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Moridin920 posted:Realtalk though believing in God as the bible describes it and taking that poo poo seriously is on par with believing in santa or the tooth fairy almost no one actually believes in biblical literalism, though strangely enough there are a lot of people in the american south who will say they believe in biblical literalism because they feel like they're supposed to, but they clearly do not, they know that outer space isn't water and they know the earth is not motionless and bats are not birds etc.
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# ? May 23, 2015 07:28 |
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# ? Mar 19, 2024 14:24 |
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devin2 posted:See this is straight up atheist bullshit and it's why I describe myself as non-religious. I think that the only reason I know people are religious is if I ask what they did over the weekend and their answer included church.
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# ? May 23, 2015 07:36 |
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devin2 posted:because let's be honest, atheists--at least on the internet--come across as a group of fedora-wearing, pimply and probably fat and extremely militant assholes who are dead set on taking offense at whatever someone just said. especially if someone just asked what their religion was; but also just because anime. Good on you, devin2
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# ? May 23, 2015 07:41 |
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i just awkwardly stare at anyone who asks until they go away. that's my reaction to a lot of things, though. i did actually work nights with this one guy who got really upset that i wasnt a christian and kept on trying to convert me, though. he just went on and on for like a week until i threatened to complain to a supervisor, at which point he dropped it completely. i guess saving my eternal soul wasnt worth getting in trouble at work.
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# ? May 23, 2015 07:59 |
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god gay, so what
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# ? May 23, 2015 08:06 |
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Laslow posted:I need a good non-answer like "I'm getting by comfortably" when people ask you how much money you make. What I usually do is say something like "I was brought up *insert parent's religion here*" and then sort of nod my head and make affirmative gestures as they play out their pitch or whatever. If they ask about worshiping together or what church I go to I just explain that I'm extremely busy so I have to settle for a more personal connection with God. If they keep pressing I'll make some excuses and then avoid that person like the plague.
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# ? May 23, 2015 08:20 |
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Iehovahs witness aka The Watch Tower Society, make u regret asking me such a stupid and rude question i will
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# ? May 23, 2015 08:49 |
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Last time a Jehovah's witness rang on the door, I responded to this question on less than three hours, with blood shot eyes, and with pure reflex: "more prophecies than fathomable by your meager mind guide me in my daily action" then slammed the door in their face. My girlfriend burst into tears with laughter and asked me what the gently caress just happened. I said "the truth." edit: I asked my girl to corroborate this story she said I muttered incomprehensibly then waved bye and closed the door slowly on them while they tried to respond. I like my version better. Tonsured fucked around with this message at 09:06 on May 23, 2015 |
# ? May 23, 2015 08:58 |
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There are terrible Christians, there are terrible atheists If someone really wanted to know your beliefs, just tell them. They aren't ashamed, why should you be?
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# ? May 23, 2015 10:48 |
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Nadir posted:There are terrible Christians, there are terrible atheists "Not religious" is a belief. It's pretty clear what a person means when they say it. They aren't hiding it, they're just saying it in a different way. If an Atheist is just someone who doesn't believe in god (gods???), then a different way of saying the same thing doesn't change anything. If being an Atheist is some sort of group identity or movement or what have you that goes beyond just that, then that's all the more reason to avoid using the word if you don't want people to think you're involved in all that.
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# ? May 23, 2015 11:52 |
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Blurry Gray Thing posted:"Not religious" is a belief. It's pretty clear what a person means when they say it. They aren't hiding it, they're just saying it in a different way. You're right when you say that "not religious" is the same as "atheist". You're wrong when you say that it's a belief. It's a lack of belief. A person who is an atheist may well believe there is no god, but that is not implied by the word atheist. Being an atheist simply means lacking a belief in god.
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# ? May 23, 2015 11:54 |
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:08 |
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:36 |
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:You're right when you say that "not religious" is the same as "atheist". You're wrong when you say that it's a belief. It's a lack of belief. A person who is an atheist may well believe there is no god, but that is not implied by the word atheist. Being an atheist simply means lacking a belief in god. No because there is as much historical baggage associated with the term atheist as with christian. Being atheist in a modern society like ours implies certain value sets and narratives, just like everyone knows that being christian in america implies others. The only difference is that you ignore the former because it's inconvenient for you
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:39 |
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so what you're saying is that in reality "militant atheists" are historical and not current also lol at the "militant christian" being some attention whore rather than a kenyan death squad that murders gay people and single mothers
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:39 |
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Beef Turret posted:No because there is as much historical baggage associated with the term atheist as with christian. Being atheist in a modern society like ours implies certain value sets and narratives, just like everyone knows that being christian in america implies others. The only difference is that you ignore the former because it's inconvenient for you how is it inconvenient for me?
