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Sexual Aluminum
Jun 21, 2003

is made of candy
Soiled Meat


StarDrive 2 is a 4X strategy game under development by Zero Sum Games where the goal is to build a space empire. Starting with a single planet and a small number of space-worthy vessels, players forge out into the galaxy: exploring space, colonizing planets, negotiating with aliens and fighting enemies. Stardrive 2 features a mix of turn based strategy, real-time space battles, and turn-based tactical ground combat.

(With info shamelessly stolen from the wiki) I didn't see a post on this game, but StarDrive 2 is one guy's take on a modern day version of Master of Orion 2. This game is really, really, close to MOO2, I am talking quasi legally actionable close. Several of the menu's are exactly like MOO2, just with updated and modern graphics. If you are like me, and really love the gameplay of MOO2, but can't deal with the ancient UI and screens, then this game should be right up your alley.

So what's cool about it? Well, you can customize ships, races, research tons of neat tech, blow up sentient marijuana plants, strap laser beams to dinosaurs and lead them into battle, and even zombie plague bomb other planets. Overall, good times.

What races are there? Can I be an anime?

No. Yes. Well, kinda if you like bears.

There is nine major factions in the game, representing ten races. These races are trying to forge mighty empires amongst the stars, and win the game.



Boring old humans. They aren't Starfleet, I swear.

The United Federation is a corporate military organization, formed by the various governments on Earth to represent humanity as a whole. Human history has had its ups and downs, as humans have equal capacity for cruelty and kindness. While humans are intelligent, the United Federation encourages a sense of human exceptionalism which can border on naivety. Human workers are industrious, although human tendencies towards corruption hamper productivity. Above all humans value prosperity, and so they are primarily traders rather than warmongers. However, they have had a long history of war and so are quite prepared should it come to that.

Blah blah blah, vanilla race for vanilla players. Honestly, the only thing they have going for them is they are lead by this suave motherfucker right here:



Riker's got nothing on this guy. Overall, humans build decent ships, have decent troops, and research. However, they are corrupt, and get less cash from taxes. A decent, if bland, race.



Cordrazine are very large molluscs who possess a soft inner body surrounded by a hard outer shell. They have a single large eye in the front-center of their bodies. Cordrazine are totally immobile and as such are reliant on their strong mind control pheremones to force enslaved races to do their bidding. Cordrazine appear to be extremely vain and self-centered, moreso than even the Chukk. The chief slave race of the Cordrazine are the Owlwoks, who are native to the Cordrazine homeworld and are hopelessly enslaved. Owlwoks do virtually all work in Cordrazine society, including farming, manufacturing, research, fighting, flying and espionage.

Everything you do as this race are as the Owlwoks. Think Owl Humanoids with rambo a bandanna.



That's an Owlwok. Horray for the slave race! Cordazine's excel at using their slaves to grow food and build stuff. They also start with the slaver tech, which lets you have captives. They aren't the fastest breeders, being space clams and all.



I know you have probably played 4x games before, but have you ever played 4x games... AS WEED?

The Pollop race evolved on Sporl, a swampy, forested planet in Polmar system. Due to their plant physiology, Pollops utilize sunlight to convert energy into nutrients through the use of photosynthesis. Pollops navigate the world using their long tentacles, but are also able to put down more permanent roots. Female Pollops appear to have brightly coloured leaves, while males are green. Some Pollop Elders are said to have roots that go all the way to core of Sporl.

Pollops are perhaps the friendliest race ever to travel the stars. Until technological advancement, Pollops were prey on their homeworld and so they shy away from physical combat and are reluctant to go to war. The Pollops want nothing more than to spread to other worlds, basking in sunlight, putting down roots, spreading seeds and playing music.



Pollops are good at being spies, (did that potted plant just move?) and reproducing. They also don't need as much food as everyone else. They do suck at ground based combat, which makes sense. Who ever lost a fight to a ficus?



Chukk are insectoid species, with an exoskeleton. Mounted on their long necks, they have a small head with several eyes and large teeth surrounded by mandibles. Chukk can range in colour from red to yellow to orange and pale brown. Their two main limbs have four large clawed digits each. The Chukk lifecycle begins with young Chukk hatching into a larval stage, before finally morphing into their adult form. Chukk are a subterranean species, and many spend their entire lives underground. As a result, they are perfectly at home in the cramped interiors of spacecraft and are able to easily climb up walls and along ceilings - even without gravity.

Despite their disgusting bodies, Chukk can be outwardly charming, though they are not nearly as vain as the Cordrazine. However it would be unwise to trust this facade, as the Chukk lack any real sense of loyalty, only being kept in line by the use of force or the promise of riches. Piracy is a celebrated profession amongst the Chukk. They are naturally greedy and opportunistic, willing to kill and steal without a hint of remorse. However the Chukk are not foolish, and often recognize that discretion is the better part of valour.



Chukk breed really fast, being humanoid roaches. They also have some of the best ships in the game, and since they live underground, can cram more population on a planet. They balance this with a lovely homeworld and everyone retches when they see you, so gg trying to use diplomacy.



The Kulrathi are a dominate species with warp-capable ships. Their home planet, Tor, is located in the Rathi system; they are ruled by a government known as the "Kulrathi Shogunate", a feudal system where authority is determined by oaths of allegiance, and as such honour is very important to them. An important concept in Kulrathi society is the dao, the way of life. Whether warriors, poets or craftsmen, Kulrathi seek perfection in all they do.

