18:57
|
|
|
Even if you dont believe this poo poo, what bothers me is that people who believe in a god that sentences people to an infinite lifetimes of torture for trivial poo poo (what they do with their dicks, which version of a religious subtype of a religious version they believe, what they think in their heads in private) and also sentences people to this is "infinitely benevolent and merciful". Bittch, if god had a picogram of mercy in his body, hell wouldn't even be a concept
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 20:13
|
|
|
The Protagonist posted:This assumes meaning has to derive from the outside, that its some imposition and not, in fact, the creation of the living observer as is the concept of meaning itself. We make our own meaning. Your subjective personal opinions about meaning are objectively meaningless. The point about judgment and punishment being necessary for morality still applies. Suppose you decide your meaning is to molest children, and then you do, and worse still you are never caught. Without an external moral arbiter you're just another existentialist ubermensch who created his own meaning. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 20:48
|
|
|
Ocean Book posted:lol if you dont experience a visceral joy from acting virtuously Virtuously like giving to the poor or virtuously like slaughtering ideological opponents?
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 20:50
|
|
|
Agag posted:Virtuously like giving to the poor or virtuously like slaughtering ideological opponents? there's a difference? virtue is whatever makes you feel self-important
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:24
|
|
|
its socially acceptable because its part of our culture (us is america because everyone else is an other)
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:37
|
|
|
This is actually a really cool topic, thanks OP. Same with ghosts. People are like LOL GHOSTS AREN"T REAL YOU IDIOT *refuses to go upstairs of funeral home * *is 45*
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:37
|
|
|
Lol if youre sucker enough to buy into the concept of a subject
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:41
|
|
|
Jastiger posted:This is actually a really cool topic, thanks OP. Same with ghosts. People are like LOL GHOSTS AREN"T REAL YOU IDIOT Like half the people I meet believe in ghosts if it comes up for some reason. really makes you think
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:49
|
|
|
Fishy Joe posted:Like half the people I meet believe in ghosts if it comes up for some reason. really makes you think hm yes
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:51
|
|
|
Do people ever achieve Nirvana while sitting around in Purgatory and just blink out existence? God all like "ok u can come out now" and there's nobody there. must really burn his crumpets
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:54
|
|
|
Fishy Joe posted:Like half the people I meet believe in ghosts if it comes up for some reason. really makes you think seriously I work nights at a place that is "haunted", and almost every guest that comes there either wants to talk to me about ghosts I've seen, or straight-up wants me to give them a "ghost-tour". I just play along to get tha big tipz $$$ Even my fellow day-shift co-workers tell me that they couldnt do my job because theyre afraid the ghosts would rape them to death or somethimg. I've been there 2 years and havent been haunted yet so ?????? People are generally idiots STOP THE PRESSES
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:55
|
|
|
Fishy Joe posted:Like half the people I meet believe in ghosts if it comes up for some reason. really makes you think not only this but even out of those people who claim they don't believe in ghosts a lot of them are still afraid to touch a ouija board i believe you could probably scare a lot of people by running around with a ouija board and making whoosh noises and saying things in a creepy voice like "wanna play?"
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:57
|
|
|
Obligatory Handle posted:I’ll make a bet with you. Two guys break into an atheist’s home. He has a little atheist wife and two little atheist daughters. Two guys break into his home and tie him up in a chair and gag him. And then they take his two daughters in front of him and rape both of them and then shoot them and they take his wife and then decapitate her head off in front of him. And then they can look at him and say, "Isn’t it great that I don’t have to worry about being judged? Isn’t it great that there’s nothing wrong with this? There’s no right or wrong, now is it dude?” Could be worse. At least they didn't make his wife and kids look at your posting.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:09
|
|
|
Pitdragon posted:not only this but even out of those people who claim they don't believe in ghosts a lot of them are still afraid to touch a ouija board I went to a B&B this weekend with the wife and one of the guys there literally said this. "I don't believe in ghosts" and rolled his eyes at the wives. "Oh! An Ouija board!" "Nope, I"m going to bed"
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:13
|
|
|
MyronGognitti posted:Hell is a metaphor. When somebody says "you're going to hell", you're not actually going to a firey place filled with devils, it means you're going down a dark path
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:51
|
|
|
Why is it that gorgeous Victorian mansions where a series of gruesome murders occurred are never on the market around me? I would gladly pay 500% less than the typical asking price and chill in da ghost mansion. I'd smoke a lot of weed so the ghosts would be all chill and down to play Mario kart
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 23:01
|
|
|
Oh, Skycake. Why are you so delicious?
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 23:21
|
|
|
What do theologians say about the existence of hell? Also how is being a theologian still an academic pursuit with teaching positions but me being an expert in LOTR lore and extended universe is just an enormous shame?
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 23:32
|
|
|
one half is serious posts and one half is joke posts but they're all bad posts
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 23:41
|
|
|
Agag posted:Virtuously like giving to the poor or virtuously like slaughtering ideological opponents? virtue has no meaning unless you define it for yourself.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:15
|
|
- hi
|
Fergus Mac Roich posted:Lol if youre sucker enough to buy into the concept of a subject literally the only thing ive been able to experience my entire life is my subjectivity so its really the only thing that makes sense to believe in
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:16
|
|
|
cams posted:supreme court justice antonin Scalia has said on several occasions that the biggest modern tragedy is that the devil has tricked so many people into not believing in God. He's Right
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:27
|
|
|
Are the showers in hell too hot or too cold? Or does it alternate between both?
