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Poison, do you reply or pass?
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Apr 27, 2015 23:18
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| # ? Apr 18, 2024 09:45 |
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Sure, what the blue gently caress. I'll ante an Iron Body token.
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Apr 27, 2015 23:22
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No further Ante.
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Apr 28, 2015 04:32
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this update brought to you via tolly's phone! new pairs please
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Apr 28, 2015 04:56
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Tollymain posted:
Quoting so I don't have to flip between pages.
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Apr 28, 2015 05:11
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i'm going to be real here, that was a horrific misplay shadow  poison mushroom, i'm assuming you want to advance 1
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Apr 28, 2015 12:53
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5th Beat! Cadenza 15 Life Discard 1: Clockwork Drive Discard 2: Battery Press, Grapnel Burst Special: Rocket Press Token Pool:  Gaspar Geddon 5 Life Discard 1: Instanced Strike, Shot Discard 2: Gordian Dash Special: Blank Infinity    ~~~ -- ANTE -- Gaspar antes Grasp! His clone is placed in his current space! -- Cadenza antes an Iron Body token for Stun Immunity this beat! -- Gaspar passes! -- Cadenza passes!   -- REVEAL Cadenza   Gaspar Geddon   -- Gaspar is the active character this beat! -- START OF BEAT -- Gaspar retreats 1 or 2 spaces! He moves 1!  -- GASPAR CLONE ACTIVATION: -- Gaspar Clone reaches out with a Clone's Grasp! -- Clone's Grasp has a range of 1! It hits!  ON HIT: -- Gaspar Clone moves Cadenza 1! He pushes 1! -- Clone's Grasp has a power of 1! -- Cadenza has Soak 1! Cadenza has Stun Immunity! Cadenza is unharmed!  -- ACTIVE CHARACTER BEFORE ACTIVATING: -- Gaspar moves each of his Clones up to 2 spaces! Gaspar declines the movement! ACTIVATION: -- Gaspar unleashes a Cascading Burst! -- Cascading Burst has a range of 2~3! It hits!  ON HIT: -- Cascading Burst has a power of 2! -- Cadenza has Soak 1! Cadenza has Stun Immunity! Cadenza takes 1 damage, but it's unfazed! -- REACTIVE CHARACTER BEFORE ACTIVATING: -- Cadenza advances 1 space! ACTIVATION: -- Cadenza lashes out with a Hydraulic Strike! -- Hydraulic Strike has a range of 1! It misses! -- END OF BEAT -- Gaspar Clone dissipates into nothing! -- RECYCLE Tollymain fucked around with this message at 01:22 on Apr 30, 2015 |
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Apr 28, 2015 12:58
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I only have one Iron Body token left.  And should Battery Press be in discard 1? I forget how cancels work.
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Apr 28, 2015 15:23
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I believe that PM should be at 14. My clone shot did one, knocking her down to soak 2, and then I struck for 4, dealing two damage. Also, we should both be a space to the left. Not that it matters, as the game likely ends this beat haha. Shadow225 fucked around with this message at 16:20 on Apr 28, 2015 |
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Apr 28, 2015 16:18
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There needs to be a mix of  and  .
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Apr 28, 2015 22:49
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Nah, but I think I just got lucky in a couple places. I actually spent most of the game terrified of a Replicated Bladestorm. Edit: I also think not picking Inception as your finisher was a mistake. You could have taunted out Clockwork, then hit me hard.
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Apr 28, 2015 22:50
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Since the game will likely be pretty short, I'm going to post a run down of my thoughts behind each move, as well as my thoughts on the match-up, period. Both of those things will be addressed for sure. I think it would be cool if we got you/Tolly/GO/any other spectators to do the same or comment on our analyses. The one thing I will fight you on; it wasn't luck. You've played well up until this point and deserve to take credit for it.
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Apr 28, 2015 23:03
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The one move I'm genuinely proud of is taunting out your Dash into a Grapnel Burst. Forced you to get in close with me without any real escape.
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Apr 28, 2015 23:05
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Also, if you're going to do a play-by-play of thoughts, then it's only reasonable that I will, too.