Physically, the Kulrathi are a mammalian race and have a very close similarity to the Earth bear, though they walk on two legs and have fully articulated, functional forelegs they use as arms. Their bodies are covered in blue-grey fur with reddish markings around the face. Perhaps due to evolving on a high-gravity world, or perhaps due to the dangerous wildlife of Tor, Kulrathi evolved to be massive and heavy-set. They stand much taller than most other races and have incredible strength. In combat, their sheer size along with razor sharp teeth and claws make them extremely formidable. Many Kulrathi warriors prefer melee combat and often carry huge swords into battle.



Samurai Space Bears. They start with a baller homeworld, building stuff, ground combat, and don't cause much pollution. Space bears aren't that good at spying, and their ships are like flying bricks.



The Ralyeh are cephalopods who bear a strong resemblance to squid or cuttlefish. Their heads protrude forward from the body, with no real neck. They possess large forward-facing eyes on either side of heads and short feeder tentacles around their mouths. On a squat Ralyeh body is two legs and four arms which end in two grasping tentacles. The top two arms are larger, while the bottom two are shorter. Due to their aquatic nature, Ralyeh possess gills on their sides, and greatly value ocean planets.

Ralyeh society is highly religious, and Ralyeh sometimes refer to themselves as the Ralyeh Devoted, referring to their worship of the Elder God. The Elder God is a grisly diety whose scriptures revolve around inevitable doom and death. As a result, the Ralyeh tend to be quite morbid. They are also very warlike, willing to kill or convert the rest of the galaxy in the name of their god. There is some suggestion that the Elder God may in fact be an ancient space-faring race, whom they worship due to finding ancient Artifacts on Zek. The race is led by Acolyte Zar, who, after a vision from the Elder God, launched a bloody inquisition on Zek and looks to take his crusade to the stars.



Ia! Ia! Ralyeh Fhtagn! Mini Cthulhus in space. They can rock it on ocean planets, earn more taxes, and can use unique planetary resources easier than other races. They aren't that good at farming though.



Keep your pants on. They aren't Asari analogues.

Drayloks are around the same height as a Human, and possess two arms and two legs, but the similarities end there. Drayloks exhibit reptilian features such as pale scaly flesh, two slits for nostrils, and a jaw full of ragged teeth twisted into a skull-like grin. Early Drayloks used their large black eyes to mesmerize prey before attacking, while modern Drayloks have a natural gift for deception and take pleasure in outsmarting "inferior" races.

The Draylok Council is a body of ultra-wealthy nobles who control Draylok society and compete for power and influence. For them, violence, espionage and scheming are all part of a great game. The prospect of unlimited wealth to be found out in the galaxy has prompted the Drayloks to expand their horizons using the StarDrive. However being focused on espionage and monetary gain, they are less aggressive and warlike than some empires. When communicating with alien races, Drayloks utilize devices called "holo-chairs" which cause them to appear visually different, in order to better allow them to manipulate others. Their leaders wear large ceremonial headdresses. Religion is important in Draylok society, but is ultimately a means to an end, and Drayloks are not fanatical like the Ralyeh.



Psst, turn your holo-chair back on. Drayloks are the merchant race, and excel at diplomacy and spying. Their warriors are really bad in combat.



The Opteris is a sentient-machine race that resembles Earth insects. Though the Opteris are of average size for organisms in the universe, their physiology could not be further from average - the Opteris have metallic bodies, four eyes, four wings, and a system that allows for anti-gravity hovering and flight. Eschewing classic government systems, the Opteris functions with a hive-mind collective consciousness. Each Opteris drone is the sum total of Opteris knowledge. The Opteris are bent on wiping out all other species. The Hive is utterly without mercy, and will stop at nothing short of total galactic domination



Robot Bees with a spash of mass effect's reapers. Opteris don't breed, since they are robots. You build your population. Also, since they are robots, they are great at science and building stuff. Just don't ask one to farm or spy.



The Vulfar, sometimes called the Vulfen (individuals are sometimes referred to as "a vulf"), are a species with ships capable of faster-than-light travel. They come from the planet Vulfar in the Vater system, and are ruled over by a government known as the Vulfar Imperium. Just like the Humans and the Kulrathi, the Vulfar are a mammalian species which resemble the bats and wolves of Earth. They have four limbs, two eyes, and two large ears. Their bodies are covered with white fur, which provides a small amount of protection from physical damage.

The Vulfar are not a strong species like the Kulrathi; they have fundamentally depended on power in numbers and strategic combat, avoiding single combat whenever possible. The Ancient Vulfar hunted in packs and modern Vulfar society still has a pack structure in some ways, with unintelligent packs of Vulfar grunts being led by Vulfar Alphas: a much stronger breed. The Vulfar Imperium is extremely aggressive and seeks to dominate the galaxy. The Alphas who lead it are perfectly willing to sacrifice Vulfar grunts, and even each other, to achieve glory for the Imperium and for their personal gain, subjugating or exterminating any race who stands in their way.



Nazi Werewolves. Good fighters, fast breeders, solid workers, nice homeworld. Being dogs, they stink at researching tech and their ships are bleh.

But I am a special snowflake! I want to build my own race!



Kay.

Each good trait costs points, and each bad trait gives you points. everyone starts with 10 points baseline. Also, yes, you can make the MOO2 Create Skill race of doom. It's just as OP in this game.