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:39 |
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:also lol at the "militant christian" being some attention whore rather than a kenyan death squad that murders gay people and single mothers Agreed
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:39 |
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:how is it inconvenient for me? Trying to paint atheism as value neutral is a way to conflate atheism with science and impartial rationality. It's a kind of special pleading
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:41 |
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Beef Turret posted:Trying to paint atheism as value neutral is a way to conflate atheism with science and impartial rationality. It's a kind of special pleading First of all, no, it doesn't do that nor is it special pleading. Second of all, that's a non-sequitur; even if the statement was true, what does it have to do with me?
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:42 |
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*plays video games and wants to gently caress the female characters*
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:49 |
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:First of all, no, it doesn't do that nor is it special pleading. Second of all, that's a non-sequitur; even if the statement was true, what does it have to do with me? Nothing. It's just that if you think christianity is an anti-scientific delusion that stunts children etc etc, as atheists claim because of the crusades and the KKK and creationism etc and also that being christian means you validate the whole mess by simply being one, then having no belief in a god where you identify with all or some of the trappings of materialism, logical positivism and scientism (assumptions that are usually unacknowledged), then you don't get to claim atheism simply means "lacking belief in a god" when atheism was such a corner stone in the murder of millions. Otherwise christianity would simply mean "believing in the divine grace as revealed through jesus christ" and nothing more
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# ? May 23, 2015 12:56 |
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Beef Turret posted:Nothing. It's just that if you think christianity is an anti-scientific delusion that stunts children etc etc, as atheists claim because of the crusades and the KKK and creationism etc and also that being christian means you validate the whole mess by simply being one, then having no belief in a god where you identify with all or some of the trappings of materialism, logical positivism and scientism (assumptions that are usually unacknowledged), then you don't get to claim atheism simply means "lacking belief in a god" when atheism was such a corner stone in the murder of millions. Otherwise christianity would simply mean "believing in the divine grace as revealed through jesus christ" and nothing more Atheism doesn't entail any of the things you just attributed to it. But if it did, how would that be inconvenient for me? You still haven't answered that, except with a non-sequitur.
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:05 |
Beef Turret posted:Nothing. It's just that if you think christianity is an anti-scientific delusion that stunts children etc etc, as atheists claim because of the crusades and the KKK and creationism etc and also that being christian means you validate the whole mess by simply being one, then having no belief in a god where you identify with all or some of the trappings of materialism, logical positivism and scientism (assumptions that are usually unacknowledged), then you don't get to claim atheism simply means "lacking belief in a god" when atheism was such a corner stone in the murder of millions. Otherwise christianity would simply mean "believing in the divine grace as revealed through jesus christ" and nothing more hey maybe people are on the whole disgusting unsalvageable lunatics who are ultimately interested in eating breeding and protecting their tiny tribe. did you ever consider that?
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:07 |
no continental philosopher should have been anywhere near a woman
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:11 |
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:Atheism doesn't entail any of the things you just attributed to it. But if it did, how would that be inconvenient for me? You still haven't answered that, except with a non-sequitur. I meant it's inconvenient to your argument. Also yes, atheism in the west does entail all those things. The peoples that scored highest on Inglehart-Welzel's chart of secular-rational values were ex-communist societies that were more accepting of paternalism from institutions brandishing the miracles of science. And Internet atheism is literally just logical positivism rebranded. Most atheists don't even know that there are feasible alternatives to a purely materialistic framework of reality. You can't just say words don't have contextual and historical baggage. They do
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:15 |
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Beef Turret is a Christian.
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:26 |
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It's about as easy to see the many ways in which christianity goes hand in hand with church repression, irrationality, patriarchy, millinerianism, mass murder, etc as to see the many ways in which atheism goes hand in hand with positivism, materialism, scientism, neoliberalism and technocratic repression. Anyone who affirms the former while denying the latter is delusional
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:35 |
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Beef Turret posted:It's about as easy to see the many ways in which christianity goes hand in hand with church repression, irrationality, patriarchy, millinerianism, mass murder, etc as to see the many ways in which atheism goes hand in hand with positivism, materialism, scientism, neoliberalism and technocratic repression. Anyone who affirms the former while denying the latter is delusional God bless.