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:37
|
|
|
Ocean Book posted:virtue has no meaning unless you define it for yourself. So its totally subjective, which is to say meaningless. Bolek posted:What do theologians say about the existence of hell? Christian theologian have a number of theories about it, the most common being the traditional "good/faithful go to Heaven, everyone else goes to Hell forever." Then there is view that hell is either temporary or doesn't exist at all, and the souls that aren't "saved" are simply cease to exist either when the person dies or at the end of the universe. Finally there is the view that everyone ultimately goes to Heaven, again either right away or at the end of the universe. LOTR is relatively new, give it some time and it might turn into a respectable academic discipline, assuming universities still exist in our horrific Mad Max future.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:45
|
|
|
Agag posted:So its totally subjective, which is to say meaningless. haha, serious lols at this noob
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:49
|
|
|
something i experience deeply at the core of my being has no meaning, because i am an idiot - an idiot
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:51
|
|
|
Thanks jewish cultural appropriation of Zoroastrianism while enslaved by the Persian Empire in antiquity.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:56
|
|
|
Ocean Book posted:haha, serious lols at this noob Ocean Book posted:something i experience deeply at the core of my being has no meaning, because i am an idiot Ocean Book feels strongly about his feelings.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:59
|
|
|
Ocean Book posted:something i experience deeply at the core of my being has no meaning, because i am an idiot meaning is a joke of a concept
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:59
|
|
|
Hamburger is a hotdog of a taco.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 01:00
|
|
|
The only reason you should be freaked out about hell is if you're a bad person that would go there if, in fact, it exists.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 01:45
|
|
|
Amarcarts posted:Questions for believers: Look, my entire theological background was pretty much that Painkiller videogame, which indicates Satan is a pretty big fan of theatre set-pieces and exotic firearms (who isn't?).
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 02:41
|
|
|
the people in the thread who were describing hell as distance from God or whatever are the correct ones, the fire and brimstone retards in America believe are just illiterate bumpkins Not that the true definition is any more valid tho but whatever
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 02:43
|
|
|
Agag posted:So its totally subjective, which is to say meaningless. It's a classic and understandable mistake to conflate "subjective" with "completely meaningless", especially in the case of morality, and especially if your worldview includes a supreme arbiter of justice. People (in this worldview) will often say that there can only be true justice if there is a singular, unchanging, resolute standard by which all moral acts are measured and judged. And! The only thing that could possibly dictate such a standard would have to be very much like a God. Now, first I want to address subjectivity. What is meant by subjectivity? Does it truly mean "arbitrary" or "meaningless"? No, those are often thought of as its components, but that is not what the word truly means. It means: having to do with the mind, internal, dealing with the subject of the experience. Let me ask you something: do you love your family? Or your friends? Or your partner, or whatever person you have in your life that you love? Is that love meaningless? No, in fact it means very much. But is it subjective? Well, it certainly isn't objective, correct? It is not a tangible, external thing. It depends entirely on the subject - i.e. you - experiencing it. So we can see that subjectivity is certainly not meaningless. But morals, those are far more important than love, right? Well, no, not really - both will influence strongly how you interact with others, but some will reason that love is far more localized; morals, it would seem, apply equally to all, so perhaps we need to give them a fair bit more weight within our discourse. Maybe you still feel morals have to be based on an objective standard to have any meaning, even though that's certainly not true for everything that influences our interpersonal interactions. So morals must be objective. And objective morals come from God. But, wait, what again were our working definitions of objective and subjective? Isn't God a subject? More like a mind than anything else, to quote C.S. Lewis? Is a moral proclamation suddenly objective just because the subject decreeing it is God? If morality is simply equivalent to "what God says", then it is still very much subjective - subjective to God, yes, but subjective nonetheless. It's essentially God's arbitrary opinion instead of ours (to use your conception of subjective here). So why listen to Him? Especially given his poor track record of homicide, genocide, and all the other Old Testament horrors which I am sure you are familiar with and that I don't need to enumerate here. Do we do what he says just because he's the biggest and strongest? Out of fear of reprisal? Fine, I guess, but does that really make our actions moral? I don't think in any other context anyone would argue that doing whatever the most powerful person says to do is moral. Maybe smart, or safe, but not moral. Of course, there's the other option in what I'm sure you recognize as the classic Euthyphro dilemma: that God Himself is beholden to a standard of morality, truly objective in this case, which he appeals to when making his decrees. But if God is just obeying a set of laws like the rest of us, that exist independent of Him and which he has no control over, why add God into the equation at all? Why not simply appeal to the objective standards ourselves, and bypass God? Do we need God to issue an anti-rape proclamation to know that rape is morally wrong? The truth is that morality is a complicated social science which has both objective and subjective components. If I stab my best friend in the stomach, for instance, he is hurt both objectively - there are physical wounds and scars - as well as subjectively - his ability to trust me is shaken and he feels betrayed - but the subjective components are no less real for being subjective, and they are certainly not meaningless. I hope you take some of my thoughts into account. GAINING WEIGHT... fucked around with this message at 03:15 on Mar 31, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 03:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 18, 2024 03:09 |
|
|
mdm posted:the people in the thread who were describing hell as distance from God or whatever are the correct ones, the fire and brimstone retards in America believe are just illiterate bumpkins Hell as a fiery torture pit goes back to Tertullian at least. Its an Early Church idea, but the specific details aren't important unless you're writing a metal album. The important point is that we are judged for our choices.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 03:20
|
|