Ok, what is gameplay like?

Here is the standard planet screen.



You can move population to various tasks, be it farming, production, or research. Money is earned from farming, and whatever your tax rate is. Taxes don't make people mad, but the higher your taxes, the less production your empire has.

You need to manage pollution, approval, population growth, and income on each planet. My only beef is the game won't tell you when a planet has gone through it's production queue, so you might spend a few turns wasting production on a planet.

Speaking of planets, there are a large variety, and you want to specialize each planet depending on it's traits. For example, some planets are Toxic, and aren't great for farming, but might be great for production. You can build freighter fleets to feed your research and production worlds as well, as long as you have a farm planet or two somewhere.

You can also recruit heroes who can manage your planets. Some come with their own ship you can use in combat too.

How does research work?



Just like MOO2, with a twist. There are research trees, and you can pick one tech from the tree, and you lock yourself out learning the others via research. You can still trade with other races for locked out tech.

The biggest difference is Special Projects. Certain events, special characters, space anomalies, or planetary traits will give you a special research project. These are techs that can be researched at the same time as your standard techs, you just choose how much of your research output is put toward basic research, and how much is devoted to special projects. Here is an example of a special project you get from a planet.



If you find and colonize a planet with Mega Fauna, you can get this special project. There a some projects that everyone gets, like derelict space crusers and strange asteroids, but most are based on the RNG seed you get.

[Knife goes in, guts come out. What is combat all about? [/b]

There are two types of combat, space and ground. Space combat occurs whenever ships meet, and one person wants to fight. Here is a screen.



You can tell your ships who to attack, where to move, etc. Just bear in mind that combat is based on ship layout, so stay at range, or fly close in, depending on your armament.

Ground combat is turn based, and you can do things like shoot, stab, deploy personal shields, use medkits, etc. Each action uses action points. If you do nothing, your points roll over to the next turn.



Ships? Can I customize?

Yep. Each race has their own hull, and you can fill the slots with whatever tech you have researched. Races also have a variety of basic templates too, but these usually suck.



Armor based bear ship.



Shield based bear ship.

I hear StarDrive 1 sucked and the creator was mean to backers and kicked puppies and screwed my mom. I'm not buying this!

I hear you. Don't support the studio if the guy if he rubs you the wrong way. However, it looks like the dev took a bunch of critique to heart and made the new version much better than StarDrive 1. The game seems LOTS more stable than the first version, and seems heads and tails better than the first one. This game has lots of charm, since the races are all distinct, and while my screen shots might not portray it, each has their own unique font and music that helps to drive home their distinctions.

If you want to play a modern day space 4x that is an awful lot like master of orion 2, try Stardrive 2.

Edit: drat it, forgot a tag. Can a kind mod give me a science tag or something?

Sexual Aluminum fucked around with this message at 05:22 on May 19, 2015

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Adam Bowen
Jan 6, 2003

This post probably contains a Rickroll link!
Just play MOO2.

thread over, cut here, etc.

AMooseDoesStuff
Dec 20, 2012
Are the space bears space furries?
Same for space wolves.
tia.

MrBims
Sep 25, 2007

by Ralp
The first game's thread was gassed and not allowed to come back because the creator took the money and ran without finishing the game and couldn't take the resulting criticism for having done so.

Don't buy this game.

Gyshall
Feb 24, 2009

Had a couple of drinks.
Saw a couple of things.

Adam Bowen posted:

Just play MOO2.

thread over, cut here, etc.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
what was the name of the early access EV:Nova clone that started with "star"

I thought that was Stardrive but I'm pretty sure it wasn't a 4X game so that can't be it, and it wasn't Starbound either.

Goatse James Bond
Mar 28, 2010

If you see me posting please remind me that I have Charlie Work in the reports forum to do instead

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

what was the name of the early access EV:Nova clone that started with "star"

I thought that was Stardrive but I'm pretty sure it wasn't a 4X game so that can't be it, and it wasn't Starbound either.

Star Citizen? :getin:

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.

GreyjoyBastard posted:

Star Citizen? :getin:

nah it was 2D and the thread was called "waste no part of the Buffalo II" or something like that

however i just remembered that very searchable thread title so will go see what that turns up!

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.
Starsector! it was called "Starfarer" when i played it which makes it even more confusing

bonds0097
Oct 23, 2010

I would cry but I don't think I can spare the moisture.
Pillbug

Tuxedo Catfish posted:

nah it was 2D and the thread was called "waste no part of the Buffalo II" or something like that

however i just remembered that very searchable thread title so will go see what that turns up!

Starsector

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Pillbug
I got hella burned on Stardrive 1. Has anyone played enough of this to say whether or not this one is actually finished and has all the poo poo that was promised for Stardrive 1? Also, info on the tech tree would be nice- I got to the end of the first game's tree and was like "That's it?"

Sexual Aluminum
Jun 21, 2003

is made of candy
Soiled Meat

Ugly In The Morning posted:

I got hella burned on Stardrive 1. Has anyone played enough of this to say whether or not this one is actually finished and has all the poo poo that was promised for Stardrive 1? Also, info on the tech tree would be nice- I got to the end of the first game's tree and was like "That's it?"

I played through 2 and thought it was decent. The endgame is kinda lacking, since there are no real victory conditions aside from when you say "Ok, I win." I suppose you can call the end when you research the pink wormholes, go through, and kill the Master of Orion.