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:42 |
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Beef Turret posted:I meant it's inconvenient to your argument. Also yes, atheism in the west does entail all those things. The peoples that scored highest on Inglehart-Welzel's chart of secular-rational values were ex-communist societies that were more accepting of paternalism from institutions brandishing the miracles of science. And Internet atheism is literally just logical positivism rebranded. Most atheists don't even know that there are feasible alternatives to a purely materialistic framework of reality. You can't just say words don't have contextual and historical baggage. They do Just because certain people choose to conflate it with those things doesn't mean the word means those things. A person who identifies as an atheist isn't telling you anything about themselves other than a lack of belief in any gods. They don't need to come up with a new word to separate themselves from your preconceptions of what atheism is anymore than a Muslim needs to come up with a new word to let you know he isn't sympathetic to Boko Haram.
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:45 |
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I just tell them I'm Unitarian Universalist. Everyone can just assume I'm the same religion as them, when I'm actually atheist.
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:54 |
i usually tell them i worship the Old Gods in the blackest depths of the forest, splashing the blood of animals on crudely carven altars
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# ? May 23, 2015 13:59 |
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Beef Turret posted:It's about as easy to see the many ways in which christianity goes hand in hand with church repression, irrationality, patriarchy, millinerianism, mass murder, etc as to see the many ways in which atheism goes hand in hand with positivism, materialism, scientism, neoliberalism and technocratic repression. Anyone who affirms the former while denying the latter is delusional I would argue that anyone who does the former or the latter, independent of whether they do both, is disingenuous, but in different ways. Christianity does not necessarily entail any of the things you just said, but unlike atheism, Christianity is a positive belief that comes prepackaged with certain dogmatic ideas. What those ideas are and how they are expressed vary widely but the fact remains that if you are a Christian you, by definition, do have a positive belief in a dogmatic ideology, whereas atheism implies no positive belief in anything, only a lack of positive beliefs in any religious ideas.
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:14 |
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People are so good at deceiving each other that self-applied labels can hardly be trusted. Hell you can't even be sure of someone's name so how are you going to trust what they say their religion is?
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:18 |
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I just say "Satan...." and take a sip of my ornate goblet.
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:25 |
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yeah yeah god is good yeah yeah god is great
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:27 |
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TacticalUrbanHomo posted:I would argue that anyone who does the former or the latter, independent of whether they do both, is disingenuous, but in different ways. Christianity does not necessarily entail any of the things you just said, but unlike atheism, Christianity is a positive belief that comes prepackaged with certain dogmatic ideas. What those ideas are and how they are expressed vary widely but the fact remains that if you are a Christian you, by definition, do have a positive belief in a dogmatic ideology, whereas atheism implies no positive belief in anything, only a lack of positive beliefs in any religious ideas. But atheism does imply certain value sets, just like christianity. I never accepted the idea that atheism was like being a "non-stamp collector". Clearly people who live in certain ways, regardless of what labels they apply to themselves, live according to certain values and narratives they've accepted or rejected. Those things matter more than labels and it makes no sense to claim your own values to be neutral after the horrors of militant atheism in the USSR and China. That's the equivalent of saying "I don't speak with an accent, other people do", it's just a sleigh of hand
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:43 |
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One weird positivist quirk is to believe that words denote precise sets of objects as if words only have definitions. But words also have uses that activate networks of familiar resemblances which people built over a lifetime. In the west buddhism is just some self-improvement program for bored housewives but elsewhere people are dying because of it. It might be fair to say that someone doesn't root for a team because sports is such a small part of society, but religion and its values are everywhere. Protestantism sans god is still protestantism. You can't absolve yourself by pretending your label is somehow outside of history
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:49 |
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where are you copy-pasting this from
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:50 |
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Beef Turret posted:One weird positivist quirk is to believe that words denote precise sets of objects as if words only have definitions. But words also have uses that activate networks of familiar resemblances which people built over a lifetime. In the west buddhism is just some self-improvement program for bored housewives but elsewhere people are dying because of it. It might be fair to say that someone doesn't root for a team because sports is such a small part of society, but religion and its values are everywhere. Protestantism sans god is still protestantism. You can't absolve yourself by pretending your label is somehow outside of history lol no one's dying for Buddhism anywhere.
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:50 |
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# ? Mar 19, 2024 14:24 |
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redshirt posted:lol no one's dying for Buddhism anywhere. Don't quote me ever again. Thanks
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# ? May 23, 2015 14:51 |