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Apr 28, 2015 23:15
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Shadow225 posted:I believe that PM should be at 14. My clone shot did one, knocking her down to soak 2, and then I struck for 4, dealing two damage. Also, we should both be a space to the left. Soak isn't depleted by attacks. That's why Gaspar's generally low Power compares so unfavorably against Cadenza's Hydraulic and Clockwork styles. Also, your clone's Shot had a priority of 2, compared to your Instanced Strike's priority of 4. Sorry 
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Apr 29, 2015 01:57
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Shadow225 posted:Also, we should both be a space to the left.
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Apr 29, 2015 02:56
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fixed
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Apr 29, 2015 03:07
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My bad! I'll send in my attacks in a few hours after I crush this final.
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Apr 29, 2015 03:23
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hope you did good on the final, shadow! poison, do you ante an iron body token or pass?
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Apr 29, 2015 06:34
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I originally submitted an illegal attack pair, so I send the correct base. My apologies. Thanks for the well wishes!
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Apr 29, 2015 06:39
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Congrats on acing your final! Ante my final Iron Body token.
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Apr 29, 2015 14:34
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No further ante.
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Apr 29, 2015 17:32
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6th Beat! Cadenza 14 Life Discard 1: Hydraulic Strike Discard 2: Clockwork Drive Special: Rocket Press Token Pool: Empty Gaspar Geddon 5 Life Discard 1: Cascading Burst, Grasp Discard 2: Instanced Strike, Shot Special: Blank Infinity ~~~ -- ANTE -- Gaspar antes Drive! His clone is placed in his current space! -- Cadenza passes! -- Gaspar passes! -- REVEAL Cadenza   Gaspar Geddon   CANCEL! Cadenza  Gaspar Geddon   -- Gaspar's attack has a power of N/A! Gaspar Clone dissipates into nothing and Drive returns to his hand! -- Gaspar is the active character this beat! -- START OF BEAT -- Cadenza retreats 1 or 2 spaces! It moves 2! -- ACTIVE CHARACTER BEFORE ACTIVATING: -- Gaspar switches places with one of his clones! Gaspar doesn't have any Clones to switch with! ACTIVATION: -- Gaspar breaks into a Gordian Dash! AFTER ACTIVATING: -- Gaspar moves 1, 2, or 3 spaces! He advances 3! -- REACTIVE CHARACTER ACTIVATION: -- Cadenza unleashes a Battery Burst! -- Battery Burst has a range of 2~3! It misses! -- END OF BEAT -- Cadenza has +4 Priority next beat! -- RECYCLE Tollymain fucked around with this message at 03:59 on Apr 30, 2015 |
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Apr 30, 2015 01:24
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Oh, nice. And you got your Dash back.
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Apr 30, 2015 01:25
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Continuing my role as the local neighborhood headache, should my clone have attacked first? It had a priority of 5, and I had a priority of 3.
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Apr 30, 2015 01:33
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They lose priority ties. If it has a higher priority, it still goes first.
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Apr 30, 2015 01:33
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Is it tied with me in this case? I've never played with more than 2 characters or character-like entities on board. You have me resolving the attack before the clone here, which is where I'm thrown off.
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Apr 30, 2015 01:39
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i think you're confused. the clone's attack went first. the only way the clone has a priority tie with you is if your priorities are equal. if it had a priority of 3, that would be a priority tie (and then it would activate after you because it loses those ties)
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Apr 30, 2015 01:43
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You're right, I am confused. I just saw it. I'll get you something for being a headache this entire game.
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Apr 30, 2015 01:45
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noooooooo don't worry about it
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Apr 30, 2015 01:47
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new pairs please
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Apr 30, 2015 02:55
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Cancel seems slightly good against me. This won't be pretty.
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Apr 30, 2015 03:14
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I'll retreat two.