I don't know much about the history of the designer, but the guy sounds like a shitheel. I didn't realize how many bridges he burned when I made this thread, I just saw a few posts in the Civ thread and the Beyond Earth thread asking about the game, and thought I'd share.

Kris xK
Apr 23, 2010
I got burned in Stardrive as well so this thing is going to need some incredible reviews/discounts before I give it anymore money.

On the other hand, I just bought Galactic Civilizations 3 from Brad "There's no such thing as bee allergies" Wardell. Its actually pretty good.

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


Wait -- I haven't even voted in this game yet!

FWIW, owners of StarDrive 1 get a big discount on StarDrive 2. It's 30% or 33% or something like that.

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Pillbug

Zurai posted:

FWIW, owners of StarDrive 1 get a big discount on StarDrive 2. It's 30% or 33% or something like that.

Yeah, it's 33 percent off.

Considering how many features were cut from the original to be moved to the sequel, it's not enough to get me to pull the trigger without some seriously good news.

Truecon420
Jul 11, 2013

I like to tweet and live my life. Thank you.

Kris xK posted:

I got burned in Stardrive as well so this thing is going to need some incredible reviews/discounts before I give it anymore money.

On the other hand, I just bought Galactic Civilizations 3 from Brad "There's no such thing as bee allergies" Wardell. Its actually pretty good.

Any idea why there isn't a GalCiv 3 thread? I've seen some people in other threads talk about the game and the possibility of a thread. Is it because Brad parks in handicap spaces?

Sorry for derailing.

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Pillbug

Truecon420 posted:

Any idea why there isn't a GalCiv 3 thread? I've seen some people in other threads talk about the game and the possibility of a thread. Is it because Brad parks in handicap spaces?

Sorry for derailing.

There was one a while back, but I think it died while the game was in Early Access. It'd probably be nice to have a new one, I'm interested in the game but I'd like to hear some impressions before I pull the trigger, given how hit-or-miss space 4X's have been lately.

Kris xK
Apr 23, 2010

Truecon420 posted:

Any idea why there isn't a GalCiv 3 thread? I've seen some people in other threads talk about the game and the possibility of a thread. Is it because Brad parks in handicap spaces?

Sorry for derailing.

Ive been wondering that too, I just assumed it was due to some arcane rule I wasn't aware of.

The game itself seems pretty popular, and I wouldn't mind a spot to post pretty pictures of spaceships.

Truecon420
Jul 11, 2013

I like to tweet and live my life. Thank you.

Kris xK posted:

Ive been wondering that too, I just assumed it was due to some arcane rule I wasn't aware of.

The game itself seems pretty popular, and I wouldn't mind a spot to post pretty pictures of spaceships.

I agree with both of you, I'm pretty new to the series, I started playing GalCiv 2 only a few months ago and would like a good thread on the series. I don't know who could/who start the thread, maybe they're waiting for the game to be out a bit longer? From what I hear it's a little rough still with glitches/missing or wrong text.

In relation to stardrive 2, I've noticed that reviews for GC3 have been more positive so far. If the metacritic scores mean anything to you, I think Stardrive 2 had around a 70 and GC3 has 85 for now.

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes
I played some GC3 and SD2 over the weekend and posted my impressions in the Steam thread, in short I think SD2 is the more fun game. In long:

Darkrenown posted:

I played ~4 hours of Galciv3 today, but I'm too bored to continue. Thoughts:
(TLDR - just play GC2 if you want more galciv in your life)

Looks nice, animated race portraits aren't as good as Stardrive though. Some missing text in a few places.

There's a lot of CGI movies for ingame events - first colony, first time mining each resource etc. I like them so far, but they'll get dull with repeated playing. They also play on a loop until you exit them, which seems silly.

Combat seems to have changed a bit - there are still 3 weapon and 3 defence types, but there are also stats for things like accuracy and combat speed. Combat looks pretty good, but the camera is poo poo. You still have no control over combat but you can set rolls for ships when you design them that affects how they behave. Ship XP is gone though. If your ships get injured they heal slowly on their own or faster in orbit of your plants, there don't appear to be any "rest until healed" command though, so rotating out ships to repair can be annoying. All 3 AI players in my game researched the same weapons type, so naturally I picked the defence good against that.

Planet buildings all have adjacency bonuses which makes placing buildings a bit more involved. The process doesn't always work though, I am not sure why - it is not explained well. I think the adjacency bonus only apply to buildings of the same class, but it is not explained anywhere. There are various buildings that don't do anything on their own but give larger adjacency bonuses - it has been hard to make much use of them so far though as planets tend to have their tiles spread out or in thin snake lines.

There doesn't seem to be any useful expansion planner with lists of uncolonised planets, unexploted resources, or starbases that could be upgraded.

Every so often you tech a specialization in the tech tree where you can choose from 3 passive empire-wide bonuses - e.g. you might get faster ship engines, smaller ship engines, or increased range. I like it.

Ideology trees - are a lot like Civ5 policy trees, you get ideology points from events and spend them in a tree to get bonuses like free ships, a planet being discovered nearby, or a change to how races react to you.

Special resources have changed - More like Civ5, you get 1 resource to use at a time for each mined and you can build special ship parts or buildings.

UI is pretty bad in places, some names aren't consistent etc. Morale is also called approval and happiness in different places, for example.

Ships are build via shipyards, which are objects in space/on the map. Planets in range can be set as "sponsors" who forward production to them, although the efficiency of this drops off with range.

There doesn't seem to be any asteroid mining like GC2 got in one expansion.

Economy is still a lot like the old weird galciv system, but now have a triangle of military production, civ production, and research and can set a balance between them where ever you like. There's also a slider diverting your production between social and military production. So far I am not keen on this, and didn't like it in the earlier games, as it seems like you are always wasting production in some areas unless you super micro it. I'm not sure what happens to the production you are not using, it's not shown anywhere.

There's a neat thing where when you colonise a planet your first building is free, which I suppose represents cannibalising the colony ship. I like this as it means your planets are being useful from day 1.

AI seems pretty dumb (I did accidentally leave it set to beginner though), the weakest faction I have met keeps demanding money from me and getting mad when I say no.

See the graph in the top right? This is Military power. The darker blue line at the top is me, the light blue line at the bottom are the Alterians.

:fuckoff:

I have no way to demand things from them in return, demanding poo poo seems to be an AI only thing.

Been fairly bored and just hitting end turn for a while. It's the same old galciv issues - you have no easy way of seeing where to make the best trade routes and you need to build starbases all over the place which needs you to send dozens of constructor ships to each base to level them up. The cool economic reports seem to be gone now. There's a United Planets (space UN) system again, and it's still stupid - you choose one of 4 issues to vote on but there's no overview of what they do (e.g. the richest race needs to give up 25% of their credits to be split amongst the other races. Who is the richest? How much $ is involved? Dunno, guess!) and vote-trading seems to be gone too. I could go crush the 3 other races to win, but it's too dull to bother.

Darkrenown posted:

Stardrive II

A quick summery for SD2 would be "Modernised Moo2 with a few extra ideas thrown in".

Tutorial is narrated and has text boxes with more details. Guides you through the actual UI. Seems decent. Lots of tooltips, everything seems well explained.

Game looks less fancy than GC3, but it has a functional, clean look. I like it.

The map is pretty small for a 4x, 100 stars is the largest setting.

Races all travel using the same "warp" drive, but there are random, stable, wormholes connecting points on the map. After having had a planet next to a wormhole for a while a wormhole study group formed and asked me for funding to investigate how they work, which was rather cool.

Production is per planet. You have pops that go in Farmer, Worker, or Scientist slots and can be drag/dropped between them. Seems a lot like I remember Moo2 doing. There are lots of spots for planetary buildings. There is no way to automate buildings or rush production en masse though, so colonising later in a game can be tedious.

Ships are also built per planet, but they need starbases or orbital shipyards to build larger ships. The process for building ships is a little awkward because you can see only 10 ship designs in the build list and you have to edit this list to be able to build other designs. Annoyingly you don't seem to be able to remove or obsolete designs, you can only overwrite them, so you'll always have several designs on the list that you have no intention of ever building again.

You can also shift what field pops are in and set planet's build queues from the empire management screen rather than going to each planet. You can also drag/drop pops between planets which makes them hop on a freighter and go there. Annoyingly you cannot swap population between 2 full planets though.

You have empire level Freighter and food pools, freighters can move food or troops between planets, move passengers (colonists moving between already colonised planets), or trade.

There is a handy list of known uncolonised planets with various filters to help plan expansion.

There's a fairly nice alert system for when stuff is built, when a colony ship reaches a system with colonisable planets, or when you scout a new system.

There are strategic resources on planets which gives stacking empire wide bonuses for each controlled. Some also have special bonuses when you control more than X sources of the resource.

Planets can also have special features giving good or bad effects - the ones with bad effects seem to come with special research projects which can negate the penalty or turn it into a bonus. I don't know if I just had a bad start, but good food producing planets were pretty rare for me and this has been the main bottleneck to my expansion - only my homeworld can really farm well.

Planets can gain traits from building stuff - e.g. my homeworld formed a trade guild after I had build a bunch of Freighters there, which reduced the cost of building more Freighters there. It also had an agricultural exchange due to all the food being farmed there, which doubled the profit from selling excess food.

On the downside, there seems to be no autoconverting of wasted production and there is no alert when a planet is not building anything, so you have to make sure to keep your build queues filled.

You can build starbases, but these seem limited to refueling points and ship speed boosters.

Research is very Moo2 like as well - you have multiple fields and can pick only one tech to research in a field, you cannot research the others (not sure if there is a creative trait letting you take all of them). Many techs which give upgrades have a choice between either a flat bonus and a small amount per pop, or no flat bonus but a larger amount per pop, which I think is an interesting choice. There is also a Random tech field that can give you a normal tech or a special racial tech. As well as regular research you have "special projects" which some from off planet effects, events, or discovering weird space stuff. These can be investigated at the same time as regular research, but you must divert some of your "beakers" to do so.

Diplomacy has an interesting twist: Depending on your relations with a race, and possibly some other factors, you have a Tolerance value that affects how much stuff you can trade or what deals they will accept. Tolerance acts as both a cap on the amount of stuff you can do and as a cooldown timer - it replenishes over time. You can also Threaten races during diplo, which can make them go over their Tolerance limit and/or agree to deals whcih are unfairly in your favour. However, races may reject your threat, in which case you must either declare war or back down. If you back down other races will view you as cowardly for a time and be more likely to reject other threats you make.