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Apr 30, 2015 03:42
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shadow, how far do you want to move? E: actually i'm gonna assume 3 unless you state otherwise Tollymain fucked around with this message at 03:59 on Apr 30, 2015 |
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Apr 30, 2015 03:53
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7th Beat! Cadenza 14 Life Discard 1: Battery Burst Discard 2: Hydraulic Strike Special: Rocket Press Token Pool: Empty Gaspar Geddon 5 Life Discard 1: Gordian Dash Discard 2: Replicated Bladestorm, Cascading Burst, Grasp Special: Blank Infinity ~~~ -- ANTE -- Gaspar passes! -- Cadenza passes! -- REVEAL Cadenza   Gaspar Geddon  CLASH! Cadenza Gaspar Geddon  -- Cadenza is the active character this beat! -- ACTIVE CHARACTER ACTIVATION: -- Cadenza reaches out with a Clockwork Grasp! -- Clockwork Grasp has a range of 1! It hits! ON HIT: -- Clockwork Grasp has a power of 5! -- Gaspar has Stun Guard 5! Gaspar takes 5 damage and is knocked out! KNOCKOUT! CADENZA WINS! Tollymain fucked around with this message at 05:10 on Apr 30, 2015 |
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Apr 30, 2015 03:59
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It's been a fun ride. I'll make my effort post after I'm officially dead.
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Apr 30, 2015 04:12
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Clash! Please submit new bases!
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Apr 30, 2015 04:47
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That's game! Good game to you both. Let's hear them mortem posts
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Apr 30, 2015 05:11
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Good game PM! Thanks for hosting Tolly! Okay, so a running theme in this fight was miscues for me. Everything from misunderstanding rules, to not realizing board position, to committing to illegal moves, and then changing them afterward. Initial thoughts: Cadenza has a lot of stats everywhere except priority, its one weakness, and to a lesser extent range. This tells me that I should probably play as evasive a battle as possible. However, I felt that Cadenza had more tools to close the gap than I had tools to play keep away, so I decided to try and sit down on it, and trade with PM. I was going to be aggressive with my clones in the hopes of catching stuns using my superior priority. A few flaws will be discovered here as we play, especially in Beat 2. Beat 1: I assumed that you wanted to get aggressive here like the heavyweight you are. So, wouldn't it catch you off guard if I got in your face instead? I went with Recursive Stike to that I could close the distance on you, and ante'd a Shot behind me to attack you at distance. Problem being that I misread Recursive, so I told Tolly the wrong movement, and I whiffed on the attack. I assumed I would either stun you, or force a token, so I wasn't worried about your damage. Beat 2: So two realizations here: 1. Cadenza hit so much harder than I anticipated. 2. I've been playing Ante wrong the entire time I've played the game. This made me about 90% sure that I wouldn't win. I assumed that we anted simultaneously, so I thought I could either bluff out your tokens with my position, or smash through with Replicating~. With this in mind, I thought that I could stun you with my Grasp, and keep you in the corner. You ante'd the token, and ensured that I couldn't stun you, so I just kept you in the corner. I didn't expect you to come rushing out at the end of beat. Beat 3: Your soul read! I ante'd the clone in hopes of bluffing you off my dash. I used Gordian to get it back. You called it well, so I got in your face to prepare for the next attack... Beat 4: So, I have you in the corner here. You put yourself in the corner with an attack that would have punished running away from you, so I assume you have a plan. You were either going to get past me or lobotomize me. So, I decide to go for the biggest punish I could have. I decided to stun you and go for broke. I was going to ante the Shot with Replicating Bladestorm to keep you from dashing past and stun you before you could hit me. I realized that my finisher wasn't that great, and if this idea worked out, ripping your most powerful attack or dash out of your hand was a decent idea and would have more impact than Blank Inifinty. So, I canceled to rip it from your hand. All went well...until you ante'd the token. I assumed that you wanted to save it for a reactionary activation, so I didn't expect you to use it here at all. I'm pretty dejected, and realize the duel is over before I even send the next attack pair. I decide to save the :masterstroke: for later, and go with Instanced Strike because I was 1 space away, and my other options have movement which I probably needed. Beat 5: I'm struggling with ideas to stay alive here. I assume that you are going to use your last token and just end the game, and there's not a lot that I could do here. After a few rules messages to Tolly, I found a plan. If I and my clone have the same priority, I'll attack, then my clone attacks. So, if I ante Grasp, and use Cascading Strike, I can hit you, move my clone to the other side of you, then the clone will grasp you over itself, putting you out of distance