There is an empire wide command point limit. Each ship costs some based on its size, although you can have a certain amount of the smallest ship for no command points. Ships only cost upkeep if you exceed your command point limit. You gain command points from starbases. Ships can be built with modules which reduce their command point cost, and ships garrisoned at a planet cost half the normal limit. It's a little like EU's supply limit. This means larger fleets, and fleets that are being used aggressively are a bit less efficient than smaller or garrisoned fleets, which is kind of nice as it generally should be more difficult to attack than to defend.

Ships use fuel and may use ammo depending on weapons equipped. No fuel is used when you are within your empire borders. You can restock by visiting a friendly planet or station.

Ship design has no visual customisation, but the working parts are fairly detailed. Each ship has 5 sections, front, rear, left, right, and centre. Each section is made up of tiles into which all the ship's module smust be slotted like a jigsaw puzzle. Modules all have HP and damage can knock them out, but the ship is not destroyed unless the center section is, so damage has to burn through on of the outer sections first. Damage is directional and weapons have firing arcs, so where you place things is important. Ships have power generation, and energy weapons require power capacitors while ammo based weapons need ammo storage. On the plus side, unlike Stardrive 1 you don't have to care about actually wiring your modules up to your generator, just having power is enough. Weapons come in many different types with different properties, and can be further modified size of the mounting (e.g turrets, spinal mounts, point defence clusters, etc.) and by special options which tend to boost certain aspects while making the weapon larger, heavier, or more expensive. You can also place armour around your ship - it is only useful if it is between the damage source and your modules though (That's what the tutorial says anyway, but I am not sure if it is true now). Modules come in a range of sizes, the large ones are more efficient, but of course you have physical space limitations. Ships have mass which modules add to, while engines provide thrust. You ratio of mass to thrust determines how manoeuvrable your ships are and how they accelerate. You can set ships either to try to broadside or aim their fronts at the enemy, and if they should sit and slug it our or keep constantly moving. It's rather detailed, but the UI is a lot better than Distant Worlds, so I quite like it. On the downside, damage is shown per shot and different weapons and mounts can have different rates of fire or fire in salvos of multiple shots, so it can be difficult to directly compare weapons - plus there is no summery of the total damage output of a ship, although I guess that would be difficult to calculate, which means it is tricky to compare your designs at a glance. The ability to simulate battles against known enemy designs would also be neat.

Space combat takes place on a special combat map - you can deploy your ships in a given zone and set proffered engagement ranges. It's kind of weird you don't just set this in the design to give a default value, as it's a pain to adjust my short range ships to short range every single battle. Aside from this you can toggle frontal/broadside facing and hold ground/keep moving settings. Finally you can order ships to attack a preferred target and move them around, but you can't give detailed orders - ships just fire all their weapons at everything nearby if they can't aim them at the target you have given. Combat is real time and could really use a speed up time command. Annoyingly, there is little feedback about what happens in combat - which of your weapons were most effective? What was the enemy using? Did you point defence help more than your armour or did only your shields save you? Who knows? At one point I was totally wrecked by some advanced aliens who just shut my ships down with some kind of EMP weapon, I assume, but what it actually was and what, if anything, I could do to counter it seems to be left to guesswork.

Ships gain XP/levels, but these have no visible effect. They can also gain medals, which seem unrelated to XP, for doing certain things in combat - defending a planet, killing X ships, doing Y damage with missiles etc. - which give benefits like reducing damage taken in friendly space or increasing damage done by certain weapons.

You can also design your ground combat units - these are produced automatically when you build infantry bases, but you can swap out their weapons, armour, special abilities, and special tactics.

Ground combat also takes place on its own map, but it's TBS and you must give your troops detailed orders such as where to move, what to shoot, and what special abilities to use. It seems a bit too involved for me, I would prefer just having abstracted ground combat and not needing to bother designed ground units.

Empires on the starmap have claimed space, but it comes in 2 types. There's a darker area of "core" space which other empires cannot colonise in, and if they move though it too without an open borders agreement you can attack them without declaring war. Then there's a larger, lighter area of "claimed" space that counts as your territory for fuel use etc, but that other empires can build in if they so desire. Core space expands after a system as been colonised for long enough.

There are events or points of interest on the map which can be branching and seem fairly well done, but on the downside these trigger whenever a ship passes close enough - e.g. I had some kind of space junk yard that would offer to sell me stuff between my homeworld and my first colony, so any time I sent ships between them it's pop up offering to sell me stuff. Points of interest also only sometimes record what they are - sometimes they just show on the map as "Explored anomaly" and it's up to you to remember if this is the rogue asteroid or the infested ship etc. which can lead some some space marines being pointlessly sent to a barren rock.

There's no reporting on known enemy forces in starsystems you can't see, which is a pain. E.g. if you send a scout to system full of space monsters which kill it there's no marker saying "poo poo, monsters!" on the starmap, so you just need to remember all the danger spots. Good luck remembering this if you take a break, or even if just after the 5-10 turns it takes to get another scout into the area while you're focused on other things.

The AI has seemed sensible so far, although they have demanded tribute from me a few times and then done nothing when I told them to stick it. There have also been a couple of occasions when they have said "Hey, will you trade us your X tech?" but since they had recently traded with me they had no tolerance for any deals I could offer them - then they got mad I "refused to trade with them". I'm not sure how the AI evaluates that I am weaker than them though, as there seems to stats for graphs showing the relative power of empires. At some point the AIs all got mad at me for having too many colonies though.