of any of your potential attacks. I very large problem with this: after sending my attack pairs, I realized I don't have strike anymore. It's down to either Burst or Bladestorm. If I Bladestorm, I effectively concede the duel, but if I Burst, I can maybe live longer? My clone's grasp is quicker than any combo you have, so it will hit first. My plan is to put you in the corner, then burst away. I considered moving the clone behind you as in the Strike plan, but I can hit you with Burst with this method. Beat 6: So, I survived. Yay. I got my dash back here, which is what I assume PM has me on, so let's subvert that. She has no more tokens, so I can stun things. I still have to work around stun guard, including the Press SG of 6. I only have Drive, Bladestorm, and Dash, so I ante Drive, Replicating Bladestorm, and cross her up to stun no matter what she plays. Unless she plays a cancel, apparently. Grade A cancel, really good against me. I literaly only have Dash left, so I Gordian Dash to give me some options next beat. Beat 7: I'm pretty SOL here. The Battery of last beat means PM is going to beat me in any way. I go with my fastest pair, Instanced Drive, in case something goes awry and I get the jump. We clash, and I play strike but it literally doesn't matter as she can grasp me and do a Zangief Spinning Atomic Buster to end the game. After game impressions: I need to learn the rules. I feel really bad for putting Tolly, and Gutter before him/her through this haha. Cadenze hits like a rock, so I should have stopped trying to trade. I need to calm down on anteing my bases as it limits me way too much down the road. Beats 3 and 4 were the deciding beats, especially since my Cancel didn't work as planned. I started to think of some clever tricks midway through the game, but it was too little too late. I don't think there's a universe in which I win this match-up. Cadenza impressions: The entire reason we're having this vendetta in the first place is because I thought Cadenza was a boring design, and PM wanted to prove me wrong in Gaspar impressions: The lasting impression is that the character conveys the idea of being a clone man very well. I actually felt that I was coordinating attacks from multiple angles to disorient the opponent, and I appreciate that. I don't completely understand the theory of the character. Am I supposed to play aggressively or keep away? He only seemed to have 1 extra positioning option, so I assumed aggressive. I'm also confused as to how often I should clone. It gives me an offensive advantage, but leaves me much more limited afterward. I don't know. He has vanilla priority for the most part, and the big sticking point is that he's weak. Against opponents without soak or stun guard, this is fine, as he and his clones can stun you into oblivion as he whittles away at your health. Against beefier opponents, I think he will struggle to do his damage or stun. As Tolly pointed out, he does have some tools to cut through soak and stun guard, so I think he'll be alright against any heavyweight not named Cadenza. I'd like to see some higher level players play him, as I'd like to think that he's a character with a high mechanical ceiling, rather than a mediocre character. Match-up impressions: I don't see a lot of ways that Gaspar wins this one. Cadenza is a train made entirely of stun guard and soak, so getting in is difficult. In the situations where you set yourself up to stun it, it can activate a token and smash you anyway with the exception of Replicating~. I don't think you can play keep away as it has more tools to keep up with you than you can keep away from it, and you don't have the defense to trade too many times. Or course I played terribly, but it wouldn't surprise me to see Cadenza as a 7/3 or even 8/2 favorite in this match up. Poison Mushroom impressions: You stomped me this go around. Combined with just barely losing while playing a gross mismatch as one of the worst characters, I would gladly pin you as the better player. That being said, as long as we can find mods, I'll gladly have Sisyphian battles with you. I'd love to have feedback on any of this from PM, Tolly, or anyone in the peanut gallery. There's so much diversity and strategy in the game, but not a lot of theory crafting. I love hearing outside opinions, especially from better players.
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Apr 30, 2015 05:14
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| # ? Apr 18, 2024 09:45 |
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I think playing Cadenza really gives a different view of his strong conveyance. It is a character with a small number of things he does very well, at the cost of being incredibly predictable. It's an unstoppable machine with a few glaring omissions in its design. Cadenza keeps coming, over and over again, until it just doesn't any more. Tolly and I were talking, and we decided that Cesar is Terminator 1's T-800, but Cadenza is the Terminator 2 T-800. You shoot him and he doesn't give a poo poo but you knocked off a bit of his skin. By the time you lose your third Iron Body token, you're just the upper half of a robot riding on a gear. I will go into more detail and also do my turn by turn once I'm not on mobile.
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Apr 30, 2015 05:41
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