Had a lot more fun playing SD2 than GC3. Game ended with an AI empire wrecking me with a huge invasion fleet at what I guess was mid-game/early-lategame tech levels.

Does anyone with SD2 know how exactly armour works? Like, do I need to armour the sides of the front section of the ship or is it assumed only the front face of the front section can take damage? I bugs the hell out of me that my designs might not be ~optimal~

DarkAvenger211
Jun 29, 2011

Damnit Steve, you know I'm a sucker for Back to the Future references.

Darkrenown posted:

Does anyone with SD2 know how exactly armour works? Like, do I need to armour the sides of the front section of the ship or is it assumed only the front face of the front section can take damage? I bugs the hell out of me that my designs might not be ~optimal~

I haven't played SD2, but in SD1 the combat was physics based. Each projectile could collide with a component on your ship, So if your ship gets hit on the right side, modules on the right side will take damage. So if you designed your ships with armor on the outer right side, the armor would take the hits first. Once a module/armor gets destroyed it doesn't block projectiles anymore and would continue to hit a module behind it.

Shields work the same way only it blocks projectiles in a radius.

**Also in SD1 if you pressed Tab, you could see your modules in real time while fighting. So you could see what modules are being hit, and also can see where enemies modules are located.

Jarvisi
Apr 17, 2001

Green is still best.
At times playing this game I forgot I wasn't playing moo2. Still not sure if that's a good thing or not yet.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


Every time I've played it has been the same. First anomaly is the asteroid, while my neighbours regardless of who they are declare war on me quite quickly. Also the diplomacy screen was better in StarDrive 1. GalCiv 2 is still the best 4X and does not have a replacement yet.

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes
^^^ Oh I don't know, GC2 was fine for a certain type of 4x, but depending on what you want Sword of the Stars 1 (for very different playing races + sweet battles) or Distant Worlds (for space empire sim sperging) could be a better game. I do agree GC3 doesn't replace GC2 in it's "type" though.

DarkAvenger211 posted:

I haven't played SD2, but in SD1 the combat was physics based. Each projectile could collide with a component on your ship, So if your ship gets hit on the right side, modules on the right side will take damage. So if you designed your ships with armor on the outer right side, the armor would take the hits first. Once a module/armor gets destroyed it doesn't block projectiles anymore and would continue to hit a module behind it.

Yup, I'm fine with that part - what I wonder is, are the ships true 3d models in combat, or do the different sides just represent facings of a box full of modules and nothing more? Like is this front section:

better protected than this one:

or can ship fronts only be hit from the front meaning armouring the sides of the front is a waste?

Darkrenown fucked around with this message at 21:46 on May 19, 2015

Zasze
Apr 29, 2009
^^^^

They are true 3d models if you leave a armor gap modules around them will take increased damage

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

Every time I've played it has been the same. First anomaly is the asteroid, while my neighbours regardless of who they are declare war on me quite quickly. Also the diplomacy screen was better in StarDrive 1. GalCiv 2 is still the best 4X and does not have a replacement yet.

This is incorrect its a tie between Distant worlds and sword of the stars 1 with all the xpacks

fake edit: its a shame sword of the stars never got a seque alsol sots 2 never happened :argh:

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


Wait -- I haven't even voted in this game yet!

Zasze posted:

^^^^

They are true 3d models if you leave a armor gap modules around them will take increased damage


This is incorrect its a tie between Distant worlds and sword of the stars 1 with all the xpacks

fake edit: its a shame sword of the stars never got a seque alsol sots 2 never happened :argh:

What's a sots 2? You're speaking gibberish.

Fire Storm
Aug 8, 2004

what's the point of life
if there are no sexborgs?
Bought this game on a recent sale, enjoying the hell out of it. *FAR* more polished than StarDrive 1, I haven't made it crash yet (been trying) , and I enjoy all the GoonFleet references.

I do like how absolutely clueless the AI is some times. You have one planet, I am blockading it and YOU are making threats? Please, feel free to war-dec me.

Tujague
May 8, 2007

by LadyAmbien
Jesus christ, what is wrong with this genre? I scooped up Endless Space, Star Ruler and Space Empires V and they all came up with fewer features, more dumb broken poo poo or more lovely, boring gameplay than MOO2, which was from goddamn *1996*

I'm glad this douchebag wants to clone a 20-year-old game but I think waiting to see if he's ripping everyone the gently caress off again is a strategy worthy of a space emperor

Red Alert 2 Yuris Revenge
May 8, 2006

"My brain is amazing! It's full of wrinkles, and... Uh... Wait... What am I trying to say?"
A lot of the art seems reused and there don't appear to be any new races. They did their best to hide any mention of how the dev handled Stardrive 1 on the steam forum too, at least prior to launch.

Probably don't buy this unless it is on heavy sale. It might be good, I don't know, but the dev is really lovely and there and a pretty good amount of 4x games out there.

Kris xK
Apr 23, 2010

Tujague posted:

Jesus christ, what is wrong with this genre? I scooped up Endless Space, Star Ruler and Space Empires V and they all came up with fewer features, more dumb broken poo poo or more lovely, boring gameplay than MOO2, which was from goddamn *1996*

I'm glad this douchebag wants to clone a 20-year-old game but I think waiting to see if he's ripping everyone the gently caress off again is a strategy worthy of a space emperor

It's a shame Space Empires 5 was awful, because 4 is one of my all time favourites. You could loving do anything in that game. Satallite defences, minefields, drones, ring worlds, dyson spheres, wormhole closers and openers, planet destroying weapons, solar system destroying weapons, black hole generators....

I think it was made by just one guy too.

Zurai
Feb 13, 2012


Wait -- I haven't even voted in this game yet!

Contest Winner posted:

there don't appear to be any new races.

The Chukk are new.

Meme Poker Party
Sep 1, 2006

by Azathoth
I notice that the OP conspicuously neglected to cover the new ground combat Stardrive II features. Now would he do that?





Oh.



e: Ok it looks like he did cover it for one sentence but that part doesn't show the true horror that is on display. This is a "chosen Steam store" image.

Meme Poker Party fucked around with this message at 02:17 on May 20, 2015

emTme3
Nov 7, 2012

by Hand Knit

Ugly In The Morning posted:

There was one a while back, but I think it died while the game was in Early Access. It'd probably be nice to have a new one, I'm interested in the game but I'd like to hear some impressions before I pull the trigger, given how hit-or-miss space 4X's have been lately.

GalCiv3 could be a pretty fun game after some patches/expansions. Right now it's very buggy and unpolished. The UI is clunky and inconsistent, many of the various info screens don't minimize with escape, there are very few useful hotkeys, and lots of broken, garbled text descriptions. I get all kinds of graphical glitches and many CTDs too. The minimap resets to the lowest zoom level possible every turn, making it useless, and another bug where the sound would just stop working entirely after about 20 minutes and stay off until I restarted the game.

It's very similar to GalCiv2, most of the icons and art are the same, the soundtrack is almost identical and all the major factions are the same (I think there might be one new faction), but it's also missing some features like espionage and the ability to set the military/social manufacturing ratio per planet rather than civ wide. Ground combat no longer has dice rolling but it's still very abstract, ship combat is identical to the previous game except you can pick various 'roles' for your ships. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be any incentive to ever use smaller ships or carriers, if you just get the biggest hulls possible and slap as many guns on them as you can you'll roll everything.

It's also extremely unbalanced. There's a bunch of identical techs, missiles are much better than every other weapon type and mass drivers suck. There's about a million different planetary buildings and no useful way to sort through them, so you spend a lot of time scrolling down massive lists of stuff.

I played a lot of GalCiv2 and I've been kind of looking forward to the sequel, but it just isn't done yet. Not $50 done anyways.

As for Stardrive 2, I also got burned on the first one so it's a hard sell. I may get it on sale eventually if the dev manages to keep supporting it this time around.

emTme3 fucked around with this message at 02:22 on May 20, 2015

Hiveminded
Aug 26, 2014
Goddamn, this game really does seem like a MoO2 clone. I'm not sure whether the dev should be praised for making a not-completely broken reskin or damned for a lack of creativity.

Psycho Landlord
Oct 10, 2012

What are you gonna do, dance with me?

Not that I want to give Zero, Dipes, or whatever the gently caress he calls himself now any credit because he's a shitlord, but haven't people been screaming for a prettier MoO2 clone in near-exact function for years now? Because it seems like this is exactly what people wanted, and now they're making GBS threads on it for being too similar.

Darkrenown
Jul 18, 2012
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes

splifyphus posted:

it's also missing some features like espionage and the ability to set the military/social manufacturing ratio per planet rather than civ wide.

An odd thing is there's a "Reset all planets to empire value" as if you could change it on a per planet basis, but there isn't. Cut feature not entire purged maybe?

Goa Tse-tung
Feb 11, 2008

;3

Yams Fan
I kinda wish you could see what unique building each race has before the start. Creating your own race has a real choice now (besides denying one to the AI, looking at you Darloks :argh:) since you always chose an existing one as the base.

Also it's cool that you could theoretically play a game vs only custom races.

junidog
Feb 17, 2004

Darkrenown posted:

An odd thing is there's a "Reset all planets to empire value" as if you could change it on a per planet basis, but there isn't. Cut feature not entire purged maybe?

You can set things on a per planet basis: select a planet from the map and click govern in the bottom left ui area (same place you tell a constructor to make a starbase).

OwlFancier
Aug 22, 2013

The game would be good fun if not for a few things.

1. The AI doesn't use fuel. It will happily send its fleets across a million miles of space with no fuel tanks to blow you up, you will not be able to do the same. This essentially means that while you have a quite strict movement limitation and will be forced to attack via fairly specific bridges of systems or fuel depots, the AI does not have to do anything of the sort. It sort of breaks the strategic game quite badly.

2. Pacing is a bit naff, and you can't change it. It's very easy to break the research system so you research extremely quickly and rush through most of the techs extremely fast. AI does the same so most of them are a bit useless.

3. Differences between racial ship designs mean some equipment is useless for some races and brilliant for others and you won't know until you research it and see how many you can fit onto your ship.

Interesting game but with a few serious flaws that prevent it from being as good as it could be.

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Stevefin
Sep 30, 2013

Yeah skip this one. Though I have not played it myself, for what I have seen he did give us those extra stuff, but took everything else away, If you really want a modern day game to scratch that itch you shou;d just pick up Star Ruler 2, Those guys sure can use your money way more than this nut job, and will probably thank you from not closing down in a few months

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